Topic: Presidential debates - page 10. (Read 2330 times)
Ok, I honestly tried for about 2, maybe 3 minutes. Joe is stuttering, Donnie is just saying random things with no relevance to the topic. I feel a bit dumber already. I'll let you guys listen to that shit and recap it here. Your sacrifice is appreciated.
Eh I don't know about him only having the first 30 mins to do so. Most people won't even end up watching the debate, they'll just watch the highlights. But I understand where you're coming from here.
Totally agree with Theymos here though, Trump TRULY has to make Biden fuck up a ton and continue the line of 'Biden is mentally unable to be the President' while not making himself look crazy in the process. It's going to be much harder to paint him as horribly corrupt because ya know, Biden is NOT Clinton. Though Trump can point to the fact that Biden has been in government for the past 40 something yrs and nothing has changed.
30 mins folks!
Totally agree with Theymos here though, Trump TRULY has to make Biden fuck up a ton and continue the line of 'Biden is mentally unable to be the President' while not making himself look crazy in the process. It's going to be much harder to paint him as horribly corrupt because ya know, Biden is NOT Clinton. Though Trump can point to the fact that Biden has been in government for the past 40 something yrs and nothing has changed.
30 mins folks!
Keep in mind, most people have already made up their mind on who they're going to vote for so they don't need the entire debate to make up their mind. So first impressions are going to matter. Also consider, itt's a Tuesday night and middle working class people that spend their day hard at work are going to have a short attention span. These are working people, family people, that aren't going to spend their evenings glued to the screen for an hour and a half.
These are also the people that don't bother with highlights. The average American hardly cares about politics, frankly. And I don't think the highlight reals will highlight Joe Biden's slurred speech or incoherent statements if he makes them, so that's another hurdle for Trump. He needs to make his case early and hope Joe Biden messed up early.
Trump campaign accidentally blasted this email a few hours ago:
LOL. Ouch, some guy is getting fired for this.
Trump really only has the first 30 minutes of the debate to make Biden stumble. People aren't going to stick around for the entire 90 minute debate. You essentially take out Trump's portion of talking and Chris Wallace's portion, you have roughly 12-15 minutes of Biden speaking time, which imo, isn't long enough for him to sound incoherent or for Trump to force Biden to stumble. Nonetheless, I expect Trump to come out swinging.
I think you're obviously right that people are looking at Joe Biden as the safe choice, I just don't know how Trump can paint Biden as a non-normal candidate. He isn't a great debater and I think Clinton outclassed him in every way last election cycle during the debates. Trump came off as unhinged, to put it mild, during the first debate against Clinton but reduced his tone and demeanor for the second and third debates which I think were better performances by miles. Trump also won't have a crowd which will hurt him -- no reactions to his witty or shocking lines..ie "you'd be in jail" to Hillary Clinton which made the crowd go insane.
Some other predictions - I think Joe Biden will obviously make the case of COVID-19 against Trump repeating the line "200k dead". Trump's best case for this probably is forcing Joe Biden to acknowledge he would not have done much different, that he listened to Dr. Fauci (very popular person among households), and that Joe Biden called Trump's travel ban racist/xeonphobic. Trump can also talk about how he provided governors with the equipment they needed when they requested for it.
Economy would be great for Trump. There is no denying that pre COVID the Trump economy was great. Record low unemployment, high stock prices, 401k growth, all the rest, yadda yadda. I think he has a few job reports numbers that were ahead of predictions that Trump can cite post COVID which would give him a good appeal for convincing Americans that we are on the road to a V shaped recovery, GRANTED that we open up the rest of the country. Americans are opposed to lock downs, so I expect Trump to attack democrats in general on their pro lock down stances.
Other than that, I'm looking forward to watching old men that are barely alive verbally berate each other for 90 minutes which is always a blast.
I think you're obviously right that people are looking at Joe Biden as the safe choice, I just don't know how Trump can paint Biden as a non-normal candidate. He isn't a great debater and I think Clinton outclassed him in every way last election cycle during the debates. Trump came off as unhinged, to put it mild, during the first debate against Clinton but reduced his tone and demeanor for the second and third debates which I think were better performances by miles. Trump also won't have a crowd which will hurt him -- no reactions to his witty or shocking lines..ie "you'd be in jail" to Hillary Clinton which made the crowd go insane.
Some other predictions - I think Joe Biden will obviously make the case of COVID-19 against Trump repeating the line "200k dead". Trump's best case for this probably is forcing Joe Biden to acknowledge he would not have done much different, that he listened to Dr. Fauci (very popular person among households), and that Joe Biden called Trump's travel ban racist/xeonphobic. Trump can also talk about how he provided governors with the equipment they needed when they requested for it.
Economy would be great for Trump. There is no denying that pre COVID the Trump economy was great. Record low unemployment, high stock prices, 401k growth, all the rest, yadda yadda. I think he has a few job reports numbers that were ahead of predictions that Trump can cite post COVID which would give him a good appeal for convincing Americans that we are on the road to a V shaped recovery, GRANTED that we open up the rest of the country. Americans are opposed to lock downs, so I expect Trump to attack democrats in general on their pro lock down stances.
Other than that, I'm looking forward to watching old men that are barely alive verbally berate each other for 90 minutes which is always a blast.
Eh I don't know about him only having the first 30 mins to do so. Most people won't even end up watching the debate, they'll just watch the highlights. But I understand where you're coming from here.
Totally agree with Theymos here though, Trump TRULY has to make Biden fuck up a ton and continue the line of 'Biden is mentally unable to be the President' while not making himself look crazy in the process. It's going to be much harder to paint him as horribly corrupt because ya know, Biden is NOT Clinton. Though Trump can point to the fact that Biden has been in government for the past 40 something yrs and nothing has changed.
30 mins folks!
Trump campaign accidentally blasted this email a few hours ago:
Trump really only has the first 30 minutes of the debate to make Biden stumble. People aren't going to stick around for the entire 90 minute debate. You essentially take out Trump's portion of talking and Chris Wallace's portion, you have roughly 12-15 minutes of Biden speaking time, which imo, isn't long enough for him to sound incoherent or for Trump to force Biden to stumble. Nonetheless, I expect Trump to come out swinging.
I think you're obviously right that people are looking at Joe Biden as the safe choice, I just don't know how Trump can paint Biden as a non-normal candidate. He isn't a great debater and I think Clinton outclassed him in every way last election cycle during the debates. Trump came off as unhinged, to put it mild, during the first debate against Clinton but reduced his tone and demeanor for the second and third debates which I think were better performances by miles. Trump also won't have a crowd which will hurt him -- no reactions to his witty or shocking lines..ie "you'd be in jail" to Hillary Clinton which made the crowd go insane.
Some other predictions - I think Joe Biden will obviously make the case of COVID-19 against Trump repeating the line "200k dead". Trump's best case for this probably is forcing Joe Biden to acknowledge he would not have done much different, that he listened to Dr. Fauci (very popular person among households), and that Joe Biden called Trump's travel ban racist/xeonphobic. Trump can also talk about how he provided governors with the equipment they needed when they requested for it.
Economy would be great for Trump. There is no denying that pre COVID the Trump economy was great. Record low unemployment, high stock prices, 401k growth, all the rest, yadda yadda. I think he has a few job reports numbers that were ahead of predictions that Trump can cite post COVID which would give him a good appeal for convincing Americans that we are on the road to a V shaped recovery, GRANTED that we open up the rest of the country. Americans are opposed to lock downs, so I expect Trump to attack democrats in general on their pro lock down stances.
Other than that, I'm looking forward to watching old men that are barely alive verbally berate each other for 90 minutes which is always a blast.
I think you're obviously right that people are looking at Joe Biden as the safe choice, I just don't know how Trump can paint Biden as a non-normal candidate. He isn't a great debater and I think Clinton outclassed him in every way last election cycle during the debates. Trump came off as unhinged, to put it mild, during the first debate against Clinton but reduced his tone and demeanor for the second and third debates which I think were better performances by miles. Trump also won't have a crowd which will hurt him -- no reactions to his witty or shocking lines..ie "you'd be in jail" to Hillary Clinton which made the crowd go insane.
Some other predictions - I think Joe Biden will obviously make the case of COVID-19 against Trump repeating the line "200k dead". Trump's best case for this probably is forcing Joe Biden to acknowledge he would not have done much different, that he listened to Dr. Fauci (very popular person among households), and that Joe Biden called Trump's travel ban racist/xeonphobic. Trump can also talk about how he provided governors with the equipment they needed when they requested for it.
Economy would be great for Trump. There is no denying that pre COVID the Trump economy was great. Record low unemployment, high stock prices, 401k growth, all the rest, yadda yadda. I think he has a few job reports numbers that were ahead of predictions that Trump can cite post COVID which would give him a good appeal for convincing Americans that we are on the road to a V shaped recovery, GRANTED that we open up the rest of the country. Americans are opposed to lock downs, so I expect Trump to attack democrats in general on their pro lock down stances.
Other than that, I'm looking forward to watching old men that are barely alive verbally berate each other for 90 minutes which is always a blast.
I don't think I've ever watched a presidential debate, as I view them as a contest for the best liar.
But I'll be watching this one - shocking that someone can still claim they pay a lot of taxes when someone is looking at their returns and can see they did not.
$400 million in loans coming due in the next presidential term? Trump is the kind of guy who will sell out people for money. I would think most tax evaders are that way.
But I'll be watching this one - shocking that someone can still claim they pay a lot of taxes when someone is looking at their returns and can see they did not.
$400 million in loans coming due in the next presidential term? Trump is the kind of guy who will sell out people for money. I would think most tax evaders are that way.
The first presidential debate is tonight. Unlike the conventions, the debates do get quite a bit of viewership. The first 2016 debate had an average viewership of 84 million; for comparison, the Super Bowl a few months later had 111 million average viewers -- not that much higher. Most viewers are "cheering for their team", and are not particularly convinceable, though debate performance may affect enthusiasm. If you agree with everything your candidate says in the debate, but you don't see their performance as some kind of slam dunk, and the media is mixed about who actually "won", then you may be less enthusiastic and therefore less likely to vote. If you see your candidate as totally destroying the other guy, then this may really fire you up to vote.
Trump is pretty far behind Biden in the polls, so he could really use some excellent debates. It's not good enough for Trump to come out of the debates looking like the person who best made his points. It's not really helpful for Trump to come out ahead on any debates of actual issues (abortion, taxes, etc.); rather, Trump needs to make Biden not look like the safe choice. Most people who are going to vote for Biden are doing it because they don't like Trump (to varying degrees), and they view Biden as a "safe enough" return to the pre-Trump status quo. Even if Biden looks a bit weak in the debate, or he communicates his policy ideas worse, or in many cases even if viewers disagree with most of Biden's policies: if voters don't like Trump and they come out of these debates thinking that Biden looks like a normal, boring politician, then they're likely to vote for him.
The best case for Trump would be for Biden to get visibly angry and incoherent, as he has a few times on the campaign trail and in a few interviews. Maybe Trump can goad him into this, but surely Biden's campaign will have anticipated this strategy and taken every possible step to prevent it. Biden's performance in the primary debates was boring, but he didn't fall apart, and that would probably be a good enough performance here. Trump will attack Biden much more strongly than any of the Democratic candidates did, though.
If Trump can't make Biden completely fall apart, then his goals will be:
- Have a lot of good attack lines that will fire up his base.
- Avoid looking like a crazy, dangerous person, as this could fire up Biden's base and put off swing voters.
- Paint Biden as dangerously radical. (Though I think it's difficult to credibly do this, since it's not how Biden comes off whatsoever.)
- Point to the fact that Biden in many ways created the problems which caused people to resort to voting Trump in 2016
(Some of these are contradictory, so it'd be difficult to do all of them.)
A boring/ordinary debate is a Biden win, even if Trump is ultimately seen as a slight "debate winner". Trump needs to turn every policy/issue into a way of attacking Biden, and these attacks have to be really effective. I think that Trump probably won't be able to do well enough to move the needle. While Biden isn't all there mentally, IMO Trump's mental faculties have also degraded since 2016, he's in a worse political position, and Biden is more likeable than Hillary. But if Trump does pull it off, then it'll be a very interesting debate!
Trump is pretty far behind Biden in the polls, so he could really use some excellent debates. It's not good enough for Trump to come out of the debates looking like the person who best made his points. It's not really helpful for Trump to come out ahead on any debates of actual issues (abortion, taxes, etc.); rather, Trump needs to make Biden not look like the safe choice. Most people who are going to vote for Biden are doing it because they don't like Trump (to varying degrees), and they view Biden as a "safe enough" return to the pre-Trump status quo. Even if Biden looks a bit weak in the debate, or he communicates his policy ideas worse, or in many cases even if viewers disagree with most of Biden's policies: if voters don't like Trump and they come out of these debates thinking that Biden looks like a normal, boring politician, then they're likely to vote for him.
The best case for Trump would be for Biden to get visibly angry and incoherent, as he has a few times on the campaign trail and in a few interviews. Maybe Trump can goad him into this, but surely Biden's campaign will have anticipated this strategy and taken every possible step to prevent it. Biden's performance in the primary debates was boring, but he didn't fall apart, and that would probably be a good enough performance here. Trump will attack Biden much more strongly than any of the Democratic candidates did, though.
If Trump can't make Biden completely fall apart, then his goals will be:
- Have a lot of good attack lines that will fire up his base.
- Avoid looking like a crazy, dangerous person, as this could fire up Biden's base and put off swing voters.
- Paint Biden as dangerously radical. (Though I think it's difficult to credibly do this, since it's not how Biden comes off whatsoever.)
- Point to the fact that Biden in many ways created the problems which caused people to resort to voting Trump in 2016
(Some of these are contradictory, so it'd be difficult to do all of them.)
A boring/ordinary debate is a Biden win, even if Trump is ultimately seen as a slight "debate winner". Trump needs to turn every policy/issue into a way of attacking Biden, and these attacks have to be really effective. I think that Trump probably won't be able to do well enough to move the needle. While Biden isn't all there mentally, IMO Trump's mental faculties have also degraded since 2016, he's in a worse political position, and Biden is more likeable than Hillary. But if Trump does pull it off, then it'll be a very interesting debate!
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