Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 37. (Read 75434 times)

First things first , you would not want to draw the attention to Zaporizhia only right? Of course not..

Kursk update



(delayed, as there are operational security lags)

- There is a large scale evacuation in Kursk.
- The Ukrainian troops are in full control of an area of 15 deep x 30 wide km (this is wider than the Avdiivka front for comparison).
- Ruzzia has built trenches along the Kurskaya nuclear power plant. The problem as I see it is that they would eventually need to put troops in them.
- Ukraine is still advancing and there has been some incursions in the Belgorod border.
- Ruzzia was able to pull out a limited attack on the eastern part of the new front, with little success.


On Zaporizhia

Thanks for looking to the source yourself, but next time try to quote what is relevant to avoid getting caught again masking the facts, like you have done in the past.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/iaea-unable-determine-cause-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-plant-fire-2024-08-12/


1. The IAEA needs to be neutral, even when they clearly see things, they cannot say them because Ruzzia would expel them.
2. The IAEA would not want nor be able to determine who did what, they are there only to look after nuclear safety.
3. There is no statement whatsoever saying Ukraine did it nor Ruzzia did it.

However, in your same source they do say, and this is bold and brave from them:


So..., this is your theory, just to make sure I understand. Ukraine gained access to the cooling towers of Zaporizhia by (fill the blanks). They put in there like a ton of burning material (I do not give a shit if it is a tire or a 10 barrels of oil). It had to be a lot, because the fire was visible from a long long distance and there was smoke at large during quite a long time.

Nobody noticed how all that material was being put in place. All the troops and security of Ruzzia in the Nuclear Plant did not see it because....(fill in blanks). Nobody noticed that someone had to put fuel and make that burn.

Ukraine decided to put at risk a nuclear plant in the middle of their country, in a place in which it would be certain that Ukraine will certainly have radiation all over THEIR OWN country because (fill in blanks). (casually coinciding with the moment in which they are doing and "special operation" in Ruzzia near the Kursk nuclear plant).

I would say that according to your theory, the level of incompetence in Ruzzia would be astonishing, but I am afraid that there is an easier explanation.

You should start watching you credibility after this, although I understand you cannot deviate from the official versions, no matter how incredible. BTW the official Ruzzian version speaks of a drone. Just looking at the pictures below you can see that a drone will not cause something like this, so precisely located under the cooling tower for maximum "drama", there needs to be flammable material, etc....

When it's all over...

Russia itself staged a provocation at the nuclear power plant, they also need to somehow take their eyes off the Kursk region.

Never heard of war? Ukraine seems nuclear disaster prone. Chernobyl 2 ? ? ?

How many times UA was active on RU land before? Are there other differences besides scale this time? How did all the previous UA operations on RU land end up? But i guess in your propaganda land, outcome of the mission doesn't matter as long as you claim all of them a success from the start.



Well, apparently you couch warriors can spot (exploding?) rubber tire fire much better than IAEA after actually inspecting the cooling tower, or you're caught lying once again

Speaking of reading skills... Shall we agree on some of these or are you trying to ignore it as usual:

1. Ukrainian army is active in Kusrk Oblast.
2. There seems to be a chunk of land taken, lets say that Ruzzia sources speak of 140 km2. Would you like to give your figure?
3. There are a number of Ruzzian conscripts that are now PoW.
4. Ruzzian advance in Adviidka took less land, and took many months.

So... all propaganda right?


I do not see how anyone could have gone into the central under Ruzzian occupation, in Ukraine, start burning stuff there (in the middle of Ukraine) ....

But of course, our trolls here think that Ukraine's best move is to create a massive radioactive threat in the middle of Ukraine in a facility that is fully occupied and controlled by Ruzzia since more than a year  

You need to work on your reading comprehension skills. Let me highlight the relevant part so you that you'll have to pivot to something else in your silly propaganda attempts
3-UA manages to hold on to the taken Russian land when negotiations begin, securing themselves some leverage in negotiations
"LOL - so in your world this mission is only successful if it collapses Ruzzia"

And there we have it, already a successful mission, regardless if UA can even hold the land. UA then should totally repeat it, pull more troops and air defenses from Donbas into these raid missions on RU, opening even more fronts. As long as we can call them all successful in the first few days it'll be a PR win, and it doesn't really matter what happens with the mission after that




Yes Russia is destroying the NPP under it's control just like it blew up Nord Stream pipeline that it built to send gas to Germany. Everyone just blindly believes that and there are absolutely no reason to even question any aspect of that. I bet when UA forces will be retreating from Sudzha gas metering station, that's sending RU gas to Europe, it will also mysteriously get blown up by "Russia". Just make sure to get more Newbie accounts so we'd all totally believe that  

Russia set it on fire, who else could it be? After Buchi and others, I have no doubt that Russia is creating terror.

A large fire has been seen in the Zaporyia Nuclear Plant. For those who have live in another planet for years, this is the largest nuclear complex with 5 reactors  in the Ruzzian occupied Zaporyia Oblast. I really hope they are burning a few weeds or doing a camp fire. A nuclear accident in Zapo could hit Ukraine, Ruzzia and several NATO countries.

https://youtu.be/mlK4a8X3FEo

It seems to me that it is necessary to publish daily reports on this topic, because Ukrainians are confidently moving forward

Dude, you are calling propaganda on facts... unless you choose to disagree in some fundamental facts?? So, you say, there are no Ukrainian troops in Kursk, they have not taken a signigicant chunk of land, they have not taken a large number of PoW and at least two on the convoys sent to repel have not been destroyed?  So it is not happening, it is not much faster than anything Ruzzia has been able to pull in the last year? All that is "propaganda"?

Are you trying again and again to divert the attention to what I say, instead of what it is actually happening?? Are you trying to score a "dialectical win" of some short that will give Ruzzia back all the lost territory?

LOL - so in your world this mission is only successful if it collapses Ruzzia   and pretty much ends the war?? That is the equivalent of saying that a chess move is only successful if it check-mates the opponent   It is much simpler, this is a good move because it improves the situation of Ukraine and deteriorates the situation of Ruzzia.

The mission HAS been successful already within the timeframe of a few days, in terms of land, prisoners, equipment destroyed and political impact. It can be even a greater success if Ruzzia fails to send support to the area and do it fast enough. It gives Ukraine yet another card to play with in the future.

I have no idea of what the Ukrainian command will do - neither do you - all I am saying is that there are significant resources, these were gathered under Ruzzia's nose for a veeery long time, that Ukraine is digging into the taken territory and it is unlikely that they will withdraw like in previous incursions.

I understand it is difficult for you to assume that Ruzzia was so utterly unprepared for this contingency, but... you do not get "victory points" for crying.

And once again, you prove that propaganda cannot allow for a loosing scenario (craftier propaganda will allow for a downside as long as conditions are unattainable). Whatever happened is already a victory, and the outcome doesn't really matter, well, because this was already a success

And what I'm saying is when you're retreating daily and cannot protect your power infrastructure, pulling your best troops, equipment and desperately needed air-defense into an attack on some villages that don't hold and military strategic value cannot be a successful military operation, but it's not trying to be by design. That is, it's a psyop mission which can be successful if:
1-It brings a political victory i.e. destabilizes Russia from within, RU hawks will demand total capture of Kiev requiring new wave of mobilization, leading to civil unrest
2-Rogue general turns onto Moscow (Prigozhin style)
3-UA manages to hold on to the taken Russian land when negotiations begin, securing themselves some leverage in negotiations

Without achieving these targets this would be a failure. Where propaganda must constantly hedge exposure and ignore the risks. It's already a success even if UA retreats, because then i'll just claim that we managed to get some PoWs which was totally worth it   Surely everyone would ignore the development elsewhere on the frontline and just believe such logic

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At any cost? Even if this allows RU to more easily capture Pokrovs, Kupyansk and all of Donbas? You know, you might be on to something, if you can help sell that to UA people as a victory then there's definitely a baseline for negotiations and i'll bet you'll get the support from both sides. I can see it now, Russia gets control of all 4 new territories, change of leadership in UA, no NATO in UA, and Kherson gets traded for Kursk. Everyone wins! Now start selling this to UA!

I think Ukrainians will gain a foothold there for a long time. The most important thing is to suppress the Russian planes and not let them drop guided bombs, here I think the F-16 will help

It could be, I mean, I am sure that you will find some people in the region originally from Ukraine that feel oppressed and mistreated by Putin, and according to Putin's own doctrine, you are free to invade a region if there are protests.

There is actually a funny video by a Ruzzian guy that is stopped and passport-checked by an Ukrainian soldier that tells him to learn the Ukrainian anthem and get ready for a referendum.

get ready to vote

Speaking of which - another convoy heading to the area got HIMARSed during the day. This is plainly ridiculous - there drove during the day and did a stop in the road ... they could as well have Telegramed their location to the Ukrainian army.

Sudzha is to all effects encircled by Ukraine and there is going to be likely a large number of PoW taken from there.

There seems to be another vector of attack in Belgorod, very small for now - who knows... may become the next Kursk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EG5CGOXDsxI

I'm all for it, everything is natural and correct.

Gentlemen, when will there be a referendum on the inclusion of new Kursk lands?

Russia isn't standing still for Ukraine's push into Russian lands. For the moment, Russia is only acting defensively. But soon they will be wiping out the Ukrainian terrorists.

Read between the lines.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0qedq0penko

If you have no clue on numbers, you should think twice before calling suicidal, bad strategy, etc... I think in fact you are still trying to make this look like and incursion - sorry to break this to you - it is not, there are significant forces of Ukraine involved.

I do not think Ukraine will withdraw in a few days, they have not sent just a few vehicles as of right now they are still pushing forward. Still, I would not measure success in terms of Ukraine retrating -  they can retire but the PoW conscripts are now in Ukrainian detention camps, the two Ruzzian convoys that were detected going in support are now destroyed, the reputation of Ruzzia and the Ruzzian government takes a hit... I think it is already a quite decent operation as it is now.

RE calling propaganda... well, it is not: Ukraine has taken several localities in days. Ruzzia has taken several localities in months. It is an absolutely fair comparison ... I understand that you do not like it - it is impossible to deny they obvious. This is not about "taking a well fortified position", because war does not give points for effort. Ukraine has taken plenty of land, very quickly and if Ruzzia was not ready to defend it... too bad. (well, in fact Ukraine did break the Surovikin line).

This is not a rushed attack, the preparation took at least a month. Again, if Ruzzia was looking to their own but and did not see it is Ruzzia's problem Again, there are no extra points for being inept.

One of the major points about this war is, if one does not live right within the war zones, he will never know what happens for sure. The media is slanted and twisted, especially the standard, government semi-controlled media in America.

One can focus on any happening in the war zone, and it might look like the war is going this way or that. Until one takes the whole thing into account, he will never know the truth.

1-From what i read the consensus seems to be that this attack caught Russians unprepared, Russia didn't expect such brazen frontal attack. Such "blitzkrieg" is typically to attacker advantage as long as they can sustain movement and keep outmaneuvering defenders. No clue on absolute numbers, believe i read RU side claimed 1k UA losses.
2-If we only view these past 3 days, as Ukraine advanced for the first time since the counteroffensive, and caught Russia by surprise, logically UA would take in more PoW than RU. But overall i believe RU still has overwhelmingly more UA's PoWs than UA.
3-Operations is still ongoing so it's all fluid and no one will release true numbers, but some reports claims 100s of km^2 on first 3 days, reportedly since then Russia has already liberated Martynovka. But once again it's still ongoing
4-What's the benefit for Russia loosing land   rhetorical question.

1b-Silly propaganda attempt, more specifically, false comparison, trying to equate taking a well fortified city on the frontline for years to a surprise attack across the border taking few villages.
2b-Again trying to compare attacking well fortified position to a rushed surprised attack.
3b-All of western intelligence is concentrated on Ukraine. NATO has exponentially more satellites than Russia, so naturally it's intelligence would be better. Don't think anyone would argue against that. Plus it's hard to predict such suicidal attacks.

Now, how high were UA losses protecting Avdiivka, and what are RU losses during this operation?
 
So if Ukraine will retreat in few days you'd concede that this operation was a failure?


As expected, looks like Russia is tapping into it's 300k of conscripts on it's land, instead of pulling contractors from the front line. Desperate attempt to destabilize Russia from within. Should know in few days how well that worked.

Militarily, seems like UA is not only planning for a possibility of a retreat but also expecting Russia won't be satisfied with just getting it's territory back but will push further and enter Sumy.


Seems that we can both agree that regardless of the outcome, this operation brings negotiations closer. Which everyone should welcome.

But these events also set yet another terrible precedent onto our world. Now countries can openly equip third country and just pay for their soldiers to invade/attack another country, while claiming not to be a party to the conflict. I'm sure a lot of good will come out of this in the future. This of course has been done many times before in our history, but never with countries openly admitting to it like now. If UN will let this slide, it would be catastrophic, would mean that they managed to completely destroy the core idea for UN.