Can You See Or Tell If A Fight Or Event Is Fix ? - page 3.

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Quote from: KTChampions on July 17, 2022, 01:40:40 PM

Well, it turns out that basically fixed games are the lot of those who are very far from the top level and those who are no longer a promising player. But the bookmakers have a limited bet limit on the games of such athletes (well, or in any case, they see a suspicious amount of bets on someone and can cancel these bets) and it’s hard to earn a lot here.

It is hard to fix a popular match because of cameras at every angle and lots of spectators around. One wrong call from any referee or umpire will create a controversy so high-level league is always careful in their action unless of course it was discussed and planned right before the match happens and involves players who will act accordingly to the plan without any mistakes making spectator to doubt the result

KTChampions

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Quote from: Distinctin on July 16, 2022, 02:15:30 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on July 16, 2022, 07:03:17 AM

I don't believe in such scenarios. How much money must be at stake for someone in management (or a player) to risk their career and freedom for money? Considering that more than 3-4 people are clearly involved in such a scheme, the risk is very high. And even if you are not caught by an indirect sign, information about your affairs may come out.

That is the risk for sure if indeed there will be a time that information will leak but they are willing to take the risk because of money, sadly, there are really people who would want to gamble with that especially if they know that if their career will not bloom that much. I don't think we are kind of new in that situation.
The staked money is disclosed for public information for sure but we are not blind and deaf to know what is the real deal.

Well, it turns out that basically fixed games are the lot of those who are very far from the top level and those who are no longer a promising player. But the bookmakers have a limited bet limit on the games of such athletes (well, or in any case, they see a suspicious amount of bets on someone and can cancel these bets) and it’s hard to earn a lot here.

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Quote from: Distinctin on July 16, 2022, 02:15:30 PM

That is the risk for sure if indeed there will be a time that information will leak but they are willing to take the risk because of money, sadly, there are really people who would want to gamble with that especially if they know that if their career will not bloom that much. I don't think we are kind of new in that situation.
The staked money is disclosed for public information for sure but we are not blind and deaf to know what is the real deal.

We are now living in the society when it is hard to believe that all the fights/ events are fixed.
Even if wish to believe that this a fair game. We won't be able to because there is always something going on behind the closed doors.

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Quote from: KTChampions on July 16, 2022, 07:03:17 AM

Quote from: Peanutswar on July 15, 2022, 09:31:29 AM

Quote from: KTChampions on July 15, 2022, 06:37:33 AM

I don't think scammers are stupid enough to constantly use the same player (who in your example gets a red card at some point in time) and the same account to place a bet. The problem with scammers is that even if they have a player willing to "cooperate" they can't make much money from it - if you make a small bet of several thousand dollars, the profit will be ridiculous compared to the risks and costs of such an operation. If you make a bet of a million or even a hundred thousand dollars, then obviously this will attract the attention of the bookmaker and he can simply return the bet with a coefficient of 1 without any trials and evidence.

This kind of thing mostly happen with the management of the team or the player itself if there's an offer to the management and they think the capability of the team for sure is not ready like an underdog some of them taking the risk to win and some of them are grabbing the chance to get paid at the same time they played even though the chance is small and just for the formality but it is different if there's a higher offer than the reward itself of course there's a possibility of throwing the game.

I don't believe in such scenarios. How much money must be at stake for someone in management (or a player) to risk their career and freedom for money? Considering that more than 3-4 people are clearly involved in such a scheme, the risk is very high. And even if you are not caught by an indirect sign, information about your affairs may come out.

That is the risk for sure if indeed there will be a time that information will leak but they are willing to take the risk because of money, sadly, there are really people who would want to gamble with that especially if they know that if their career will not bloom that much. I don't think we are kind of new in that situation.
The staked money is disclosed for public information for sure but we are not blind and deaf to know what is the real deal.

KTChampions

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Quote from: Peanutswar on July 15, 2022, 09:31:29 AM

Quote from: KTChampions on July 15, 2022, 06:37:33 AM

I don't think scammers are stupid enough to constantly use the same player (who in your example gets a red card at some point in time) and the same account to place a bet. The problem with scammers is that even if they have a player willing to "cooperate" they can't make much money from it - if you make a small bet of several thousand dollars, the profit will be ridiculous compared to the risks and costs of such an operation. If you make a bet of a million or even a hundred thousand dollars, then obviously this will attract the attention of the bookmaker and he can simply return the bet with a coefficient of 1 without any trials and evidence.

This kind of thing mostly happen with the management of the team or the player itself if there's an offer to the management and they think the capability of the team for sure is not ready like an underdog some of them taking the risk to win and some of them are grabbing the chance to get paid at the same time they played even though the chance is small and just for the formality but it is different if there's a higher offer than the reward itself of course there's a possibility of throwing the game.

I don't believe in such scenarios. How much money must be at stake for someone in management (or a player) to risk their career and freedom for money? Considering that more than 3-4 people are clearly involved in such a scheme, the risk is very high. And even if you are not caught by an indirect sign, information about your affairs may come out.

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If ever you have read some gambling news today, an Italian Chair Umpire Francesco Totaro was suspended by ITIA Provisionally for grounds of match-fixing.[1]

Quote

“The International Tennis Integrity Agency (ITIA) today confirms that Italian chair umpire Francesco Totaro has been provisionally suspended from the sport, pending the full consideration of match-fixing charges.”

It looks like this isn't the first time that ITIA banned umpires due to match-fixing.

Umpires that is banned with the same offense of match-fixing

Majd Affi, a green badge chair umpire for 20 years
Abderahim Gharsallah, a white badge chair umpire
Mohamed Ghassen Snene, a green badge chair umpire

The latter two bans came from manipulating scores inputted into their electronic scoring devices, which did not reflect the actual scores on the court, it happens in Tunisia way back 2020.

Match fixing may not be discovered during the event but post reviews and appeals may open a panel for an investigation to determine if a match-fixing happens during the match.

[1] ITIA Provisionally Suspends Italian Chair Umpire Francesco Totaro

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Quote from: KTChampions on July 15, 2022, 06:37:33 AM

Quote from: Fortify on July 14, 2022, 01:49:09 PM

Most match fixing is only caught because it involves obscure bets that only a bookmaker would see and later investigate. It'll involve things like a football player forcing a red card in the second half of a game. The first bet might not get looked into deeply but a string of suspicious bets, usually focused around particular players would definitely set off alarm bells so it's not something that can last for long. If a bookmaker is ripped off, they'll definitely alert game officials and likely try to recover money by suing. All these things are normally kept behind closed doors to reduce humiliation and stop copycat activities.

I don't think scammers are stupid enough to constantly use the same player (who in your example gets a red card at some point in time) and the same account to place a bet. The problem with scammers is that even if they have a player willing to "cooperate" they can't make much money from it - if you make a small bet of several thousand dollars, the profit will be ridiculous compared to the risks and costs of such an operation. If you make a bet of a million or even a hundred thousand dollars, then obviously this will attract the attention of the bookmaker and he can simply return the bet with a coefficient of 1 without any trials and evidence.

This kind of thing mostly happen with the management of the team or the player itself if there's an offer to the management and they think the capability of the team for sure is not ready like an underdog some of them taking the risk to win and some of them are grabbing the chance to get paid at the same time they played even though the chance is small and just for the formality but it is different if there's a higher offer than the reward itself of course there's a possibility of throwing the game.

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Quote from: KTChampions on July 15, 2022, 06:37:33 AM

Quote from: Fortify on July 14, 2022, 01:49:09 PM

Most match fixing is only caught because it involves obscure bets that only a bookmaker would see and later investigate. It'll involve things like a football player forcing a red card in the second half of a game. The first bet might not get looked into deeply but a string of suspicious bets, usually focused around particular players would definitely set off alarm bells so it's not something that can last for long. If a bookmaker is ripped off, they'll definitely alert game officials and likely try to recover money by suing. All these things are normally kept behind closed doors to reduce humiliation and stop copycat activities.

I don't think scammers are stupid enough to constantly use the same player (who in your example gets a red card at some point in time) and the same account to place a bet. The problem with scammers is that even if they have a player willing to "cooperate" they can't make much money from it - if you make a small bet of several thousand dollars, the profit will be ridiculous compared to the risks and costs of such an operation. If you make a bet of a million or even a hundred thousand dollars, then obviously this will attract the attention of the bookmaker and he can simply return the bet with a coefficient of 1 without any trials and evidence.

some people are very good in making big bets and knowing the deals.
Those who know this art are real legends - I wish people makes their and don't damage other people peace of mind and do not run away with their money while making their profits.

KTChampions

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Quote from: Fortify on July 14, 2022, 01:49:09 PM

Most match fixing is only caught because it involves obscure bets that only a bookmaker would see and later investigate. It'll involve things like a football player forcing a red card in the second half of a game. The first bet might not get looked into deeply but a string of suspicious bets, usually focused around particular players would definitely set off alarm bells so it's not something that can last for long. If a bookmaker is ripped off, they'll definitely alert game officials and likely try to recover money by suing. All these things are normally kept behind closed doors to reduce humiliation and stop copycat activities.

I don't think scammers are stupid enough to constantly use the same player (who in your example gets a red card at some point in time) and the same account to place a bet. The problem with scammers is that even if they have a player willing to "cooperate" they can't make much money from it - if you make a small bet of several thousand dollars, the profit will be ridiculous compared to the risks and costs of such an operation. If you make a bet of a million or even a hundred thousand dollars, then obviously this will attract the attention of the bookmaker and he can simply return the bet with a coefficient of 1 without any trials and evidence.

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Quote from: n0ne on July 13, 2022, 06:59:58 PM

Once we used to believe that WWE is true. Later we understood that everything is planned and executed. It has got separate academy to provide training and based on their performance they were introduced. With real fights it is quite hard to make a prediction on whether the match is a fix.

In the past there used to be signals through which the players give information to the bookies. For what purpose match-fixing came into existence. Everything is Money and during those days technology isn't that accurate. These days things have changed a lot, so chances of fix seems to be lower than the past.

WWE was sure looking so real to me when I was a bit younger and never had an idea that those fights were scripted and all, it kept me entertained every other fight because I really thought it was true. Actually, people of all sorts of age believed that WWE was a real fight with a real champion because we can't really see some hint that it was staged as most of us here did only afford to watch it on the television and never had the chance to see it on personal.
As of now, almost all facts are available in the internet and every video can be paused to see if there was indeed some staging happened in between and that makes the cheating even more impossible to happen. There may be some instances up until now but we can't totally say it as it was just a pure speculation on our part.

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Quote from: Fredomago on July 03, 2022, 04:04:01 PM

Quote from: mirakal on July 01, 2022, 01:44:15 PM

I agree that as per fixed games, it will remain a rumor and a speculation unless there will be some people who will stand up for it and begin an investigation and as long as it's not proven then it's safe to assume that these things are actually rumor.

Locally, there are attempts to expose those kinds of activities but a magic hands coming from nowhere easily remove any rumor about it and the individuals who attempt to bring it out either stop the claim or being ignored. Fixed games will continue to run the business without any doubts, though again, it's tough to recognize and every speculation will remain at it is until something will be proven that the game is being manipulated.

Nonetheless, only those who are involved will also continue to enjoy the luxury of keep sucking their winnings after settling the game.

Well, in every sports ecosystem there will always be corruption and when you try to be discovered, those who have more (economic) power buy all those who want to echo what is bad, this is something that will always exist, according to what they are more connoisseurs of a sport, they can realize when it is fixed or not, but there are times that they do it in such a shameless way that it is impressive how they do it, this reminds me of a local tournament game in Colombia, which the players let the goal be scored in such a crazy way, that everyone said it was fixed, that's a source of shame, in fact those teams were sanctioned by FIFA.

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Quote from: Fredomago on July 14, 2022, 06:29:18 PM

The catch is to protect the entire league and to be aware all the teams that the investigation is already running and facilitators are already tracking down the people behind of this possible game fixing activities.

That might be possible that things are not disclosed to the public to protect the league but all are informed that they will not tolerate such activities and will penalize all the involved persons. They will do the investigation behind the table as making some noise about it might affect the reputation of the league and people will think that it's not a trusted league anymore.

But even if that's possible I'm sure such things are not always happened. Big leagues always do anything to protect their reputation and most of the participating teams and players are involved in shady activities as they also protect their respective careers and fame, especially for popular ones that might also have commercial investments and product advertisements.

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Quote from: Fortify on July 14, 2022, 01:49:09 PM

All these things are normally kept behind closed doors to reduce humiliation and stop copycat activities.

Yeah right, they are doing this to make sure that things will be covered up and not to exposed. Chances of a duplicate act can be tracked if there's already an investigation that runs around. I'm not sure, but maybe the league officials see that with the kind of treatment, it will avoid ruining the credibility of the sport and it will lessen the negative impact that will surely widen if the cases will be exposed that much.

The catch is to protect the entire league and to be aware all the teams that the investigation is already running and facilitators are already tracking down the people behind of this possible game fixing activities.

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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/11/cricket-fake-ipl-tournament-farm-russian-gamblers-india-police-betting-scam-the-sting

have you seen this news? some scammers has created a fake Indian premier League of cricket just to fool russian gamblers! Of course results of the matches were adapted according bets. This is the first time that I have see something similar. Find inside article some details Wink

about the scam (yes they have been caught)

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Quote from: Saisher on June 04, 2022, 09:46:28 AM

It could be on basketball, boxing or horse racing, or any kind of sport, after being in a particular sport for many years can you see or tell if a fight or event is fixed, there are upsets but in the back of our mind, there's a possibility that the match or game is fixed.

Most match fixing is only caught because it involves obscure bets that only a bookmaker would see and later investigate. It'll involve things like a football player forcing a red card in the second half of a game. The first bet might not get looked into deeply but a string of suspicious bets, usually focused around particular players would definitely set off alarm bells so it's not something that can last for long. If a bookmaker is ripped off, they'll definitely alert game officials and likely try to recover money by suing. All these things are normally kept behind closed doors to reduce humiliation and stop copycat activities.

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I'll be watching the Jake Paul vs Hasim Rahman Jr fight pretty closely to see if there's another moment where Rahman will be accused of taking a dive. I'm sure that fixed fights probably happen quite a bit in professional fighting and the best demonstration of that lately has to be Jake Paul. Many people have questioned if his knockouts are real so if this is a topic that you're interested in, you've no doubt watched Jake's prior knockouts. If there's another moment like the Woodley fight where people claim a dive is taken, you have to give a little credit to the conspiracy.

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Quote from: GiftedMAN on July 13, 2022, 04:28:19 AM

Quote from: Saisher on June 04, 2022, 09:46:28 AM

It could be on basketball, boxing or horse racing, or any kind of sport, after being in a particular sport for many years can you see or tell if a fight or event is fixed, there are upsets but in the back of our minds, there's a possibility that the match or game is fixed.

Yes, I can assume that a match is fixed based on the performance of the team especially if it happens to be a well-known team with good players playing against a team that has fewer quality players or a team that is in poor form. Using football as an example, when a big team with an odd of 1.20 is playing against a smaller team that has an odd of 30.25 is playing a football match when the big team is having all the possessions when the team has created so many goals scoring chances but fails to put any goal at the back of the net even when the team is awarded a penalty, it is obvious that the game is fixed to end as a draw since the small club can not score.

If every match are like that (good/popular teams vs weak/unpopular teams) then people can always bet on the good popular teams and secure a win. That's going to be an easy money and if they still lose then it is indeed questionable. The game must be investigated properly right after the match to see if there's really a fixing that takes place.

On rare occasions, an underdog can win and make an epic comeback but that is if they are really lucky that time. That's the only thing that they can win in a legit manner. Those who bet on those teams are also lucky despite of not doing a research and ended up betting on a weak team.

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Quote from: Pierre 2 on July 13, 2022, 07:17:55 AM

I think it is somekinda hard to spot match fixing in football as players can make many mistakes. But if I observe referee making weird decision and changing flow of match I become doubtful. Some referees I am sure get paid through stopping a specific team's good harmony. And also they sometimes give absurd chances to weaker times. These are examples I can observe in football matches in general.

But often players make mistakes in the highest level games (eg Donaruma in the Champions League) and more than one per game. It is hard to imagine that he is involved in a fixed game, there are just such coincidences when two serious mistakes happen at once in one game. It seems to me that the same thing happens with referees, although it's hard to argue with the fact that referees are often biased and often seem to be trying to influence the outcome of the game (especially in the past, since now there is VAR and now it is more difficult to make a biased decision).

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There was a boxing match where you can easily see the fight was fixed and I believe it's on youtube if you want to watch here is the link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_-C4Sk6EHw&ab_channel=LucaTiberiu

In the boxing match, you can easily see the sign whenever they fixed the fight and you can see that the boxer who is losing is hardly making any moves to win the fight, he just right there waiting for his opponent's punches to land on his face and get knockout easily. But the other sports like basketball, it is really hard to detect because it seems like the losing team has just some bad day they're not getting their usual shooting percentage but in reality, they deliberately took some low percentage shots to lose the game.

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Quote from: n0ne on July 13, 2022, 06:59:58 PM

Once we used to believe that WWE is true. Later we understood that everything is planned and executed. It has got separate academy to provide training and based on their performance they were introduced. With real fights it is quite hard to make a prediction on whether the match is a fix.

I also used to believe that but I just knew and notice that so many things are wrong like, why there was no blood and why after so many beatings the fighter managed to retaliate and wins the about without bruises or even stain of blood, later I find out that its all a drama but even if its a drama some matches are unpredictable, at least in WWE you know its fixed and you just want to look on the twist of the ending

Quote

In the past there used to be signals through which the players give information to the bookies. For what purpose match-fixing came into existence. Everything is Money and during those days technology isn't that accurate. These days things have changed a lot, so chances of fix seems to be lower than the past.

Because there are many cameras on focus and we have social media and spectators can easily post on social media and debate if there's fixing in particular fights or matches.

Topic: Can You See Or Tell If A Fight Or Event Is Fix ? - page 3. (Read 2584 times)