Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 84. (Read 73577 times)

The only fact is that, as I said, there is only speculation and you, as usual, copy-paste whatever article seems to be friendly to your version. So... nothing new here. BTW, I do see an newspaper speaking on behalf of the "European Investigators", not a quote of whatever the "investigators" have "investigated" or whatever they have said, so first problem here: not the original source, which should be easy to access for a super-news-aggregator user like you.

Ruzzia could have done it yes. The fact that the Polish are accused of not being cooperative by the "investigators" is nothing new, they are rarely fast or cooperative with the Germans the "investigators" - perhaps due to some bad experiences with Germans "investigators".

Actually i just browse news aggregator sites like news.google.com for keyword "Ukraine" and filter for last day to stay updated on the topic. But keep thinking that i'm an agent of Kremlin. It's interesting to watch your reaction when i point to western media pivoting, which is typically a precursor to political pivot.

Circling back to Nord Stream missed this one from few days back


But hey no "facts" here, so must mean that Russia did it, but then now Poles are covering for Russia!?!?


Edi: Added the left out Wall Street Journal citation

This makes no sense. Can tell by the percentage of loaded and otherwise idiotic questions with relation to the total content of your post, in this case 100%.

You can stop pretending, I doubt anyone here believes that you just found the article browsing Guardian's website and thought "hm, this sounds credible". You lifted this from whatever sewage you lift all your Kremlin talking points and thought that those western idiots in this thread would surely believe anything coming from their western media because obviously all western media works the same and does only what Biden tells it to do.

Hate to disappoint you, but this is so ludicrous outside of Putinstan that you're really wasting your time trying this cherry-picking shit over and over again. Just post links to Medvedev's drunk telegram posts and we'll at least know that you're being honest.

Nord Stream Probe Hampered by Resistance From Poland

BERLIN—Polish officials have resisted cooperating with an international probe into the sabotage of the Nord Stream natural-gas pipelines and failed to disclose potentially crucial evidence, according to European investigators working on the case.
Those Polish officials have been slow to provide information and withheld key evidence about the alleged saboteurs’ movements on Polish soil, investigators said. They are now hoping the new government in Warsaw, which took office in December, will help shed light on the attack.

European investigators have long believed the attack was launched from Ukraine via Poland. But they say Warsaw’s failure to fully cooperate has made it hard to establish whether the attack happened with or without the former Polish government’s knowledge, according to senior officials.

Some senior European officials say they are considering approaching the office of Donald Tusk, Poland’s new prime minister, for help in investigating the biggest act of sabotage on the European continent since World War II.
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The Nord Stream pipelines, connecting Russia to Germany underneath the Baltic Sea, were blown up in September 2022. This added pressure on Germany and others to make themselves independent from Russian fuel supplies.

Investigators haven’t offered evidence linking the Polish government to the explosions and say that even if some Polish officials were involved, it could have been without the knowledge of the political leadership. Yet they say efforts by Polish officials to hinder their investigation have made them increasingly suspicious of Warsaw’s role and motives.
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Most Western security officials believe that a Ukrainian crew, operating with or without sanction from Kyiv, was behind the sabotage. Ukraine has denied any involvement.
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An investigation by Germany, Denmark and Sweden has so far found that the pipeline was blown up by a crew of six, including deep-sea divers, traveling on a leisure yacht called Andromeda. On its voyage, Andromeda stopped in all three countries, as well as Poland, according to investigators. The boat, leased in Germany via a Polish company, contained traces of octagon, the same explosive that was found at the underwater blast sites, they said.
After mining parts of the pipelines, the crew docked in Poland’s Baltic port of Kołobrzeg, where they spent a full day, according to investigators who tracked the boat by analyzing its navigation system data, the crew’s mobile-phone communications, satellite imagery and witnesses’ accounts.

A port official suspicious about the five men and one woman, all of whom spoke a mixture of Russian and Ukrainian, alerted police. On Sept. 19, Poland’s border guard checked the identification of the crew, who produced European Union passports and were allowed to continue their trip, sailing back up north, where they laid the rest of the mines, investigators say.

Polish authorities didn’t share this information with European investigators until March 2023—and they only did so after being contacted by their German counterparts. Berlin was tipped off in January about the yacht’s stay in Poland by the Dutch military intelligence service, whose information came from someone in Ukraine.

A number of Polish agencies declined to share with European investigators footage of the suspects taken by CCTV cameras while the yacht was moored there, those investigators said. The investigators have established that the boat and its crew were exposed to security cameras throughout their stay in the port.
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In one instance, Polish prosecutors told their European counterparts that no explosives were found on the Andromeda, although no forensic investigation had taken place. Yet the Polish internal security service told European investigators that the border guard officers who had checked the crew never boarded the boat, contradicting the prosecutor’s claim.

In one instance, Polish prosecutors told their European counterparts that no explosives were found on the Andromeda, although no forensic investigation had taken place. Yet the Polish internal security service told European investigators that the border guard officers who had checked the crew never boarded the boat, contradicting the prosecutor’s claim.

German investigators waited at least two months before obtaining a meeting with their Polish counterparts in mid-May last year, according to the European officials. They left the meeting with the impression that some Polish colleagues were unwilling or unable to cooperate.
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In September, Stanislaw Zaryn, a senior Polish official then involved in overseeing Poland’s security services, dismissed the findings that the Andromeda crew was behind the sabotage, saying the crew had no military training and were merely tourists “looking for fun.”
Around the same time, Poland’s internal security service circulated with European investigators alleged intelligence that the Andromeda had links with Russian espionage, which they alleged was behind the attack. Some investigators said they considered this to be disinformation.
Zaryn, who left office following the election, said in a recent interview that any Polish involvement was unlikely as Russia was plausibly behind the sabotage.

You're just all kinds of confused here aren't you? Isn't bias pretty much the opposite of credibility? If you you know that Fox news is biased towards Trump so you adjust for their bias when reading their coverage that's cherry picking to you?

That's the silliest thing I have heard from you... probably. No, you do not "correct for bias", you look at the facts - if there are any in the whole article, check these facts across sources and form YOUR own opinion about what it means. It will not work 100% of times and it will not ever work perfectly because you are rarely close enough to the original source but it is better than "correcting for bias" where you do not know how much of a bias they have introduced.

Seems to me you are confusing opinion and facts e.g. Ruzzia lost the equivalent to an AWACS yesterday and it costs 300 million. That seems to be a confirmed fact from a variety of sources. Anything not confirmed is an opinion: it being an "accident" a shot by Ruzzia's own airdefence, a shot by a Patriot or a crash or due to lack of maintenance.

Or something closer to your posting history: The Nordstream was blown up, fact. It was Ruzzia, US, a humpback whale, two Polish guys.... speculative, opinion.

You're just all kinds of confused here aren't you? Isn't bias pretty much the opposite of credibility? If you you know that Fox news is biased towards Trump so you adjust for their bias when reading their coverage that's cherry picking to you?

Where did I say that I categorize media as "totally credible" etc? Rhetorical question of course, because I didn't, you're just making this up as you always do.

Media can be biased. You are cherrypicking. Incredibly difficult concept to grasp but give it a shot: more than one of those statements can be true.

There were only 8 A-50 planes in service, but it doesn't means that all these planes is ready to fly. And loss of such plane isn't just about money, it would take years to build such plane from scratch and I'm not sure that current Russia is capable to do it.
Il-22 worked as command post, they managed to land it. But when you see how much damage from shrapnel it good, I doubt it's possible to repair it:
https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1746872033185563018
Some Russian channels raised version of friendly fire, but I doubt about it. These planes almost from start of invasion were flying same route daily in Azov see triangle between Crimea, Berdyansk and Rostov, it's difficult to believe in such version. Now is question what Ukraine used to reach it, after all, distance to Berdyansk from front line is quite significant.

It seems that Ukraine has downed an IL-22 and a A-50 EWC. These are seriously high value targets in the range of hundreds of millions. Ruzzia has only 30 of these.

Something out there is hunting Ruzzian planes and it seems to be hungry.

This is a pretty silly argument, to the point of absurdity. Is the concept of media bias really totally alien to you? Do you honestly categorize media sources between totally credible and totally non-credible? If so please share with us which media sources you consider totally credible? (something telling me that you won't and just trolling as usual) Otherwise either state your counterarguments by citing some sources, or stop these silly attempts at derailing the conversation.

I am surprised there haven't been any threads opened about this yet.

In recent months, Russia has massed hundreds of thousands of troops and other military equipment on the Russia-Ukraine border. It is well known that Russia wants Ukraine to be part of its county, however Russian dictator, President Putin, has claimed that the troop mass is part of a training exercise.

The US and NATO allies are sending military equipment to Ukraine to help repeal an attack, and there is some talk about possibly sending troops to the region.

Update 2/18/22:
It appears there may have been some kind of false flag operation in Dumbas, Ukraine, an area controlled by a separatist group, today, possibly involving an alleged bombing of the car belonging to the leader of the separatist group. It is possible this is part of some kind of false flag operation to create a pretext for an invasion.

President Biden today said he believes Putin has made the decision to invade and will start an invasion in the coming days.

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Update 2/21/22:
It appears an invasion has begun

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Update 2/23/22:
It appears there are some kind of bombings in Kiev, the capital of Ukraine

This is a pretty silly argument, to the point of absurdity. Is the concept of media bias really totally alien to you? Do you honestly categorize media sources between totally credible and totally non-credible? If so please share with us which media sources you consider totally credible? (something telling me that you won't and just trolling as usual) Otherwise either state your counterarguments by citing some sources, or stop these silly attempts at derailing the conversation,
The point is that you choosing which of e.g. Guardian's or any other "western" media articles are credible or not is pretty much a textbook definition of cherry picking. Regardless of any convoluted rationalizations you're making up

What does this have to do with your neo-nazi fetish?

The point is that you choosing which of e.g. Guardian's or any other "western" media articles are credible or not is pretty much a textbook definition of cherry picking. Regardless of any convoluted rationalizations you're making up.

Low or no air defense to cover critical infrastructure (in the largest country in Europe besides Russia), with no prospects of increase against growing Russian missile production, and with Russia on the offensive at the front. But sure you can pretend that i'm just cherry picking, and that western news coverage has not pivoted and coverage is just the same as before. Denial is always an option, but as always at your peril.

RE ramping production from Ruzzia, hat is not what your "sources say", that is your making.Ruzzian production of missiles and use of them is evidently lower than last year in which there was a continuous destruction of Ukrainian infrastructure. Not the case this year.

Ruzzia at this point is using shells for North Korea (you may ask for view of their "effectiveness" and "user safety"), Iran and their own production. It is obvious Ruzzia alone cannot keep up with the rate they need to keep the pressure on Ukraine.

The NYT has been consistently publishing smear  articles about Ukraine as of late. None of what is says is unknown nor for that matter known in sufficient detail as to make a judgement of the situation. I have no doubt that Ukraine needs the West to free the aid promised, but if you want to speak of the front...

- Avdiivka, well, it is embarrassing for Ruzzia dude. They are Throwing everything they got and still unable to take it.
- Yes the fight near Kupiansk has not stopped. Ruzzia got nothing, but yes, the fight has not sttoped nor the loses.
- Vulhedar direction... well, Ruzzia has stopped trying pretty much...
- RE Chasiv Yar, sure the article says there are attacks in that direction. As there are in most directions, with plenty of rusty crap left behind to nearly no effect.

BTW, it seems that Putin's fund have started to be seized effectively - not frozen, but seized. No more "playing nice".

Last Friday's attack has been described by Ukrainian officials as the worst aerial strike of the war, involving 158 missiles and drones and a death toll of at least 39 people.

On Tuesday, Russia followed that attack with more than 130 missiles, 10 of which were Kinzhal missiles, and drones.
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Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said Tuesday that since last Friday, the Russians have lobbed about 500 missiles and drones at his country.

The sheer number of weapons used is consistent with warnings from Ukrainian officials that Russia had been amassing weapons for larger air assaults and raises questions about both its stockpiles and production capabilities.
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The sheer number of weapons used is consistent with warnings from Ukrainian officials that Russia had been amassing weapons for larger air assaults and raises questions about both its stockpiles and production capabilities.

Two things are happening. One, Russia has mobilized its defense industry for war-time production, an effort Western officials recently admitted they underestimated, and two, certain nations, such as North Korea and Iran, have partnered closely with Russia, supporting its war efforts.

Experts have previously assessed that Russia has upped its production of long-range munitions, among other weapons and systems.

"For Russia, the supply of strike munitions is increasing. In October 2022 Russia was producing approximately 40 long-range missiles a month. Now it is producing over 100 a month, and this is supplemented by large numbers of Geran-2 UAVs," Jack Watling, a land warfare expert at the Royal United Services Institute, wrote in an October report.

Justin Bronk, a fellow RUSI expert, recently made a similar assessment, noting that "Russia has now transitioned its economy onto a war footing."

"For much of the year, Russian forces in Ukraine have been suffering from significant shortages of vehicles, weapons and above all ammunition," he wrote in December. "However, from a low point in the spring, Russia's military supply situation has been steadily improving."
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the Ministry noted, adding that "Russian planners almost certainly recognize the growing importance of relative defense industrial capacity as they prepare for a long war."

According to the calculations of the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine, since the beginning of the full-scale invasion, russia has exhausted about 50.7% of its missile arsenal.

Low or no air defense to cover critical infrastructure (in the largest country in Europe besides Russia), with no prospects of increase against growing Russian missile production, and with Russia on the offensive at the front. But sure you can pretend that i'm just cherry picking, and that western news coverage has not pivoted and coverage is just the same as before. Denial is always an option, but as always at your peril.

Ukraine suffered a large Russian missile attack in the early hours of Saturday, while its air defences were able to down a far lower proportion of them than usual.

According to Ukraine's air force, Russia launched 37 missiles and three drones. Eight missiles were downed, it said in a statement on social media.

The air force's spokesperson said earlier this week that Ukraine was now suffering from a deficit of air defence missiles. It was not immediately clear whether this or any other factor was the reason for the low hit rate.

Russia Regains Upper Hand in Ukraine’s East as Kyiv’s Troops Struggle

Ukrainians are weary, short of ammunition and outnumbered, and their prospects look bleak. “We can stop them for now, but who knows,” one soldier said. “Tomorrow or the next day, maybe we can’t stop them.”
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Ukraine’s military prospects are looking bleak. Western military aid is no longer assured at the same levels as years past. Ukraine’s summer counteroffensive in the south, where Jaeger was wounded days after it began, is over, having failed to meet any of its objectives.

And now, Russian troops are on the attack, especially in the country’s east. The town of Marinka has all but fallen. Avdiivka is being slowly encircled. A push on Chasiv Yar, near Bakhmut, is expected. Farther north, outside Kupiansk, the fighting has barely slowed since the fall.

The joke among Ukrainian troops goes like this: The Russian army is not good or bad. It is just long. The Kremlin has more of everything: more men, ammunition and vehicles. And they are not stopping despite their mounting numbers of wounded and dead.
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“Today we had two shells, but some days we don’t have any in these positions,” said the crew’s commander, who goes by the call sign Monk. “The last time we fired was four days ago, and that was only five shells.”
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“I have two tanks, but only five shells,” said Italian, as he walked through a denuded tree line splintered by shelling about 500 yards from Russian positions in the Luhansk region. “It’s a bad situation now, especially in Avdiivka and Kupiansk.”

This ammunition imbalance has been felt across much of the more than 600-mile front line, Ukrainian soldiers said. The Russian units are in a position similar to the summer of 2022, where they can simply wear down a Ukrainian position until Kyiv’s forces run out of ordnance. But unlike that summer, there is no longer a frantic scramble in Western capitals to arm and re-equip Ukraine’s troops.

And unlike that summer, drones have assumed a much larger presence in the arsenal of both sides — especially the FPV racing drones affixed with explosives and used like remote-controlled missiles.
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Outside Avdiivka, where Russian forces are concentrating much of their forces in the east, the rumble of artillery on one recent afternoon was almost nonstop. It was a soundtrack not heard since the war’s earlier months, when Russian paramilitary forces assaulted Bakhmut, eventually capturing it.
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Washington’s suggestion for Ukraine to go on the defensive in 2024 will mean little if Kyiv does not have the ammunition or people to defend what territory it currently holds, analysts have said.

Our town has welcomed around 500 Ukrainian refugees and they all seem to be nice people unlike most of the fake refugees that came from parts of Africa. Both Ukrainian and Russian people should leave their countries en masse and let the glorious leaders on both sides and their families fight each other to the death and go back when they are finished.

Hmmm, i see, let me try explaining it to you a different way. I do not consider positive news from either side about itself as credible, as i do not consider negative news about the opponent from either side as credible. Logical no? Let me give you an example, Russian sources saying that Russia was withdrawing from Kherson (with whatever positive spin they tried to put on it) was credible and groundbreaking. Russia sources talking about some Russian supersoldier that single-handedly defeated battalions of Ukrainian soldiers, or how happy RU mobilized soldiers are that they're on the front lines are not so credible.  And this works the other way, The Guardian claiming that Russian economy is about to collapse, how RU military is just so demoralized, Putin is terminally ill/already dead/clone/Hilter/Nazi is not so credible, The Guarding covering US neo-Nazis leaving Ukraine in credible. Each side will exaggerate news positive to them, but will reluctantly cover and will try to soften negative news by trying to put some positive spin on it.