Topic: [Archive] BFL trolling museum (Read 69392 times)
I left it open so people could get out their final retorts here instead of starting new threads... but fair enough. Locked.
I appreciate the recent actions by the mods in excising chunks of thread that don't belong.
This thread is however a lost cause. Only a complete audit of every post will save it - but who on earth could muddle through this thread and make any sense of it?
I agree. Can we just lock this thread and start over? This thread is however a lost cause. Only a complete audit of every post will save it - but who on earth could muddle through this thread and make any sense of it?
I appreciate the recent actions by the mods in excising chunks of thread that don't belong.
This thread is however a lost cause. Only a complete audit of every post will save it - but who on earth could muddle through this thread and make any sense of it?
This thread is however a lost cause. Only a complete audit of every post will save it - but who on earth could muddle through this thread and make any sense of it?
I like the forum and it's operation, but it's not going to look very good if BFL turns out to be a complete scam given the thread name change and that still, a quarter after BFL were to have delivered, I continue to see bitcointalk.org pumping BFL through their (presumably) paid advertising.
Thought for the day. Now I gotta go to work...though that has not stopped me from spending way to much time on the forum than is healthy over the last 1.5 years...
Note that I never said _who_ was trolling in this thread… Thought for the day. Now I gotta go to work...though that has not stopped me from spending way to much time on the forum than is healthy over the last 1.5 years...
That its stuffed with trolling is indisputable and this remains true regardless of what BFL delivers when.
Adds on the forum are paid— sure. And have nothing to do with me: I don't see any of that revenue, I'm just an unpaid volunteer.
I like the forum and it's operation, but it's not going to look very good if BFL turns out to be a complete scam given the thread name change and that still, a quarter after BFL were to have delivered, I continue to see bitcointalk.org pumping BFL through their (presumably) paid advertising.
Thought for the day. Now I gotta go to work...though that has not stopped me from spending way to much time on the forum than is healthy over the last 1.5 years...
all of a sudden 25% less chips.
All of a sudden? They clarified weeks ago that 75k would easily cover all their pre orders.
I interpreted that statement as the ASIC design team is payed on performance. If they never deliver a working ASIC then the engineers do not get paid.
The engineers obviously do not work at the fab, they 'only' design the ASIC for BFL, since they don't have the expertise in house
But someone has to pay for the maskset and I doubt it is the ASIC design team. So BFL does pay the price if the design team makes a mistake, sure they wont have to pay the engineers or pay them less, but BFL has to pay the fab and that is where the real costs are (although i do not presume ASIC design in itself is cheap).
Perhaps Josh can clarify his statement
The engineers obviously do not work at the fab, they 'only' design the ASIC for BFL, since they don't have the expertise in house
But someone has to pay for the maskset and I doubt it is the ASIC design team. So BFL does pay the price if the design team makes a mistake, sure they wont have to pay the engineers or pay them less, but BFL has to pay the fab and that is where the real costs are (although i do not presume ASIC design in itself is cheap).
Perhaps Josh can clarify his statement
That didn't take long: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/690-13-jan-2013-asic-update-discussion-thread-5.html#post10399
I'm pretty sure that's what creativex was eluding to.
Quote
Another delay we've had to endure is the fact that we have effectively tied the ASIC teams payment to the success of the chip. If the chip were to be a failure they don't get paid... so they have incentive to get it right but that has made them very cautious and slow to approve final masks (This is why we can refund all pre-orders we want and why we have the capital to do what we need to do without a failure putting us in bankruptcy).
I'm pretty sure that's what creativex was eluding to.
Can't imagine them not getting paid at all before producing them.
Right good logic.
Take customer preorders and have them basically pay you to develop and ship this new device and at the same time tell the manufacturer/fab/engineer "fuck you you don't get paid until you finish it"
Right that makes a lot of sense.
Hypocritical much Josh?
Plus I don't think anyone would be that stupid to take on a job like that without getting a percentage of the total cost upfront before any work began.
all of a sudden 25% less chips.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
WHAT?!? BFL wrong about a specification estimate? ...surely you jest. Please cite 12 examples of something a BFL rep said that turned out to be inaccurate, then find 12 moar. I'll give you 90 seconds which should be more than enough time.
Ask me about 12 truths, and I might need 25 days....
Has to be because thats what i meant to
Could someone (or inaba himself) explain to me why he's not using his BFL Account do comment us trolls?
Just curious?
Could someone (or inaba himself) explain to me why he's not using his BFL Account do comment us trolls?
Just curious?
That didn't take long: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/690-13-jan-2013-asic-update-discussion-thread-5.html#post10399
I'm pretty sure that's what creativex was eluding to.
Quote
Another delay we've had to endure is the fact that we have effectively tied the ASIC teams payment to the success of the chip. If the chip were to be a failure they don't get paid... so they have incentive to get it right but that has made them very cautious and slow to approve final masks (This is why we can refund all pre-orders we want and why we have the capital to do what we need to do without a failure putting us in bankruptcy).
I'm pretty sure that's what creativex was eluding to.
He mentioned that they only get paid when delivering a working product.
I thought it was in reference to the FAB. I'll hunt it to give everybody piece of mind.
He mentioned that they only get paid when delivering a working product.
Didn't Josh say their engineers get nada if they don't produce? Odd if any respectable engineer works that way, but I do recall it being said.
No BTW, I'm not going fishing for it. ;p I get queasy going through pages of BFL fabricated bs.
I also don't believe JZ is just a little Indian within the organization. If that were the case he'd have been sh1tcanned long ago for grotesque incompetence.
No BTW, I'm not going fishing for it. ;p I get queasy going through pages of BFL fabricated bs.
I also don't believe JZ is just a little Indian within the organization. If that were the case he'd have been sh1tcanned long ago for grotesque incompetence.
all of a sudden 25% less chips.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
WHAT?!? BFL wrong about a specification estimate? ...surely you jest. Please cite 12 examples of something a BFL rep said that turned out to be inaccurate, then find 12 moar. I'll give you 90 seconds which should be more than enough time.
Josh is obviously a lacky that just spouts out the next "estimate" given by the "engineers" which are working in a blackbox.
I seriously think that BFL started out with good intentions to create ASICs but then as things didnt go according to plan they panicked and made bad development decisions (money management) and are now caught in a place where they have tons of irritated customers that will cancel should they delay one more time but at the same time have no control over the actual creation of the chips/devices and can only go on the "engineer" who they paid a ton of $$ to produce these things for them.
Wouldn't be surprised to see 3 more delays and set of excuses and possibly have BFL run because they don't have enough money to cover ALL customer preorders should they all request a refund at the same time. (PONZI-like).
all of a sudden 25% less chips.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
WHAT?!? BFL wrong about a specification estimate? ...surely you jest. Please cite 12 examples of something a BFL rep said that turned out to be inaccurate, then find 12 moar. I'll give you 90 seconds which should be more than enough time.
all of a sudden 25% less chips.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
LOL a moving target can be expected when someone really doesn't know when things will be done.
Next it will be that the mini rigs will be 0.9Th/s instead of 1.5TH/s and the power will be 50% higher than expected.
It appears that one of three things is about to happen,
A) BFL lost 25k of chips due to genuine malfunctions.
B) BFL lost 25k chips they initially tried to turn a Frankenstein QFN to FCBGA configuration. (The operation was unsuccessful and 25,000 Frankensteins died)
Note: Which implies that they only expected to receive 75k by Feb 10th. So that means there may be a delay coming up for later customers.
C) For whatever reason the Fab only got 75k chips done for them on time. (Unlikely IMO)
As they usually go out at the same time.
----------------
Written by the "Excuses guy":
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/796-just-ordered-my-jalape%F1o-2.html#post11856
A) BFL lost 25k of chips due to genuine malfunctions.
B) BFL lost 25k chips they initially tried to turn a Frankenstein QFN to FCBGA configuration. (The operation was unsuccessful and 25,000 Frankensteins died)
Note: Which implies that they only expected to receive 75k by Feb 10th. So that means there may be a delay coming up for later customers.
C) For whatever reason the Fab only got 75k chips done for them on time. (Unlikely IMO)
As they usually go out at the same time.
----------------
Written by the "Excuses guy":
Quote
We only have 75k chips to start off with, not 100k anymore, just a point of fact. See update tonight or tomorrow for more information on this as well.
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/796-just-ordered-my-jalape%F1o-2.html#post11856
I really hope we can all calm down. Me and PL have come to an understanding and I hope you can too Inaba. If we all have a shrewd of decorum when we post then hopefully clown/stalker/sexoffenders like Micon will just get kicked out of the community.
Says one of the biggest clowns himself.
Look at the die shot.
16 fully unrolled cores, each producing 1 hash per clock cycle.
7500MH/s / 16 cores = 468.75MHz.
From what I remember of the announcement, the 500MHz mark was what they moved too.
Edit: Found it.
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/104-shipping-2-3-weeks-2.html#post1461
Ah ok. That update from Josh was 10/9, and they upped their specs exactly when, end of September? They were so close I got confused and thought the 500MHz number was for the old spec.16 fully unrolled cores, each producing 1 hash per clock cycle.
7500MH/s / 16 cores = 468.75MHz.
From what I remember of the announcement, the 500MHz mark was what they moved too.
Edit: Found it.
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/104-shipping-2-3-weeks-2.html#post1461
So lets say ~500MHz means 60GH/s @ 60W. So lets say they went to 800MHz: we're talking almost 100GH/s @ 120W? Totally just guessing here.
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