Author

Topic: Do you believe in god? - page 181. (Read 316209 times)

legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
August 23, 2016, 02:12:38 PM
You can pray all you want but the will of humans is stronger than your god
+1

One pair of wise hands working can do infinitely more good than one billion foolish idle ones clasped in prayer.


Stop throwing your potential wealth away. Get out there and get some people saved so you can be wealthy in Heaven forever.

Cool
Boy, the religious elite must of really tried hard to surpress their joy when they saw this malleable fool walking up the garden path towards them. He's a real asset to them, they won't let him go easy. You can be sure of that. Cheesy

Since you are so deluded with your own vain words, you will trip yourself up in ways that won't be fun for you. God's protection is leaving you. You are pushing Him away. Change, before there is no turning back for you.

Cool

Perhaps if you stopped focusing on the irrelevant parts (the vanity bit), and concentrated your efforts into the important parts (the truth), you'd be a lot less angry and a lot more wiser.
At the moment you're all upside-down, back to front and mixed up.


Yes, the truth can be quite unnerving at times. And that's why I show it to you in ways that you can't refute logically. Like the good propagandist that you have become, all you do is say you refute it without refuting it at all.

I am glad that you have waked up to the truth... as shown by your not being able to refute it with anything other than propaganda.

Cool

Yes you're right. You really blew us all out the water with your irrefutable 6000 year old earth argument.
We are still speechless to this day.  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Also, lest we forget you're astonishing argument skills, particularly with strawmen.


Wow! I never knew you could be so honest!    Tongue
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
August 23, 2016, 01:56:50 PM
You can pray all you want but the will of humans is stronger than your god
+1

One pair of wise hands working can do infinitely more good than one billion foolish idle ones clasped in prayer.


Stop throwing your potential wealth away. Get out there and get some people saved so you can be wealthy in Heaven forever.

Cool
Boy, the religious elite must of really tried hard to surpress their joy when they saw this malleable fool walking up the garden path towards them. He's a real asset to them, they won't let him go easy. You can be sure of that. Cheesy

Since you are so deluded with your own vain words, you will trip yourself up in ways that won't be fun for you. God's protection is leaving you. You are pushing Him away. Change, before there is no turning back for you.

Cool

Perhaps if you stopped focusing on the irrelevant parts (the vanity bit), and concentrated your efforts into the important parts (the truth), you'd be a lot less angry and a lot more wiser.
At the moment you're all upside-down, back to front and mixed up.


Yes, the truth can be quite unnerving at times. And that's why I show it to you in ways that you can't refute logically. Like the good propagandist that you have become, all you do is say you refute it without refuting it at all.

I am glad that you have waked up to the truth... as shown by your not being able to refute it with anything other than propaganda.

Cool

Yes you're right. You really blew us all out the water with your irrefutable 6000 year old earth argument.
We are still speechless to this day.  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Also, lest we forget you're astonishing argument skills, particularly with strawmen.




full member
Activity: 148
Merit: 100
August 23, 2016, 12:45:04 PM
Nope, I don't believe in god but I do believe that there might be something out there.
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
August 23, 2016, 11:04:39 AM

Hitler as Christian? That is somewhat comical considering that Hitlers plan was to destroy Christianity.

The Case Against the Nazis; How Hitler's Forces Planned To Destroy German Christianity
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/13/weekinreview/word-for-word-case-against-nazis-hitler-s-forces-planned-destroy-german.html?pagewanted=all

Quote
''The Persecution of the Christian Churches,'' summarizes the Nazi plan to subvert and destroy German Christianity, which it calls ''an integral part of the National Socialist scheme of world conquest.''

In the 1920's, as they battled for power, the Nazis realized that the churches in overwhelmingly Christian Germany needed to be neutralized before they would get anywhere. Two-thirds of German Christians were Protestants, belonging to one of 28 regional factions of the German Evangelical Church. Most of the rest were Roman Catholics. On one level, the Nazis saw an advantage. In tumultuous post-World War I Germany, the Christian churches ''had long been associated with conservative ways of thought, which meant that they tended to agree with the National Socialists in their authoritarianism, their attacks on Socialism and Communism, and in their campaign against the Versailles treaty'' that had ended World War I with a bitterly resentful Germany.

But there was a dilemma for Hitler. While conservatives, the Christian churches ''could not be reconciled with the principle of racism, with a foreign policy of unlimited aggressive warfare, or with a domestic policy involving the complete subservience of Church to State.'' Given that these were the fundamental underpinnings of the Nazi regime, ''conflict was inevitable,'' the summary states. It came, as Nazi power surged in the late 1920's toward national domination in the early 30's.

According to Baldur von Schirach, the Nazi leader of the German youth corps that would later be known as the Hitler Youth, ''the destruction of Christianity was explicitly recognized as a purpose of the National Socialist movement'' from the beginning, though ''considerations of expedience made it impossible'' for the movement to adopt this radical stance officially until it had consolidated power, the outline says.

Attracted by the strategic value inherent in the churches' ''historic mission of conservative social discipline,'' the Nazis simply lied and made deals with the churches while planning a ''slow and cautious policy of gradual encroachment'' to eliminate Christianity.

The prosecution investigators describe this as a criminal conspiracy. ''This general plan had been established even before the rise of the Nazis to power,'' the outline says. ''It apparently came out of discussions among an inner circle'' comprised of Hitler himself, other top Nazi leaders including the propaganda minister, Joseph Goebbels, and a collection of party enforcers and veteran beer-hall agitators.

Of course, the churches stayed in Hitler's good graces for only as long as the Nazis considered their cooperation expedient. Soon after Hitler assumed dictatorial powers, ''relations between the Nazi state and the church became progressively worse,'' the outline says. The Nazis ''took advantage of their subsequently increasing strength to violate every one of the Concordat's provisions.''

In 1937, Pope Pius XI denounced Nazi treachery in an encyclical that accused Hitler of ''a war of extermination'' against the church. The battle had been joined on some fronts. Nazi street mobs, often in the company of the Gestapo, routinely stormed offices in Protestant and Catholic churches where clergymen were seen as lax in their support of the regime.

Still, in a society where the entire Jewish population was being automatically condemned without public protest, care was taken to manipulate public perceptions about clergymen who fell into Nazi disfavor. ''The Catholic Church need not imagine that we are going to create martyrs,'' Robert Wagner, the Nazi Gauleiter of Baden, said in a speech, according to the O.S.S. study. ''We shall not give the church that satisfaction. She shall have not martyrs, but criminals.''

But once they had total power and set off to launch a world war, the Nazis made no secret of what lay in store for Christian clergymen who expressed dissent.

In Munich, Nazi street gangs and a Gestapo squad attacked the residence of the Roman Catholic cardinal. ''A hail of stones was directed against the windows, while the men shouted, 'Take the rotten traitor to Dachau!' '' the outline says, adding: ''After 1937, German Catholic bishops gave up all attempts to print'' their pastoral letters publicly and instead ''had them merely read from the pulpits.''

Then the letters themselves were confiscated. 'In many churches, the confiscation took place during Mass by the police snatching the letter out of the hands of the priests as they were in the act of reading it.''

Later the same year, dissident Protestant churches joined in a manifesto protesting Nazi tactics. In response, the Nazis arrested 700 Protestant pastors.

Objectionable statements made by the clergy would no longer be prosecuted in the courts, the Nazis said. Statements ''injurious to the State would be ruthlessly punished by 'protective custody,' that is, the concentration camp,'' the outline says.

criptix posted some links to some actual science above, however, which is much more interesting than talk of Hitler so I will look at it later today and respond with my thoughts.
newbie
Activity: 44
Merit: 0
August 23, 2016, 11:00:55 AM
Yes I believe in GOD ......Who create human and allow him to question !
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
August 23, 2016, 10:56:48 AM
If man spent half the time throughout history embracing real knowledge and science that was spent quivering in fear created by ancient mythology and killing in the name of God we would already be colonizing other planets, have cured cancer and ended world hunger.

Twice.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_intelligence

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_religion

https://arxiv.org/abs/1012.1375


Btw it is only hard to understand because religious people tend to be stupid. Fact.

Yep






Matthew 10:34-35
 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law"

I wonder why there's so much hatred and killing in the world? Well, I'd like to chat some more but I need to hurry over to my church. We're having a bbq with hot dogs, potato salad and for entertainment were burning a few niggers on crosses.



Like as there are hypocrites and betrayers in any large organization, there are also going to be hypocrites and betrayers in Christianity. On top of that, many innocent Christians don't really understand Christianity.

Christianity that is true has to do with the salvation of the soul. Other Christianity is Christianity in name only. Anybody can read the Bible to see that true followers of Jesus, the Christ, are those who act like Him. And He never did the wicked things that many Christian ignorants and hypocrites do.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
August 23, 2016, 10:51:04 AM
You can pray all you want but the will of humans is stronger than your god
+1

One pair of wise hands working can do infinitely more good than one billion foolish idle ones clasped in prayer.


Stop throwing your potential wealth away. Get out there and get some people saved so you can be wealthy in Heaven forever.

Cool
Boy, the religious elite must of really tried hard to surpress their joy when they saw this malleable fool walking up the garden path towards them. He's a real asset to them, they won't let him go easy. You can be sure of that. Cheesy

Since you are so deluded with your own vain words, you will trip yourself up in ways that won't be fun for you. God's protection is leaving you. You are pushing Him away. Change, before there is no turning back for you.

Cool

Perhaps if you stopped focusing on the irrelevant parts (the vanity bit), and concentrated your efforts into the important parts (the truth), you'd be a lot less angry and a lot more wiser.
At the moment you're all upside-down, back to front and mixed up.


Yes, the truth can be quite unnerving at times. And that's why I show it to you in ways that you can't refute logically. Like the good propagandist that you have become, all you do is say you refute it without refuting it at all.

I am glad that you have waked up to the truth... as shown by your not being able to refute it with anything other than propaganda.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
August 23, 2016, 09:52:22 AM
If man spent half the time throughout history embracing real knowledge and science that was spent quivering in fear created by ancient mythology and killing in the name of God we would already be colonizing other planets, have cured cancer and ended world hunger.

Twice.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_intelligence

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_religion

https://arxiv.org/abs/1012.1375


Btw it is only hard to understand because religious people tend to be stupid. Fact.

Yep






Matthew 10:34-35
 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law"

I wonder why there's so much hatred and killing in the world? Well, I'd like to chat some more but I need to hurry over to my church. We're having a bbq with hot dogs, potato salad and for entertainment were burning a few niggers on crosses.

legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
August 23, 2016, 09:42:53 AM
You can pray all you want but the will of humans is stronger than your god
+1

One pair of wise hands working can do infinitely more good than one billion foolish idle ones clasped in prayer.


Stop throwing your potential wealth away. Get out there and get some people saved so you can be wealthy in Heaven forever.

Cool
Boy, the religious elite must of really tried hard to surpress their joy when they saw this malleable fool walking up the garden path towards them. He's a real asset to them, they won't let him go easy. You can be sure of that. Cheesy

Since you are so deluded with your own vain words, you will trip yourself up in ways that won't be fun for you. God's protection is leaving you. You are pushing Him away. Change, before there is no turning back for you.

Cool

Perhaps if you stopped focusing on the irrelevant parts (the vanity bit), and concentrated your efforts into the important parts (the truth), you'd be a lot less angry and a lot more wiser.
At the moment you're all upside-down, back to front and mixed up.



newbie
Activity: 34
Merit: 0
August 23, 2016, 08:43:32 AM
I have faith in God but I don't believe in 'god' for they don't have power and they must not be worshiped at all.
They are just like idols.
legendary
Activity: 2464
Merit: 1145
August 23, 2016, 08:25:35 AM
If man spent half the time throughout history embracing real knowledge and science that was spent quivering in fear created by ancient mythology and killing in the name of God we would already be colonizing other planets, have cured cancer and ended world hunger.

Twice.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_intelligence

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_religion

https://arxiv.org/abs/1012.1375


Btw it is only hard to understand because religious people tend to be stupid. Fact.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
August 23, 2016, 01:28:06 AM

Do I have to believe I have an imagination? No, I just imagine and whooff things start to appear and come into reality.

Do I have to believe in god? No, I just imagine and whooff god starts to appear and come into reality. Its wonderful.  Smiley



The ways that God works are not well understood. The workings He has planted in the universe are not well understood.

While it is not necessary to have love to be saved, a person without love, but only faith, will have a hard time of life, even if he is saved because of his faith. A person with love will receive the blessings of love, and if he doesn't have faith to be saved, God just might grant him such faith after all.



I wished God to show me a little bit of his workings and he has granted me my wish with the gift of imagination. What more do I need? With imagination I can roam free. I have met God in the space of my imagination. Right there, in the meeting place in inner space, God whispered into my innermost ear that I too, was imagined by him. this knowledge is the best bit of news I have ever heard. God's wish came true - just look at me - here I am.




Is it a poem?  I do not know what to call that, but it is indeed very moving.  We are God's creation.  Just look around you and you will see all His works.  The mountains, the sky, the river, the sea, flowers, and animals they are the God's creation.  God also gives us that imagination to roam freely and through that we can do things that is such impossible in the reality.  Imagination that you are also the author and the creator.  In this imagination you could do whatever you want and you could make everything just by imagining it. 
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
August 23, 2016, 12:32:58 AM
If man spent half the time throughout history embracing real knowledge and science that was spent quivering in fear created by ancient mythology and killing in the name of God we would already be colonizing other planets, have cured cancer and ended world hunger.

The scientific achievement you so respect can only be achieved by a society with a sound foundation.

Ethical monotheism is probably the single greatest contributor to human progress from any source since human culture emerged from the stone ages. This force which emerged first in Judaism and and spread throughout the world via the mediums of Christianity and Islam continues to shape human destiny even in a time when much of the world foolishly rejects it as irrelevant.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/mono.html
Quote from: Dennis Prager
Nature is amoral. Nature knows nothing of good and evil. In nature there is one rule—survival of the fittest. There is no right, only might. If a creature is weak, kill it. Only human beings could have moral rules such as, "If it is weak, protect it." Only human beings can feel themselves ethically obligated to strangers.
...
Nature allows you to act naturally, i.e., do only what you want you to do, without moral restraints; God does not. Nature lets you act naturally - and it is as natural to kill, rape, and enslave as it is to love.
...
One of the vital elements in the ethical monotheist revolution was its repudiation of nature as god. The evolution of civilization and morality have depended in large part on desanctifying nature.
...
Civilizations that equated gods with nature—a characteristic of all primitive societies—or that worshipped nature did not evolve.
...
Words cannot convey the magnitude of the change wrought by the Bible's introduction into the world of a God who rules the universe morally.
...
ethical monotheism suggests more than that God demands ethical behavior; it means that Gods primary demand is ethical behavior. It means that God cares about how we treat one another more than He cares about anything else.

Thus, ethical monotheism's message remains as. radical today as when it was first promulgated. The secular world has looked elsewhere for its values, while even many religious Jews, Christians, and Muslims believe that Gods primary demand is something other than ethics.


http://old.explorefaith.org/neighbors/beliefs/nature_j.html
Quote from: Howard Greenstein
To hold that God is the Source and Sustainer of moral values is to insist upon an objective status for ethical ideals. They are not the impulsive fabrication of human minds, but are grounded in the very bedrock of creation. Moral laws have objective validity similar to the laws of physics. They are not our invention, but it is for us to discover them. Just as it would be foolish to defy the law of gravity and hope to escape its consequences, so is it perilous to presume that a human infant can grow to emotional maturity without ever being loved or cared for. In both cases the penalty for ignoring the law is a natural consequence of defying the given realities of the universe. The uniqueness of God in this context is the complex but delicate blend of both physical and spiritual reality in a single deity which accounts for the balance, harmony and order of nature within us and without.

Ethical monotheism is not just a way of talking about God. It is a way of understanding human experience; it is a way of organizing the world in which we live. It is a faith that attempts to explain what we do not know by beginning with what we do know. We do know our awareness of this world is rooted in a unity of our own senses. We do know that defiance of moral law invites a disaster as devastating as any contempt for the laws of physics or chemistry or biology. We know, in short, that we cannot fathom it all and that this world is ultimately grounded in mystery. And that singular ethical mystery is what we call God

sr. member
Activity: 441
Merit: 278
It's personal
August 23, 2016, 12:08:47 AM

Do I have to believe I have an imagination? No, I just imagine and whooff things start to appear and come into reality.

Do I have to believe in god? No, I just imagine and whooff god starts to appear and come into reality. Its wonderful.  Smiley



The ways that God works are not well understood. The workings He has planted in the universe are not well understood.

While it is not necessary to have love to be saved, a person without love, but only faith, will have a hard time of life, even if he is saved because of his faith. A person with love will receive the blessings of love, and if he doesn't have faith to be saved, God just might grant him such faith after all.



I wished God to show me a little bit of his workings and he has granted me my wish with the gift of imagination. What more do I need? With imagination I can roam free. I have met God in the space of my imagination. Right there, in the meeting place in inner space, God whispered into my innermost ear that I too, was imagined by him. this knowledge is the best bit of news I have ever heard. God's wish came true - just look at me - here I am.


legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
August 22, 2016, 11:59:26 PM
If man spent half the time throughout history embracing real knowledge and science that was spent quivering in fear created by ancient mythology and killing in the name of God we would already be colonizing other planets, have cured cancer and ended world hunger.
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
August 22, 2016, 11:36:37 PM
The questions raised in this thread are very deep ones

1) How could God allow horrific things to occur?

2) How could we know anything at all about an infinite creator when we are finite making him incomprehensible?

These are questions who's answer requires one to delve deep into the rich intellectual history of ethical monotheism. Doing that is hard and requires significant effort and thinking. It is much easier to dismiss God as fable those seeking to learn simpletons.

Rejecting God on these grounds is committing to a foolish error akin to watching a child struggle with addition and concluding that mathematics must be useless and false.

I am far from an expert on religion but I can tell you that there is a vast and incredibly deep body of knowledge, logic and reason at the foundation of monotheism.  

For those truly interested in the topic I will share my prior recommendation. The audio recordings in the bottom link are free.

I wanted to share with anyone who is interested what I am reading at the moment. I have recently started reading the Way of God: Derech Hashem by Moshe Chaim Luzzatto.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/087306769X/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_1/159-3751462-6767111?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_r=NM9R7T16A9G2147WGMJX&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1944687722&pf_rd_i=1598264672

It is an older classic 18th century philosophical book. It is very logical and is set out in parts that are divided into a few chapters. The parts are:
1. Fundamentals, covering The Creator, Man, Human Responsibility.
2. Providence, covering Providence in General, Individual Providence, How Providence Works.
3. The Soul, Inspiration and Prophecy, with The Soul and Its Influence, Theurgy, The Prophetic Experience.
4. Serving God, Love and Fear of God, Prayer, Seasonal Commandments.

There is a free class in Seattle that is currently going through this book chapter by chapter taught by Mark Spiro.
Geography unfortunately prevents me from attending his class but audio recordings of it and discussions of each chapter are available for free here.

http://www.livingjudaism.com/the-way-of-god.html



Both Moshe Chaim Luzzatto and Mark Spiro approach the issue from the Jewish tradition but I think anyone interested in God or religion will find it worthwhile. I do and I am not Jewish.
hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 564
Need some spare btc for a new PC
August 22, 2016, 11:18:01 PM
Do you believe in god? If you do, why do you believe? (give a few reasons)


I used to believe in God untill I got to that edgy metalhead period then, as we all know, I was the edgelord and would spit on the religion a lot... now, I don't really care that much, now I'm more of a live and let live type...
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
August 22, 2016, 08:34:29 PM

Do I have to believe I have an imagination? No, I just imagine and whooff things start to appear and come into reality.

Do I have to believe in god? No, I just imagine and whooff god starts to appear and come into reality. Its wonderful.  Smiley



The ways that God works are not well understood. The workings He has planted in the universe are not well understood.

While it is not necessary to have love to be saved, a person without love, but only faith, will have a hard time of life, even if he is saved because of his faith. A person with love will receive the blessings of love, and if he doesn't have faith to be saved, God just might grant him such faith after all.

Cool
sr. member
Activity: 441
Merit: 278
It's personal
August 22, 2016, 06:24:16 PM

Do I have to believe I have an imagination? No, I just imagine and whooff things start to appear and come into reality.

Do I have to believe in god? No, I just imagine and whooff god starts to appear and come into reality. Its wonderful.  Smiley

hero member
Activity: 784
Merit: 500
August 22, 2016, 08:46:49 AM
god have scenario of each event, i trust god, we must prayer because we need god and god never need your pray.
i think in this world we can see more "magic situation" where god give wonders in the incident.
Jump to: