Topic: Stake Casino Scam Locking 45k$ Balance - page 3. (Read 1720 times)

Yea at this point I've exhausted all my options only other form I have I can send in is my literally SAT form (Mexican tax documents) for the past 3 years showing my employment.
I have sent in multiple months of pay stubs with my employer information signing off on the pay sheet. I am paid in cash and crypto and stake is requiring my employer to provide me with a quarterly earnings statement and bank statements to prove deposits which is impossible as I do not have. They are asking for more information then it would take to buy a house, get a loan, or even my own country's tax department asks for.

They take days to verify or deny, then days to respond to reasoning of this or next step. They are really slow boating this as long as they can which is very concerning.

 I am appalled at their message back as well as before in emails to accounts team I was specifically told KYC doesn't have anything to do with and I will be presented the decision of investigation when one is provided. Now its a different story. Complete all levels of KYC in order to gain access to the results of the investigation. Some next level fuckery going on with stake lately.

I think you get it wrongly, it is not over and resolved yet. OP is still required to clear his level 4 KYC. After that, and if we assume the problem is indeed with that bet, Stake will tell him their decision regarding the rest of the fund on his account.

Why do they need you to complete KYC level 4 to explain you what they are going to do with your funds? If they've accepted your level 3 and below KYC documentation it means they've no doubt about your identity, no? Do they want to avoid to publicly expose they've decided to take your funds? Thus if you're unable to complete level4 KYC, they will never have to reveal it? As you've quoted on AskGamblers, they've assured you to accept all proofs of income for level4 "any form of proof of income will be accepted for Level 4". And now you've managed to complete level3 they're finally requesting very specific documents you're unable to provide. When I saw their message saying they will accept any proof, I was surprising, now I'm not anymore, sadly.

Some light at the end of the tunnel nice to know, but Stake should really have handled this differently unlike having to leave the player believing there was something wrong with players KYC Doc's.. probably it was done to avoid compromising their investigations but great to see that it's almost over...

Do share the outcome of this @jeffyeps

Despite stake not giving a valid reason for whatever they did, atleast you knew were the real problem came from, and seeing the NBA investigations are done it would be nice to have you update the thread on how this was resolved unlike leaving this open , good luck to you.

Yea very weird case. Cant believe this player threw away his career to profit 20k$... Also was betting on his own team and losing and placing bets as low as 15$
obvious scape goat for the NBA to make a point here. Very sad he didn't have a translator to just take the fall.. lol

But on a serious note stake still wont give me an answer on what happens to the bet, and my original stake, til my level 4 is complete. I am level 3 verified now (finally after completely re doing the verification process from level 1) so hopefully this gets figured out.

This was the email response from stake after asking about this case.
" Hello,

You need to complete Level 4 KYC before any further changes or communication can take place regarding this issue.

Regards,"

Also as my last message reads I would be offline till then. And since there is no responses on here after that there was no reason to come on here and talk to myself.
Explain what you mean by "I might already know what's up. " I don't understand what this means.

Also i literally grabbed these bets from stake high rollers seen lots of people slamming big bets so me having the bank roll I was ready to take the risk and follow trend.

Well, the verdict is here.
Jontay Porter has been found guilty of manipulating games: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/basketball/68840803

Since OP bet on exactly these lines I guess the original wins will all get voided.

Leaves the questions, what happens with the rest of the funds in the account? Is it a violation of terms betting on this, knowingly of course, but unknowingly? Stake can't prove OP made these bets knowing it is rigged, he can always say he was just "following the trend", I would do the same.

Let's see if OP comes back at all, he hasn't been online for over 2 weeks now. I might already know what's up. 

I know i said i wasnt going to post on here til update but this person ( "who doesnt work for the casinos" ) is making some serious defamatory accusations.
So what your doing is deliberately trying to illegitimate my statement. From the beginning I've been transparent about this whole thing. Even posting all my bets ( even the one in question from the very beginning of this form ). My account was immediately suspended after this bet was made on the Jontay Porter game and i was told some BS about multi accounting and Kyc issues. After the news broke about this story it was quite obvious that the bets i placed right before my account was suspended ( prop bets on Jontay ) were the ones in question. Again I admitted to following trend from stakes very own high rollers.

To accuse me of having some kind of knowledge on this would be insane. Do i know Jontay personally ?

Also the people accusing me what do you personally gain from this? Someone with any kind of inside knowledge wouldn't be running to forums and complaint sites with complete transparency in trying to figure this out. Just would be very dumb and leave lots of web imprints to further bring this investigation to my front door. 
The internet is one weird place were I guess opinion beats logic/facts every time.

Thank you for this. I somewhat trusted your instinct on this one. I was just venturing and amusing an idea of OP knowing that the problematic bets will be that one, instead of others he made, because he knew from the beginning as he deliberately followed a specific tip instead of doing what he claimed he did: just following the crowd.

Form the beginning this was the only game that made sense, I even commented on that back then.
Also in his starting post he wrote:
"After submitting the correct paperwork i was instructed to send in i was immediately hit with a random investigation " into one of the bets I had placed " and was told no further information would be provided and I would be updated once the investigation has been completed."

So if it not this game, what else.
Also you must agree, previous bets of him were all much smaller and ( at least he didn't show any other ) not on player lines.
If he is a regular player props bettor it would make sense to maybe follow that bet, but what if it is the first time he made such a bet on stake.

Anyway, it's useless now to comment on this any further. It is obvious this is the game/bet they are talking about . All he can do now is wait until there is an official statement. Of coure stake support should be much better, also say what's up from the beginning instead of first stating something about multiple accounts and so on. But this is what they always do, also other sites. First they want you to perform KYC and then MAYBE they tell you the truth what it's all about.

It's a shady but common practice unfortunately.

i disagree with you . i used to Buy ads space here in Bitcointalk multiple times before it was canceled the traffic is not much and MOSTLY returning visits also its indexed yes but the pages not in the first pages of google not at all you need to add bitcointalk to any search to be able to get it in first page .
also i used to have a pro account in similarweb  and  for the traffic sources for Stake Com Bitcointalk is   less than 0.01%  like nothing
you might ask then why most of casinos pay for signatures here if not much traffic the reason is Bitcointalk have a good DA (authority) and gaining a lot of links from here helps them get good DA to their domains but most of them stop after a while and new ones comes in .

Speaking generally, casino requires KYC prior to investigation and informing the user about their findings, I believe, is to get the user to perform KYC and obtained their data to prevent future abuse in case the user was found to be in violation and got their account blocked. Understandably, no user will want to perform KYC if the casino said, "we detect you of multi-acc, can you please perform KYC so we can get your data?" [This paragraph is more intended for readers of this thread in general as I believe you should be quite familiar with this].

Nonetheless, I have to agree that their request to OP is a bit excessive. OP already performed KYC level 1 and 2, which should be enough to prove his identity and help casino flag the user if they abuse the ToS, I don't see the necessity of level 3 and 4 KYC if it's simply to investigate a bet.

Addressing your question why Stake only mention about the KYC on AG and not the suspicious bet, I think that's going back to their SOP, that the KYC should be done first [disregarding how intrusive and unnecessary the level 3 and 4 KYC for now], and only after it's done, Stake will inform the findings and let AG do their investigation. Much like what I wrote on the other thread, a very similar one where KYC being dragged for so long, this is sadly just a beginning of a very long phase, because only after the OP finished their KYC, the real investigation began.

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I believe someone with an once of a brain will be able to understand that when I said "working for the forum", I am not talking about being staff or anything, but rather in sense of helping the users of the forum. Users. This means both the gamblers and the casino. Certainly you understand that a casino and their representative counted as a user of the forum too, and thus, both parties reserve an equal treatment? If they're being the wrong one here, then they're wrong, if they scam their user, they will probably be tagged, but if they're the victim of a gambler who try to extort them, don't they reserve the right to be treated as a victim and the bad actors who try to scam them being exposed?

As for jumping on every post and defend the casino, I believe my previous post, the one that you quoted, explains my position during each cases. Unless you jumped from reading that post straight to write something? I can understand that it's quite a long text, some will find it difficult to follow, let alone digest them. It's ok, I understand.

For bitcointalk have nothing to do with casinos, I believe there were a discussion and thread about this, about how they co-exist and depending on each other, I'm too lazy to dig it out though. But please amuse us, how do you think bitcointalk has nothing to do with casinos, while they actually have a board about gambling, that facilitates announcement and communication for casinos?

Maaaan.

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Here is a fact: you accuse someone of siding with casino, that 99% post of that user is defending almost every casino, that he is partial and biased. One can even dare to say you make a defamatory statement regarding that person. And when he stepped up and explained things, with supporting evidence that what you say and believe is wrong, your response is what we can summarize as, "yeah, I don't care, I don't even bother reading it, it's such a waste of my time".

Based on that reaction, I think it's safe to assume either of the two possible situation: one, you actually read them, realized that you made a mistake and wrongy lashed out at someone else [again], but too proud and too little of a man to admit that he made a mistake [it's ok, you know? Misunderstanding happens, we understand that] so you pretended that you didn't read them. Or two, you did not read them. Which... somehow actually more awful. You accuse someone, a serious allegation, if I may add my personal opinion, that someone then tried to explain the situation according to their side and tried to defend themselves, and you don't bother to listen [or... read]. Inferred from this, is it safe to assume that it's your trait and it'll basically be your reaction to the ruling made by AG and/or Stake themselves? "Yeah, I don't care. I'll let someone who has more time than me to read your explanation, I am not reading that explanation of what actually happened. I know what happens. I believe in what I know."

Hmm?

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AHOYBRAUSE, I think I need a little help to understand the context here. And as you've been here for a while too, and quite familiar with that latest news of Porter...

So far, the narrative is: OP is KYC verified level 2, made bets and withdrawals and other activities normally, and at one point got his account frozen and asked to perform further KYC [level 3 and 4], and got stuck on that process ever since, and is in the middle of sorting this thing out with AG.

Can you tell me where does exactly the information about the problematic bets was the one related to Jontay Porter? Do I miss something? I didn't see it being mentioned anywhere on AG, nor by Stake's representative. I can't find any decision or ruling regarding it, yet OP sounds so sure about it. Is there something --that I missed-- that helps OP sure and zeroing in into those bets amongst every other possible bets he had?

I mean, OP himself stated that he just follow trends. Logically, at least if it was me, I'll still be clueless of which bets is the root of my situation, unless I've suspected it from the beginning that it'll be a problem. But, given I am just following trends, I should have no way to suspect anything, as I am basically following and placing my money on what other people picks instead of specifically follows one instruction.

Or is there a way to be sure that the problematic bet is that one without having to wait for Stake to release their statement?

I wouldn't say they care very much of their reputation here, but if they pay so many people to wear their signature and avatar as an advertising medium, and if they update regularly their thread here, it's not for nothing IMO. Bitcointalk has still a rather big weight in the cryptouniverse and is very well-indexed by Google. So I think updating your thread could be a good way to prevent them from "forgetting" your case and doing whatever they want with you.

They should give him an ETA for that, and explain a little bit what is going on if their investigation takes several months, they shouldn't hide it to Askgamblers especially.

LOL, without holydarkness a lot of scam accusation thread would still be open and unresolved.
He is asking the questions that actually matter and has a good relation with many casino representatives here in this forum.

So who are you to attack him. 

About this case here, you better look at the facts, this game is clearly under investigation. Of course stake doesn't pay out (yet), I wouldn't as well if I was the bookie/odds provider. After the investigation is done we will have the final result, before that it's pointless to argue any further.

" working for the forum" You are not working for the Forum buddy what are you talking about ?
and yes the OP have a good point you jump on every post a person got scammed or delaied payment to defend the Casino and giving Excuses even the Casino doesnt come it it .

working for the Forum ? maaaan  you could say for spreading Casinos Signatures or your own self . you  are not represinting the Bitcoin Forum
And Bitcointalk have nothing to do with the casinos

Simplest things to answer first, which I marked in bold.
Who am I work for in order to provide detailed information for every casino complaint on this site? I think we can say "the forum", I get detailed information of [almost] every casino complaint on this board [correction, not the entire forum, as I don't monitor other boards] because I attended most of those cases, get to know them personally, made my notes and findings... and I have a very good memory.

Do I work for casino? And do I aware of every ToS they have? Nope and nope. I am not their representative, and I am sure as hell don't memorize their ToS. I barely read them. Not to mention they're constantly updated. The familiarity is because most cases here shared the same violation of a section or two on the ToS, so I basically recycled what I know from previous case to other case.

Do I think it'll lead me to a job with these casino? LMAO! I really laughed at this while I'm actually at a very pissed condition reading your allegation against me. Anyone knows how much does a casino staff getting paid? It never crossed my mind, but this is interesting. I'll make sure I ask a representative in my contact later. If you have to know, the answer is NO. I don't need a job offer. I have a steady job IRL and I live comfortably enough. The extra fund from the forum is nice, I will admit that, but it's not like my life depended on it. I have my own business, so I can't exactly stick to a timeframe, but I accessed the forum on my spare time to "give back" what I get from life.

Now, moving to a more serious --which made me pissed-- points:

Siding with them. Umm... I am not? Why would I? It doesn't make sense as --to reply to your confusion on what am I benefitted from those cases as well-- I literally get nothing from the outcome of every single cases. Definitely not a job offer, as I've explained above.

Zero.

The casino does not [understandably] thanking me for hounding them on routine interval to give their response when they're slacking and the user who complained here are mostly people who come with the sole purpose of seeking resolution [or those with disposable alt account] who barely came back to the forum once their case come to an end, so I either a-stranger-on-the-internet who helped them get their rights or an-asshole-on-the-internet who help exposing their scam attempt.

The only "benefit" I get from all of these activities I do on my spare time [while I can actually binge-watch those series which the list growing into a worrying number] was... well, still nothing. Unless we can call a satisfaction that I feel after I managed to help exposing a scammer as a benefit?

Just to assure you that I am not siding with casinos, especially Stake, as you're currently dealing with them, here, if you read through my post history, you should've easily stumbled upon this recent one:


Is there a logic why would I reminded and warned a user that their timer on AG and CG against Stake almost ran out if I am siding with Stake? Wouldn't it be more logical to let it roll and have AG and CG close the case due to the complainant's inactivity? After all, as you're so sure yourself, AG give no mercy and will reject a case or marked it as resolved if the complainant didn't answer in time.

Why would I bother reaching to several users to get them to reach each of their Stake's contact just to get the accusations against them resolved? I basically combed the forum just to get a contact from Stake, so I can hound them with the cases they currently have. If I am siding with them [or other casino] wouldn't it be easier to turn a blind eye?

Oh, here, case with another casino, just to assure you that I am not just doing it with Stake, that I don't take side, a post where I am trying to get the TXID of a user that'll help him get their initial deposit back. I was very possibly pissed the representative and was at the end of his patience and he's probably almost cut contact with me just because of this stunt I pulled. How is this me siding with a casino?

And what benefit do I get from it? Here:


Purely that.

Simply knowing someone get a deserved outcome [though... that'll be a poor example, given the OP is accused of multi-acc abuse], and that they get what's rightfully theirs, their joy of finally getting their fund or situation cleared, that's enough to make my day.

I am 99% defending casinos on the forum? How? Unless... you concluded that from the last ten or so pages of my recent posts? The current one that [I think] I just got out from a very dirty and muddy pit of a cluster of case. Yeah, that'll look like it, as I pressed three of those users while "taking it easy" with the casino, but here's the twist: those three users are the same user, weaponizing his mental health to extort money from casinos, moving from one casino to another. Do you prefer me to side with this specific kind of... human-being, be kind and welcoming them nicely [but hey, in my defense, I did, initially, before the fact that they're the same people came to my awareness] instead of pressing them and exposing the discrepancies in their story?

And there almost no post from the 223 pages of my post that I am siding with OP of a case? Again, how? I mean, for the love of the hole of a certain fox goddess, how could I be siding with casinos if I have a thread consisting a list that literally exposes their trustworthiness in form of their track record of cases against them? From time to time, it works as a "leverage" to push casino to get a resolution [note and disclaimer: a resolution I seek was the real truth of the case, not the casino simply giving up and ruled the case in favor to the OP due to the pressure, that'll be an extortion and that's against my goal] because they don't like seeing the oranges and the reds on their section.

Interestingly, though, if you bother to look at that thread, you'll see I don't give any mercy to Stake [though I also didn't give any special treatment to other casinos]. How could you think I am siding with Stake if I have a thread which post depicting them as this:



In fact, one can justifiedly argue that I actually go a little bit too harsh with them because I have to stay true to the rules of "status" that I set when I compiled the thread. They did not attend to any cases. Their representative whose role is to monitor, compile, and forward the cases against them never shows themselves and say anything, and as such, I automatically wrote the cases against Stake as "active" due to the absence of their representative:


All of those said and vented out, I am sorry if I rant and lashed out, I usually just brushed the accusation of me taking side and the question of my neutrality with sarcasm [umm... I think I ranted some too on those several occasions] but those people who accuses me with what you said are usually scammers who at the verge of their scheme being plumetted, and thus they resorted to a smear campaign. Snd I didn't mind them much, or those who get slightly irritated by my barrage of question. I can understand that.

You, though, I actually "rooted" for you, I think your case is a misunderstanding from Stake's side and I spent a good effort to get to the bottom of this [as well as other cases], and what triggers your accusation against me [unless I am wrong] was a simple explanation from me on how arbitrator works.

That's all I wanted to say regarding where I stand on this and every other cases. I haven't reply to your other point, but let's wait until tomorrow, I'll take it to sleep, see if some sleep will help. I'll give your whole case a refresher course, reading them again, in case I missed something later tomorrow.

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Saint-loup, I'll address your query tomorrow too. Hopefully I am very much rested and not spiked with annoyance when I do that.

While going back and forth with you does me nothing but you siding with the casino on every point. I guess I just have no point on grounds of weird tactics put on here by the casino. My money is held, i must jump through hoops to get it back. I understand you want to give the casino every option to make this right. Again i am just another customer out of his money.

I understand the investigation atleast more now that i can see that its a real investigation. ( finally after 2 months of no answers even when reached out to the sports book provider)

I guess i just have no valid claims here.

Like you said "casino will require the KYC process to be completed first before they conduct the investigation of the account"
Well why was my KYC completely cleared and started over again. I was already KYC'd and they made me restart the process asking for documents i dont have nor my job/country provides. They want quarterly earnings sheet matched to the deposits on my bank account. LOL On top of this when reaching out to accounts team only after completing KYC did this bet investigation issue arrise. Then immediatly once taken to AG again for some reason KYC is wiped and rejected due to "discrepancies"

The problem has finally been revealed. KYC will be completed or my lawyer will do whatever needed to prove Identification.

As far as going back and forth on this with you anymore its obviously pointless. Anyone looking at your recent posts 99% of them are you defending almost every casino on the BT forum. I'm very confused at what benefit you get or who you work for in order to provide such detailed information on every casino complaint on this site. Do you work for the casinos are just are aware of every TOS every casino has. Or do you think this may lead you to a job with one of these casinos. Either way anyone wondering why this person is so adamant on giving the casino every chance just look at all his recent posts and the manner in which he posts about these said complaint casinos. I dont think ive seen one post which he actually agrees with OP's complaint in the 223 pages of replys this person has made.

I hope for him you're wrong because it would mean they will lock his $45k+ during several more months at least... but if you are right, I don't understand why they didn't tell it since the very first day. It would have taken one sentence to say, the event X you've bet on is under investigation, and we need all those documents from yourself in order to conduct our investigation and to make one decision about your case. But since 2 months they've just said privately they're suspending his account "until the completion of [an] investigation" about "an event [he] wagered on" and on Askgamblers, they don't talk about any ongoing investigation and pretend to just being a matter of bad KYC "due to discrepancies in the information entered at level 1 during the first verification attempt and the present information". Their communication is very confusing and shady, very unprofessional at least for such amount of money. Anyway I wish good luck to OP because their last message on AG says they "would like to inform that we haven't received the requested documents" lol


  

To be honest, I don't think I perfectly grasp what you tried to say with "casino wants to help" part, but I assume what you mean was that if a casino wants things to be resolved smoothly, that they care about their user, they should be more responsive to the customer during the earlier phase when the communication happens through their live support, before it gets escalated to an arbitrator, and even after it gets to that phase [arbitrator phase] because resolution can't be reached during the private communication, it should revert back to the private conversation between the support and the user, and only updates the arbitrator later on, when a resolution is achieved.

Two things about this.

First, the why casinos don't resolve things earlier [during the live support phase] and need to drag things ever so slowly. Contrary to what you probably believe, they actually do solve things on earlier phase. I believe there are probably around hundred of complaints arriving at the support division's desk every day. Some are as easy as forgotting a password, or losing 2FA, the others are a bit more complicated like a missing bet, or a pending withdrawal, and others need more efforts like an uncredited win, or voided bet, or KYC failure, you got the gist of it.

Amongst these hundred of cases, most were clearly resolved during that "early phase", because if they weren't, then certainly this board will be flooded by threads every growing minutes. Few that can not be cleared under that phase are the ones that landed on this forum and the arbitrators. From my experience, most of these few are due to the casino already made their ruling, mostly are because the gamblers doing things that violates their ToS. They've investigate the case and finds the damning evidence, made a decision and close the case. The gamblers wanted the case retried, and thus they escalate to arbitrators and this forum.

Second, the why can't the case moved back to private discussion, I believe mostly it's because as what mentioned above: they've actually made their decision and the resolution with arbitrator as well as the forum are because the case being retried.

There is little to no added benefits in taking another fly at the case and conducting things in private again, as they'll come to the same conclusion. Thus, they provide the evidence of their findings to the arbitrator. Likewise, suppose the gamblers are the one being wronged here, don't you agree they will want a transparency? What's the point of having similar situation being discussed in private again, given they've provide everything to the casino and the casino unfairly decide that the gamblers are the wrong one here.

Also, I don't think they can simply say, "Ok Thomas, we'll take it back from here. We'll be in touch with this user privately, we both will come back to you when it's closed".


It's ok, you're doing great now.

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I don't think I get about this part too. I can't find Stake explaining this on AG, so I am not sure where does OP get this explanation from. Far as I know, casino will require the KYC process to be completed first before they conduct the investigation of the account, which is where OP's current situation [and where he's stuck] right now. Only after the account being verified will an investigation, findings, and ruling be made.

OP, can you perhaps explain more about this?

Yes that's exactly  what is advertised and exactly what I expect. If i dont respond in time guess what, Case goes resolved or rejected due to my no response.  what i would like that way the accurate score can be calculated. If the casino wants to actually wanted to help they would reach out via all their support emails before it ever got to the point of complaint, and once it did. It should go back to being private and updated the complaint after all parties are satisfied. But hey what are times/deadlines if they can just be abused. People should see clearly response time isn't at 2 a " 2 days avg. response time " As advertised on the casino page on AG.

Anyway sorry about the separate posts didnt know that was a rule and was just trying to respond to everyone accordingly as I don't know how to add every conversation into one quoted thread until now.



Yes basically whats going on but either way i will get this verifiication figured out for when this investigation is actually over.