[ANN] Blacknet | IBO for BlackCoin | New code | PoS | No ICO - page 1203.

mr_random

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 1001

Quote from: gonzoucab on March 29, 2014, 04:33:24 PM

I have an honest question.

To an investor in wall street how can i explain in a single powerpoint slide why Blackcoin has bigger Market Cap than Mintcoin, they have same features. Mint was released 10 days before and is hybrid POW/POS, to an outsider they are practicaly the same

Im conducting investing rounds, i now FAST/POS is the future and i need your side of the story, for an possible investment.

Thanks.

1. Mintcoin is pre-mined by the developer. Roughly 3% of the total money supply he gave to himself. The crypto community tends not to like such schemes.
2. Mintcoin dev launched the coin saying the pre-mined coins would be spent on bounties etc but weeks later he refuses to list what he spent the coins on.
3. Mintcoin has 20% rate of interest compared with Blackcoin 1% rate of interest. The higher the rate of interest the great the dampening/suppressive effect it has on price as some of those new coins will get dumped on the market.
4. Blackcoin has a great developer. He's responded very quickly to any issues that have arisen.
5. The community has pioneered innovative concepts eg the blackconimultipool, a pool to boost blackcoin price whilst decrease the price of competing alt coins. Encouraging for the future.
6. Community and trading volume. Mintcoin trading volume is tiny. Very few people are buying and selling it on exchanges which suggests to me a lot of the activity in the mintcoin community is sockpuppets (one person with multiple accounts).

Those are specific reasons. There's lots of general reasons why two clones with identical features (seemingly) have different values. Feathercoin is a clone of Litecoin with 4 times as many coins and it has been out for 9 months and is nowhere near Litecoin's price. Community support is a huge factor in a coins success (see dogecoin for example).

ssaCEO

hero member

Activity: 568

Merit: 500

Quote from: IconicExpert on March 28, 2014, 08:39:04 PM

It is great you accepted BlackCoin at your casino, but do not pretend like you are bringing extra value to the community. The only one benefiting from you accepting BlackCoin at your casino is you, so please stop acting as if you are doing the BlackCoin community a favor.

I take exception with this. It's obviously of value to BlackCoin to have merchants and gaming sites start accepting it. I never said I was doing anyone a favor, obviously we're in business to make money. We didn't start taking BC because we're doing charity work, we started because we've been looking to diversify out of Bitcoin for some time, and think that BC has the best combination of qualities to make it a viable long-term bet for us as a new market and store of value.

As far as our Alexa rank, sure we are relatively low traffic compared with the BTC casinos that accept American players, and players in other countries where online gambling is illegal. We block anywhere up to 85% of our hits. We don't think it's worth the risk. But isn't it better to have a casino in BC that's acting legally as opposed to some site that's violating US and other laws? I think it's clearly a benefit to the community in that it adds legitimacy and gives people something to do with their coins besides just trade them back and forth for BTC.

In any event, likewise, best of luck with your project. If you succeed, I'll be the first in line to get one of those cards. I really will.

micryon

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: mikenz on March 29, 2014, 04:07:04 PM

1. If all Coins are mined already, where do the 1% stake-coins come from?
2. Why does the staking only works when I have my wallet open? shouldnt the calculation be executed by the blockchain??Is the staking executed by the client or by the blockchain?

All coins are not mined already. Mining still happens, it just doesn't use PoW, it uses PoS. You can still "find" blocks but it is based on your stake, rather than hash power.

When your wallet is open, it is effectively doing PoS, and trying to find blocks.. which generates the 1% coins, and confirms transactions. The whole concept is still 99% bitcoin, except it replaces PoW with PoS for finding blocks/confirming transactions.

gonzoucab

newbie

Activity: 42

Merit: 0

I have an honest question.

To an investor in wall street how can i explain in a single powerpoint slide why Blackcoin has bigger Market Cap than Mintcoin, they have same features. Mint was released 10 days before and is hybrid POW/POS, to an outsider they are practicaly the same

Im conducting investing rounds, i now FAST/POS is the future and i need your side of the story, for an possible investment.

Thanks.

micryon

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: PeterPalmBeach on March 29, 2014, 04:17:44 PM

BC accepted on my site
http://globalfuze.com

Very cool!

machinez

member

Activity: 61

Merit: 10

Quote from: Nurka on March 29, 2014, 04:19:40 PM

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 04:04:46 PM

98w? typo? Huh

Gridseed chips are very powerefficient when it comes to scrypt. ~7-10w per 5-chip unit, so around 100w for 10 of them.

I just started mining on the multipool today, and I'm not seeing much. I realize it's in beta, but how long roughly do "shifts" go? I've been getting shares for the past 6-7 hours and still no info other than shares. When will I see results?

had no idea you're talking about about gridseed, thought it was just GPUs. LOLz

payout on the multipool is one per 24hr

Ziploc

sr. member

Activity: 405

Merit: 250

Quote from: Jabulon on March 29, 2014, 01:57:09 PM

Quote from: Ziploc on March 29, 2014, 01:54:04 PM

Quote from: Jabulon on March 29, 2014, 01:47:08 PM

Quote from: Ziploc on March 29, 2014, 01:30:11 PM

Quote from: Jabulon on March 29, 2014, 01:08:17 PM

Quote from: Jabulon on March 28, 2014, 11:10:25 PM

Quote from: Soepkip on March 28, 2014, 01:43:46 PM

Quote from: XbladeX on March 28, 2014, 01:37:00 PM

Quote from: Wh1teKn1ght on March 28, 2014, 01:30:42 PM

why can't the wallet have an option to only be unlocked for staking but not allow for any transactions to be SENT? then ppl could leave their wallets unlocked to stake without worry of being stolen.

Good point we will try ask rar4 for that feature.Something like transaction password block

That is already in there. I have mine unlocked and can't send transactions without entering my pass.

Check again people. I just did, and not for the first time. No password is required to send from an unlocked wallet. And yes, I'm using the latest release (windows client). I brought this up weeks ago in a cautionary post, before Soepkip had his coins swiped, and then subsequently. For the future health of the coin and anyone owning it, let's tie up this loose end.

Just to follow up with a couple more details and confirmations on this.

1. If you unlock the 'new' way, via the dropdown, you're wallet is up for grabs. No password is needed to send out your coins.
2. If you unlock it old-school, via console, you will unlock for staking. It is a 'mintonly' command, fortunately. Thank god someone was thinking.
3. If you do #2, then initiate a send but cancel out before entering password, your wallet 'lock' symbol will close, but your staking light remains 'green' and mouse-hover will indicate you are staking.
4. If you do #1, then go back to the console and enter the command 'walletlock', same result as #3. (as someone else rightly pointed out).
5. Only remaining question is, for #3 and #4, is the wallet in fact still staking as indicated? I am waiting to find out. So far apparently not. But we shall see.

Conclusion: if you just do #1 and walk away for the day, you might have a very nasty surprise waiting for you when you get home. Even if no one has physical access to your computer, it can occur through a variety of exploits that someone gains remote access to your system. Then, my friend, you are most certainly fucked. Finally, if you don't already, consider using a password mgr. Among other things it will allow you to enter your long-and-random-as-fuck password without entering keystrokes. And be sure to keep a backup of your password database!

if You do no 2...the stacking works...just received few fractions of coins

Well yes, it's supposed to work that way and does. You will also be staking by doing #1. The open question was more about #3 and #4. So far it looks like client is misreporting, and in fact at that point you are locked and not staking, in spite of the green light. Not a major issue. Security is. Looks like you're ok with #2. No doubt future releases will add features and heightened security.
Be sure when you unlock in console to immediately delete history.
**footnote for experts: there is always a possibility that, in spite of deleting console history your password is retained somewhere in memory and retrievable by someone clever enough to get in. It's beyond my skills to verify that, but would be glad to hear a report from someone capable of analyzing the matter in detail.

actually no2 might be dangerous also.....just checked and my transaction passed without password......

I then did walletlock command.....
wallet is locked now and the stacking icon is green...will have to check if it is really stacking....I came to the same questions as yours...will try to report if I will get something...

Strange. I confirmed earlier that #2 demanded my password. What client are you on? Could you restart and reconfirm please. I'm on the latest windows qt.

v 1.0.5

just retested the no 2 and worked as You described......however before I was staking for some time and I don't know why it didn't asked me for a pass...

Nurka

newbie

Activity: 37

Merit: 0

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 04:04:46 PM

98w? typo? Huh

Gridseed chips are very powerefficient when it comes to scrypt. ~7-10w per 5-chip unit, so around 100w for 10 of them.

I just started mining on the multipool today, and I'm not seeing much. I realize it's in beta, but how long roughly do "shifts" go? I've been getting shares for the past 6-7 hours and still no info other than shares. When will I see results?

PeterPalmBeach

sr. member

Activity: 336

Merit: 250

SellALL, BuyBTC

BC accepted on my site
http://globalfuze.com

mikenz

full member

Activity: 215

Merit: 102

Hi,

I bought in Blackcoin a few days ago and transferred all coins in my wallet. Im absolutly convinced by the concept, however, can someone answer my POS-related noob-questions?

1. If all Coins are mined already, where do the 1% stake-coins come from?
2. Why does the staking only works when I have my wallet open? shouldnt the calculation be executed by the blockchain??Is the staking executed by the client or by the blockchain?

Huh

thx guys

machinez

member

Activity: 61

Merit: 10

98w? typo? Huh

kana

full member

Activity: 183

Merit: 100

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 03:37:57 PM

Quote from: kana on March 29, 2014, 02:47:07 PM

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 02:43:33 PM

to match $14 dollars, you will need a scrypt rig that can mine at around 4.7mhz. If you're looking to purchase one TODAY, then SHA256 seems to be a better option as you can get the ANTMINER S1 on ebay for $500-600 Cool

A scrypt rig will cost alot more than that Cry

Even with the difference in power usage?

I did not calculate power usage. It was base purely on mining power. If you take power usage into consideration then you'll end up paying more for a scrypt gig, thus your profit will be lower.

I can see that the price differnce is pretty large at 3000 for the scrypt miner but the power for that scrypt would be about 98w compared to 350-450 with the ant

machinez

member

Activity: 61

Merit: 10

on an unrelated topic, all my coins have been staking at least 2-3 times a day Tongue

such staking, much profit, w0w Cheesy

machinez

member

Activity: 61

Merit: 10

Quote from: kana on March 29, 2014, 02:47:07 PM

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 02:43:33 PM

to match $14 dollars, you will need a scrypt rig that can mine at around 4.7mhz. If you're looking to purchase one TODAY, then SHA256 seems to be a better option as you can get the ANTMINER S1 on ebay for $500-600 Cool

A scrypt rig will cost alot more than that Cry

Even with the difference in power usage?

I did not calculate power usage. It was base purely on mining power. If you take power usage into consideration then you'll end up paying more for a scrypt gig, thus your profit will be lower.

Jabulon

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 250

Quote from: jiangkand1 on March 29, 2014, 03:10:19 PM

I like this coin,it's performance was perfect,I am really like it.

Blackcoin has been the rockstar of crypto, going up steadily against a down market. The youthful hero, child of the beleaguered King BTC. It paid its dues, working its way up through early days on cryptorush, then taking over Mintpal, and now with Cryptsy coming to beg for a piece of the action. Definitely the Badboy of the alts.

jiangkand1

newbie

Activity: 42

Merit: 0

Quote from: moderndezigns on March 29, 2014, 02:46:08 AM

Quote from: CatKiwi on March 29, 2014, 02:23:05 AM

I see our friend the market manipulator is buying and selling his own large orders again....

agreed

Yes,
As long as we can see the trend of prices, investment in the market is very easy to obtain benefits!

jamieb81

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 250

Quote

Just to follow up with a couple more details and confirmations on this.

1. If you unlock the 'new' way, via the dropdown, you're wallet is up for grabs. No password is needed to send out your coins.
2. If you unlock it old-school, via console, you will unlock for staking. It is a 'mintonly' command, fortunately. Tahnk god someone was thinking.
3. If you do #2, then initiate a send but cancel out before entering password, your wallet 'lock' symbol will close, but your staking light remains 'green' and mouse-hover will indicate you are staking.
4. If you do #1, then go back to the console and enter the command 'walletlock', same result as #3. (as someone else rightly pointed out).
5. Only remaining question is, for #3 and #4, is the wallet in fact still staking as indicated? I am waiting to find out. So far apparently not. But we shall see.

Conclusion: if you just do #1 and walk away for the day, you might have a very nasty surprise waiting for you when you get home. Even if no one has physical access to your computer, it can occur through a variety of exploits that someone gains remote access to your system. Then, my friend, you are most certainly fucked. Finally, if you don't already, consider using a password mgr. Among other things it will allow you to enter your long-and-random-as-fuck password without entering keystrokes. And be sure to keep a backup of your password database!

Yes indeed, I'm using KeePass together with chromeipass to store all my passwords.

stormia

hero member

Activity: 868

Merit: 1000

Quote from: artiface on March 29, 2014, 02:57:15 PM

Quote from: Jabulon on March 29, 2014, 02:31:40 PM

Quote from: stormia on March 29, 2014, 02:27:21 PM

Quote from: Soepkip on March 29, 2014, 08:33:47 AM

Quote from: deadmanwalking on March 29, 2014, 03:17:57 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 01:03:45 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 12:51:22 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 03:09:12 AM

im still on the fence

can someone explain how this stops someone from generating lots of PoS blocks 20 days in the future from a bunch of TX's with small interval, whether through one or multiple wallets

Code:

ss << nStakeModifier;
ss << nTimeBlockFrom << nTxPrevOffset << txPrev.nTime << prevout.n << nTimeTx;
hashProofOfStake = Hash(ss.begin(), ss.end());
if(CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
return false;

im not well enough versed with the code to know what these variable names imply

i have discovered a flaw with current PoS implementation

you can easily do a 51% attack with PoS blocks without needing large holdings

since PoS blocks are generated on a coin age basis, you could create TXO's delayed by a time offset at the minimum TXO cost for a future attack period

so after creating 10000 TXO of 1 MINT separated by 0.5 seconds to make sure 60 consecutive blocks are generated at repeated interval by your wallet 20 days in the future, the attack would last 1 hour and 40 minutes

enough to put the security and function of a coin in question

couple that with the fact the difficulty calculation includes PoS blocks, that would mean difficulty would jump to stratospheric levels making it impossible to mine PoW blocks

are people really not concerned about this?

YOU CAN 51% ATTACK ANY POS COIN WITHOUT THE NEED FOR 51% OF SUPPLY OR ANY PoW HASHRATE AT ALL

Hi all. Just thought I'd share some of the joy we've been dealing with on the Mintcoin thread. Have a good night.

Check our code i'd say

No explanation? I'm not computer savvy enough to get the answer from the code myself so I was hoping somebody who knows the blackcoin code could explain. It seems that this type of attack is prevented by hybrid PoW/PoS since the PoW blocks have a different and independent difficulty algorithm from the PoS blocks, and you cannot predict with any certainty what the next block in the chain will be (trying to build x consecutive PoS blocks to form an attack with would be interrupted by the generation of a valid PoW block). If that is true, I still don't understand how a pure PoS coin would deal with this. I've got a lot of money invested in this coin and other PoS coins so I would like to know my money is safe, and I would appreciate a concrete answer other than "your money is safe" or "we've figured out how to prevent that" because I'm the type of person that only trusts something if I understand why.

This flaw was addressed by the author of PoS, Sunny King, earlier this year:

Official release build is now available http://www.ppcoin.org/ (via sourceforge)

What's in 0.3.0 release:

Stake generation protocol upgrade (protocol switch March 20th)
Qt UI support
Fix compatibility with vanitygen (note: private keys dumped in v0.2 is no longer importable into v0.3.0, must dump again from v0.3.0 client)
Miscellaneous bug fixes and improvements

The protocol upgrade in 0.3.0 includes a new algorithm to derive proof-of-stake hash modifier, the entity that scrambles computation for stake owners, which replaces the current proof-of-stake difficulty used as modifier in 0.2 protocol. The design was started late September last year, when I first began to realize the issues with using difficulty as modifier. Honorary mention also goes to Jutarul, who independently discovered and verified an issue with using difficulty as modifier and published on bitcointalk in December last year, while successfully executed a demo attack on the block chain. Other changes in the protocol include starting hash weight from 0 at the 30-day mininum age, and requirement that coinstake timestamp must equal block timestamp. Overall 0.3 protocol should significantly strengthen the proof-of-stake protection and resolve the current known vulnerabilities.

My sincere appreciation to co-contributors of 0.3.0 release:

Robert VanHazinga of Hartland PC (dreamwatcher) for the vanitygen compatibility fix
Jutarul for demonstrating stake generation vulnerability
EskimoBob for reporting issue fixed in 0.3.0

And just to make it absolutely clear Blackcoin uses 0.3.0 POS protocol.

Also the attack described would not work. Coins are not staked only on coinage, it is only one factor. So even if you made a lot of transactions so all your coins were separated by a small interval, there is no guarantee they will stake at each interval - in fact splitting them into small amounts to make these intervals will make them less likely to stake. You would have to have a very large amount of coins at each interval to even have a chance of producing 2 consecutive blocks. This attack is completely unrealistic.

Thank you both, my fears have been quelled and I've learned some new stuff:)

artiface

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote from: Jabulon on March 29, 2014, 02:31:40 PM

Quote from: stormia on March 29, 2014, 02:27:21 PM

Quote from: Soepkip on March 29, 2014, 08:33:47 AM

Quote from: deadmanwalking on March 29, 2014, 03:17:57 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 01:03:45 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 12:51:22 AM

Quote from: Anonymousg64 on March 29, 2014, 03:09:12 AM

im still on the fence

can someone explain how this stops someone from generating lots of PoS blocks 20 days in the future from a bunch of TX's with small interval, whether through one or multiple wallets

Code:

ss << nStakeModifier;
ss << nTimeBlockFrom << nTxPrevOffset << txPrev.nTime << prevout.n << nTimeTx;
hashProofOfStake = Hash(ss.begin(), ss.end());
if(CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
return false;

im not well enough versed with the code to know what these variable names imply

i have discovered a flaw with current PoS implementation

you can easily do a 51% attack with PoS blocks without needing large holdings

since PoS blocks are generated on a coin age basis, you could create TXO's delayed by a time offset at the minimum TXO cost for a future attack period

so after creating 10000 TXO of 1 MINT separated by 0.5 seconds to make sure 60 consecutive blocks are generated at repeated interval by your wallet 20 days in the future, the attack would last 1 hour and 40 minutes

enough to put the security and function of a coin in question

couple that with the fact the difficulty calculation includes PoS blocks, that would mean difficulty would jump to stratospheric levels making it impossible to mine PoW blocks

are people really not concerned about this?

YOU CAN 51% ATTACK ANY POS COIN WITHOUT THE NEED FOR 51% OF SUPPLY OR ANY PoW HASHRATE AT ALL

Hi all. Just thought I'd share some of the joy we've been dealing with on the Mintcoin thread. Have a good night.

Check our code i'd say

No explanation? I'm not computer savvy enough to get the answer from the code myself so I was hoping somebody who knows the blackcoin code could explain. It seems that this type of attack is prevented by hybrid PoW/PoS since the PoW blocks have a different and independent difficulty algorithm from the PoS blocks, and you cannot predict with any certainty what the next block in the chain will be (trying to build x consecutive PoS blocks to form an attack with would be interrupted by the generation of a valid PoW block). If that is true, I still don't understand how a pure PoS coin would deal with this. I've got a lot of money invested in this coin and other PoS coins so I would like to know my money is safe, and I would appreciate a concrete answer other than "your money is safe" or "we've figured out how to prevent that" because I'm the type of person that only trusts something if I understand why.

This flaw was addressed by the author of PoS, Sunny King, earlier this year:

Official release build is now available http://www.ppcoin.org/ (via sourceforge)

What's in 0.3.0 release:

Stake generation protocol upgrade (protocol switch March 20th)
Qt UI support
Fix compatibility with vanitygen (note: private keys dumped in v0.2 is no longer importable into v0.3.0, must dump again from v0.3.0 client)
Miscellaneous bug fixes and improvements

The protocol upgrade in 0.3.0 includes a new algorithm to derive proof-of-stake hash modifier, the entity that scrambles computation for stake owners, which replaces the current proof-of-stake difficulty used as modifier in 0.2 protocol. The design was started late September last year, when I first began to realize the issues with using difficulty as modifier. Honorary mention also goes to Jutarul, who independently discovered and verified an issue with using difficulty as modifier and published on bitcointalk in December last year, while successfully executed a demo attack on the block chain. Other changes in the protocol include starting hash weight from 0 at the 30-day mininum age, and requirement that coinstake timestamp must equal block timestamp. Overall 0.3 protocol should significantly strengthen the proof-of-stake protection and resolve the current known vulnerabilities.

My sincere appreciation to co-contributors of 0.3.0 release:

Robert VanHazinga of Hartland PC (dreamwatcher) for the vanitygen compatibility fix
Jutarul for demonstrating stake generation vulnerability
EskimoBob for reporting issue fixed in 0.3.0

And just to make it absolutely clear Blackcoin uses 0.3.0 POS protocol.

Also the attack described would not work. Coins are not staked only on coinage, it is only one factor. So even if you made a lot of transactions so all your coins were separated by a small interval, there is no guarantee they will stake at each interval - in fact splitting them into small amounts to make these intervals will make them less likely to stake. You would have to have a very large amount of coins at each interval to even have a chance of producing 2 consecutive blocks. This attack is completely unrealistic.

kana

full member

Activity: 183

Merit: 100

Quote from: machinez on March 29, 2014, 02:43:33 PM

to match $14 dollars, you will need a scrypt rig that can mine at around 4.7mhz. If you're looking to purchase one TODAY, then SHA256 seems to be a better option as you can get the ANTMINER S1 on ebay for $500-600 Cool

A scrypt rig will cost alot more than that Cry

Even with the difference in power usage?

Topic: [ANN] Blacknet | IBO for BlackCoin | New code | PoS | No ICO - page 1203. (Read 2509934 times)