Topic: ANTMINER S7 is available at bitmaintech.com with 4.86TH/s, 0.25J/GH - page 318. (Read 527809 times)

This is nowhere near adequate. You have completely botched the release of the S7 and screwed over your loyal customer base of early adopters.

Bitmain has enjoyed a lot of good will with this community. You have burned through that now and are well on your way to ruining your reputation.

Prior to this debacle, I would have no problem placing orders with you for early batches. Now I have no intention of being an early adopter of future products.

You should change your plans and truly make us whole. Once you destroy our trust, it will be hard to earn back.

Are full refunds an option?


Ufo

It is bad business to push your semiconductor device fabrication issues onto B1 users in the guise of "engineering" issues, while you pull out the ones that are in spec for B1 for shipment to us. Then with a short wait the B2/3 orders will filled with B1 users equipment that failed or barely passed your QA\QC marketed hashrates. Surely, you can come up with something more of a middle of the road approach of appeasement? Using hashnest to test our pre-orders, charging high pool fees and starting the counter on day one of your official "delay" date after a month of waiting for some, surely doesn't sit well with your company (or for sure your customer base). We are all in this to make money by mining, which in essence you have been doing with your engineering tests on hashnest using our B1 orders.

I am not trying to be a pain, but put yourselves in the position of your customers. Some of us have spent tens of thousands of dollars awaiting our equipment, but the small home miner sold their gear to afford one or two S7's. The ROI will likely never happen for most before the halving since a large amount will dump their s7's on ebay in March or April to make up for the huge loss for a month of lost mining.


Ufo

I ordered 2 on day one they arrived fast and with the soft reboot i can do 4800 on each one at freq 600.
I believe the batch one can do close to spec if your psu really gives 11.9 volts to each pcie jack with full draw on it.

my guess is this s-7 needs very close to prefect voltage so if your psu sags below 11.8 at the socket you are fucked.
my second guess is most people don't know how to measure the draw at the socket to see just how bad the psu sags.

my psu is putting out 12.07 volts before it hits the s-7 socket the 1200 watts pulled across nine sockets drops the power down to 11.94 volts this is above 11.8 which is good.  but all nine sockets read 11.93 or 11.94 volts.

I suspect that most losing s-7 low hash like 4600 would do better if the psu supplied really tight numbers.



like all nine jack at 11.93 or 11.94  i think if you have two psu's and five jacks are getting 11.9 and the other four jacks get 11.96


you get a fail due to 11.9 mixed with 11.94. 

Thank you for posting the compensation details.

I have to note though that this is the LOWEST possible compensation amount you could possibly come up with. It doesn't address the issue of some purchases being delivered two weeks ago thus having a significant advantage. As someone already mentioned it is unfair for those with lower power costs. It implies a very high 2.5% "pool fee". It doesn't address the price difference between Batch 1 and 2/3. It doesn't address the issues with already delivered underperforming miners.

You could have made a lot of friends here with a more reasonable plan that would reward and not penalize early adopters. Oh well, who needs friends when you have a monopoly.

By using $0.098/kWh (hashnet overhead?) you are simply reducing the payout since large numbers of us have much cheaper electricity, even you. Will there be coupons and anything to compensate the B1 buyers pricing discrepancy with your B2/3 miners? I assume you are using hashnest to find the B1/2/3 miners that have already been manufactured to meet the B1 pre-order hashrate +/-5%, at least that is what I would do if the roles were reversed. Has there been anything discussed about this pricing difference at all, which I know will be a very hotly discussed discrepancy with B1 pre-orders like myself.

Engineers working on already manufactured hardware means they are testing the miners, not working on the semiconductor device fabrication issues that QA\QC missed since they have already been pressed. Will that be addressed at all?


Ufo (ex-Applied Materials)

Thank you very much for an update, it is very much appreciated. What about the difference between B1 and the others, will anything be done to accommodate the pricing differences?


Ufo

This is the "form notice"?
It's not a promise, it's an agreement.
What is a "spot check"?
What are you going to do with those who got the batch 2 miners when they bought batch 1?

Dear loyal customers,

We're sorry to inform you that we didn't make the shipment of some orders today as promised. When we did the last spot check, we found some issues which cannot be delivered to you directly, engineers are working on it now and shipment should be arranged before end of next week.

Due to this trouble, we'd like to offer you the compensation following 97.5%*PPS payment according to the total hash rate of miners in order, starting from Oct. 11 Hong Kong Time, till the real shipping out date(which is not included), with electricity cost deducted at the price of $0.098/KWH.

The accounting unit is Bitcoin in the calculating, while USD is considered as a foreign currency. The day to day exchange rate will be get from Bitstamp daily average.

The final payment will be after we have collected your payment address, and we will inform you the way to confirm your receiving address with us.

After collect all the necessary info, we'll process the refund by batches, please wait for update patiently.

Apologize again!

To the person that said they pre-printed the shipping labels, if they use UPS I get notified immediately when a shipping label is scanned. That record will show when it was entered in the UPS system, so with them being late already makes no sense. I imagine there are several people working today trying to find a balance to appease people and make it not seem like damage control. Since they have the only real platform for home miners at this point they are killing us with the difficulty changes and the days lost before the halving.

The coin price is slowly rising as I expected, but will it be enough for us to recoup a reasonable amount of ROI before selling the S7's before they release the 16nm asci's? That question is the one that has me wondering if they offer a refund, should I simply take it and day trade until the halving. There are ten variables I use that have blown my profit model out of the water before the halving, so I am in uncharted waters. I am not sure what I will do if they offer multiple options, which is unlikely. Every day not mining before the halving is costing us money.....

Anyhow, I am angry, bewildered and wondering what the announcement will be on Monday Chine time....


Ufo

Normally, in mass production of IC's QA\QC will perform burn-in tests and report their findings. My suspicion is they ran into issues with a large batch of under performing chips and had to sell them since production costs are a capex expense, albeit on our dime. Anything short of them making up the difference between pricing on B1 and later batches for people that pre-ordered B1 will be very disappointing.

I cleared out all of my miners and paid for nine s7's /w their recommended PSU's. I believe they know they will have serious backlash and are trying to come up with a solution to balance out the failure of their first production run with the people that paid for it. Not using ones own equity/credit is always better when releasing any product, which is why they are generally priced lower in western business practices. The fact they priced the B1 higher, then dropped the pricing on B2/B3 for obvious reasons will make their decision very difficult. Most people that know supply chain mechanics will know that this a worse case scenario in the west, but they are the only reliable provider that will sell to non-mega farms.

I know three farms with over fifty s7's on order that received theirs before the holiday that ordered in mid September, so they are appeasing the larger customers. Granted my measly nine is small in comparison, but I am losing money everyday.

Hopefully, the Monday announcement will shore up my faith in them. I am not holding my breathe at this point.

edit: I honestly think they didn't intentionally ship out the under performing s7's. They realized it after the fact and quickly created B2/3 to allow them to recoup the losses from their bad batch, while B1 order holders sit on the sidelines waiting for their never ending holiday and weekends for a true update or compensation option.


Ufo

I am curious as to their response on Monday China time since they had our btc/fiat for this "long" amount of time for Batch 1, even though it's only one day "late" at this point. I have lost over $1k in mining and considerably more in trading while they were on vacation. The thing that makes me angry is hashnest has s7's and a large number of people that ordered in early September have not received their miners.

While I understand the clusterfuck they are going through with the hashrate variance in their initial release, I am concerned they will simply remedy the issue with the one day late "delay". They are using our pre-orders to float the manufacturing costs/issues while not providing accurate updates like most companies would, but at this point they have a monopoly for home miners.

I am hoping for some form of reasonable compensation, but if they are using the float to avoid using their own equity or credit lines, it is worrying me beyond the inconvenience.

We will see their official response on Monday "hopefully", but anything short of making up the pricing differences between Batch 1 and later batches is going to make a bunch of people very agitated.

Looking at all of the angles, I am expecting the worst and hoping for the best. Based on their track record, I expect a coupon. Anything better than that I will consider a deus ex machina event.....



Ufo

Ofc there is a overlap. But the fact is this:
When you produce chips, everything is made in one "batch" or plate or whatever you want to call it. When the batch is done, they cut it into individual chips.
Then they test the chips to check the performance and stability. I guess this is called Quality Control.

Intel example:
When the batch is done, the good performing chips (that has proven stable at a given performance) are labeled as "Intel" processors.
The chips (from the same batch/plate) that are not stable at the target clock/performance, are underclocked to a freq that makes it stable. And labeled and sold as "Celeron" processors.

Do you see where I'm getting at?

What Bitmain has done is this:
They tested the chips from batch 1, and figured out that some of these chips do not perform as the BM1385 are supposed to.
What did they do? They took the poor performing chips, placed them on hashingboards, and shipped them out to customers as S7 miners anyway..
Why did they do this? If they didn't, many batch 1 S7 orders would have been shipped late, and they would have been forced to pay big compensations.

This is what I believe has happend, and is the reason why I will call it a scam if I get some of these celeron miners..

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm assuming ASIC chips are made the same way as CPU's.

4.8-5%= 4.6
4.6+5%=4.8
So I take it there is overlap between the two

To me it is 4.6 batch 3 and batch 1
4.4 batch 2

Did you do the soft reboot after powering up?

Well, they keep changing that "disclaimer". At first it was ±5%, then they changed it to "Optimal hashrate 4.86TH".
Anyway, both batch 1 and 2 has the same disclaimer. If you get the units that can't reach 4.86, you got the faulty batch 2, its that simple.
If they give me batch 2, when I paid for batch 1, I will consider it a scam.

Can someone post what kind of dB you are getting with lower than default settings AND lower fan settings (for example, 30-55%)?
I am thinking that i might be able to run a second unit if I keep the noise down.
thanks

Don't forget about their disclaimer on product page  Hash Rate: 4.86 TH/s ±5%, although it has always been -5%. But I do hope everybody gets good per spec working units including myself.

I have bought hundreds of units from Bitmain.There may be a delay for a few days.For me, delay is much better then receiving faulty miners.
It is international sales, you do not buy from the shop at the corner.
I am pissed of them because today the site did not allow me to use the coupons, etc.But I never thought they are scam.They are bussinessman not thieves.
I am not connected to them any means,I am not their advocate.I just say sometimes you can not control everything.There is systematic risks.If there is a fault, it is not the chips but FPGA.
I believe we will run our S7 units in November.If they are late they will pay.

ps:I have mailed them about my coupon issue .I will also give feedback.

Oops.

Sorry, to clarify, I meant to state that they are now beyond their specified 10 day period, by a day.

Thanks for that catch