Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 85. (Read 56702 times)

Because it was not accidentally shot down. And nobody is trying to blame it on russia. It was Bayraktar TB2, which russia doesn't even have in its arsenal. It was Ukrainian drone, which lost control therefore it was shot down. End of the story.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/05/ukraine-shoots-down-its-own-drone-over-kyiv-after-device-lost-control

  Russian drone shot down over Kiev
  https://www.bitchute.com/video/LptOznbKV3Uu/

Lol.  I'm surprised they didn't credit the 'Ghost of Kiev' for the kill.  If it was a Russian drone I would suggest to the Russians that they stick with Iranian hardware.  Seems much more effective.  Maybe the drone was 'Russian' insofar as they bought it from some corrupt Ukrainian general or middle-man and were just flying it over to it's new home to be analyzed, but from what I read they probably have a ton of bits and pieces collected back before they became completely ineffective against Russian air defenses.  Looks like these things to for around $5,000,000 each.  Wow, what a joke when the Iranian stuff comes in at around $25,000.  Gimme 50 200 flying chainsaws over one of these things any day.  But what do the Ukrainians care about prices when my tax-paying peers back in the U.S. are footing all the bills?

Ironically, I just traded my Turkish semi-auto shotgun in earlier today because it was not very satisfactory in some ways.

You didn't say "... 'accidentally' shot down... ." They must be trying to blame it on Russia.

More and more it's coming out into the open that the US and Nato 'trainers' are not on Ukraine's side.

Meanwhile, in the sky over Kiev, a Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile successfully shot down its own Bayraktar TB2 drone.

photo
video

As Russia continues to plow up Ukraine ground for spring planting.


TRUTH BEHIND "RUSSIAN STRIKES ON CIVILIANS" IN UKRAINE

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https://southfront.org/truth-behind-strikes-on-civilians-in-ukraine/
Before the massive night attack, Ukrainian media reported that five Russian Tu-95MS strategic missile carriers armed with X-101 or X-555 cruise missiles took to the air. Kiev could get this information only from the United States or NATO intelligence.

By morning, the Ukrainian military reported that their air defenses had allegedly shot down 21 Russian missiles, without specifying how many of them had reached their targets.

Despite the fact that Kiev has banned Ukrainians from filming and posting the consequences of Russian strikes on social networks, videos showcasing the defeat of targets continue to be published online, confirming the damage that Kiev is hiding.

Explosions thundered in the cities of Kiev, Kremenchuk, Dnepropetrovsk, as well as in the Kiev, Mykolaiv, Poltava and Cherkasy regions. Strikes targeted military infrastructure facilities: locations of Ukrainian forces, ammunition depots and accumulation points for military equipment and weapons.
According to Ukrainian reports, seven Russian missiles were shot down over the city of Dnepropetrovsk. However, two oil depots filled with fuel for Western military equipment were destroyed in the city. Local authorities reported that two people were killed and three were injured.

The Ukrainian military once again demonstrated their incompetence and the inability of Ukrainian air defenses to protect their own people. Local officials confirmed that Ukrainian air defense forces destroyed a multi-storey residential building in the city of Ukrainka in the Kiev region.
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Russia RETALIATES for Attack on Sevastopol - Massive Russian Attacks

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https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php/en/news-page/world/russia-retaliates-for-attack-on-sevastopol-massive-russian-attacks
Above, a massive explosion in Pavlohrad, a Ukrainian-occupied portion of Donetsk Oblast.  It seems a Ukrainian missile storage depot was hit!

Initial Reports say Russian Missiles struck a Rail Yard and a Ukrainian Arms Depot on the Outskirts of the City.  Multiple missiles inside that depot then launched catastrophically and unguided, into the night sky.  

Video of the storage depot ablaze appears below:

Above, a massive explosion in Pavlohrad, a Ukrainian-occupied portion of Donetsk Oblast.  It seems a Ukrainian missile storage depot was hit!

Initial Reports say Russian Missiles struck a Rail Yard and a Ukrainian Arms Depot on the Outskirts of the City.  Multiple missiles inside that depot then launched catastrophically and unguided, into the night sky.  

Video of the storage depot ablaze appears below:
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HORRIFIC SLAUGHTER:

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https://southfront.org/horrific-slaughter-russia-finally-admits-to-destroying-natos-deep-underground-command-bunker-in-kiev/
As reported on March 12 by the Greek portal of political and military information Pronews, citing American sources, in the course of an operation to retaliate for a provocation in the Bryansk region, a Russian hypersonic missile "Dagger" struck at a joint Ukrainian-NATO command and communications center.

According to Pronews , "dozens of NATO officers" were killed in a "terrifying strike" by a Mach 12 missile. In all likelihood, we are talking about the defeat of the "shadow General Staff" of NATO in Ukraine. The secret underground bunker, built at a depth of 400 feet (120 meters), housed several NATO officers (retired) and advisers. In total, more than 300 people.

To date, according to the portal, 40 people have been pulled out from under the rubble of the underground headquarters, but most of those who died under the rubble have not yet been found.

It is not known, the portal continues, exactly how many Western citizens and how many Ukrainians were killed as a result of the "Dagger" strike. "Most of them, "  according to Pronews, "are British and Poles, but there were also Americans and representatives of private companies that support communication and data transmission. In the coming days, it will be seen to what extent this will affect the conduct of Ukrainian and Western operations and attempts to stop the final phase of the Russian offensive on Bakhmut.
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The activity of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the Zaporozhye region is more like a distraction maneuver or reconnaissance in force. The hottest points of confrontation are still Bakhmut and Marinka.

It could be a false flag, but I am not sure this is the best moment and I am not sure it gives Putin something he did not have before. Basically, you have the "victory parade" in a few days, you can even see the tribune there under the building "attacked" so I would say that people attending may be a bit more "concerned" about attending it. Putin has now a hard choice: show himself and other high rankers in there, knowing that it is possible to get "droned" or cancel the event and look week. If you think it for a second... if someone wanted to make sure the parade goes ahead, would have done exactly this. He cannot really cancel now.

Regardless, the real war is happening in Zapo and in the Delta of the Dniper river, while minimal counterattacks happen in Bakhmut and nearby places just to make sure the RF army keeps busy dying there

It seems to me it was an inside job in order to justify further action. Perhaps they are preparing to change tactics, so they need an explanation and justification for why they are changing it. Here, they say, look, we are already being attacked, we have no other choice but to continue to "defend ourselves." Also, such internal provocations can be done in order to frighten their own population and thus force them to take a more active part in the mobilization (allegedly go to the military registration and enlistment office on their own, and not avoid it).

Declaration of war? Seriously?

If it is false flag, and given the interpretation of being "an attempt on Putin" the reason would be to justify a political assassination of Zelensky. If you ask me, a veeery bad idea. The war would continue anyway and they would have created a martyr just as they are creating a precedent and something to remember in Bakhmut. Not great ideas any of them.

BTW there seems to be some real action near Zaporilla, yet I would not call that an offensive. More like a "hostile recon". No change in the front.

That's epic. Never expected such thing to happen. When there was talks about Ukraine attack on kremlin and Red Square, I saw it more like memes and attempts to tease Russians. First, explosion of Crimea bridge, now drone attack on Kremlin. It doesn't looks like attempt to make much damage or serious attempt to kill Putin. It's more showing how vulnerable Russia is that even their symbols can hit by simple drone and their glorious air defense systems can't protect from it. And seems that Russians is really butthurt about it. It looks even more epic when now Red Square is in preparations for Victory Day parade.

I don't know was it false flag attack or no, but there is some valid reasons to think that it was inside job. It will show people that war isn't somewhere far away in Ukraine and that they're not safe. In such way they can increase support to ''special operation, maybe they also preparing for new wave of mobilization. They even can use this attack as reason to use tactical nuclear weapon. It wasn't attack on Russian border regions, it's heart of their capital and they even call it as attempt to kill Putin.

I have not really noticed that all that much.  Seems to me more like there are 'conspiricy theory' things which are studiously avoided.  One of the more amusing ones recently was when some Ukrainian asserted that Russia was making it a wet spring using geoengineering technics.  Indeed, what little mention of it which I did catch seemed to have been scrubbed.  I posit that these are things which TPTB would rather people just don't contemplate at all.


Most countries of significance will bend over backward to make things they wish to do 'legal'.  Why I don't know.  The U.S., Nazi Germany, the Soviet Union, and now the Russian Federation are/were pretty much sticklers for this.  I am quite certain that there are things which are 'legal' and 'allowed', a milestone such as a declaration of war.  And a little bit before that, what it takes to actually make such a declaration.  Even if it's a 'war on terror' or a 'war on covid'.


Sure.  I didn't mean to imply that I thought it was a false flag by the Russians.  Simply that I would not expect them to have any qualms about doing such a thing if they felt a need or saw a benefit.  Maybe I'm selling them short, but I doubt it.

Ukraine itself seems to be continuously descending into more and more of an uncoordinated nazi cluster-fuck so any number of groups could have responsibility.  Not to mention the possibility of home-grown anti-govt groups associated exclusively with the RF.


Whoever did it would almost certainly had no expectation that it would be 'effective' at doing any real damage or killing anyone.  Looks like it was some kind of a toy.  Having an expectation of doing any significant damage would be as silly as pretending that Russia could 'take Kiev' with the token forces they sent in that direction back when this thing started out.  These are fairytales for low-functioning children.

Things have changed dramatically for Russia in these last days,especially in the regions bordering with Ukraine and Crimea,a lot of explosions in ammunition depot and train derailing becoming a common thing these days,for me clearly these messages are preliminary to another spring counter offensive by Ukrainian forces,there has no other way to be as all the meetings with the Western Powers and all the modern weapons and training of their soldiers needs to translate into something and this something is going to be a new counter offensive.

The drone attack if it was not an inside job is a clear message to all the people in Russia,you are not safe with such government and you should wake up against them.

It seems a little weird that anytime an attack happens against Russia or it's interests the media immediately starts pushing this false flag attack angle.  I don't think Russia needs any more reasons to attack, they're already attacking.  Personally, I would say this is more likely some fringe group making an attempt at impacting the war.  The facts are these types of weapons are getting lost everywhere right now and it wouldn't be insane to think that anyone could have gotten their hands on some tech and tried to use it.  The fact they failed shows that it wasn't a sophisticated attack.

How possible is it that the thing was a false-flag for the purposes of getting legal authorization for a potential declaration of war against Ukraine?  I would say 'very'.  Would the various Russian governmental apparatus do such a thing?  I would say 'of course'.

I would also say that there will never be a better opportunity for Russia to ensure that ye'ol 'pale of settlement' does not go contiguously from the Baltic sea to the Black sea for the simple reason that it will necessitate sharing of the revenue of transit fees over the Belt-n-Road.

I would also say that if Russia has an opportunity to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, it would be by losing control of the PMC situation.  I think that Putin would do his county well to make a rule that PMC's are welcome to operate in the contested areas outside of Russia in pursuit of commercial advantage, but not within or really even near RF areas.  If Prigozon or Shoigu or anyone else cannot handle that, it would be 'thanks for your service, here's a lot of money, and goodbye.'  Similarly this is a golden opportunity to not just switch the oligarchs around, but get rid of much of the oligarchy and various other undesirables altogether.  'This' being the point in time where a new global monetary system is being formed up and the Oligarch's power via the old one are diminished.  Many of these people probably do constitute a clear and present danger to the nation's people, it's political leaders, and one-another as they can be offered future Western goodies to offset their losses under the current sanctions regimes.  I'd suggest to keep an eye on 'em.

Interestingly enough, they argue that it is terrorism. They are still trying to confuse their own people about what they have been brought into - in a war, you can be expected your centres of command to be attacked and that includes ministries, government buildings and other key strategic targets, including Generals and even their dictator. All those targets are legitimate, as opposed to a Mall, a hospital and areas with nothing but civilians.

In practical terms I am not sure this is drone attack. There seems to be something exploding above the flag so if it is a drone, it is probably a statement - a message saying "you cannot even keep your capital safe" - rather than something that could potentially kill or cause any real damage other than by mistake.

https://youtu.be/_Hp8YuhzJYY

Sure, if putin explained it then no questions and discussions are already a priori needed.

Now let's wait for him to explain the situation with his "attempted murder". This, however, will take time, because he needs to figure out how to explain the fact that the invulnerable russian air defense missed the drones directly to the residence of the president (who, oh, how convenient, of course, was not there).

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/05/03/world/russia-ukraine-news

Yes... one could almost feel some sympathy for the old guy when he gives his view of the events. Almost.

He speaks of strong arm tactics, imposing on others and creating a certain order. However, that is exactly what he has aimed for in the RF since he got the slightest power -  a dictatorial regime. As all dictatorial regimes, it is critical to have an outside enemy. If the economy goes badly is because of the US or the traitors or the foreign influence...

But there is something that is not said an is the base of all this discourse and "explanation" (apart for a few lies here and there). All this is based on the "safety" of Russia being above anything else. And if a few hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians have to die for it, it is OK, because Russia is more important than Ukraine, Russians more important the Ukrainians and his regime more important than peace.

Why would I think of calling this guy Adolf Putin?

Now, there is only one winner to all this: the US. Putin should have been more proactive in diplomacy with Europe and things would have been quite different. War is the last resource of an incompetent leader.

Now, if you see this from the European perspective, it would have been much better not to have a war, possibly incorporating Ukraine to the European Union or having  preferential treaty (and I believe this is a key, much more than any prospective NATO invasion). Russia would be a commercial partner for Europe which would have been really beneficial to all. However we are where we are and now Europe cannot afford to have a war in Europe in which the RF takes territory by force first in 2014 and now in 2021 and gets away with it. Europe has no option but to play the game with the US.

Has the US forced Putin to war? I could say that is true, but only half true. It is his own incompetence to generate a fair and seductive regime and attract Ukraine by means of commerce, culture and diplomacy that bring the "need" for war as he states it.

As usual, half truths and one-sided arguments - the type that Branko usually likes.

Why we even comment here...Putin explained it all more than a year ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qS6J-WbTD8

Then, I should read all you said as "your best guess" and a "conjecture". Which pretty much means you are just inventing whatever you say. Thanks, good to know,

See, the problem is that there are no "old nuclear warheads" or "old ICMBs" anywhere in Ukraine. The case is that not "most of them were taken", but an agreement for which ALL nuclear weapons were passed to the RF.

https://www.icanw.org/did_ukraine_give_up_nuclear_weapons?locale=en#:~:text=In%201992%2C%20Ukraine%20signed%20the,and%20all%20launch%20silos%20decommissioned.


Next time you go high and start imagining things, please let us know again, so that we give your "best guesses" all the attention they really deserve - that is - a comment from someone who has not bothered to get even the most basic information about this war.

These were not missiles, but FAB-500 high-explosive bombs of the middle of the last century (additionally equipped with modern planning and correction modules). These modified bombs have recently become a big headache for Ukraine, because they allow hitting fortified objects in the vicinity of the front line, while the aircraft itself is not included in the front-line air defense coverage area. The bombs themselves are almost free, Russia has a lot of them since the days of the USSR. With such bombs, even without planning and correction modules, Azovstal in Mariupol was actively bombed a year ago, breaking the resistance of the Nazis of Azov.