Topic: Bitcoin Conference 2012- London 15-16 Sept | ANNOUNCEMENT sponsorship available! - page 9. (Read 60311 times)

1. Amir is directly responsible for allowing the theft of what is currently worth more than $500,000 worth of customer funds.
2. Amir is directly responsible for the destruction of the only asset that Bitcoinica had, that could have been sold to pay off the creditors. (The proprietary Bitcoinica code)
3. Amir is directly responsible for delaying the return of funds to creditors by refusing to relinquish his control of Bitcoinica.


I think the creditors have plenty of rational reasons to be super angry with Amir. (Genjix)

Please redirect all rage,FUD and witch burning to some other thread!
There are plenty of them
//DeaDTerra

Even though I am also awaiting a refund from Bitcoinica, I would like to make this debate more balanced.

You need to realise that Amir, Patrick and Donald are three individuals. They are not the same person. What bad did Amir do? He blabbers a lot, has strong opinions about issues and he released confidential documents. For Bitcoinica's creditors, the first two are irrelevant. The last one is to a large extent an internal issue between him and Bitcoinica. What remains is the (presumably inadvertent) release of the password within the confidential documents that lead to a theft of some funds, of which a large proportion has been recovered in the meantime. But this is as well an internal issue of Bitcoinica.

Amir (based on available information) did not have access to Bitcoinica's funds, and if I recall right from his posts, his suggestions about the refund process were rejected (by Patrick, presumably).

In summary, the creditors have no logical reason to be angry with Amir, even though they have plenty of emotional reasons.

You've just described every self-styled "entrepreneur", "visionary", and "ideas person" I've ever met.

typo due to rage....

Cant believe ppl let worthless shiet like him to organize the conference. Get the fck off bitcoin community already.

Whats that supposed to mean ?

Shut up, let ppl speak for themselves.

Amir, you made me sick. You're lucky i'm thousands miles from London.

That's the problem. You should also be sorry that a large amount of money went missing. Also, you should know better than saying to a client that you could care less about the large amount he lost because he can still make ends meet. Even if you thought so, which is bad enough, you should know better than to speak it out.

I'm confused about why didn't you hand it over to someone with liquidity to cover losses.

This is going to sound like "hindsight is always 20/20" but I was worried since the very moment you guys got involved in Bitcoinica and pulled all my funds from both Bitcoinica and Intersango (thank ****). You are 3 young lads running an exchange, which I used by the way. Why would you get involved in a margin trading tool that had been hacked a number of times before? didn't you have enough trouble with the exchange? got bored? even with a conference coming up in months?

This kind of reckless and unprofessional attitude doesn't belong in finance and it's commonplace in the Bitcoin community (no need to even point fingers at anyone). Mainly because it's run by kids. The community needs to mature ASAP and you guys should hand over your business to people like Roger Ver before you end up in jail. We need more people like Roger and fewer like you, the chinese teen and the emo guy who's involved in 200 projects and delivered none to a decent standard.

And how do you know that Roger's 25,000 missing BTC hasn't affected him personally?  How do you know that it's only a "fraction" of an "already large net worth"?  How do you know that that wasn't Roger's life savings that he had worked his a** off over the last 30 years to accumulate?  How do you know that those people claiming that they are on their last meal are telling the truth?  Why are you in a position of any kind to judge who is in the worst position as a result of your actions?  And frankly, why does it matter to you?  Would you rather have divvied up the money based on who needs it the most?  A modern day robin hood, screwing the pooch with regards to fairness of who actually deserves what?

No one is going to feel sorry for you for emails you found hard to deal with, by the way.

Nobody asked you for a judgement. Your judgement has already proven to be worthless. So keep your ideas of who is most to be pitied to yourself. Your are not listening to what people are telling you about the consequences of anyone losing money - big or small, it's not your choice of words that is poor. Your logic is flawed because all the people that are suffering due to a big player losing money won't even have email to tell you their stories. Your narcissism and self-righteousness is the actual misery here. Who the fuck do you think you are to believe you can judge over all the consequences of someone being robbed? One reason why liquidators pay back the big fish first is precisely because they know many jobs and existences are on the line, not just a few individuals crying for help. Someone that loses their life savings because he invested it all in a risky business is far more responsible than someone losing their job for no reason because their employer just lost thousands of dollars. What are you? A Marxist trying to decide who's more worthy of the funds? Reconsider your believes of what is right and what is wrong because your logic is fundamentalist.

Even Zhou himself pretty much acknowledged that.


Of course it's easy to take an ethical stance against something after you've already profited from it.

Everybody is hurt when they play the money game.

This is a very interesting question. Donald, Patrick, and Genjix ?

This is true.  Had the Intersango trio lifted even one finger,  likely everyone would already have %100 of their money back with the exception of the four plaintives listed on the lawsuit.   (This was our offer to Intersango)

genjix:
How can you say you are sorry? You didn't do *anything* to help the situation. You 3 are either complete lying thieves or incredibly stupid. We offered to take over bitcoinica and pay everyone back 100% of their claims but instead you assholes twiddled your thumbs, hid and allowed even *more* money to be stolen and now it is all going to be pissed away in receivership. All you had to do was simply give control back to tihan but that was too much trouble for you worthless...
 

Maybe this guy?

http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/3715077/shareholdings

You're all not listening to what I'm saying. I am sorry this happened, but not because a large amount of money went missing but because it affected people in personal ways. Affected them personally.

My choice of words was poor:

I feel far much more for the guy who has lost all of his already small net worth that is paying for his next meal and this month's housing than the guy who has lost a fraction of his already large net worth and has legal recourse available to him.

The absolute numbers don't mean much. It's the effect it has on the person's life.

What do you say to someone when they email you a desperate plea for help because they might not make next week? I remember one guy in particular. I lost his email because I was being flooded with tons of emails. That was really devastating and hard to deal with.

Nefario,

I agree with this, your a stand up guy with a good reputation.

Your working super hard to do this conference, are you willing to take all this hate to keep the others on board?

-Charlie

I suggest the untainted conference organizers publicly sever all ties with the Bitcoinica trio as soon as possible. This is only going to get worse.

How about not abandoning ship and sticking with the claims process? Sadly it sounds like fucking off at the first sign of trouble is your MO.