Topic: Steem pyramid scheme revealed - page 35. (Read 107064 times)

I'm not... It's summer and I can't focus too much on the pc. If I were *focused* on it, I'd be maxing out 4 posts per day. Right now I'm probably doing probably 4-7 per week or something. And that's not good for maximizing income. I think the key to milking it, as I see others do, is to be there consistently and creating a brand of your name with multiple posts per day. Once you get the revenue coming, this creates a psychological anchor-trigger-response mechanism where curators go like "oh that guy posted, let's click now before other whales vote on him" and then every time you post you wait for the 15-20m mark and kaaachiiiiing. Curators won't even read what you wrote. They'll just vote on it, blindly - at most they'll skim it to see the topic, photos, etc to see it's properly presented and doesn't have anything very controversial, and then click.


I'm curious as to how. I'll have to wait and see...


Understood.


Dafuq?


I agree I'm not a mainstream case, but the numbers are there. It took me quite a while to go over 45 pages of steemd history, but anyway here is the breakdown of comment-only rewards that exceed 1$.

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-sharkolate-please-read-voting-power-should-be-equal-vote-or-not-but-please-comment-last-post-didn-t-upload-correctly-20160718t014317683z"
sbd_payout   101.037 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-steempower-re-alexgr-re-steempower-help-me-what-key-points-should-we-focus-on-to-promote-steemit-to-a-wider-20160612t160855594z"
sbd_payout   16.486 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-steempower-help-me-what-key-points-should-we-focus-on-to-promote-steemit-to-a-wider-20160612t123102767z"
sbd_payout   17.148 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-dantheman-earn-13-per-year-with-these-low-risk-tax-free-inflation-protected-investments-20160531t062809267z"
sbd_payout   8.805 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-clayop-steem-passed-ethereum-s-number-of-transaction-and-will-pass-bitcoin-soon-20160721t082212770z"
sbd_payout   10.058 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-jsteck-re-cryptoctopus-witnesses-exposed-what-witnesses-has-done-for-us-this-week-first-edition-20160722t131213060z"
sbd_payout   1.829 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-cryptoctopus-witnesses-exposed-what-witnesses-has-done-for-us-this-week-first-edition-20160722t021210988z"
sbd_payout   3.489 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-hannahp-a-steemit-welcome-from-england-20160721t170554915z"
sbd_payout   2.889 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-complexring-chapter-6-old-friends-20160724t024738566z"
sbd_payout   3.451 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-jasonstaggers-how-my-most-painful-investing-mistake-could-make-you-a-steemillionaire-20160724t002415394z"
sbd_payout   60.318 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-recursive-re-masteryoda-fox-dives-headfirst-into-snow-20160724t034054958z"
sbd_payout   1.009 SBD

author_reward
author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-masteryoda-why-i-removed-all-my-posts-20160725t071916073z"
sbd_payout   177.270 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-ozchartart-usdsteem-btc-technical-analysis-20160726t045759842z"
sbd_payout   118.173 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-stellabelle-secret-writer-my-brother-s-heroin-addiction-destroyed-our-family-20160725t205409365z"
sbd_payout   1.808 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-jamtaylor-to-catch-a-whale-what-do-they-think-about-all-this-whale-talk-and-how-do-we-get-their-attention-20160727t230329783z"
sbd_payout   209.834 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-crossdresser-38-upvotes-and-not-1-single-cent-20160727t225648161z"
sbd_payout   1.461 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-winstonwolfe-lesson-learned-i-got-the-payout-i-deserved-get-your-post-perfect-before-posting-do-not-edit-it-20160729t070041973z"
sbd_payout   1.209 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-complexring-confessions-of-an-academic-postdoc-20160729t071110408z"
sbd_payout   3.488 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-cryptomarket-steemit-for-investors-2-how-steemit-will-revolutionize-online-advertising-by-tai-zen-and-leon-fu-dot-com-20160731t081630478z"
sbd_payout   3.933 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-egjoshslim-re-alexgr-re-egjoshslim-why-are-people-getting-butt-hurt-over-any-post-that-mention-any-issue-with-steemit-20160807t174952287z"
sbd_payout   7.513 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-egjoshslim-why-are-people-getting-butt-hurt-over-any-post-that-mention-any-issue-with-steemit-20160807t105603401z"
sbd_payout   18.793 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-stellabelle-secret-writer-i-feel-like-an-alien-among-people-in-my-country-20160815t165558736z"
sbd_payout   1.140 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-markrmorrisjr-an-open-letter-to-steemit-gods-dan-in-particular-are-you-trying-to-build-the-buzzfeed-of-the-blockchain-20160818t123636269z"
sbd_payout   2.678 SBD


author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-hitmeasap-steemians-what-the-hell-are-we-doing-here-what-happened-to-this-place-20160818t130610492z"
sbd_payout   2.972 SBD

author   "alexgr"
permlink   "re-algimantas-re-stellabelle-2-problems-plaguing-steemit-that-synereo-has-already-solved-20160828t182302775z"
sbd_payout   4.126 SBD

----

781 SBD. So the screen payouts would be 2082$ and the SBD+SP payout minus curation would be 1562$.

My post count is 1280, including blog entries, so it's definitely >1$/comment. (Again, I've not included all payouts less than 1$ - which add up too).


The biggest problem, I think, is finding a continuous stream of money to pay. If you find that, then you have a solid basis to work.

Synereo's main feature can be probably emulated on a global blockchain (e.g. Steem):

I am now getting 300+K but then it reduces to 200+K after some time.

Perhaps it was an issue with the state my browser was in at the time.

Could be some Javascript memory leak, that only clears when the GC has time to run perhaps... as I said I didn't delve into it further.

180 MB opening it in chrome Windows and 260 MB if you scroll all the way down to the end of comments, are you sure it's a "Steemit issue"?

Steemit seems to have some resource issues. This blog page consumes more than 1 GB of memory on my Chrome on Linux:

https://steemit.com/synereo/@stellabelle/2-problems-plaguing-steemit-that-synereo-has-already-solved

It appears to be some inefficiency with the comments. I haven't delved into further.

Turn of events, the article by @msgivings instigated another blog author that had sort of irked me in the past, to write a blog that amazed me:

Ah thanks I didn't realize you were actively trying to earn money that way. That is very exciting. If you are willing to expend that amount of effort there, then I hopefully you are going to love what I present, because your earnings will be much more deterministic.

My opportunity cost is too high to spend all my time thinking about how I might blog to maximize earnings. I'd have to be very adept at understanding the culture there and targeting it. In other words, I'd have to become fake (or create anonymous personas). That isn't for me. I want to be true to myself and receive appreciation or hate for who I am. I very much appreciated the ~$6000 of quick cash (cashed out already). I am very low on funds, but hopefully I will announce something very soon and we will be on our way. Yes I continue to pay my $256+$10 monthly child support (it was $1000s monthly until I became bankrupt) for one 17 year old. And I will spend ~$1500 - $2000 for upcoming semester of college education for my gf and her sister. The rest just surviving paying expenses @ $1600 monthly burn rate hoping to have something to show the community here asap. My gf is at her parent's home until 2nd week of October enabling me to focus on work (no one else here except the dog) and then she'll be busy in school during days so I won't be disturbed throughout the day. My gosh she got home and was doing a barbeque business daily but only generates ~$3 daily of profit and she has to feed the entire extended family (~10 people) with that! So I had to supplement another $3 per day for her, because she wasn't able to eat properly! I'd prefer to be able to help them more than that!

Although it seems $1s per day would be useful to people in that situation, they don't have the skills to be able to blog successfully enough to earn $1s per day. And they don't even have the desire to do so. It isn't an activity nor culture over there at Steem which fits. Also when gf is away from me, she doesn't even have regular access to the Internet because again of the lack of funds; and although hypothetically she could manage to get online to post a blog (if she was inclined to, which she isn't), she wouldn't be online continuously enough to learn and interact. She has been posting family photos to Facebook daily since she has been gone. I think the 33 cents I give her daily for mobile phone load enables her to have some limited bandwidth Facebook access with her Samsung smartphone. The major social networks have arrangements with the major telcoms here to offer free access.

I am very excited. I am trying to kick this health problem out because I am very excited and I know this is do or die time. I will write about this in other thread, because it is off-topic here.


Again I don't trust your guesstimate math, because you've demonstrated in the past that you tend to not be very precise. It would be helpful if you'd go to steemd.com, tally this, and report back actual statistics on your usage and earnings.

Also I think you present not a mainstream case, because you were already expending much of your time over here at Bitcointalk, before you transferred much of your posting to Steem. And you apparently are motivated to work that hard for several $ per day on average. Statistics on your actual earnings would be helpful. This seems to explain your desire to add a $1 per day in earnings by displaying ads to non-registered readers. I didn't realize a $1 per day meant anything to anyone capable of blogging daily.

To get people in the developing world to treat this as a daily vocation, I think we will need to achieve about $10 per day average for the average user. I am in my design conceptualization preferring to assume most will instead will take it as a part-time, fun activity that is supplemental to their day jobs. Again realize they need to be able to pay Internet access from this, or if they can do it from work when they are bored and where they may have free WiFi access (e.g. saleslady in the mall, although they are often restricted from using their phones at work).

For developed world, and for the youth who are bored at home with free Internet access, perhaps $20 - $30 per day would be very motivational perhaps even enough to motivate several hours of daily effort. But if it was $5 or $10 per day and very part-time, fun, easy, and interesting on its own, that would be a potent synergy.

For the professional content creators, I have something potent to offer them.

I am personally opposed to cultivating false expectations and in that we agree. However the platform itself is not saying come here and you'll get 1000$. From the steem.io site I see


...so... maybe others are saying earn thousands but the official site is more "reserved" in the claims.

As for my investment in Steem, I'm less invested than you are. I've never engaged in mining it. I'm following the other selling point that blogging is the new mining and find that it works for me since it's making more than my dekstop mining some shitcoin. And being summer, I don't want extra heat in here. It is time consuming though and obviously there is opportunity cost if my time was spent elsewhere. To compensate for this time loss I've reduced my btctalk time.

About the authors and the readers having a fundamental connection, I agree. I'll have to wait to see what you come up with. Same with whales being the deciders and you having a different approach.

Regarding the 1$ per post, I meant it on average. I've probably made >1$ per post/comment on average. Some had pretty high upvote value like 100-200-300$ - so they cover the 0.01$ ones pretty fast. The introduction of the whale slidebar has reduced this kind of rewards as of late although I do get the occasional 10-20$ per comment...

I did put "lies" in quotes indicating that it is not exactly a literal usage. Do you have a better word for presenting to people that they can earn $1000s for blogging as the unique selling point which ends up not being true and the discord it causes epecially when they realize that whales are the primary deciders on all matters including allocation of rewards?

I also used the phrase "onboarding gimmick".

Perhaps I feel competitive and hope I can do better. But I don't think I've made a strong effort to spread animosity or false accusations.

Why is it you are so attached to Steem to be point of getting defensive? I mean I appreciate you encouraging me to blog on Steem. But why wouldn't you be open minded to what ever will end up being the best? Have you mined a large portion of Steem?


Even if you don't blog crap and your content does not resonate with several whales, then you won't get paid (consumerate with your investment of effort).

Not that blogging ever did pay consumerately for most authors, but that is why most authors don't do it for the income, or just don't do it at all. Yet Steem is telling people they can do it and earn well. Which is not true.


The author is not in control of his performance with his readers. This is  fundamental error in the design. FUNDAMENTAL! It violates the entire ideological point that authors want to eliminate the gatekeepers.

It is not like the author is getting any other benefit, such as the music author who may be satisfied with the distribution even if not paid.


You often make these sort of absolutist statements (without any proof) and I laugh, because I will hopefully soon show that you are wrong.


No one (other than a whale upvoting his own) is making $1 per (comment) post on Steem. The effort required to make a non-crap blog post is much more than effort to write a comment post here or there.


You didn't consider the math, even I have already showed it to  you in this thread. Again you make me repeat the same points over and over. Go find that math.

It can't add up to more than very roughly about ~$50 a year per user if we had a uniform distribution (and worse without). That is assuming the usership is consumerate with the marketcap (on a per user valuation typical for social networks or even with a multiplier for the token commerce expectation aspect), which it currently isn't but the mcap is falling fast to bring it into alignment.

Note that in theory in the short-term speculative investors could pay users much more than the social networking valuation per user, because onboarding and growth are very valuable to building the token ecosystem. This is one of key insights in my design.

Edit: I agree that if there was a fun activity that users would do for free anyway and they were making a few $ per day on average, and they were at no disadvantage to not doing that activity on a more popular social network, then that wouldn't necessarily create disappointment. But when you put $1000s per blog post in front of people's faces as the UNIQUE SELLING POINT and they find out you need whales voting for you to earn that, then it is clearly seen as just yet another political failure. Authoring blog posts is not really a relaxing, stress-free, fun activity. It requires considerable effort and thought. You are not asking users to play around for a few $ per day. You are asking them to work hard for a few $ per day. You are treating them as a slave to whales. If the income was consistent, we could change "slave" to "employee", but it is not. Or if income was not under the control of whales, we could change "slave" to "entrepreneur" or "speculator".

Edit#2: even if you consider that bloggers may do so for free, they do it on a platform where they can meet their goals for distribution. The Steem circle-jerk ranking system will drive them away.

I don't understand why you have this subconscious desire to create controversy or friction by being so aggressive in your labeling. "Lies". Yeah... ok... and I've been told I can sell my junk on ebay, I listed them and nobody bought them. Those fuckin liars - nobody bought my garbage

It's like what you said. Try to infer meaning from context. Obviously if you blog crap, you won't get paid. I will grant you that the process is not consistent (casino effect) and this creates confusion and an emotional roller coaster for the author who feels rejected. And it also creates feelings of inadequacy in terms of relative worth (why is X making more than me). But the subtleties of human psychology are difficult to tackle effectively in any kind of similar system.

As for the 1$, if you had 1$ / post in bitcointalk, you'd probably be making a living (by your asian country standards) by simply writing your opinions on crypto. Sure, it'd be below your pay-grade, but hey: while you can't do that at bitcointalk, you can do that at steem. Now, the rewards will obviously not be uniform or predictable (20 comments may generate 0.5$ and 1 comment may generate 100$) but on average they tend to accumulate. And you also have article writing which is more consuming in terms of time although it might hit the jackpot.

But I sense all these are simply distractions from what you need to design... so... I'll leave it there.

The lie is for most people. And $1 is an insult (especially when we are asking people to do something which is time consuming, tedious, contentious, argumentative). Some of us made made money and I am grateful for it. I do hope @dan and @ned have made some money and gained valuable knowledge. I think they did an important experiment. Whether they knowingly created something to fail or not and whether some might fault them, it outside of my area of responsibility to comment on.

Another aspect of the "lie" is that we have to cowtail to whales on Steem in order to gain. It feels like we are not invested into something we can individually control, but rather we are subservient. It doesn't feel like we've escaped the gatekeepers and middle-men, so the ideological win has been diluted. What content producers want is to a level playing field and very large demographic reach.

There is a way to do this in a way that everyone is satisfied and invested. I will hopefully soon tell you.

P.S. there is another aspect of Steem which is that others may create new apps on top of it. So we can't be sure it will fail. Blogging may not be the only activity that will come to Steem. But the economics of rewards are unlikely to change much, so this lie will remain although with more popular activities perhaps no one will care about the $1 of earnings, but then what is the unique selling point?

There is more to come. r0ach might be correct that it settles at a lower price and then morphs into something else and comes raging back later. I dunno. I'm working on a different project.

I don't think so. I mean it was heavily sneaky mined, and the concept of paying everyone for blogging doesn't work mathematically (they stated it was a designed onboarding gimmick), but it doesn't appear to be a scam although one could argue that it was consciously designed knowing it would fail, but afaik no one has proven that.

I think it is a very poor investment to make (but note my P.S. that follows in next reply to AlexGR), but that doesn't make it a scam. You go spend your effort blogging and the site pays you. As an investor you decide whether you think the design is viable.

The thread discussion has veered a long way from its thread title.

People have paid bills with the money they made. Others are traveling the world and I think you said you'd be spending some of it for child support.

We can argue if that can continue indefinitely, but so far it is delivering.

Remember, even 1$ for a post, is 1$ more than what another network is paying you.

I read that many tech startups had their garage genesis during the dot.com crash because many developers were unemployed and were fiddling around at home. So I do understand the concept.

Again the problem with ideologically driven motivation (their real reason was because they wanted to replace the corruption and banks which were the focus of the subprime debacle), is it it almost always unrealistic and has limited staying power, as you and I have both noted.

The best motivation is one that people need every day ongoing no matter what, and for which there is a solid economic business model. If some ideological motivation dovetails for some key users of the system, then great for the synergy of adoption. I believe we can do this now.


Of course those buying in believe Steem is on the verge of changing the world and/or they believe they can milk more out of the system gaming curation rewards or some strategy, so they are not cashing out because of their beliefs.

Well I told you all last month in this thread that the usership would stagnate. And I told you why. I hope I am recognized for this. Because my plan is soon to tell us all how we achieve our goal.

The reason Steem is stagnating is because it a) really isn't a popular activity,  b) its main selling point is a lie, c) it has no viable economic model forward, d) it is competing against established sites in an activity with a small target market with no advantage of a viable unique selling point, and e) it has no viral engagement (for numerous reasons including crypto weirdness and the prior points in this sentence).

We need to correct all of those enumerated issues in order to succeed, and also we need to make the ecosystem has commerce the users want to spend their tokens on, so they are not inclined to just dump them on exchanges. Also we need the users invested into the system, and thus they have to feel that their are part of something extremely important which they want to support. And this needs to be popular which is something diverse people want to participate in, not just some weird demographics of gfs of crypto enthusiasts and those who want to blahblah philosophy and self-help melodrama.

I think most people tire quickly of wasting their entire day arguing in blog comments. I realize this is an addictive activity for unproductive people. Rather than having a site where the average person feels they wasted their time arguing, we'd rather have some activity where the users ends their day feeling very satisfied (even if it is another addiction, but at least a less contentious one that doesn't pigeon-hole people into activity which really isn't remembered as "fun").

Farmville was an addictive activity which was extremely popular on Facebook and people felt they were accomplishing something. The gamification worked to get them to spend money on it, because they became invested in accomplishing.

Deep argumentation is not a popular activity. That is not something that most people will be able to do well or feel accomplished. Many people would even be afraid of it.

So this is a scam?

Alright you got me. Can you summarize it in less than 46 pages?

You may not realize that some of us are very seriously commenting in this thread because we want to produce a winning strategy and project.

I did mention in my very first essay (also in comments that ensued) on this site March 2013, that Bitcoin's white paper appeared to be written to target gold enthusiasts.

But it is not clear to me if it was for the purpose you state, and/or for the purpose of helping to condition the world for the move digital currency and a global currency regime.

It appears to me that the real purpose of Bitcoin is to subvert the nation-state central banks and the banks that would try to create their own local electronic currency or otherwise resist the elite globalism hegemony. I would think of this as an elite thinktank doing creative destruction.

Also Bitcoin is helping to put the financial activities of those who would are awake on a blockchain so that when governements decide to start their wrecking ball with tax avoidance and money laundering prosecutions, they will have a nice list on the blockchain documented.

Then again, who knows. Bitcoin's development could have been funded by some rogue billionaire, or...

46 pages of this crap. Guys scams will always exist as long as people give money to them. Best you can do is warn and then report it to somebody who can bring justice if it is indeed a scam and move on instead of spending hours here debating since it solves nothing.. more people I know in real life have asked me about Onecoin than Bitcoin and I know friends-friends in the past who has tried to sell these energy drinks MLM stuff to everybody they know. Not bad people at all just stupid and blinded in the moment and they will never listen and only learn when they get burned.

Thanks for giving us feedback. Feel free to tell us more, but since you are here, I'd assume you originated from crypto-currency realm and were not one of the mainstream from the outside?

Giving us feedback helps, since we are developers and there are other developers reading these discussions.