Computer Scientists Prove God Exists - page 25.

just_me

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Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 08:42:21 AM

I figured this article would cause some interesting discussions on here!

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/computer-scientists-prove-god-exists/story?id=20678984

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/335543-scientists-prove-god-exists-german-scientists-say-they-have/

I find it fascinating.

From one of the articles:

Quote

Gödel’s theorem is based on modal logic, a type of formal logic that, narrowly defined, involves the use of the expressions “necessarily” and “possibly,” according to Stanford University.

The theorem says that God, or a supreme being, is that for which no greater can be conceived. God exists in the understanding. If God exists in the understanding, we could imagine Him to be greater by existing in reality. Therefore, God must exist.

Paleo and Benzmüller say that they have proven that the theorem is correct, at least on a mathematical level.

God as the pinnacle, or peak, and none greater can be concieved.
I think I get the logic.
If God only exists in the understanding but not in reality; then God existing in the reality, would be greater than God existing only in the understanding; therefore God must exist. (because there is none greater than God, and in order to fulfill that logic/reasoning, therefore if God existing in reality is greater than God existing only in understanding, then God must exist in reality then.

I changed the words a bit. I did not understand at first, but I kind of see what they are getting at.

dank

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Quote from: Rassah on November 01, 2013, 11:22:58 PM

Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 07:56:47 PM

Quote from: solex on November 01, 2013, 07:36:20 PM

The real question is "How did the super-compressed ball of energy originate?

It always has been and always will. It was never created, it just has always existed.

OK, let's say this is true, and it has always existed. If you look out into space, you can see that everything is rapidly flying away from everything else. The universe is expanding. If the universe always existed, what is it expanding from? What was the universe before everything was all together in a single spot it's expanding out of?

Think beyond our physical universe. Consciousness has always existed and always will.

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But guys, the tide comes in and the tide goes out. You can't explain that

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Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 07:56:47 PM

Quote from: solex on November 01, 2013, 07:36:20 PM

The real question is "How did the super-compressed ball of energy originate?

It always has been and always will. It was never created, it just has always existed.

OK, let's say this is true, and it has always existed. If you look out into space, you can see that everything is rapidly flying away from everything else. The universe is expanding. If the universe always existed, what is it expanding from? What was the universe before everything was all together in a single spot it's expanding out of?

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Quote from: the joint on November 01, 2013, 07:23:43 PM

Remember: there has never been a single fact, theory, or model that science has been able to prove beyond all doubt, and as long as the scientific method is utilized, this will remain the case forever.

Science can't prove shit. Never has, never will.

Which is exactly why it is the most trustworthy method we have. I trust someone who says "I don't know everything, but based on this and this, the answer is probably this" much more than I trust someone who says "I know everything, and out mpof my ass, the answer is this. DON'T QUESTION ME!"

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Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 06:56:51 PM

Quote from: Rassah on November 01, 2013, 06:37:54 PM

Their proof is that there is a limit to what can be conceived, and that limit is god? Well, it's not the Christian, Hebrew, or Muslim god. I don't really see how it's god at all, actually. Just a supreme limit that nothing can be conceived beyond...

By the way, scientists have disproven god a long time ago. Einstein said that god doesn't play dice with the universe, meaning that nothing is random and everything is planned and predetermined, and then quantum physics came out and proved that things in the universe are random and not planned out at all (maybe even killing a cat in the process, but we don't know), meaning god wasn't around to guide anything, or is just playing with dice, and thus was unimportant. Anyone can play with dice to make the universe completely random, or the universe can just be completely random on its own.

Ahh, but not all scientists have disproven God and this article shows that doesn't it? Could scientist be wrong?

It seems completely illogical to think that the universe is random to me. How could something so complex as our universe happen by chance?

Just so you know, I posted my reply half in jest. Like, "Oh yeah? Will some other scientists said this. You don't doubt Einstein, do you?" Just because these scientists figured this out, doesn't mean they proved god's existence. They basically attributed some concept to the word "god," in much the same way as dank calls the whole universe "god." It's just redefining a word to make your idea sound special, but doesn't actually mean anything. I call a spork "a divine all knowing oracle," but it's just a spork, just like space is just space, and this is just a math function.

As for your question, imagine rolling a 6 sided dice, getting a 1, and then saying "That is impossible! How could I have rolled a 1, when it could have been any one of 6 different numbers?" It doesn't matter. It happened. If there was a one in bazillion chance, and it happened, then it just plain happened. Extremely improbable doesn't mean impossible. If you wish to believe that it happened with a purpose, feel free to keep doing it if it makes you comfortable. For me, it's easier to think that it just happened because there was a chance that it could.

dank

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Quote from: Vod on November 01, 2013, 10:34:13 PM

Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 10:25:31 PM

Was what I said not enough? Magic, that is the fifth dimension. You become god because you are god, you are conscious.

NO. It wasn't enough. Science teaches us that magic does not exist, and even offers to pay a million dollars should magic be proven.
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

I explained the 4th dimension clear enough for anyone to understand. Can you explain the 5th dimension and how it adds to space + time?

Ah, I beg to differ. I have held back a piece of a cloud from moving, with witnesses. I have observed a stationary lamp leap off a table. I have seen the impossible. I know two people who have experienced levitation, one of them actually floating himself, yes, with sober witnesses around.

I have ran my car on empty off the power of consciousness. I have quantum healed a dog of cancer by believing he was healthy.

And I assume more magic (or miracles) will come with time.

The fifth dimension adds the variable of omnipotent consciousness into the equation of life.

Vod

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Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 10:25:31 PM

Was what I said not enough? Magic, that is the fifth dimension. You become god because you are god, you are conscious.

NO. It wasn't enough. Science teaches us that magic does not exist, and even offers to pay a million dollars should magic be proven.
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

I explained the 4th dimension clear enough for anyone to understand. Can you explain the 5th dimension and how it adds to space + time?

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then in the 6th dimension you realize you weren't god and it was just a trick to get you become Satan's puppet. Then 7th heaven. Then 8 ball. 9 grams. 10 is the end? 11 happens. 12 you're 12 years old again. 13 you lose 60 grand at the casino. 14 you save someone's life.

dank

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Quote from: Vod on November 01, 2013, 10:15:57 PM

Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 10:05:48 PM

Okay, you can do things like communicate by thought, telepathy. I have done this, I know it is possible. You can practice telekinesis, levitation, you can learn to fly, I have done this in dreams and I have seen a lamp fall off a table with no movement triggering it to fall (this happened in the same day as the telekinesis). You can channel any entity of your imagination, I have channeled spongebob before and he exploded and came back together (also on the same event as the other happenings).

You can create light, teleport, bend elements such as fire and water. You can create a minilife where you pick what will happen for a short period of time before experiencing it with your choice of ego and returning to your full level of consciousness.

Simply put, you can do anything. I don't want to spoil everything that can happen, but I'm sure I have missed much of the infinite abilities you'll shortly obtain.

Best of all, you feel infinite love, that has to be the best part of anything I have experienced.

DANK! Explain the 5th dimension please. Your ignoring questions is getting old.

Was what I said not enough? Magic, that is the fifth dimension. You become god because you are god, you are conscious.

just_me

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I found a few websites with some witnessing for Jesus Christ, that people might find interesting.

Below is a link to an interesting witness about jesus christ
http://www.w3school.com/

Information on theism, atheism and Mormonism; also discussion of moral topics and issues
pleaseconvinceme.com

Cold Case Detective Converts to Faith In Jesus Christ
Online home to J. Warner Wallace, author of Cold Case Christianity and Christian apologist
And here is a link to a witness from a cold-case detective, that you might also find interesting:
coldcasechristianity.com

Vod

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Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 10:05:48 PM

Okay, you can do things like communicate by thought, telepathy. I have done this, I know it is possible. You can practice telekinesis, levitation, you can learn to fly, I have done this in dreams and I have seen a lamp fall off a table with no movement triggering it to fall (this happened in the same day as the telekinesis). You can channel any entity of your imagination, I have channeled spongebob before and he exploded and came back together (also on the same event as the other happenings).

You can create light, teleport, bend elements such as fire and water. You can create a minilife where you pick what will happen for a short period of time before experiencing it with your choice of ego and returning to your full level of consciousness.

Simply put, you can do anything. I don't want to spoil everything that can happen, but I'm sure I have missed much of the infinite abilities you'll shortly obtain.

Best of all, you feel infinite love, that has to be the best part of anything I have experienced.

DANK! Explain the 5th dimension please. Your ignoring questions is getting old.

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Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 10:05:48 PM

Okay, you can do things like communicate by thought, telepathy. I have done this, I know it is possible. You can practice telekinesis, levitation, you can learn to fly, I have done this in dreams and I have seen a lamp fall off a table with no movement triggering it to fall (this happened in the same day as the telekinesis). You can channel any entity of your imagination, I have channeled spongebob before and he exploded and came back together (also on the same event as the other happenings).

You can create light, teleport, bend elements such as fire and water. You can create a minilife where you pick what will happen for a short period of time before experiencing it with your choice of ego and returning to your full level of consciousness.

Simply put, you can do anything. I don't want to spoil everything that can happen, but I'm sure I have missed much of the infinite abilities you'll shortly obtain.

Best of all, you feel infinite love, that has to be the best part of anything I have experienced.

Don't be fooled. That's how I got sent to jail in the first place. I thought I was telepathically talking to this girl and she was telling me that she wanted me to go kiss her. Well I got up and put my hands on her hips and attempted to kiss her. Unfortunately her boyfriend was there so she pushed me off. A couple days later her boyfriend called me and threatened to make up a story saying I grabbed her boobs if I don't pay him 1000 dollars. I thought there was no way in hell the cops would possibly believe this idiot, but I guess they are required to arrest you even if there is no evidence whatsoever. So it turns out that going out on a limb wishing that your telepathy is working doesn't always turn out so well. Just because I thought I had telepathy doesn't mean I did. Obviously I was just psychotic. I do believe people communicate through telepathy subconsciously though. It's just a matter of being aware of it.

dank

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Okay, you can do things like communicate by thought, telepathy. I have done this, I know it is possible. You can practice telekinesis, levitation, you can learn to fly, I have done this in dreams and I have seen a lamp fall off a table with no movement triggering it to fall (this happened in the same day as the telekinesis). You can channel any entity of your imagination, I have channeled spongebob before and he exploded and came back together (also on the same event as the other happenings).

You can create light, teleport, bend elements such as fire and water. You can create a minilife where you pick what will happen for a short period of time before experiencing it with your choice of ego and returning to your full level of consciousness.

Simply put, you can do anything. I don't want to spoil everything that can happen, but I'm sure I have missed much of the infinite abilities you'll shortly obtain.

Best of all, you feel infinite love, that has to be the best part of anything I have experienced.

kentrolla

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Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 09:44:27 PM

Wow Kentrolla, You say you enjoyed the Amazon and the experience you had there with the "Shaman." I believe in the supernatural but I believe that there is good and evil spirits. With this last post I have a strong suspicion that you have been greatly influenced by that "Shaman" visit in more ways than you expected. They invoke demons with their practices and there is a much greater instance of demon possession and oppression in those cultures. Sure there is "power" there but it leads to great suffering and delusions and bondage. I will pray for Jesus to deliver you from this mental anguish you appear to be in and I pray that you will find someone that can physically pray for you to be released in Jesus' name so you never have to go through this again.

And Dank, you need to be delivered from drugs. That is a form of bondage too. Praying for you to have a clear mind.

Vod. No comment. I can't get past the boob licking picture.

BTW, Everything is NOT a lie. Jesus is the way, the TRUTH and the life.

The shaman visit was about four months after this Jail experience. It actually helped me with the PTSD and Depression caused by this experience. During the whole time until my visit with the Shaman every time I would hear a wall crack in my house or someone walking I would hear those war drums and It was terrifying. Probably the scariest thing when I was in jail was when I heard this little girl get sacrificed for some satanic ritual they were doing outside my cell. I think that's where most of the PTSD came from. I heard a little girl running around giggling and I could hear her shoes tap on the tile then I heard a screaming and the screaming wouldn't stop. She was getting tortured 2 feet away from me and there was nothing I could do about it. Scary stuff. So I would have flashbacks and I wouldn't even be able to talk about any of this stuff until I visited this shaman. I think this shaman was a good person and I think all religions are basically talking about the same thing just with a different interpretation.

I agree Jesus is the answer and when I felt the presence of Jesus it was the best feeling I've ever had in my life. No drug can describe that feeling.

Just remember - Jesus ain't no snitch

inside head joke lol. voices in my head said that.

Vod

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Quote from: BitchicksHusband on November 01, 2013, 09:58:47 PM

There's a ton of scientific evidence at that link that won't ever be considered by the scientific community at large.

Whoa. There is ZERO evidence.

If you have even one shred of evidence, post it here. I won't even require public scientific scrutiny.

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Quote from: pedrog on November 01, 2013, 07:18:17 PM

Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 06:56:51 PM

Quote from: Rassah on November 01, 2013, 06:37:54 PM

Their proof is that there is a limit to what can be conceived, and that limit is god? Well, it's not the Christian, Hebrew, or Muslim god. I don't really see how it's god at all, actually. Just a supreme limit that nothing can be conceived beyond...

By the way, scientists have disproven god a long time ago. Einstein said that god doesn't play dice with the universe, meaning that nothing is random and everything is planned and predetermined, and then quantum physics came out and proved that things in the universe are random and not planned out at all (maybe even killing a cat in the process, but we don't know), meaning god wasn't around to guide anything, or is just playing with dice, and thus was unimportant. Anyone can play with dice to make the universe completely random, or the universe can just be completely random on its own.

Ahh, but not all scientists have disproven God and this article shows that doesn't it? Could scientist be wrong?

It seems completely illogical to think that the universe is random to me. How could something so complex as our universe happen by chance?
Here is a great article I found when looking for something to show how order cannot scientifically come from chaos:

http://www.icr.org/article/819/247/

I liked this quote at the bottom:

Quote

Such notions come not from any empirical evidence but solely from philosophical speculations based on lack of evidence! "Since there is no evidence that evolution proceeded gradually, it must have occurred chaotically!" This seems to be the idea.

If one wants to believe by blind faith that order can arise spontaneously from chaos, it is still a free country. But please don't call it science!

Rassah, you know I love debating with you! Hopefully you know that I do it with good intentions though and I am not really trying to pick a fight here. It is just that I am very passionate about what I believe, as I know you are too.

You can't do with science the same thing you do with the bible, choosing the bits you like and ignoring the rest.

There is no evidence whatsoever, 0, nada, niente, for the existence of something like a god, much less the Abraham God!

Sure they do:

http://www.answersingenesis.org/get-answers

There's a ton of scientific evidence at that link that won't ever be considered by the scientific community at large. No matter how closely they follow the scientific method, their experiments that disprove certain tenets of evolution will never be accepted because scientists also pick and choose. All the time.

And the "global warming" people ignore the fact that you can't move a ship north of Canada right now. In fact they still say that the Canadian glaciers are receding, even as they are having feet of thickness added to them as we speak.

There is no evidence (0, nada, nyet) for God using a "scientific" method that by definition excludes the supernatural at the outset. Well no wonder. But observation clearly shows that the supernatural exists, whether it be ghosts, demon possession, angels, God, etc.

Vod

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Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 09:50:58 PM

What didn't you understand about the end of time and beginning of superpowers?

Everything. You didn't explain it. You just said it was so.

Please explain it in terms normal sober people can understand.

dank

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Quote from: Vod on November 01, 2013, 09:40:19 PM

Quote from: dank on November 01, 2013, 09:37:25 PM

Yes, though dimensions are very real, everything exists within our minds, everything is real. You are an inverted ball of consciousness creating a space time continuum.

OK... so now you are saying it is real. Three posts ago you said it was a perception. Roll Eyes

Ok dank, explain the 5th dimension in the same coherent way I explained the 4th dimension.

It is real, your reality is still based on your perception though, your beliefs.

Just because something can disappear in the flash of an eye, doesn't mean what you experienced wasn't real, unless you truly believe it isn't.

What didn't you understand about the end of time and beginning of superpowers?

BitChick, have you heard of The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross?

P.S. ty for praying for me.

Vod, all shall be yours in due time.

Vod

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Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 09:47:03 PM

Quote from: Vod on November 01, 2013, 09:45:54 PM

Quote from: BitChick on November 01, 2013, 09:44:27 PM

Vod. No comment. I can't get past the boob licking picture.

Pray for my understanding then. Perhaps in some mystical way your thoughts will affect my life. Roll Eyes

I was giving you a free pass but if you want prayers I will certainly send some your way too! Grin

If you could pray for more money, less boob fat and no glasses that would be nice as well, although you can't really affect reality.

P.S. I like my hairline, please leave that alone.

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