Topic: CryptoKingdom Uncensored - page 17. (Read 69696 times)

I believe all his assets should be used to repay his debt, from which, we'll gather voluntary donations, which will probably be sufficient as if it was  forceably taken from his debtors.

I couldn't go further back in the changelog, but I know there was a confirmed near 5k XMR withdrawal around that time, so $100k in that case minimum. Honestly, I have a remembrance that it was over 10k XMR, maybe even 20k that Risto gave him!


As a debtholder myself, I obviously would like to be repaid even a portion of what I am owed. My issue with using Risto's assets are, firstly, how are they defined? Do Risto's assets include things like NewCorp, Town Housing Corp., and Hypothecary Bank as well as user assets like "Dark" and "Soul"?

And secondly, where do funds to actually and grow out the game come from? Several didn't seem to like the dilution route I suggested for creation of more M/CKM for a token exchange campaign (TEC). This would impact debt and non-debt holders equally and Smooth was at least warm to the idea. If we don't have any dilution, don't hold a TEC, and use all of Risto's assets to pay off, how will we grow?

A 1/3 of profit by the game going to "debt" payments and 1/3 for CKO holders and 1/3 saved for game growth tries to balance the different factors we need to keep in mind. %'s can change and we can of course think about if we even want "CKO" (ownership) shares that function like old "CK" shares to a degree. Smooth was earlier saying that there needs to be a separation of currency and ownership, but I am not sure to what levels this needs to be done. 


Well, we can always finally implement the long-promised ShapeShift.io integration.

I think with this aspect as well, we can try to tap into the urge that people have with games such as agar.io or lordz.io. Which is seeing growth, a rising score rank, and competing with other factions.



Risto has not been the king for a long time. That was given to HMC at one point. I believe there was also and "in-game" event turned over all of Risto's assets to the game and they are currently not being used at all.


All good ideas. I also like how "voting power" can be more than just a single asset type. Perhaps this can be the way to calculate CKO distribution or can be used in place of CKO.


This all sounds great, and many of us got involved in CK for this sort of system!

The least unfair (best we'll all be able to agree to) way to approach this it seems to me would be to essentially integrate the 'death' of the king into the game itself, meaning at face value his assets would belong to the game itself, and would be 'off-limits'. For them to be used to pay off debts (which is fair in my opinion) the process would be to submit a git issue, which would be turned over to a community vote which could be conducted in-game. It would be impossible to have the system be 100% fair, but something along the lines of an account owning between 1 and infinite units of real estate has a vote weighted with a minimum weight of 5, with an additional weight of X added for every (whatever the community decides) units of real estate .., if you have no real estate but your in game assets have X property your vote has a weight of 2' or whatever is the fairest approach that pisses off the least number of people. I'm sure someone in the community knows game theory better than myself. What I'm considering is putting up the site at first, having a dev available for implementing stuff like this (rapidly and responsively) until the project would move along without the training wheels. After nailing down fair voting everything would be up for vote, including who gets dev access to git, where to host server, whether to allow people to create objects at will or assign a cost so that it doesn't get spammed, moving everything to exist within a smart contract block-chain based setup, whatever... We'd have a dev from the start who could implement changes like that overnight, happily, and code would be of good quality. Well, smart contract set-up wouldn't happen overnight. But if this flops it flops, I'm not horrified by that idea. I'd like to let this linger for a bit so as to be able to gauge opposition and see if and to and to what degree there is strong disagreement, which will indicate whether I should try to get things moving or leave it be.

Man, dude lives in Serbia, the average wage there is 400$, that's 42 years of average Serbian wages
PJ can live his entire life with that kind of money
Considering he sold right away, if he kept some, he can provide for his fucking grandchildren.


So, Ristos assets should be used to repay his debts.


A good idea would be to allow people to create a civilization for their currency for a certain price, good funding  
Ofc, we would add major currencies ourselves.
That would add a lot to the name Crypto Kingdom.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Aeon/comments/7mcaat/some_motived_souls_are_rallying_an_effort_to/

"Some motived souls are rallying an effort to relaunch CryptoKingdom in Aeon. Possible Encrypted Charms integration is flirted with."

KatieCharm/AP has shared the potential CK/AEON initiative on Reddit at the link above.

I would recommend anyone interested in commenting and eliciting feedback to interact with that thread as well.

I have a dev interested in moving the project forward. We played with a million different ideas of how to approach moving forward, and the least complicated solution able to produce results essentially seems to be to 'just do it'. The code is not complicated, setting up the site to use current code and unmodified SQL database (non-reboot) is simple enough I could do it, however he has the time to actually continue to develop the project. He's talented and happy to work for donations. Concerning debts/in-game tokens, we figured best and easiest solution would be to allow private parties to cover the territory of currency conversions. Let people exchange whatever currency they would like for the in game currency. We were thinking to just move forward with it, and respond to community feedback. If a respected member of the community like saddam or generalizethis is requested to have git access and the community thinks that is best, then that happens. If community wants to integrate to on an chain token, add that to the todo list. He doesn't want anyone to have to trust him, isn't particularly comfortable with that really and we shouldn't be either. I know this person IRL and have worked with them on many projects. They are very capable of handling frontends to SQL databases with their eyes closed, and further capable of acheiving the decentralized game some of us seem to be envisioning. I don't want to be stepping on anyone's toes so it would be helpful if anyone 'in the know' could speak specifically as to what, if anything, is going on as far as PJ/Speed/Anyone's development efforts.  I dont understand how so little gets accomplished.... its a freaking frontend to an SQL database..  For me personally I enjoy the game a lot, but if I hadn't built my home in old town back in the day, I'm a bit busier at this point in my life and may not be terribly interested in a reboot from scratch. But, his interest in the project is not contingent on that or my opinion, and though we respect eachothers opinion I would not be "in charge". The idea is to have nobody be in charge. But somebody has to make a move. So if there is any reason to NOT fork the database, throw up a site, have him start interacting with the community to see what they want, please let me know. If everyone thinks it s dog-shit and wants to stay away, no harm done. The idea is that if the community wants, he'll happily use his own creativity if necessary, but main focus is to get the project moving, implement what the community wants, be funded by donations, move towards trustless and modular set-up... and not piss off anyone in the process. He doesn't want to have things devolve into a "I'll pay you to add this!" situation, as that would give donators control in relation to their wealth, but to have the generosity of the community fund his efforts to implement what the community wants.

We'd talked and have been considering this for about a week. I respect AmericanPegasus , this was all thought before they had expressed interest. As far as I can tell, their on chain asset of trading cards will exist with or without CK, and it could absolutely be traded within Agora, just as ALMOST anything else could. I think marketplace activity should be restricated to digital assets so as to avoid potential confusion of being mistaken for certain... other.... marktplaces associated with privacy centric cryptos. The idea is to keep things simple as possible, no crazy algos or massive changes at fork... and that he would be available to work for the community to move the project in whatever direction the community wants it to go.

It's not a new concept. It is still a medieval simulation. It will still be the same CK at its core, and at minimum the maps/lands/properties are being moved over. Most definately CANnabis too! And we have to keep the FOIE gras I'd say!  

Really, I think how the game was structured pre-Ultima deserves a solid look. Yes, some aspects like the NPC consumption and STOne creation need to be automated (rather than worked on in a spreadsheet), but looking back on the thread and game history at the time, it looked like overall it was a "tighter" game design. Once Ultima came online, Risto kept adding modules and items that ultimately had no point as it was easier to do so.

Additionally, there is a lot of crypto history (specifically XMR-based) in CK: just look at all the names of the properties. Like David Latapie's land is still in CK. He had a lot to do with the early founding of XMR and he's unfortunately no longer with us. I think it's worth carrying this sort of lineage forward.

Overall, there is still a kingdom  

I still think a fork with a new concept needs to be something completely new. Not CK anymore. Why even use the name CryptoKingdom if there is no King / Kingdom? Why not take a new name and just buy the Agora Market database / setup from CK and then fill it up with new charming items?

CK as a kingdom can then go on with the effort of Speed, our King and others willing to work out the debt thing.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.23313528

Would recommend everyone taking a look at this post as well. Since I'm in favor of a full relaunch and rethinking of all CK in-game items, I believe it's worth seeing how we can more closely pair with encryptedcharm's card attributes and stats.

For example, card types seem more or less the same as what we have now, with some additional sub classifications (such as "book" being a subgroup of "item"). And many of those sub classifications may be removed in the relaunch.

The elemental classifications (air, water, plant, spirit, earth, metal, and fire) are interesting and this is also an area I feel could be integrated in the game's items. For example, perhaps these elements could be associated with item attributes. Say "air" items help increase "wisdom" and "earth" items increase "health".

5 tiers of item rarity? Weren't we already working through that in simplifying the NPC system? And of course we can still have "uniques" outside of the 5 item tiers for say plots of land, precious works of art, etc. AP/Katie: we already have some silver and gold unicorns in CK that went for hundreds and thousands of XMR that are just dying for cards/tokenization!

I know it's the holidays, but let's start cracking on concepts here! I was very impressed at how the 40k AEON rebase campaign went, and I am sure we can get similar enthusiasm going here!

Surely it will moon to 30k xmr 

Karl Hungus owns ~10% of M, so maybe he still makes his money back when CK moons one day

This could be a game saving boost for CK, Aeon is a truly great coin, the synergies from a collaboration would be awesome, amazing offer too @AP airdropping tokens from your card token game, really appreciated !!

If you are guys did this, I would be a huge contributer to the tune of many tens of thousands of Aeon no matter what.  
  
Super optionally, As well, I have an upcoming (fairly distributed with me having no advantage) Counterparty asset coming out soon.  If you were willing to incorporate these custom magical tokens into the game, I would be happy to airdrop a significant amount of the base token into the hands of players.  It's going to be basically a retro fantasy version of the rarepepedirectory.com cards.

Here's a couple of sample cards from Series One.  In series two we allow users to submit their own cards.  Actual in game effects of these tokens would be left up to the game programmers as it is outside my area of expertise.  But a relaunch of CK for Aeon with some secondary layer custom cryptographic assets (that can't be taken away or fall in value even in the worst cases) would be awesome.  This might be a pipe dream though, as it would require BOTH Aeon integration and reading signed tx from Counterparty assets (to assure that the player actually owned an asset).  One day would be amazing to do this natively on Aeon, but at the moment second layers with custom assets only exist on the bitcoin blockchain.  

 


 

As we have a lot of user overlap with XMR/AEON, I am sure several of you have seen this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Aeon/comments/7laim2/20000_aeon_rebase_bountydev_contract_possibly/

I am thinking of doing something similar for CK and introducing it to the AEON community since the bounty will be paid in AEON.

This doesn't necessarily mean that M will be pegged to AEON, but we could certainly have AEON as a major exchange/depository relationship and any additional deposit/withdrawal transactions that the game can provide for AEON will certainly help increase the body of transactions for use in RingCT and the like.

If Speed or someone else wants to prepare a more defined proposal for a CK relaunch, please share it here for public comment.

Yes. People other than PJ have access to the private CK github/codebase. A private repo should be cloned and given to trusted alternative parties. Then, another repo should be pushed to public view with any sensitive information (like email addresses/IPs/etc.), hidden/removed.

This way, any interested developers can see the code without having to access the private CK slack and ask. As a matter of fact, CK should never of had a completely private slack. A private dev channel on the slack, fine, but people should be able to add themselves automatically to the CK slack without needing to contact anyone. Many other coins/projects have this self-service add feature.

If PJ or someone needs a fee for the private and public code repo stuff I have just outlined to happen, I will pay. But it won't be moronic Risto's "mad money" developer payments. ;P

Just want to remind everyone that PJ was paid at least 10k XMR around April of 2017 by Risto to work on CK. May have even been more (changelog wouldn't go back far enough for me to check). This is in addition to monthly payments from Risto for most of the life of this project. XMR was around $20 then, so that is $200k. Enough to live comfortably for a few years where PJ is located.

At current XMR prices, it is $4 million!

And what did Risto get for his money? NOTHING!

P.S. I don't care if PJ wasted his money. He had $200k in hand. He was given enough early this year to work for several years on this project. And if he had kept any of his XMR, rather than being a fool and going straight to Dubai once he was paid to blow it, he would probably still have hundreds of thousands of dollars in multiples. 

I would prefer to get as many of the old guard in favor of actually getting something going. Or maybe they don't want to be a part and/or are busy trading other shitcoins? I mean I had oldster SirJacket dump out almost all his M yet again on me: which is cool, I wanted 110bil M, just didn't expect to see SirJacket as the dumper

Just some brief thoughts on the other items you mentioned:

New domain - Yeah, the cryptokingdom.com domain is up for grabs. Why is there literally zero interest in acquiring it?

New dev-team - Absolutely zero PJ on the development side, yes. If he wants to use his player accounts, fine. Speed and company are of course welcome, but we need a process more streamlined than what we have now. Are we waiting another year? At that rate, just kill the project as that will be 3 years with zero activity.

No debt - Yes, just remove it imo. Takeover Risto's accounts (including Risto proxies like Soul). Manage those to the benefit of all players, not just those who were involved with the depo share nonsense. Otherwise, by focusing on debt, we ignore players like Karl Hungus who lost 30k XMR, but weren't involved in the depo business.

No king - Yes. Part of the reason I feel nothing has been accomplished is that for a long while, people expected the king to do something. HMC is welcome to play in the new game, but we don't need a single king.

I thought you meant new everything with a fork. New domain, new server, new dev-team, no debt, no king etc. That would be interesting, to start new. That I would play.

Speed & co is still probably going ahead with original CK, and that is very good, I would play that too.

Can a fork/relaunch be done without PJ's involvement? If it can I can't think of any reason not to try saving CK (the basic idea is still full of potential).