I'm dumping Nxt and here's why you should too - page 6.

Daedelus

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 02:55:35 PM

Quote from: jones_ on January 18, 2015, 02:51:03 PM

in the move towards more efficient and advanced crypto, I believe nxt will outpace bitcoin, some people dont see that, no harm in that.

Well despite Bitcoin capitulating , Nxt is shrinking faster so it will have to pull a 180. When do you think NxT will start growing in market share(not necessarily market cap) in our ecosystem?

You haven't shown that your claims have any merit. Since BTC started diving, both BTC and Nxt have lost about 38% equally. Where do you define the start of 'bitcoin capitulating'?

If you measure these claims based on your opinion, I think we are wasting our time.. Cheesy

Daedelus

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 02:45:09 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on January 18, 2015, 02:25:55 PM

I think your timeframes are too short. Marketcap rankings can be relevant over long periods, let's see if PayCoin is still as important as the market suggests it is in 1 year from now..

Well you keep arguing points I am not making, but we can both hope and agree for the above.

I think my posts perfectly answer your claim that Nxt is losing mindshare, concluding that your timeframes are too short.

Quote

You seem to be blasé about the fate of NxT because you are comparing it to scamcoins and P&D coins, while I am worried about Bitcoin and see it fighting for survival, and its enemies don't include NxT.

It is also easy to say the coins a year ago were scamcoins but what is implicit in that post is that a significant proportion of crypto users at the time didn't see them as scamcoins. It is easy to call it now with hindsight. And I think it is likely many are just failed projects, which aren't the same as scams. Can you confidently predict today, which of the top 20 cryptos won't be in the top 20 next year?

Quote

Don't let your Hubris get the better of you....

One day at a time. If Nxters keep doing what they are doing, we will all do all right Cheesy

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: jones_ on January 18, 2015, 02:51:03 PM

in the move towards more efficient and advanced crypto, I believe nxt will outpace bitcoin, some people dont see that, no harm in that.

Well despite Bitcoin capitulating , Nxt is shrinking faster so it will have to pull a 180. When do you think NxT will start growing in market share(not necessarily market cap) in our ecosystem?

jones_

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 02:45:09 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on January 18, 2015, 02:25:55 PM

I think your timeframes are too short. Marketcap rankings can be relevant over long periods, let's see if PayCoin is still as important as the market suggests it is in 1 year from now..

Well you keep arguing points I am not making, but we can both hope and agree for the above.

You seem to be blasé about the fate of NxT because you are comparing it to scamcoins and P&D coins, while I am worried about Bitcoin and see it fighting for survival, and its enemies don't include NxT. Don't let your Hubris get the better of you....

I see bitcoin surviving for a while more, its hard to refute that, but as a system, there are improvements that can be made.

I hope that bit coins enemies aren't alts, its more like cryptos enemies are anything not crypto and centralized.

in the move towards more efficient and advanced crypto, I believe nxt will outpace bitcoin, some people dont see that, no harm in that.

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: Daedelus on January 18, 2015, 02:25:55 PM

I think your timeframes are too short. Marketcap rankings can be relevant over long periods, let's see if PayCoin is still as important as the market suggests it is in 1 year from now..

Well you keep arguing points I am not making, but we can both hope and agree for the above.

You seem to be blasé about the fate of NxT because you are comparing it to scamcoins and P&D coins, while I am worried about Bitcoin and see it fighting for survival, and its enemies don't include NxT. Don't let your Hubris get the better of you....

Daedelus

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As I said above (for the first time), I am relaxed about this as there have been many coins come and go. The time between each new coin is just decreasing. This will be no different.

Look back at CMC one year ago, the numbers don't matter but these are obviously what were in people's minds:

Bitcoin
Ripple
Litecoin
Peercoin
~~Mastercoin~~
Nxt
~~Namecoin~~
Quark
Megacoin
Worldcoin
Primecoin
Feathercoin
Novacoin
Infinitecoin
Dogecoin
Netcoin
Devcoin
Anoncoin
Tickets
Freicoin
Terracoin
Copperlark
Cryptogenic Bullion
Ixcoin
Earthcoin
Zetacoin
GoldCoin
BBQCoin
Fastcoin
Memorycoin
Mincoin
Sexcoin
Junkcoin
... and on and on and on

All the ones ~~scrubbed~~ out are the ones who have actually lost 'mindshare' as they are no longer considered relevant. Most of them have faded to insignificance. Nxt is still slugging it out after a whole year.

I think you could do the same from 6 months ago and find the results are very similar.

There is a current surge to "corporate cryptos" (Ripple, Stellar, Bitshares, Paycoin) in an attempt to change bank balances rather than the world. I think the frequency of these will increase as more money is made. But it doesn't diminish the "change the world cryptos".

I think your timeframes are too short. Marketcap rankings can be relevant over long periods, let's see if PayCoin is still as important as the market suggests it is in 1 year from now..

inBitweTrust

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jones_

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 02:00:50 PM

Quote from: jones_ on January 18, 2015, 01:56:56 PM

nxt is a crypto in constant development and doing research into the best systems, so I would venture to guess that statistics related to unpaid people helping out the platform, and developer, research and project development would slide in nxts way.

anything relating to VC money will be weighted against nxt as that's not the route we've taken

You understand that VC money pays for professional developers right? You understand that NxT has a fraction of devs compared to those working directly for bitcoin core or on bitcoin projects, right?

Or are you under the impression that NxT actually has more development?

I am under the impression that nxt has gotten much more done in its first year of development than most if not all other cryptos and will continue to do so.
bitcoin got a head start and got the ball rolling, but it is possible for better systems to exist.

Daedelus

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 01:52:01 PM

You are completely avoiding the fact that their are many ways to gather metrics as to NxT's falling marketshare within the crypto ecosystem as I have just shown. Even brand new coins like Stellar and Paycoin are ousting NxT when studying metrics other than market cap.

It is because I am relaxed about it.

Let's see... from memory

Peercoin, Darkcoin, Counterparty, Banxshares?, Mastercoin, Blackcoin, Monero, Auroracoin and probably many others have all "ousted" Nxt in the last year. Where are they now? Just because the frequency is picking up doesn't change anything.

Nxt has shown it has staying power through solid devs, regular stable releases, innovative features and a large community. It is still early days.

Perhaps you should do your alexa analysis at regular intervals to see the change over time, then it would be more meaningful.

Add in the blockchain data about increasing adoption and use from here...

Quote from: Daedelus on January 15, 2015, 02:24:57 PM

The blockchain data shows ever increasing adoption, I don't think anybody expected Bitcoin levels of transactions after just 1 year. But they are increasing.

https://nxtblocks.info/#section/blockexplorer_charts

I am using May 2014 as that was the launch of the first major feature users could use, Asset Exchange.

Transactions per day has gone up more than ten fold.

May 14: 200 - 500 transactions per day
Jan 15: 5500 - 7000 transactions per day

The growing steepness of the curve in Cumulative transactions per day shows how transactions are increasing at a faster and faster rate.

With the transactions per day increasing, the Average transactions per block per day is also rising, which is good for forgers.

May 14: 0.3 - 0.6 transactions per block per day
Jan 15: 8 - 11 transactions per block per day

No crypto shows signs of wide adoption (even Bitcoin). Nxt does show positive, concrete signs of growing adoption and at an ever increasing rate. Something must be going right Grin

I have noticed a couple of guys pushing this "Nxt is dying" vibe over the last day or so. Undecided

. The facts are that people like Nxt and people use it. The blockchain data and the standard 100+ people online at nxtforum.org supports this. Open your eyes Grin

And it quite hard to make the characterisation your are attempting to make stick. Nxt is on the up, even in a very bear market. Those that try Nxt, like it. This shows adoption and use are increasing (at an ever increasing rate).

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: jones_ on January 18, 2015, 01:56:56 PM

nxt is a crypto in constant development and doing research into the best systems, so I would venture to guess that statistics related to unpaid people helping out the platform, and developer, research and project development would slide in nxts way.

anything relating to VC money will be weighted against nxt as that's not the route we've taken

You understand that VC money pays for professional developers right? You understand that NxT has a fraction of devs compared to those working directly for bitcoin core or on bitcoin projects, right? You understand that Bitcoin also has the most unpaid development as well and Nxt has a fraction of what Bitcoin has, right?

Or are you under the impression that NxT actually has more development?

jones_

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 01:52:01 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on January 18, 2015, 01:44:57 PM

Read CfB's comments in context with the logic.

i) CMC doesn't include trading on the three decentralised exchange platforms Nxt has: Asset Exchange, Marketplace and Monetary System (and multigateway too, thinking of it. Though it isn't a core feature of Nxt).

ii) "Once everyone start using solely NXT its market cap will become 0, because no trades will be happening on centralized fiat exchanges" and centralized fiat exchanges are the only thing CMC reports.

The more Nxt moves to decentralised exchanges, the closer it will get to 0 on CMC as they only report centralised exchange stats. The decentralised stats are on the blockchain, but they just don't bother.

You are completely avoiding the fact that their are many ways to gather metrics as to NxT's falling marketshare within the crypto ecosystem as I have just shown. Even brand new coins like Stellar and Paycoin are ousting NxT when studying metrics other than market cap.

nxt is a crypto in constant development and doing research into the best systems, so I would venture to guess that statistics related to unpaid people helping out the platform, and developer, research and project development would slide in nxts way.

anything relating to VC money will be weighted against nxt as that's not the route we've taken

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: Daedelus on January 18, 2015, 01:44:57 PM

Read CfB's comments in context with the logic.

i) CMC doesn't include trading on the three decentralised exchange platforms Nxt has: Asset Exchange, Marketplace and Monetary System (and multigateway too, thinking of it. Though it isn't a core feature of Nxt).

ii) "Once everyone start using solely NXT its market cap will become 0, because no trades will be happening on centralized fiat exchanges" and centralized fiat exchanges are the only thing CMC reports.

The more Nxt moves to decentralised exchanges, the closer it will get to 0 on CMC as they only report centralised exchange stats. The decentralised stats are on the blockchain, but they just don't bother.

You are completely avoiding the fact that their are many ways to gather metrics as to NxT's falling marketshare within the crypto ecosystem as I have just shown. Even brand new coins like Stellar and Paycoin are ousting NxT when studying metrics other than market cap.

Additionally , CMC should refelct a somewhat accurate market cap as all other internal exchanges because of arbitrage. CfB statement only is applicable with regards to liquidity.

Daedelus

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Quote from: Zer0Sum on January 18, 2015, 01:36:08 PM

As for NXT... why are NXT Devs gratuitously trashing their "tokens" every chance they get?

Read CfB's comments in context with the logic.

i) CMC doesn't include trading on the three decentralised exchange platforms Nxt has: Asset Exchange, Marketplace and Monetary System (and multigateway too, thinking of it. Though it isn't a core feature of Nxt).

ii) "Once everyone start using solely NXT its market cap will become 0, because no trades will be happening on centralized fiat exchanges" and centralized fiat exchanges are the only thing CMC reports.

The more Nxt moves to decentralised exchanges, the closer it will get to 0 on CMC as they only report centralised exchange stats. The decentralised stats are on the blockchain, but they just don't bother.

Zer0Sum

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Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on January 18, 2015, 12:20:50 PM

Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 12:09:54 PM

I am inclined to believe that NxT will continue its downward trend of losing marketshare in the crpto currency ecosystem however, but am open to changes.

How do you measure marketshare? Don't say that you visit http://coinmarketcap.com, Paycoin at #4 is enough to prove that marketshare can't be measured this way.

PS: Nxt is low in CoinMarketCap rating simply because the site doesn't pull data from Asset Exchange and the like. Once everyone start using solely NXT its market cap will become 0, because no trades will be happening on centralized fiat exchanges.

Coinmarketcap needs to be called out as a joke. And ignored.
They conflate phony assets bubbles created by colluding traders with "capital" (Bitshares, NuBits).

As for NXT... why are NXT Devs gratuitously trashing their "tokens" every chance they get?
Your point makes no sense anyway... unless the 10-15 people that control NXT actually want to seal it off from the world.

SuperNET is clearly doing the opposite.

Dude, your "financial system" is going nowhere without a strong, liquid central currency...
Right now all you have is a constellation of Asset Bubbles with zero revenue = untenable situation.

"Best tech" means nothing... NXT is one major shock away from becoming an also-ran.

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on January 18, 2015, 12:20:50 PM

Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 12:09:54 PM

I am inclined to believe that NxT will continue its downward trend of losing marketshare in the crpto currency ecosystem however, but am open to changes.

How do you measure marketshare? Don't say that you visit http://coinmarketcap.com, Paycoin at #4 is enough to prove that marketshare can't be measured this way.

Unfortunately, for the cryptocurrency eco-system that PoS scam coin does deserve a high market share as they have a large and loyal following and high liquidity. I would suggest their standing is artificially elevated above others due to manipulation in the monetary supply, but the same could be said about NxT where a few whales control most of the supply and the liquidity is pathetic.

Your point is still valid, as there are other indications to test market share like:
Merchant adoption, user adoption(very difficult to measure accurately), Venture capital investments, development involvement.

Google trends wont be accurate at all because NxT is mainly affiliated with WWE in searches.

One could use Alexa ranking though:

bitcoin.org Global rank 13,074
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/bitcoin.org

bitcointalk.org Global rank 4,405
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/bitcointalk.org

http://nxt.org Global rank 451,998
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/nxt.org

nxtforum.org Global rank 197,055
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/nxtforum.org

paycoin.com Global rank 138,714
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/paycoin.com

hashtalk.org Global rank 28,827
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/hashtalk.org

Thus much to our chagrin paycoin has stolen marketshare/mindshare from NxT as the evidence has provided.

Come-from-Beyond

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 12:09:54 PM

I am inclined to believe that NxT will continue its downward trend of losing marketshare in the crpto currency ecosystem however, but am open to changes.

How do you measure marketshare? Don't say that you visit http://coinmarketcap.com, Paycoin at #4 is enough to prove that marketshare can't be measured this way.

PS: Nxt is low in CoinMarketCap rating simply because the site doesn't pull data from Asset Exchange and the like. Once everyone start using solely NXT its market cap will become 0, because no trades will be happening on centralized fiat exchanges.

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: achimsmile on January 18, 2015, 12:04:15 PM

Your strategy is to take the wind out of somebodys sails by weakening your own stance.

Having no hidden agenda doesn't mean having no agenda.

Weakening my own stance? With all the scams, thefts, and cloud mining ponzi's the Bitcoin ecosystem needs no help from me. I prefer we honestly discuss the facts so we can allow coins to stand on their own merits or not.

Yes, I indeed have an agenda... one that is spelled out clearly.

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on January 18, 2015, 12:07:34 PM

Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 11:59:34 AM

I am quite vocal about Bitcoins security problems, regardless of it remaining the most secure coin.

You are talking about an abstract Bitcoin in spherical vacuum. Real Bitcoin is very insecure, so much BTC is already stolen. I would say that not less will be stolen in the future, but... I'm not sure that Bitcoin will survive the next dump.

Here is what I am suggesting:

Bitcoin is very unstable and insecure. All other crypto-currencies are more so. I recommend and encourage developers to test other alts on the open market if there is some real development and ingenuity behind them(NxT classifies as thus), but this still hasn't met the bar of confidence that would make me suggest for the average user to invest in it yet or any other alt for that matter. My recommendations may change in the future depending upon the evolution of the currencies and it is possible in 5 years that I may be recommending NxT over Bitcoin. I am inclined to believe that NxT will continue its downward trend of losing marketshare in the crpto currency ecosystem however, but am open to changes.

Come-from-Beyond

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Quote from: inBitweTrust on January 18, 2015, 11:59:34 AM

I am quite vocal about Bitcoins security problems, regardless of it remaining the most secure coin.

You are talking about an abstract Bitcoin in spherical vacuum. Real Bitcoin is very insecure, so much BTC is already stolen. I would say that not less will be stolen in the future, but... I'm not sure that Bitcoin will survive the next dump.

achimsmile

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Quote

review the historical ~~facts~~ opinions and to indeed warn users that NxT isn't a recommended investment

Review historical opinions after half a year?

very altruistic. To each his own motives.

Your strategy is to take the wind out of somebodys sails by weakening your own stance.
i.e.: I don't have a hidden agenda and it's not a scam per se, but ico was skewed, stake distribution is centralized, etc. etc.

All your points are subjective. Is an ipo skewed when it's been open for 1.5 months? What is a "good" distrbution?

Having no hidden agenda doesn't mean having no agenda.

autodiv

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I am a holder and buyer of NXT simply because of the speed of development by the core team.

At least these individuals are serious about releasing new features in a timely fashion and that is what keeps serious competitors ahead of their not as serious foes.

Look at the decentralized asset exchange and monetary system features and how much they can help the ecosystem grow because of the amount of economic activity (true value) they can spawn. A lot of very important economic activity will surround the NXT cryptocurrency ecosystem because of the foundation they have laid and are laying.

Just my 2 cents! Does anyone use cents anymore?

Topic: I'm dumping Nxt and here's why you should too - page 6. (Read 21266 times)