Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 48.

Bitcoinorama

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Quote from: Vycid on August 17, 2013, 04:37:24 PM

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 04:28:34 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 04:05:22 PM

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:56:14 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

I don't think I can produce a batch of ASICs. If you can, then compete with him.

I don't think you can produce anything useful at all.

My point ... that is clearly beyond your feeble understanding ... is that they have already ordered these chips this year more than once.
The chips have been mining in 2 rigs since January ... a few more since then Tongue

So the process of getting more is a repeat of what they have already done more than once ... and no chip design involved in it at all.
Do I need to use smaller words or bigger text to point out the obvious?

Do you understand what is involved with the manufacture of a modern integrated circuit? You are talking about one of the most complex manufacturing processes on earth. Yifu is clearly at fault for missing the deadlines he promised - but that does not change the fact that getting these chips manufactured is far more complex than sending TSMC a request for some more chips.

Yes, but the chips have been ready and delivered from TSMC since 25th June.

Vycid

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Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 04:28:34 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 04:05:22 PM

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:56:14 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

I don't think I can produce a batch of ASICs. If you can, then compete with him.

I don't think you can produce anything useful at all.

My point ... that is clearly beyond your feeble understanding ... is that they have already ordered these chips this year more than once.
The chips have been mining in 2 rigs since January ... a few more since then Tongue

So the process of getting more is a repeat of what they have already done more than once ... and no chip design involved in it at all.
Do I need to use smaller words or bigger text to point out the obvious?

Do you understand what is involved with the manufacture of a modern integrated circuit? You are talking about one of the most complex manufacturing processes on earth. Yifu is clearly at fault for missing the deadlines he promised - but that does not change the fact that getting these chips manufactured is far more complex than sending TSMC a request for some more chips.

SebastianJu

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Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

It doesnt sound as hard to collect money, find the people that are capable to develop it and build the product in foundry.

The point is. Yifu already did this several times. He knows exactly how long it takes to produce that exact chip. There are no vars in between so he was able to give a lead time of 9-10 weeks. After 5 weeks exactly the chip batches in shop were changed to "Chips ordered" which means to me he knows that the chip production takes 4 weeks from then.
And it looks there were a huge amount of such chips see the fotos of the boxes. They only didnt reach us.
I cant believe his story. 20 batches in customs for 2 weeks when they are 5 weeks late? First, 20 batches are nothing and the 2 weeks explain nothing.
Then someone knocked at a employees door? Thats so creepy one have to stop working and, like i read, getting bodyguards? I really believe it only was a customer asking were his chips are.
The same goes for the pdf with private details. Whats the problem? The problem is that so many customers are angry and would like to break the communication stop. Without that the threat would be useless.

Whatever. Im tired of getting angry at Yifu.

kano

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Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 04:05:22 PM

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:56:14 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

I don't think I can produce a batch of ASICs. If you can, then compete with him.

I don't think you can produce anything useful at all.

My point ... that is clearly beyond your feeble understanding ... is that they have already ordered these chips this year more than once.
The chips have been mining in 2 rigs since January ... a few more since then Tongue

So the process of getting more is a repeat of what they have already done more than once ... and no chip design involved in it at all.
Do I need to use smaller words or bigger text to point out the obvious?

dmcdad

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Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 04:05:22 PM

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:56:14 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

I don't think I can produce a batch of ASICs. If you can, then compete with him.

I'm not sure I understand your point, but my point is that I think Yifu has been unethical and needs to right his wrongs. I don't think the reason my chips haven't shipped have anything to do with how difficult it is to develop/produce/ship an ASIC. It has to do with him selling it to the highest bidder and not fulfilling his own plainly state "no bullshit" (should have been "loads of bullshit") terms of sale.

ProfMac

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Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:56:14 PM

Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

I don't think I can produce a batch of ASICs. If you can, then compete with him.

kano

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Linux since 1997 RedHat 4

Quote from: Its About Sharing on August 17, 2013, 03:31:34 PM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 17, 2013, 03:02:31 PM

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Interesting. You want to know what would help BFL right now? If they started to upgrade certain orders delivered a bit late. Like barely profitable or unprofitably late. Just an idea and it won't cost them any more unless they got the old chips stacked up.

Any links?

http://www.butterflylabs.com/
Tongue

kano

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Quote from: ProfMac on August 17, 2013, 03:53:21 PM

For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

They had them in January ... so ... yeah send out an order for more of the same ... I guess that was beyond his abilities ...

ProfMac

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For those of you who think it is easy to order chips and that YiFu could easily have done better and cheaper, I offer a challenge:

Make it so.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: kano on August 17, 2013, 03:19:19 PM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 17, 2013, 03:02:31 PM

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Maybe all maybe by KnC? Cheesy

Wouldn't that be ironic, especially after all the fudding Inaba did about 28nm chips being unrealistic.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: Its About Sharing on August 17, 2013, 03:31:34 PM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 17, 2013, 03:02:31 PM

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Interesting. You want to know what would help BFL right now? If they started to upgrade certain orders delivered a bit late. Like barely profitable or unprofitably late. Just an idea and it won't cost them any more unless they got the old chips stacked up.

Any links?

You can upgrade an existing order but
1) you lose your place in line
2) have to pay the difference if product price
3) this is just the punch in the gut, there is a 10% fee for upgrades.

So people who's gear is now obsolete because they waited a year for delivery, get to lose 10% more for the priveledge of joining the end of the line for "delivery" in December. It would be hard to make this stuff up.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=276692.0;topicseen

Its About Sharing

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Antifragile

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 17, 2013, 03:02:31 PM

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Interesting. You want to know what would help BFL right now? If they started to upgrade certain orders delivered a bit late. Like barely profitable or unprofitably late. Just an idea and it won't cost them any more unless they got the old chips stacked up.

Any links?

kano

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Activity: 4634

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Linux since 1997 RedHat 4

Quote from: cardcomm on August 17, 2013, 02:22:55 PM

Quote from: zumzero on August 16, 2013, 07:41:48 PM

Or, I might get angry because the Christmas present I wanted to give my wife is stuck in some sorting office somewhere until after New Year.

How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us.

What a great thought! I've faced nearly overwhelming adversity in my life. And it faced it with dignity and courage, if I do say so myself.

Yet I still get mad if a Christmas present I ordered arrives too late, or if someone cheats me out a couple grand worth of bitcoin hardware. It's nothing compared to what I've already faced, but yet I get angry. It's funny how people are...

Thanks for the reminder

Now I just need to keep reminding myself: "How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us."

cardcomm, just ignore zumzero.
Looking through his post history, it's full of "Ken is only human, why did you expect him to do what he said he would do" regarding something elsewhere I'll not even bother linking.
His account has been registered for 3 weeks, so yeah a noob and he clearly knows nothing of what he is talking about.

kano

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Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 17, 2013, 03:02:31 PM

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Maybe all maybe by KnC? Cheesy

DeathAndTaxes

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Activity: 1218

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: Bicknellski on August 17, 2013, 03:00:39 AM

Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance. BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders. I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Its About Sharing

legendary

Activity: 1442

Merit: 1000

Antifragile

Quote from: cardcomm on August 17, 2013, 02:22:55 PM

Quote from: zumzero on August 16, 2013, 07:41:48 PM

Or, I might get angry because the Christmas present I wanted to give my wife is stuck in some sorting office somewhere until after New Year.

How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us.

What a great thought! I've faced nearly overwhelming adversity in my life. And it faced it with dignity and courage, if I do say so myself.

Yet I still get mad if a Christmas present I ordered arrives too late, or if someone cheats me out a couple grand worth of bitcoin hardware. It's nothing compared to what I've already faced, but yet I get angry. It's funny how people are...

Thanks for the reminder

Now I just need to keep reminding myself: "How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us."

I see it as helping others. I don't think it will be fair to others to let this slide. When you have a certain knowledge, acting on it to help others is morally obligatory.

I find that is where we are.

cardcomm

sr. member

Activity: 294

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Quote from: zumzero on August 16, 2013, 07:41:48 PM

Or, I might get angry because the Christmas present I wanted to give my wife is stuck in some sorting office somewhere until after New Year.

How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us.

What a great thought! I've faced nearly overwhelming adversity in my life. And it faced it with dignity and courage, if I do say so myself.

Yet I still get mad if a Christmas present I ordered arrives too late, or if someone cheats me out a couple grand worth of bitcoin hardware. It's nothing compared to what I've already faced, but yet I get angry. It's funny how people are...

Thanks for the reminder

Now I just need to keep reminding myself: "How we chose to conduct ourselves when we face adversity is what defines us."

rebelrat

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Activity: 52

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People - wake up and smell the coffee. After weeks of silence, when users get ready to file
class action lawsuits - out of nowhere appears YIFU and posts a one-liner about shipping some
chips to calm the crowd and get his shills to defend his truly criminal actions. Please proceed
with legal action and hurt the little boy where it really matters to him - in his pocketbook.

Its About Sharing

legendary

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Antifragile

Quote from: Ozymandias on August 17, 2013, 01:44:24 PM

Quote from: Its About Sharing on August 17, 2013, 01:08:48 PM

I say we use some of the refund money (or other) that will be coming back for legal action. Has anyone looked into this?

Yifu ignored phone calls, messages, etc. The mafia was involved or whatever the story, but yet he logged in again and again leaving no messages. His actions have guilt written all over them.
I'll apologize if I'm in err, but the writing is on the wall regarding his inaction.

IAS

Suggesting we use the refunds to engage in legal action against the company issuing the refunds seems like a less-than-ideal motivator for the company to actually issue the refunds, no?

Well, we can use our own funds if need be. And perhaps others throwing in their suggestions would assist here.

The thing is, do they want to dig a deeper hole? I mean they aren't going to say, "Sign this paper stating no legal action and then we will give you your money back."
That is almost admitting guilt. If anything like that happens, we need to "reach a settlement". A punitive one. But I'd rather involve a lawyers. Can't believe I just said that...

I'm in this small time but feel bad for the people who put lots of money in. Something should be done and I worry that if people just settle for refunds it gives the message of "It's ok to fuck the customer". After all the worst that happens is they give us back all that money and keep the highest bidders money. It is like the 1 billion dollar fine levied against Wachovia or HSBC for hundreds of billions in drug laundering... They must be thinking "Sign me up..."

Ozymandias

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Quote from: Its About Sharing on August 17, 2013, 01:08:48 PM

I say we use some of the refund money (or other) that will be coming back for legal action. Has anyone looked into this?

Yifu ignored phone calls, messages, etc. The mafia was involved or whatever the story, but yet he logged in again and again leaving no messages. His actions have guilt written all over them.
I'll apologize if I'm in err, but the writing is on the wall regarding his inaction.

IAS

Suggesting we use the refunds to engage in legal action against the company issuing the refunds seems like a less-than-ideal motivator for the company to actually issue the refunds, no?

Topic: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 48. (Read 186720 times)