Topic: FORTUNEJACK.COM |Deposit 777 play with 1777 mBTC |Live Casino, Slots, Betting - page 151. (Read 465252 times)

Your staked bet amount was 0.0672 while the bet cancelled the bet amount was retured or not? You said you only withdrew your remaining balance but now saying you did lose nothing.

Each spoortbooks has their own terms and conditions so if one did means others should not follow the same and even it changes per case to case.

I don't see any DT members agrees with this case. Isn't it?

I did not lose "nothing". The night before the match I had an open bet with a stake of 0.0672 BTC @ 2.6 odds that you canceled 2 hours before the match was about to start (super late), and did not return this stake back to me. So at the very least, I lost 0.0672 BTC.

But ultimately, 80%+ of members on this forum agree with me that this bet should not have been canceled in the 1st place for many reasons that were discussed earlier (especially not from a change of odds from 2.6-1.7 as you claimed in your email). Therefore, I lost 0.174 BTC because this is the winning amount I would have won if the bet was played out the normal way (without any cancelations), because De Jong went on to win the match. And if he had lost it, I would not be complaining at all and would have accepted the loss as I always do.

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How is the situation quite different? It is the exact same situation because I am talking about & referring to the same exact match that happened on the same day.

All other bookies did not cancel this match for any of their users, and counted the bet as a win for those who bet on De Jong. I know for a fact that Stake.com did not, Bovada also did not, and I believe neither did Cloudbet along with countless of others.

So what Shield is saying is 100% true in this case because it is the same exact situation. Therefore, you should honor this bet as a win just like every other bookie did too, because this bet should never have been canceled in the first place and I picked the right player to win.

And trust me that if the player I bet on would have lost the match, I would have peacefully moved on a long time ago and never complained about anything - I can promise you that.

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Regarding the statement number 3:


While talking about Amazon.

Once there is some sort of price error or a glitch within the product and users are allowed to make a purchase.

9 out of 10 times, items do not get shipped - it might if the right department doesn't identify the bug in time.

The offer made from our end comes from the point of appreciating the user himself, that's exactly what Amazon does in similar cases by offering the customer some sort of bonus or a balance due to ongoing situation somehow affecting the userbase.

Not want to argue with you at any point - we do appreciate your feedback a lot by all means but this case doesn't quite relate to the one you mentioned.


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Regarding the statement number 2:


Can you clarify bit more about what you mean by a user having to pay for it?

He lost nothing, got the initial deposit back and was offered a bonus on top of that.


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Regarding the statement number 1:


It depends, definitely not for all the cases.

+ user claiming that all the sportsbooks paying in full for that game isn't a fact unless proved and cannot be used as the right example cause the situation itself is quite different from the ones he's mentioning.

Thank you for your feedback and I appreciate your support Shield, that's exactly what happened and why it's so frustrating & I feel like I was cheated.

In terms of other bookies, they had the same exact swings of odds throughout this match, yet all of them honored their users who bet on De Jong the win (even at 2.6+ odds) without canceling this bet for anyone who bet on him.

I know Stake.com did for a fact, and another fiat bookie did as well for 1 of my friends who also bet on De Jong to win (and I believe he got in at even better odds than 2.6)

So I have no idea why FortuneJack is the only bookie who is refusing to do the same (when universally, all other bookies did not cancel this bet for anyone who placed a bet on this match, and got paid if they chose De Jong to win even if they got him at 2.6+ odds).

EpicChamp
Please, write things shortly. All of your posts are very, very long and because of this I guess a higher percentage of people will just ignore it, it's good advice for you

So, on 24 November, you bet on De Jong and odd was 2.6 that's true. Odd was even 3.0 on almost every sportsbook, including crypto and fiat. Then, on 24 November, odd was really corrected and it becomes 1.3
It seems interesting to know what happened on other sportsbook? Did they do the same as FortuneJack? And at the moment they let this user to do everything (partial cashout) and lately understood that it was the error from a provider, in our case, from BetRadar.

This situation is a real dilemma.
1. When something wrong happens in live casinos, games are cancelled and there are cases when players get a good reward because of live supplier mistake.
2. I think that if your partner did something wrong, users shouldn't pay for it.
3. Let's take Amazon for example, they had the similar case when the price was extremely low on certain thing in their sales day but instead of refusing, they accept the payment and sent an item. Everything comes down to how ethical you are.

In reality, it's not a fault from the user's side, it's a fault from your odds provider and that's clear. Btw FJ doesn't want to fully pay but still offers some bonus for it, that's why this situation is dillema. Everything comes down to how ethical you are.

The initial bet amount was never willingly returned by "them" - I personally cashed it out myself the night before the match when I saw that they gave me the option to do so themselves.

But that was only 50% of my entire bet, and the other 50% had 0.067 BTC left at 2.6 odds of winning the match, which FortuneJack unjustifiably canceled super late, 2 hours before the match was about to start.

Their reasoning in the email was a change of odds from 2.6 to 1.7 (which is not that uncommon in gambling and is a reasonable change of its own, I've seen + had it happen countless of times against me and bets were never canceled because of that) - but now they are claiming something completely different which goes against their original reasoning. (and even their new explanation doesn't make sense either)

The bottom line is I had 0.067 BTC at stake (about 2.5k USD right now) @ 2.6 odds of winning, and then it was canceled super late and FJ kept that stake to themselves.

Have you ever seen or had this happen to you before? Where a bookie canceled a bet and then takes away the entire stake from you & keeps it to themselves?

Yeah, that's exactly what happened to me.

Almost everyone on this forum agrees with me as well, claiming that what FJ did is wrong & that my bet should NOT have been canceled at all, yet FJ is the only one here who doesn't seem to understand or see anything wrong about what they did, and isn't willing to own up to any "mistakes" they were made on their end.

IMHO, its an fair offer to be honest but @EpicChamp why you still don't want to claim that offer given by FJ. Only on rare cases gambling sites allowed the gamblers to withdraw funds if they got it from the bugs on their system but mostly company will simply cancel the bet and will quote their terms of Service so they have the right to do what they want but here they offer 25% so its good to accept and make a life with it.

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Initial money was sent back and has already been withdrawn by OP.

On top of that, we've already offered 25% of a deposit back as a balance - goodwill from the company for having a bug of some sort of live at the website.

Avoid posting wall of text or atleast the nested quotes because people won't be interested in reading all the quoted posts and to be honest its too hard to understand. Just now entered in this thread and trying to understand your issues with FJ.

You made bets but this was cancelled due to the bugs identified by the FJ but still your initial money wasn't retured?

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Seems FJ said their final discussion here so you better continue to post on your thread which is on scam accusation section and stop posting about them on multiple boards.

 

First off, 90%+ of all community members here agree that what you did is wrong and that this bet should not have been canceled, refer to my recent post on my thread where I broke down to you what everyone had to say about this. Therefore, this means that I should be awarded the full win for 0.174 BTC for choosing the right player to win. (Much like I would have lost this bet, the way the situation is right now, if my player had lost the match - but that didn't happen.)

Second, let me address your 3 points:

1. How was the stake not kept to yourself when I had an open bet/stake of 0.0672 BTC @ 2.6 odds, and then after you canceled the bet super late right before the match was about to start, I did not get anything back and had a balance of 0? Where did this amount go exactly? Cuz it surely didn't go to me.

2. The odds that you posted were universal and all other bookies had the same odds + changes for this match (and all of them rewarded their users who picked De Jong to win, even at 2.6+ odds) - this is fact #1.

Then you supposedly posted the wrong odds, kept De Jong's odds between 2.6-3.0 for 2-3 hours on your site for people to bet on, and despite being aware of this, you kept slowly dropping De Jong's odds by 0.2 units every 30mins during this 2-3 hour timeframe (meaning you kept intentionally changing the odds once they went live. Cuz you can post the wrong odds by accident, but you cannot change them by accident for 2-3 hours. In other words, you were doing it deliberetly) - this is fact #2.

The date of the email you received from "betrader" that you used as a screenshot on here was sent to you on December 31st, 2020 when the match took place on November 24th, 2020 - that is fact #3

1 month later they can come up with any excuse and write whatever they want - why do I have to take their word for it & believe them, and then lose thousands of dollars because of THEIR mistake?

3. Exactly, you said it yourself. Any time bets are canceled the stake is always returned in full to the bettor.

In my case, you canceled the bet and did NOT return my stake because I had 0.0672 BTC at stake and then my balance was 0 - that is fact #4

The 0.139 BTC I got initially was a partial cashout (for only 50%), it was not an amount that you returned to me yourself because of a canceled bet. I cashed it out on my own because I was voluntarily given this option by you to allow me to do that, so I did. Are you going to blame & penalize me for this too after giving me this choice yourself? That is fact #5

(And then I still had ~50% left on this bet which was a lot of money at stake, which is equivalent to around 2.5k USD right now).

You then sent me an email saying that you canceled the bet because of a change of odds from 2.6-1.7. And you did not mention anything in this email about it being a palpable or technical error. That is fact #6

Please get your facts straight and don't mislead the community with the wrong information.

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Don't lead the community in the wrong direction - that's a thing we've been trying since starting a discussion with you, to be honest.

1) stake wasn't left on our end - the actual cost from the standpoint of the casino was annulled.
2) the proofs of wrongly provided odds have been posted multiple times - you saying that all happened naturally and intentionally is wrong
3) bets are quite commonly cancelled along with the stakes returned - not the first and last case to see.

That's all I wanted to add.

The decision is final and as stated into another thread you made - the only thing that we can offer is a bonus of some sort of - if you agree.

If not, there's nothing to negotiate on from our point of view - as the decision is already final and supported by quite a few facts and community members.

Deposit back (same as the first stake placed as a bet) - funds received - no point to argue here anymore.

Let us know if you're in so we can discuss the bonus publicly if it's the case.

So are you saying that you agree with FortuneJack and think that what they did is right or fair? To cancel my bet for no valid reason (because of a change of odds from 2.6 to 1.7) and then keep the entire stake to themselves too without returning it back to me?

Have you EVER had a situation before where your bet was canceled for whatever reason, and that amount was not returned to you?

I can also technically take this to court and easily win this case if I wanted to, as has been proven several times here already for exactly the same situation against other bookies, but for much more extreme cases or "accidental" mistakes where bettors deliberatly took advantage of unbelievable odds or error in odds from bookies (whereas in my case, that's far from the truth).

But I would much rather solve this in a more civilized & professional way and explain to everyone here why what they did is wrong and why I deserve to win my bet in full. So of course I backed it up with a lot of information and reasons to prove my case.

What else do you want me to do?

And how would YOU feel if you placed a bet in the thousands that a bookie canceled for no valid reason, denied your big win, and then refused to return to you your large stake?

Easy to not give a crap about others, but when it happens to you it's a completely different story.

You can't really change his idea, he is far gone already and has been for a while. Think about it this way, dude says "Is 0.174 btc worth their reputation?" as in like if fortunejack doesn't pay him, their reputation will be gone. He doesn't even realize that we do not care, doesn't even acknowledge what we are saying, he thinks either fortunejack bows down to him or he will ruin fortunejack forever and will make them bankrupt. He thinks he has that kind of power, so it is impossible for all of us to just talk to him and make him realize that other gamblers do not care about him.

I have seen plenty of people like him who vow to destroy a casino, hell I remember game-protect which attacked every single casino out there, they all eventually stop no matter how dedicated they are, so fortunejack definitely doesn't have anything they need to fear from just one person.

They are good when it comes to promos, giveaways and no strict KYC rules, agreed. Also, no taxes helps a lot in increasing our chances to win.
I had good experiences on all crypto betting/gambling sites and never had any complaints myself. They are probably more lenient sometimes because we're people with nametags and posting histories here, it's more of a 'family' feeling than when you bet on a fiat bookie with whom you're not connected in any way.

What I can assure you though is that a FIAT bookie would pay out the bet EpicChamp is mentioning. They would pay it out in full, not just return his stake, because they are obligated by law. There were numerous occasions where people won lawsuits, because the law is clear. Bookies are responsible for their odds - end of. It's not my opinion, it's the law. Agreed it's a lot easier to sue a Croatian bookie in Croatia than it is to sue FJ from Croatia - they are not a legal entity here and don't answer to Croatian laws. That's why their TOC's allow them more room to wiggle.

I can give you many examples of a fiat bookie making a mistake and having to swallow the loss. Once they offered a handball over/under for a brother of a player which is a great scorer - but the brother plays only defence. We bet heavily on him scoring less than 4,5 goals, when the bookie realized the mistake they blocked the pair - but they had to pay out the bets that were made before the pair was blocked. Also, recently they offered a bet on eSports game in a best to 5, the offer was over/under 2,5. All bets on over 2,5 were accepted and paid out.
They do pay because they are afraid. Some don't, but are then sued and their licences taken away.
Fiat bookies deal with winners in a different way though - they just limit their bets to pennies. So, if you are winning constantly, your max bet becomes like 5 euro. Also not legal, also scammy AF and there were also lawsuits forcing bookies to accept these bets. That's however the fastest and most efficient way for them to limit good players and it's working great for them so far. I did not hear of a crypto bookie doing that yet and fair play to them there.

I know it looks like a bit of an off-topic, but it is relevant to a recent case here so I just wanted to answer.

Books in the space are some of the most accomodating an lenient at times.  Fiat books won’t give an inch.  I don’t know why this is..  Prolly cos being a bookie is still a small niche in crypto.

I have just replied on that thread, feel free to check what I wrote on there.

They gave me the option to 100% have this stake if I wanted to as a full cashout for not even 0.238 BTC, but rather for ~0.268 BTC. And the moment I cash it out after they themselves give me the option to do so, it is 100% officially MINE, and taking it away is complete theft & robbery.

In fact, I could have cashed everything out for 0.268 BTC, and now with MY BTC, placed a seperate bet either in full or a bit lower at De Jong to win around 1.3 odds, and if it was in full I would have earned ~0.3484 BTC if the odds indeed were 1.3, which is around the same equivalent as having 0.14 BTC at 2.6 odds to win 0.364 BTC.

The point is, once they give me the option to cash out and I cash out whatever amount I want, it is 100% mine and no longer theirs. I can then choose if I want to keep betting with this amount, or just keep it to myself. That is 100% up to me to decide, but they offered me this opportunity themselves, so now they cannot just take it back and take it away from me.

Beyond that, my point is that they also should have never canceled this bet to begin with for all the reasons I explained earlier, and I should win my bet in full for 0.1747 BTC fair & square.

It was house money, not his money... It's not "his stake", he took out his entire balance on a faulty bet which was later canceled.