[PRE-ANN] Stone - DAG Data-Structured Private Cryptocurrency - page 74.

Attilaloe

sr. member

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Quote from: Watsuji on December 31, 2017, 08:41:53 AM

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 08:24:50 AM

Quote from: Watsuji on December 31, 2017, 08:22:05 AM

In Raiblocks, when there is a fork, balance-weighted vote is used to determine the outcome through use of representatives.

How would balance-weighted vote work in Stone? cos certain amount of balances will be shielded if zsnarks are used

Finally, I think that raiblocks snapshot should be used for distribution as the majority of code will be from Raiblocks

Like that voters of XRB (that will have the same power in STONE) could easily make Stone fail with a 51% attack if they want. Not safe. And not fair too.

My point is that balances can be shielded with zsnarks. Once a balance becomes shielded, it cannot vote.

One potential problem is that if say supply is 100million and total shielded amount is 95million (which is not unreasonable), the network becomes easier to attack

It would be pretty easy to do zk-snarks based delegated voting. Your balance is shielded but you can delegate voting with some of it to some other node without disclosing it.

Attilaloe

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Quote from: Watsuji on December 31, 2017, 08:22:05 AM

Finally, I think that raiblocks snapshot should be used for distribution as the majority of code will be from Raiblocks

Can't say I can follow the logic. What most raiblocks holder (e.g. myself) have to do with writing RaiBlocks code?

Watsuji

newbie

Activity: 59

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Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 08:24:50 AM

Quote from: Watsuji on December 31, 2017, 08:22:05 AM

In Raiblocks, when there is a fork, balance-weighted vote is used to determine the outcome through use of representatives.

How would balance-weighted vote work in Stone? cos certain amount of balances will be shielded if zsnarks are used

Finally, I think that raiblocks snapshot should be used for distribution as the majority of code will be from Raiblocks

Like that voters of XRB (that will have the same power in STONE) could easily make Stone fail with a 51% attack if they want. Not safe. And not fair too.

My point is that balances can be shielded with zsnarks. Once a balance becomes shielded, it cannot vote.

One potential problem is that if say supply is 100million and total shielded amount is 95million (which is not unreasonable), the network becomes easier to attack

cryptohunter

legendary

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Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Deep onions distributional method is the best and fairest

Reward those that promote your project

Free airdrops to people that contribute nothing are not as good.

fracas

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Quote from: Watsuji on December 31, 2017, 08:22:05 AM

In Raiblocks, when there is a fork, balance-weighted vote is used to determine the outcome through use of representatives.

How would balance-weighted vote work in Stone? cos certain amount of balances will be shielded if zsnarks are used

Finally, I think that raiblocks snapshot should be used for distribution as the majority of code will be from Raiblocks

Like that voters of XRB (that will have the same power in STONE) could easily make Stone fail with a 51% attack if they want. Not safe. And not fair too.

Watsuji

newbie

Activity: 59

Merit: 0

In Raiblocks, when there is a fork, balance-weighted vote is used to determine the outcome through use of representatives.

How would balance-weighted vote work in Stone? cos certain amount of balances will be shielded if zsnarks are used

Finally, I think that raiblocks snapshot should be used for distribution as the majority of code will be from Raiblocks

Verethraghna

member

Activity: 420

Merit: 10

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 07:22:09 AM

Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 07:18:07 AM

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 07:00:56 AM

Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 06:57:48 AM

Quote from: felixando on December 31, 2017, 06:23:55 AM

..i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

I would love to see this distribution model come to play. This will be an honourable gesture towards the RaiBlocks community and it's developers who worked so passionately on creating this beautiful code.
Distribution to Bitcoin holders as well will allow for additional exposure and overall fairness to a wider user base.

No way, why make rich people richer?

As I said, paying respect to the originators of this code by choosing a friendly fork. I can understand the wish for a free-for-all airdrop and perhaps that can be incorporated as well. However, this is not just another ERC20 token on the Ethereum network that requires almost no development resources.

XRB distribution has been flawed by BOTs and that's the reason they stopped faucets:
- https://www.google.it/search?q=youtube+railblock+software&oq=youtube+railblock+software

Do you think distribution like that would be fair? Please let's Stone have it's own life. Projects are open source so anyone can use them and improve.

Nobody is asking for a free for all airdrop. But for a fair distribution. Give them to already XRB holders is not. Moreover most of them will go to XRB representatives (https://raiblocks.net/page/frontiers.php). Is this fair?

agreed, since we want wider and fairer distribution we should think of another way to do it

fracas

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Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 07:18:07 AM

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 07:00:56 AM

Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 06:57:48 AM

Quote from: felixando on December 31, 2017, 06:23:55 AM

..i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

I would love to see this distribution model come to play. This will be an honourable gesture towards the RaiBlocks community and it's developers who worked so passionately on creating this beautiful code.
Distribution to Bitcoin holders as well will allow for additional exposure and overall fairness to a wider user base.

No way, why make rich people richer?

As I said, paying respect to the originators of this code by choosing a friendly fork. I can understand the wish for a free-for-all airdrop and perhaps that can be incorporated as well. However, this is not just another ERC20 token on the Ethereum network that requires almost no development resources.

XRB distribution has been flawed by BOTs and that's the reason they stopped faucets:
- https://www.google.it/search?q=youtube+railblock+software&oq=youtube+railblock+software

Do you think distribution like that would be fair? Please let's Stone have it's own life. Projects are open source so anyone can use them and improve.

Nobody is asking for a free for all airdrop. But for a fair distribution. Give them to already XRB holders is not. Moreover most of them will go to XRB representatives (https://raiblocks.net/page/frontiers.php). Is this fair?

btcdee

sr. member

Activity: 406

Merit: 253

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 07:00:56 AM

Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 06:57:48 AM

Quote from: felixando on December 31, 2017, 06:23:55 AM

..i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

I would love to see this distribution model come to play. This will be an honourable gesture towards the RaiBlocks community and it's developers who worked so passionately on creating this beautiful code.
Distribution to Bitcoin holders as well will allow for additional exposure and overall fairness to a wider user base.

No way, why make rich people richer?

As I said, paying respect to the originators of this code by choosing a friendly fork. I can understand the wish for a free-for-all airdrop and perhaps that can be incorporated as well. However, this is not just another ERC20 token on the Ethereum network that requires almost no development resources.

fracas

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Quote from: btcdee on December 31, 2017, 06:57:48 AM

Quote from: felixando on December 31, 2017, 06:23:55 AM

..i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

I would love to see this distribution model come to play. This will be an honourable gesture towards the RaiBlocks community and it's developers who worked so passionately on creating this beautiful code.
Distribution to Bitcoin holders as well will allow for additional exposure and overall fairness to a wider user base.

No way, why make rich people richer?

btcdee

sr. member

Activity: 406

Merit: 253

Quote from: felixando on December 31, 2017, 06:23:55 AM

..i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

I would love to see this distribution model come to play. This will be an honourable gesture towards the RaiBlocks community and it's developers who worked so passionately on creating this beautiful code.
Distribution to Bitcoin holders as well will allow for additional exposure and overall fairness to a wider user base.

felixando

copper member

Activity: 137

Merit: 31

Another note: all the latest donators have now been entered into the official donators list in the OP - my apologies for not being able to confirm and reply back to you one by one, bitcointalk has its limitations!

For those who are asking when will donations finish? When you don't see the donation addresses in the OP anymore

felixando

copper member

Activity: 137

Merit: 31

Quote from: murgut on December 31, 2017, 02:22:26 AM

dag is the next blockchain revolution. is blockchain 3.0. i am acctually very bullish on all early dag projects

I concur!

Quote from: sxafir on December 31, 2017, 02:14:16 AM

When faucet ready?

I'm sorry but as discussed in a previous post, faucets place too much stress on the community, for that reason i have decided against it.

Quote from: BountyX on December 30, 2017, 11:40:33 AM

Now I suddenly understand the reason of the huuuuge rise in price of RAIBLOCKS recently - people want to catch 2 coins with one buy.

Hi there, we have not yet finalized the method of distribution, whether it will be a bitcoin snapshot, raiblocks snapshot, airdrop or some other method, i'm aiming towards even and fair distribution, if you have suggestions you are welcome to post your idea! i noted that another user mentioned it would be a good idea to do a similar process to what the ZClassic team are doing, which is merging ZCL and bitcoin snapshot together, there is a possibility i could do this combined with the donators fund, although it leaves the question of, is it fair? still very open to discussion.

Quote from: spyshagg on December 30, 2017, 11:18:13 AM

Quote from: Jester. on December 30, 2017, 09:11:25 AM

I have a great idea for distribution, leave 30% to donators, then the other 70% do a bitcoin airdrop/merge, the same thing which zclassic is doing right now.

Please get back to me with your thoughts, i'm sure the rest of the community would support this.

From here on, Its all about what kind of "coin" you want to "be" in this world.

If what fuels the developer passion for the project is quick personal economic growth, then yes distribute it using methods that already favor the able, rich and wealthy.

In that case, the only semblance to raiblocks its the fact it was forked from it.

He has one chance to fairly decentralize a coin. What he will choose will steer the project.

I appreciate your words of support, and your spot on with what fuels my passion, which is represented in the OP.

Quote from: dodvip123 on December 31, 2017, 05:12:17 AM

Possible to reserve Dutch translation?

I'm sorry i wont be needing translations as of yet - we are still in PRE-ANN stage, perhaps when the first wallet is released and distribution has commenced.

Quote from: fracas on December 31, 2017, 05:24:49 AM

Quote from: iVajra on December 30, 2017, 10:08:01 PM

raiblocks 2.0 ? are you one of raiblocks core team ? or this thread is just to gain more exposure / new money comes into raiblocks Huh

btw DAG with privacy features will be very interesting
this project will be hype as what raiblocks gained till today

I bet this to be much better than RaiBlocks, avoiding their mistakes (very bad exchange, pump based on low volume and exchange bug) and possible price manipulation too.

RaiBlocks is a work of art, i pay alot of respect to Colin and the team for the beautiful piece of code they have presented. The exchange issues were out of Colin's hands. I dont plan to be better than RaiBlock, i just plan and adding to the already existing tech, something different.

In other news - development is going to plan, i have been playing with in-line transactions with great results with the added weight of zk-SNARK's, currently receiving 7s round trip response times for anonymous transactions, but with a alot of tuning i should be able to bring that right down to at least 3s - 600ms. I will also be creating a github in the very near future, id advise not to donate until then, if your slightly worried about the legitimacy of my project.

Thank you to the supporters so far.

fracas

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Quote from: iVajra on December 30, 2017, 10:08:01 PM

raiblocks 2.0 ? are you one of raiblocks core team ? or this thread is just to gain more exposure / new money comes into raiblocks Huh

btw DAG with privacy features will be very interesting
this project will be hype as what raiblocks gained till today

I bet this to be much better than RaiBlocks, avoiding their mistakes (very bad exchange, pump based on low volume and exchange bug) and possible price manipulation too.

DeluxeFont

newbie

Activity: 1

Merit: 0

I can help with the Russian translation. I am very excited about this.

dodvip123

newbie

Activity: 4

Merit: 0

Possible to reserve Dutch translation?

murgut

full member

Activity: 224

Merit: 100

dag is the next blockchain revolution. is blockchain 3.0. i am acctually very bullish on all early dag projects

sxafir

hero member

Activity: 1022

Merit: 500

When faucet ready?

felixando

copper member

Activity: 137

Merit: 31

Hi community, just checking in to say ill be replying to the next wave of PM's and posts over the next couple of hours, apologies for the lack of responses, but as everybody knows its quite busy over the new years period.

Thanks to all those who are supporting and waiting patiently.

iVajra

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

raiblocks 2.0 ? are you one of raiblocks core team ? or this thread is just to gain more exposure / new money comes into raiblocks Huh

btw DAG with privacy features will be very interesting
this project will be hype as what raiblocks gained till today

Topic: [PRE-ANN] Stone - DAG Data-Structured Private Cryptocurrency - page 74. (Read 42234 times)