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Topic: Re: Farewell - page 2. (Read 3053 times)

member
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February 01, 2024, 09:33:09 AM
You willfully missed the entire point. Nobody here is swayed by your arguments, regardless of how many times you repost the same text over and over again.

I'm not sure you're capable of experiencing humility, so there's no reason to continue this discussion.

I guess I didn't leave out any context then.  I rigorously proved that o_e_l_e_o was knowingly lying about open source privacy projects and convincing users to give up custody of their funds and data to ChipMixer, who scammed their depositors.
legendary
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February 01, 2024, 09:30:24 AM

You willfully missed the entire point. Nobody here is swayed by your arguments, regardless of how many times you repost the same text over and over again.

I'm not sure you're capable of experiencing humility, so there's no reason to continue this discussion.
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February 01, 2024, 09:14:00 AM
You actually believe that framing things out of context helps your argument... It does not, because most of us see right through what you are doing.

What context have I left out?  Please provide it.

- o_e_l_e_o is allowed to hold his own viewpoints... if they differ from theymos' that is not a case of "backstabbing."

o_e_l_e_o's viewpoints confirmed that Wasabi's privacy is not compromised by coordinator policy:

TIMELINE

March 14 2022 - o_e_l_e_o admits coordinator policy doesn’t affect your inputs, admits to BlackHatCoiner that switching coordinators solves the censorship problem, and admits to BlackHatCoiner that his motivation is simply to fight against Wasabi anyways:

Even if this change from Wasabi won't affect any of your inputs, they are no longer an entity which I can trust to fight for my privacy.

Would it be possible for some to start running coordinators?
Absolutely. The coordinator code is open source, so anyone can download it and spin up their own instance. That would solve the immediate problem if everyone switched to a different coordinator, but it doesn't stop these other coordinators being pressured in to implementing the same restrictions and it doesn't change the fact that Wasabi did this in the first place instead of fighting against it.

March 15 2022 - o_e_l_e_o admits that the data feed is a 1 way street from a blockchain analysis company to the coordinator, and that no data is provided to blockchain analysis:

In fact, they need to cooperate with blockchain analysis to obtain information about "taint" UTXOs.
Well, they only need to cooperate in this sense to have the blockchain analysis entity feed them data about which UTXO's to block. But as I said, if they cooperate like this then it won't be long before that cooperation becomes a two way street, with them feeding data back to the blockchain analysis entity.

- he is not "miseducating" the forum by expressing his viewpoints.

o_e_l_e_o is miseducating users by telling them that a trusted third party provides better privacy than trustless software:

August 23 2022 – o_e_l_e_o lies and says the custodian he partnered with that stole everyone’s deposits and turned over their data to the government has as good or better privacy than Wasabi

If projects such as Samourai, JoinMarket, ChipMixer, Bisq, LocalCryptos, Monero, and anything else which gives users as good or better privacy than Wasabi can continue unencumbered, then Wasabi can too. They simply choose not to.

- theymos hasn't mentioned Wasabi since 2019. Its quite possible his opinion has changed in the last 4 years. As I already mentioned, he also said this:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins

It just so happens these are currently both giant, omnipresent concerns with Wasabi.

Wasabi massively upgraded in 2022 to a brand new coinjoin protocol, it's quite possible he's even more impressed than when he originally awarded Wasabi & JoinMarket the bounty.

You're obviously here to protect a vested business interest, but you should attempt to have the insight to understand when you are doing more harm than good.

I'm here to help people improve their privacy and stop getting scammed, there's no "vested business interest" because the software is completely open source.

If you have no ability or desire to self-reflect on your actions and correct your behavior, then you will be cursed with a shitty reputation. This holds true in all aspects of life.

I've passionately defended using Bitcoin non custodially and privately against o_e_l_e_o who betrayed the Bitcointalk community by looting their coins and data with ChipMixer.  If you think this behavior needs to be "corrected", it sounds like you are against self custody and privacy.
legendary
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February 01, 2024, 09:03:38 AM
Why do you think o_e_l_e_o would backstab theymos and miseducate the users of his forum by telling them the opposite?

You actually believe that framing things out of context helps your argument... It does not, because most of us see right through what you are doing.

 - o_e_l_e_o is allowed to hold his own viewpoints... if they differ from theymos' that is not a case of "backstabbing."

 - he is not "miseducating" the forum by expressing his viewpoints.

 - theymos hasn't mentioned Wasabi since 2019. Its quite possible his opinion has changed in the last 4 years. As I already mentioned, he also said this:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins

It just so happens these are currently both giant, omnipresent concerns with Wasabi.

You're obviously here to protect a vested business interest, but you should attempt to have the insight to understand when you are doing more harm than good.

If you have no ability or desire to self-reflect on your actions and correct your behavior, then you will be cursed with a shitty reputation. This holds true in all aspects of life.
member
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February 01, 2024, 08:12:23 AM
Whether they deleted the private keys or not (we have no evidence they didn't), how does that prove what you claim?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?

We do have evidence that ChipMixer did not delete the private keys, I proved my claim with these victim testimonials:

Even my chips which I had in chipmixer service for which they claimed to "delete private" keys after 7 days or whatever, were seized/transfered. and these transactions took place good 3 months ago.
It seems that you are right, whoever had vouchers or chips was left without them. I checked some old wallets older than 1 year that only contained chips from CM, and they were all emptied. Yes, it's a bit stupid that I didn't spend them, but honestly I forgot about a few $ in those old wallets. It's really strange that it wasn't all deleted, but now we at least know where even 7GB of data came from.
Can confirm, they stole a chip of mine a friend of mine that he hadn't yet spent. :/ Really fucking bad practice of ChipMixer to keep private keys, not gonna lie.
It was still there today morning and even when the news broke here; I he had not considered that private keys may have been backed up on CM servers to be honest.

What made you think I was interested in some software from some shitty company you're promoting? Well, let me make that clear: I'm not!

You were the one who brought up theymos' perspective on this issue. As I pointed out, theymos' statements confirm that Wasabi improves your privacy compared to centralized mixers.  Why do you think o_e_l_e_o would backstab theymos and miseducate the users of his forum by telling them the opposite?
legendary
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February 01, 2024, 07:46:34 AM
I already answered your question, I provided the quote from directly from Chipmixer where they said they deleted the private keys:

Whether they deleted the private keys or not (we have no evidence they didn't), how does that prove what you claim?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?


Why do you think o_e_l_e_o backstabbed theymos and told everyone to use centralized mixers instead of Wasabi?

What made you think I was interested in some software from some shitty company you're promoting? Well, let me make that clear: I'm not!
member
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February 01, 2024, 06:48:06 AM
Now why didn't you answer my question?

Why didn't you answer my question?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?


I already answered your question, I provided the quote from directly from Chipmixer where they said they deleted the private keys:

It's not an "exaggeration", ChipMixer explicitly claimed that they delete the private keys:

Destroying the session deletes chip private key.

^This was a scam.

Just answer my question:

Which was obviously bad judgment on your part, because otherwise your post wouldn't have been deleted, and theymos wouldn't have moved the rest of your posts to a separate thread.

Okay, if you want to appeal to authority, let's quote theymos directly:

For everyone looking to improve their privacy, I highly recommend checking out Wasabi, especially over centralized "mixers".

Why do you think o_e_l_e_o backstabbed theymos and told everyone to use centralized mixers instead of Wasabi?
legendary
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February 01, 2024, 06:44:46 AM
Now why didn't you answer my question?

Why didn't you answer my question?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?
member
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February 01, 2024, 06:25:30 AM
Your baseless accusations are as empty as your head.  ChipMixer did NOT stole everyone's coins, and you're just spewing nonsense without a shred of proof and intentionally spreading lies to advance your own agenda, just as you falsely accused o_e_l_e_o with no evidence to support your claims.

I already showed you the evidence ChipMixer was a scam, remember?

While I think we're getting a bit off track, but you're the one spreading lies here.

1. Chipmixer did NOT steal everyone's deposits, and you have no evidence to back up that claim.

2. Chipmixer has NOT handed over any of their data to the government, and you have no proof of that either.  They were seized. As for the content of the seized data, we can only speculate, the evidence is inconclusive.

3. When Leo recommended using that centralized mixing service, it was a trusted and respected platform in the community. It was promoted/endorsed by many high-ranking members, not just him, and I've never heard of any legitimate scam accusations against them. I can personally testify that they were a legitimate service, as I have used them on numerous occasions without any issues.

Here's the evidence that backs up my claim:

Even my chips which I had in chipmixer service for which they claimed to "delete private" keys after 7 days or whatever, were seized/transfered. and these transactions took place good 3 months ago.
It seems that you are right, whoever had vouchers or chips was left without them. I checked some old wallets older than 1 year that only contained chips from CM, and they were all emptied. Yes, it's a bit stupid that I didn't spend them, but honestly I forgot about a few $ in those old wallets. It's really strange that it wasn't all deleted, but now we at least know where even 7GB of data came from.
Can confirm, they stole a chip of mine a friend of mine that he hadn't yet spent. :/ Really fucking bad practice of ChipMixer to keep private keys, not gonna lie.
It was still there today morning and even when the news broke here; I he had not considered that private keys may have been backed up on CM servers to be honest.

Now why didn't you answer my question?

Which was obviously bad judgment on your part, because otherwise your post wouldn't have been deleted, and theymos wouldn't have moved the rest of your posts to a separate thread.

Okay, if you want to appeal to authority, let's quote theymos directly:

For everyone looking to improve their privacy, I highly recommend checking out Wasabi, especially over centralized "mixers".

Why do you think o_e_l_e_o backstabbed theymos and told everyone to use centralized mixers instead of Wasabi?
legendary
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February 01, 2024, 06:23:31 AM
The difference between ChipMixer and Wasabi is that ChipMixer stole everyone's coins and gave their data to the government because they are a trusted custodian.  

Your baseless accusations are as empty as your head.  ChipMixer did NOT stole everyone's coins, and you're just spewing nonsense without a shred of proof and intentionally spreading lies to advance your own agenda, just as you falsely accused o_e_l_e_o with no evidence to support your claims.

You're sounding like a Bitcoin SV troll more and more. What's your deal with them?
jr. member
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January 31, 2024, 03:32:35 PM
The difference is Wasabi fund BC analysis and give your data straight to BC analysis and are a government honeypot. So anyone doing adverts for BC analysis funding government honeypot is a scammer.
member
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January 31, 2024, 03:20:54 PM
Almost all members with Wasabi signature advert have done mixer signature advert before. Some even do Chipmixer advert before.

We should tag all them to be scammers as well. Kruwed thinks so! All Wasabi adverters are scammers!

The difference between ChipMixer and Wasabi is that ChipMixer stole everyone's coins and gave their data to the government because they are a trusted custodian.  Wasabi can't steal your coins or give anyone your data because it's non custodial and protects your information from being leaked using Tor and block filters by default.
jr. member
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January 31, 2024, 03:18:15 PM
Almost all members with Wasabi signature advert have done mixer signature advert before. Some even do Chipmixer advert before.

We should tag all them to be scammers as well. Kruwed thinks so! All Wasabi adverters are scammers!
member
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January 30, 2024, 10:24:34 PM
Do you believe theymos?

That was close to 5 years ago now. Perhaps his opinion has changed. He also said this, mind you:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins


Why do you think I'm a "piece of shit" for telling the truth about how you can keep your Bitcoins safe and data private?

That's not why. The reason why is the same reason the creation of this thread was necessitated. You think you can "win" by reframing everything to cast you as the hero instead of the villain, yet everybody can still see what you wrote.

https://ninjastic.space/search?author=kruw&topic_id=5481890

Go back to your hole.

I hope everyone sees what I wrote.  That was the point of writing it.
legendary
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January 30, 2024, 10:22:58 PM
Do you believe theymos?

That was close to 5 years ago now. Perhaps his opinion has changed. He also said this, mind you:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins


Why do you think I'm a "piece of shit" for telling the truth about how you can keep your Bitcoins safe and data private?

That's not why. The reason why is the same reason the creation of this thread was necessitated. You think you can "win" by reframing everything to cast you as the hero instead of the villain, yet everybody can still see what you wrote.

https://ninjastic.space/search?author=kruw&topic_id=5481890

Go back to your hole.
member
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January 30, 2024, 06:44:24 PM
Yeah, whatever.  If I knew I only had a short time left on this earth, the last thing on my mind would be trying to appease anyone on the internet.  I would imagine Leo doesn't agree with the arguments being made here anyhow, so doubtless he doesn't think there's anything to set straight.

His motivation shouldn't be about "appeasing anyone on the Internet", his motivation should be to leave behind a better future for Bitcoin.  However, the proof shows that o_e_l_e_o spent the last years of his life intentionally tricking people into forfeiting custody of their Bitcoins and forfeiting their financial history instead, which is a tragically sinister act.

Everyone indeed has somewhat level of stupidity in their closet but making a public display of it is absolutely irresponsible and unnecessary and you have really displayed a great deal of stupidity with all this. I don't know your motive or what you stand to gain with this public display of cruelty and stupidity but trust me, it is totally irrelevant.

My motive is the truth.  Do you think the truth is relevant?

If you've got grievances with Leo, rather than coming to a Farewell thread and publicly spitting dung for everyone to see just how full of shit you really are, you could've taken it somewhere else and let out your grievances, no one is saying you should forgive anyone for whatever grievances you've got, but for God's sake have some little conscience. I don't know if you're expecting appraisal for this crap but I'm pretty sure I'm not the one who feels disgusted by what you're doing.

Farewell threads are an appropriate place to leave your grievances with a person.  Everyone should know the damage that o_e_l_e_o caused to innocent people before he leaves the forum and they should hold him accountable for it.

Not everyone finds it necessary to engage in frivolous online arguments. And to be honest, there's no shame in that; if I were Leo, I'd rather take a nap all day than come here and attempt to clear things up. Sometimes, it's more valuable to concentrate on living your life than it is to engage in pointless internet disputes with strangers.

If he didn't want to engage in frivolous online arguments, then why did he intentionally lie about innocent open source non custodial privacy projects?  You can't falsely accuse people then claim that you don't want to engage after that since the burden of proof is on the accuser.

While I think we're getting a bit off track, but you're the one spreading lies here.

3. When Leo recommended using that centralized mixing service, it was a trusted and respected platform in the community. It was promoted/endorsed by many high-ranking members, not just him, and I've never heard of any legitimate scam accusations against them. I can personally testify that they were a legitimate service, as I have used them on numerous occasions without any issues.

So, while the claim that a centralized mixer service offers comparable or superior privacy to Wasabi can be considered a matter of opinion, it is unfair and inaccurate to label it as an outright lie.

Agreed, a lot of people uses Binance exchange, regardless the fact that it's a centralized exchange, and not only do they use it, they also recommend it to other users because it's trusted and respected, so if Binance happens to go down today, there's no way anyone would be help responsible or blamed for promoting Binance or recommending it to other users. I believe that's just the case here, so that's really not enough proof for anyone to point accusing fingers on Leo, except he'll also call out every other person on the forum that's promoted the same mixer service. Or except maybe there's another reason to why he's taking this whole thing personal.

No, you don't understand, it's a LITERAL OUTRIGHT LIE.  It doesn't matter how much you trust Binance to hold your money because there is no trust whatsoever required when holding the money yourself.

In exactly the same way this applies to custody of coins, it also applies to custody of data, so it's a literal lie to say a trusted mixing site provides better privacy than a trustless coinjoin. 

If you care about the truth, why do you spread lies?

I don't spread lies.  Can you back up your accusation with any proof?

There can be many explanations, as we have already discussed this in the CM ANN thread and other related threads. (Have you actually read the whole document posted on justice.gov?) Since FBI agents have been monitoring the site and collecting evidence since 2021, we don't know for sure when they got the private keys or if they were used or unused "chips" at that time.  So, it is still possible that CM deleted the used private keys as they claimed, and the FBI could have gotten them beforehand.  

But, there's no need to repeat everything here just for your convenience. If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?

I'm not lying, this scam is also validated by law enforcement themselves, they admitted to taking control of ChipMixer's coins:

Which was obviously bad judgment on your part, because otherwise your post wouldn't have been deleted, and theymos wouldn't have moved the rest of your posts to a separate thread.

Okay, if you want to appeal to authority, let's quote theymos directly:

For everyone looking to improve their privacy, I highly recommend checking out Wasabi, especially over centralized "mixers".

Why do you think o_e_l_e_o backstabbed theymos and told everyone to use centralized mixers instead of Wasabi?

I've taken a small break from the forums. This thread is still seriously going on?

Yes, you still need to answer this:

Have some respect, that person may literally lose his life and here you are whining about what he said in the past. No one cares about your little bitcoin project. You are retarded

I may lose my life too, so why aren't you holding o_e_l_e_o accountable for spreading lies about flaws in untraceable privacy software?  

Isn't it proved yet that the guy who created this topic is either extreme-level toxic or just a troll? Why are you guys paying attention to this guy? I do not believe anything that has come from this user. I cannot imagine that Wassabi hired such screwed-minded people to engage with the community. I see several people say that it's not proved that he is officially from Wasabi. Fuck you guys! Wassabi wallet owner aren't going to this forum to confirm that he is their employee. If you believe, good. If not, very good, please stay away and do not bump this thread anymore. There are just friendly advise.

Do you believe theymos?

For everyone looking to improve their privacy, I highly recommend checking out Wasabi, especially over centralized "mixers".


His continued engagement is just keeping the thread active and spreading the word of what a piece of shit he is so there is that. Smiley


Why do you think I'm a "piece of shit" for telling the truth about how you can keep your Bitcoins safe and data private?
legendary
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January 30, 2024, 11:24:51 AM
Isn't it proved yet that the guy who created this topic is either extreme-level toxic or just a troll? Why are you guys paying attention to this guy? I do not believe anything that has come from this user. I cannot imagine that Wassabi hired such screwed-minded people to engage with the community. I see several people say that it's not proved that he is officially from Wasabi. Fuck you guys! Wassabi wallet owner aren't going to this forum to confirm that he is their employee. If you believe, good. If not, very good, please stay away and do not bump this thread anymore. There are just friendly advise.



His continued engagement is just keeping the thread active and spreading the word of what a piece of shit he is so there is that. Smiley
hero member
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January 30, 2024, 10:26:02 AM
Isn't it proved yet that the guy who created this topic is either extreme-level toxic or just a troll? Why are you guys paying attention to this guy? I do not believe anything that has come from this user. I cannot imagine that Wassabi hired such screwed-minded people to engage with the community. I see several people say that it's not proved that he is officially from Wasabi. Fuck you guys! Wassabi wallet owner aren't going to this forum to confirm that he is their employee. If you believe, good. If not, very good, please stay away and do not bump this thread anymore. There are just friendly advise.
member
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January 30, 2024, 09:42:00 AM
I've taken a small break from the forums. This thread is still seriously going on?
legendary
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January 30, 2024, 05:57:01 AM
I don't care about people's feelings, I care about the truth.

If you care about the truth, why do you spread lies?

As you can see, I do not have a double standard because I always make sure my accusations are backed up with proof.

Let's see about that:

That's your opinion, but I disagree. They were seized by a government and all available private keys were confiscated. That's not the definition of a scam.

If ChipMixer wasn't a scam, please explain how all the NON available private keys that ChipMixer said they deleted were also confiscated.

There can be many explanations, as we have already discussed this in the CM ANN thread and other related threads. (Have you actually read the whole document posted on justice.gov?) Since FBI agents have been monitoring the site and collecting evidence since 2021, we don't know for sure when they got the private keys or if they were used or unused "chips" at that time.  So, it is still possible that CM deleted the used private keys as they claimed, and the FBI could have gotten them beforehand.  

But, there's no need to repeat everything here just for your convenience. If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?

As I mentioned earlier, if o_e_l_e_o's farewell thread said he was leaving the forum to become a Buddhist monk or Amish farmer, my "Good Riddance" post would not change at all, because no mention was made whatsoever about his physical condition.  

Which was obviously bad judgment on your part, because otherwise your post wouldn't have been deleted, and theymos wouldn't have moved the rest of your posts to a separate thread.

But you are digressing again, why did you previously lie that you posted proof about o_e_l_e_o when in fact that post doesn't contain any proof at all?  You seem to have a habit of lying a lot.   Tongue
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