There IS life after DEATH: Scientists reveal shock findings - page 3.

vokain

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Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 11:53:01 AM

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

When you sleep your senses shutdown (your brain is ignoring the inputs), you are not aware of your surroundings.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consciousness

When you awake they come back online. You are conscious.

The neural networks that process stimuli from your eyes, ears, your skin are ALWAYS in your brain.

End of story.

What can trigger your waking up? Sensory input.

qwik2learn

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 505

Quote from: Gimpeline on June 23, 2016, 12:40:23 PM

Quote from: qwik2learn on June 23, 2016, 12:24:51 PM

Quote

No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

So why would the patient exhibit conscious behavior such as having valid perceptions if there is no brain activity at that time? This result points to a failure in the theory of mind as being generated from the brain. You did not present any evidence to substantiate your claim that awareness is possible when there is no electrical activity. Awareness is based on constantly-fluctuating levels of electrical activity in the brain, but this patient had no brain activity for several minutes and still had awareness. So where is the evidence that can save the physicalist hypothesis?

The electrical theory of the brain has already failed:

"some AI researchers have simulated the entire, already-mapped nervous system (302 neurons) of the tiny worm C elegans. Like paramecium, we don’t know if they’re conscious, but C elegans clearly exhibits ‘easy problem’ behaviors, e.g. moving in response to stimuli. But even artificial C elegans just sits there, with no functional behavior. AI can’t simulate the ‘easy problems’ in simple brains. Something is missing."

See: Which came first: Feelings or the Brain?

"Something is missing. Therefor God" I don't understand it, therefor God" Religious people always take the easy way out instead of investigating

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF!
YOU DID NOT INVESTIGATE THE LINK; YOU ARE NOT EVEN CURIOUS AS TO WHAT COULD BE MISSING!

Gimpeline

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Activity: 555

Merit: 507

Quote from: qwik2learn on June 23, 2016, 12:24:51 PM

Quote

No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

So why would the patient exhibit conscious behavior such as having valid perceptions if there is no brain activity at that time? This result points to a failure in the theory of mind as being generated from the brain. You did not present any evidence to substantiate your claim that awareness is possible when there is no electrical activity. Awareness is based on constantly-fluctuating levels of electrical activity in the brain, but this patient had no brain activity for several minutes and still had awareness. So where is the evidence that can save the physicalist hypothesis?

The electrical theory of the brain has already failed:

"some AI researchers have simulated the entire, already-mapped nervous system (302 neurons) of the tiny worm C elegans. Like paramecium, we don’t know if they’re conscious, but C elegans clearly exhibits ‘easy problem’ behaviors, e.g. moving in response to stimuli. But even artificial C elegans just sits there, with no functional behavior. AI can’t simulate the ‘easy problems’ in simple brains. Something is missing."

See: Which came first: Feelings or the Brain?

"Something is missing. Therefor God" I don't understand it, therefor God" Religious people always take the easy way out instead of investigating

af_newbie

legendary

Activity: 2702

Merit: 1468

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

When you sleep your senses shutdown (your brain is ignoring the inputs), you are not aware of your surroundings.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consciousness

When you awake they come back online. You are conscious.

The neural networks that process stimuli from your eyes, ears, your skin are ALWAYS in your brain.

End of story.

qwik2learn

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 505

Quote

No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

So why would the patient exhibit conscious behavior such as having valid perceptions if there is no brain activity at that time? This result points to a failure in the theory of mind as being generated from the brain. You did not present any evidence to substantiate your claim that awareness is possible when there is no electrical activity. Awareness is based on constantly-fluctuating levels of electrical activity in the brain, but this patient had no brain activity for several minutes and still had awareness. So where is the evidence that can save the physicalist hypothesis?

The electrical theory of the brain has already failed:

"some AI researchers have simulated the entire, already-mapped nervous system (302 neurons) of the tiny worm C elegans. Like paramecium, we don’t know if they’re conscious, but C elegans clearly exhibits ‘easy problem’ behaviors, e.g. moving in response to stimuli. But even artificial C elegans just sits there, with no functional behavior. AI can’t simulate the ‘easy problems’ in simple brains. Something is missing."

See: Which came first: Feelings or the Brain?

mOgliE

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 1251

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:58:46 AM

Quote from: mOgliE on June 23, 2016, 11:54:09 AM

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

There is a rather good evidence consciousness is in your head on the contrary.
Consciousness is linked to brain electric activity. No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

That's all you got to know no? Every action in your body is linked to brain. Every emotion and every thought is linked to brain. Why the fuck would you want anything "outside" to control something?

Electrical activity = consciousness. If we can map all the electrical activities in our brain we can create consciousness, yes?

Map and recreate it. If you can map the electrical activity correctly linking every neuronal connection activity to its effect and then recreate it, yeah I guess you would create consciousness. You would be able to create life, to create another human. You'd be god.

Wilikon

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Activity: 1176

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minds.com/Wilikon

Quote from: mOgliE on June 23, 2016, 11:54:09 AM

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

There is a rather good evidence consciousness is in your head on the contrary.
Consciousness is linked to brain electric activity. No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

That's all you got to know no? Every action in your body is linked to brain. Every emotion and every thought is linked to brain. Why the fuck would you want anything "outside" to control something?

Electrical activity = consciousness. If we can map all the electrical activities in our brain we can create consciousness, yes?

Daniel91

legendary

Activity: 3374

Merit: 1824

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

What is consciousness?
Can we see it?
Is this material or spiritual thing?
If is spiritual science can't detect it directly, only indirectly through such researches.
It's said in Genesis that God created man from flash and spirit.
If body is connected with flash, what is connected with spirit?

mOgliE

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Activity: 1344

Merit: 1251

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 11:46:03 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

There is a rather good evidence consciousness is in your head on the contrary.
Consciousness is linked to brain electric activity. No consciousness is linked to no brain electric activity.

That's all you got to know no? Every action in your body is linked to brain. Every emotion and every thought is linked to brain. Why the fuck would you want anything "outside" to control something?

af_newbie

legendary

Activity: 2702

Merit: 1468

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Wilikon

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1001

minds.com/Wilikon

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

Hmm.. There is no evidence consciousness is inside your head either. When there is a brain damage or a coma we are unconscious (aware of what's around us) When we sleep we are unconscious (aware of what's around us). But consciousness does not stop when we wake up.

Consciousness could be living outside our brain. See that's the problem when we want to use a tool to explain itself and why it exists without understanding the first thing about it.

If the parallel between an electronic circuit and the brain is the same, and if there is zero tissue damage we should be able to wake up the dead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NQKEFeFKsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VEwcvJJeck

Are we sure the same consciousness comes back... or something else?

vokain

legendary

Activity: 1834

Merit: 1019

Quote from: crairezx20 on June 23, 2016, 10:45:30 AM

Do you think this is real.. or this is the same as astral projection that people spirit can go out in his body and get back after few minutes..
I just read some article about astral projection looks like the same as the patience life after death..

You and I... We're not so different after all...

crairezx20

legendary

Activity: 1638

Merit: 1046

Do you think this is real.. or this is the same as astral projection that people spirit can go out in his body and get back after few minutes..
I just read some article about astral projection looks like the same as the patience life after death..

af_newbie

legendary

Activity: 2702

Merit: 1468

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:42:10 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 09:35:06 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:21:17 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 09:06:41 AM

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 08:57:13 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 08:39:07 AM

Quote from: bitcoinboy12 on June 23, 2016, 08:21:20 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 08:14:13 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Well without proof I still believe in the life after death. I believe that heaven and hell exist. ....

That is the reason why religious scams are so successful. Religious people don't care if what they believe is actually true.

They will believe it anyway, NO MATTER WHAT.

Well I'm guessing that the OP wants to discuss particularly the scientific evaluations and assessments of life and death, not exactly theoretical and spiritual. See scientists quote unquote have managed to find proof. I guess it would be worth it to review this.

Our organism and its neural network behaves similar to a capacitor in an electric system. You might see the system operating for short while after power is removed and the system discharges stored capacity/electric potential. Neurons might continue to fire after blood stops flowing and pressure drops. Cells will continue to die off, but not all at once. The actual dying process is not an ON/OFF type of thing. It takes few minutes for all cells die.

After an hour of no blood to your brain, you'll definitely be dead. Three minutes (as per OP) is quite possible.
System will discharge, cells will die, and even if heart starts pumping blood after an hour, nothing will happen. It will be like pumping blood to a chicken in your freezer.

The longer you are out the greater chances of a permanent brain damage.

In a large scale study of more than 2,000 people, British boffins confirmed that thoughts DO carry on after the heart stops.

The shock research has also uncovered the most convincing evidence of an out of body experience for a patient declared dead.

It had been believed the brain stopped all activity 30 seconds after the heart had stopped pumping blood around the body, and that with that, awareness ceases too.

However, the study from the University of Southampton shows people still experience awareness for up to three minutes after they had been pronounced dead.

What you are saying is no one is really dead, even after all the machines and tests are saying it is so and science was wrong not to wait at least another 3, 4 min for a definite conclusion?

Not into electronics but I remember that some capacitors can hold a charge for years after being unplugged, so...

Plug them into a circuit with small resistance and they will discharge rather quickly. If they are charged and not connected they can hold charge because of high impedance of the air between the +/- plates. The discharge of a disconnected capacitor happens but a much slower rate, depending on humidity and temperature of the ambient air.

Wow! Here you go trying to conceptualize the complexity of the human brain and nervous system by plugging it into an electrical system the same as a simple capacitor. You are behind almost 200 years - ask Mary Shelley.

Cool

Not sure what you mean, Wilikon was talking about charged capacitors holding charge for a long time, I explained how they are discharged. I definitely am not suggesting you plug your brain into an electrical system. Although, in your case, electric shocks might offer some therapeutic benefits.

Check with your neurologist before any experimentation.

Actually, Wilikon was talking about the brain holding a charge long after death. The comparison was simply to show that the brain could do it, because we know that capacitors can do it.

How in the world dense are you that you can barely even read? How can you even write responses to other posts when you can't hold what those posts are about in your memory long enough to recognize what those posts are about?

It's definitely a miracle of God that you can even think to post anything.

Cool

Reading comprehension is something you struggle with. I put it in bold what he said.

I recommend you start slow, maybe start with children's books. Scholastic is probably a good choice.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 10:02:14 AM

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:54:41 AM

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

Humiliate me? You are insane. Anyway I really don't have patience to help you with your reading comprehension. Try Scholastic books first.

Again, God is in your head and in your head only. Trust me. There is no evidence of him existing anywhere else.

I gotta hand it to you. You have stubbornly strong faith in your religion.

Try mixing a little reality with your religion some time, just to see where your religion is wrong.

Cool

af_newbie

legendary

Activity: 2702

Merit: 1468

Quote from: BADecker on June 23, 2016, 09:21:17 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 09:06:41 AM

Quote from: Wilikon on June 23, 2016, 08:57:13 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 08:39:07 AM

Quote from: bitcoinboy12 on June 23, 2016, 08:21:20 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 08:14:13 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Well without proof I still believe in the life after death. I believe that heaven and hell exist. ....

That is the reason why religious scams are so successful. Religious people don't care if what they believe is actually true.

They will believe it anyway, NO MATTER WHAT.

Well I'm guessing that the OP wants to discuss particularly the scientific evaluations and assessments of life and death, not exactly theoretical and spiritual. See scientists quote unquote have managed to find proof. I guess it would be worth it to review this.

Our organism and its neural network behaves similar to a capacitor in an electric system. You might see the system operating for short while after power is removed and the system discharges stored capacity/electric potential. Neurons might continue to fire after blood stops flowing and pressure drops. Cells will continue to die off, but not all at once. The actual dying process is not an ON/OFF type of thing. It takes few minutes for all cells die.

After an hour of no blood to your brain, you'll definitely be dead. Three minutes (as per OP) is quite possible.
System will discharge, cells will die, and even if heart starts pumping blood after an hour, nothing will happen. It will be like pumping blood to a chicken in your freezer.

The longer you are out the greater chances of a permanent brain damage.

In a large scale study of more than 2,000 people, British boffins confirmed that thoughts DO carry on after the heart stops.

The shock research has also uncovered the most convincing evidence of an out of body experience for a patient declared dead.

It had been believed the brain stopped all activity 30 seconds after the heart had stopped pumping blood around the body, and that with that, awareness ceases too.

However, the study from the University of Southampton shows people still experience awareness for up to three minutes after they had been pronounced dead.

What you are saying is no one is really dead, even after all the machines and tests are saying it is so and science was wrong not to wait at least another 3, 4 min for a definite conclusion?

Not into electronics but I remember that some capacitors can hold a charge for years after being unplugged, so...

Plug them into a circuit with small resistance and they will discharge rather quickly. If they are charged and not connected they can hold charge because of high impedance of the air between the +/- plates. The discharge of a disconnected capacitor happens but a much slower rate, depending on humidity and temperature of the ambient air.

Wow! Here you go trying to conceptualize the complexity of the human brain and nervous system by plugging it into an electrical system the same as a simple capacitor. You are behind almost 200 years - ask Mary Shelley.

Cool

Not sure what you mean, Wilikon was talking about charged capacitors holding charge for a long time, I explained how they are discharged. I definitely am not suggesting you plug your brain into an electrical system. Although, in your case, electric shocks might offer some therapeutic benefits.

Check with your neurologist before any experimentation.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Don't get me wrong, af_newbie. I am not trying to humiliate you in the least. I am trying to get you to wake up to the fact that God exists, before it is too late for you.

Cool

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: af_newbie on June 23, 2016, 09:46:35 AM