Why do people in USA fear socialism so much? - page 7.

vampire

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Quote from: BlueTemplar on April 15, 2013, 10:38:27 AM

Well, the only clear definitions I could find are that : capitalism = private property, socialism = state property, communism = no property. Which is of course not how most people tend to think about those notions.

You can't even properly define communism and socialism.

Socialism: resources are allocated according to the person's input
Communism: resources are allocated according the person's needs

Communism is statism, while socialism doesn't beed to be one.

Capitalism & Socialism aren't political systems. Communism is.

BlueTemplar

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Gone for a minute now back again

Well, the only clear definitions I could find are that : capitalism = private property, socialism = state property, communism = no property. Which is of course not how most people tend to think about those notions.

vampire

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Quote from: BlueTemplar on April 15, 2013, 10:25:10 AM

(Sorry if this has been discussed before, too lazy now to read the whole 27 pages of the discussion.)

Can the Americans even define clearly what "socialism" is? From what I've seen, it's treated like some sort of imaginary devil, a synonym for the word "bad", and not like a specific and well-defined concept.

Can you define it? Since I am quiet sure that the true socialism doesn't include money.

cypher-punk

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if they did, foxnews would have to rewrite scripts, which is tedious.

BlueTemplar

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Gone for a minute now back again

(Sorry if this has been discussed before, too lazy now to read the whole 27 pages of the discussion.)

Can the Americans even define clearly what "socialism" is? From what I've seen, it's treated like some sort of imaginary devil, a synonym for the word "bad", and not like a specific and well-defined concept.

creativex

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Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 10:02:37 AM

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:51:18 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:37:08 AM

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:31:07 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:23:30 AM

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, the list goes on...

The US government attempts to instill fear in it's people to use these things as an excuse for it's actions. Those actions are not in the best interest of the American people, nor are they intended to be.

I'm an American and I have zero fear of terrorists, Arabs, Chinese, Socialists, North Koreans and the list goes on. I DO fear my own government however, because they're capable of nearly anything at any time and they do not care about the laws that are in place to keep them in check(Constitution).

You are in error when you attribute the actions of the rogue American government, running around the globe murdering people(including Americans), to the American people. Most Americans either haven't a clue what's going on or do not support DC's actions. For evidence of this check Congressional approval polls.

own government added to the list.

K, thanks for reading my post...or at least a tiny portion of it. Feel free to completely disregard the parts of it that don't support your own predetermined conclusions.

If you do not fear the US government then you're likely not paying attention.

fear of people not paying attention. Tongue

/troll off
I read your post, and please notice that im talking about americans in general. im afraid of the US government too, and im happy i don't live there.

Really. ...and how do you go about gathering a consensus on how Americans in general feel? I'm actually in America and interact with hundreds of people every week and I do not know anybody that's ever seen a "spooky terrorist" or fears them. Most go about their lives oblivious to the atrocities being carried out in their name. The only indication at all that there's a "war on terror" occurs when one is molested at the airport. That's why I take the train whenever possible, the whole situation would be ridiculous if it weren't so tragic.

kokjo

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You are WRONG!

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:51:18 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:37:08 AM

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:31:07 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:23:30 AM

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, the list goes on...

The US government attempts to instill fear in it's people to use these things as an excuse for it's actions. Those actions are not in the best interest of the American people, nor are they intended to be.

I'm an American and I have zero fear of terrorists, Arabs, Chinese, Socialists, North Koreans and the list goes on. I DO fear my own government however, because they're capable of nearly anything at any time and they do not care about the laws that are in place to keep them in check(Constitution).

You are in error when you attribute the actions of the rogue American government, running around the globe murdering people(including Americans), to the American people. Most Americans either haven't a clue what's going on or do not support DC's actions. For evidence of this check Congressional approval polls.

own government added to the list.

K, thanks for reading my post...or at least a tiny portion of it. Feel free to completely disregard the parts of it that don't support your own predetermined conclusions.

If you do not fear the US government then you're likely not paying attention.

fear of people not paying attention. Tongue

/troll off
I read your post, and please notice that im talking about americans in general. im afraid of the US government too, and im happy i don't live there.

creativex

sr. member

Activity: 434

Merit: 250

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:37:08 AM

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:31:07 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:23:30 AM

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, the list goes on...

The US government attempts to instill fear in it's people to use these things as an excuse for it's actions. Those actions are not in the best interest of the American people, nor are they intended to be.

I'm an American and I have zero fear of terrorists, Arabs, Chinese, Socialists, North Koreans and the list goes on. I DO fear my own government however, because they're capable of nearly anything at any time and they do not care about the laws that are in place to keep them in check(Constitution).

You are in error when you attribute the actions of the rogue American government, running around the globe murdering people(including Americans), to the American people. Most Americans either haven't a clue what's going on or do not support DC's actions. For evidence of this check Congressional approval polls.

own government added to the list.

K, thanks for reading my post...or at least a tiny portion of it. Feel free to completely disregard the parts of it that don't support your own predetermined conclusions.

If you do not fear the US government then you're likely not paying attention.

kokjo

legendary

Activity: 1050

Merit: 1000

You are WRONG!

Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:31:07 AM

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:23:30 AM

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, the list goes on...

The US government attempts to instill fear in it's people to use these things as an excuse for it's actions. Those actions are not in the best interest of the American people, nor are they intended to be.

I'm an American and I have zero fear of terrorists, Arabs, Chinese, Socialists, North Koreans and the list goes on. I DO fear my own government however, because they're capable of nearly anything at any time and they do not care about the laws that are in place to keep them in check(Constitution).

You are in error when you attribute the actions of the rogue American government, running around the globe murdering people(including Americans), to the American people. Most Americans either haven't a clue what's going on or do not support DC's actions. For evidence of this check Congressional approval polls.

own government added to the list.

creativex

sr. member

Activity: 434

Merit: 250

Quote from: kokjo on April 15, 2013, 09:23:30 AM

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, the list goes on...

The US government attempts to instill fear in it's people to use these things as an excuse for it's actions. Those actions are not in the best interest of the American people, nor are they intended to be.

I'm an American and I have zero fear of terrorists, Arabs, Chinese, Socialists, North Koreans and the list goes on. I DO fear my own government however, because they're capable of nearly anything at any time and they do not care about the laws that are in place to keep them in check(Constitution).

You are in error when you attribute the actions of the rogue American government, running around the globe murdering people(including Americans), to the American people. Most Americans either haven't a clue what's going on or do not support DC's actions. For evidence of this check Congressional approval polls.

cypher-punk

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Anyhow. I am in line with Michael Moore and his docu "Sicko"

kokjo

legendary

Activity: 1050

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You are WRONG!

Another theory: Americans fears most of the world, including socialism.

no, its not a joke. see middle east, terrorist, china, socialism, Kim Jong-un, their own government, the list goes on...

(edit: added "their own government" to the list)

vampire

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Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 09:16:00 AM

medicare + aid is for elderly only. Usually you are dead long before you reach that stage.

Wrong. My friend is about my age 35 y/o:

He has Medicaid/Medicare/SS/Food stamps.

He has a permanent disability (a bad genetic disorder with his immune system)

cypher-punk

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Quote from: vampire on April 15, 2013, 09:12:02 AM

Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 09:08:39 AM

I understand that many US folks end up bancrupt after an accident whith huge health care cost, which was uncovered by insurance.

So, again: What difference does it make to the bancrupt person who he was bancrupted by?

Wrong. Most of the horror stories you hear is about uninsured.

I can go for a year to be in a hospital, get paid at 80% of my current salary and fully covered with my healthcare insurance.

It's called:

Short term disability insurance
Health Insurance

If I don't get better I can claim:

Permanent disability
Medicare/Medicaid (paid by government)

That is anecdotal evidence. I don't buy it.

cypher-punk

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medicare + aid is for elderly only. Usually you are dead long before you reach that stage.

vampire

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Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 09:08:39 AM

I understand that many US folks end up bancrupt after an accident whith huge health care cost, which was uncovered by insurance.

So, again: What difference does it make to the bancrupt person who he was bancrupted by?

Wrong. Most of the horror stories you hear is about uninsured.

I can go for a year to be in a hospital, get paid at 80% of my current salary and fully covered with my healthcare insurance.

It's called:

Short term disability insurance
Health Insurance

If I don't get better I can claim:

Permanent disability
Medicare/Medicaid (paid by government)

cypher-punk

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Quote from: vampire on April 15, 2013, 09:06:11 AM

Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 09:04:52 AM

I tell you which. But first answer my question:

If you are totally broke and bancrupt: Whether the tax collector bancrupted you or your hospital ...

WHAT IS THE FUCKING DIFFERENCE ? Grin

Why would a hospital bankrupt me? o.O

I understand that many US folks end up bancrupt after an accident with huge health care cost, which was uncovered by insurance. This never - for all practical purposes - used to happen in Europe for some decades.

So, again: What difference does it make to the bancrupt person by whom he was bancrupted ?

cypher-punk

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Quote from: creativex on April 15, 2013, 09:02:56 AM

Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 08:25:55 AM

Many US folks are brainwashed into buying the notion that a good affordable health care system like in many parts of Europe MUST be socialism. Once people stopped thinking to such an alarming level, anything is possible.

If you stop thinking for yourself as indeed many US citizens have, you even fear a fictional monster in a closet or a communist under your bed, who does not exist.

Did you just suggest people stop thinking for themselves as a solution to a perceived problem?

nope, that would be a misread IMHO

vampire

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Quote from: cypher-punk on April 15, 2013, 09:04:52 AM

I tell you which. But first answer my question:

If you are totally broke and bancrupt: Whether the tax collector bancrupted you or your hospital ...

WHAT IS THE FUCKING DIFFERENCE ? Grin

Why would a hospital bankrupt me? o.O

cypher-punk

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Activity: 14

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I tell you which. But first answer my question:

If you are totally broke and bancrupt: Whether the tax collector bancrupted you or your hospital ...

WHAT IS THE FUCKING DIFFERENCE ? Grin

Topic: Why do people in USA fear socialism so much? - page 7. (Read 34886 times)