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Topic: Intellectual Property - In All Fairness! - page 10. (Read 105893 times)

sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 252
October 21, 2011, 09:13:52 AM
So if the movie is leaked, no contract is needed and the movie maker doesn't get paid.

So everyone's going to build business models relying upon leaked movies? No, most are going to stick with the contract because it is more reliable.

Movies cost millions to make

Some do. It's not a necessity though.

if you take away the protection from the movie maker, you take away the incentive to make movies.

Some people are creative, and will express that creativity regardless of a profit motive.

There will be far fewer of them.

So what, if people want fewer movies?
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 21, 2011, 09:02:19 AM

...snip...

If there is no way for movie makers to get paid, then there will be far fewer movies made.  I take it you agree with that?

I agree with the conclusion if the premise is correct, but it's not.  The producers get paid because of contract law not copyright law.  The same is true for each and every one of the actors.  Not a single major production company depends upon copyright law to do anything for a first run major motion picture.  How the hell do you think that Showtime produces movies and shows that subscribers pay nothing for?  How does Hallmark produce direct-to-cable/direct-to-video tearjerkers?  How does SciFi produce hours upon hours of B-rate movies?  Not one of these producers depends upon copyright law to get paid, they damn near give it all away free.

So if the movie is leaked, no contract is needed and the movie maker doesn't get paid.  Movies cost millions to make - if you take away the protection from the movie maker, you take away the incentive to make movies.  There will be far fewer of them.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1010
October 21, 2011, 08:13:12 AM

..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?

I download and torrent stuff often, and I've never seen them. Actually, I don't even know what video format theater movies are in... Can you point me to where those high quality movies are available?

If you are serious, Google it. 

We've been over this before...not sure why you want to repeat something that has already been settled. 

You say something, assume it's so, and then believe it's settled?  What is wrong with you?  None of us agree with your assessment.  You have changed no one's mind, neither have we.  That's a far cry from 'settled'.

If there is no way for movie makers to get paid, then there will be far fewer movies made.  I take it you agree with that?

I agree with the conclusion if the premise is correct, but it's not.  The producers get paid because of contract law not copyright law.  The same is true for each and every one of the actors.  Not a single major production company depends upon copyright law to do anything for a first run major motion picture.  How the hell do you think that Showtime produces movies and shows that subscribers pay nothing for?  How does Hallmark produce direct-to-cable/direct-to-video tearjerkers?  How does SciFi produce hours upon hours of B-rate movies?  Not one of these producers depends upon copyright law to get paid, they damn near give it all away free.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 21, 2011, 08:04:29 AM
..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?

I download and torrent stuff often, and I've never seen them. Actually, I don't even know what video format theater movies are in... Can you point me to where those high quality movies are available?

If you are serious, Google it. 

We've been over this before...not sure why you want to repeat something that has already been settled. 

You say something, assume it's so, and then believe it's settled?  What is wrong with you?  None of us agree with your assessment.  You have changed no one's mind, neither have we.  That's a far cry from 'settled'.

If there is no way for movie makers to get paid, then there will be far fewer movies made.  I take it you agree with that?
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1010
October 21, 2011, 07:45:39 AM
And I'm still waiting for a response to this question...

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.585369
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1010
October 21, 2011, 07:44:23 AM
..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?

I download and torrent stuff often, and I've never seen them. Actually, I don't even know what video format theater movies are in... Can you point me to where those high quality movies are available?

If you are serious, Google it. 

We've been over this before...not sure why you want to repeat something that has already been settled. 

You say something, assume it's so, and then believe it's settled?  What is wrong with you?  None of us agree with your assessment.  You have changed no one's mind, neither have we.  That's a far cry from 'settled'.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 21, 2011, 01:22:11 AM
..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?

I download and torrent stuff often, and I've never seen them. Actually, I don't even know what video format theater movies are in... Can you point me to where those high quality movies are available?

If you are serious, Google it. 

We've been over this before...not sure why you want to repeat something that has already been settled.  There is no viable business model for movie makers if they do not have a guarantee that the movie theaters will pay them for showings of the movie.  So if you want to remove that guarantee/IP laws, you need to come up with a system that works better than what we have.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 20, 2011, 10:50:14 PM
..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?

I download and torrent stuff often, and I've never seen them. Actually, I don't even know what video format theater movies are in... Can you point me to where those high quality movies are available?
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 20, 2011, 05:13:46 PM
..snip...

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.

Yes.  And you know it...why even ask?
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 20, 2011, 02:43:34 PM
This https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/websteading-49179 was actually inspired by this thread, and may give the libertarians here a chance to put their bitcoin where their mouth is, so to speak.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 20, 2011, 02:40:37 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be
 downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online

And if there is no IP law, the movie maker won't see a cent of that $12.  

Unless he releases copies of the movie ONLY to specific theaters under contract, or sells it for millions to Hulu or Netflix.

You know, like how movie makers do already, and which has been mentioned many many many times.

Yes the movies are on the net before they reach the theaters...as was also mentioned many times.  The only reason the theater owners pay is IP law.

Are the high quality film versions on the net? I think it was mentioned that the only reason they pay is to get the film versions instead of the grainy DVD screener versions, and if they ever showed or gave away a movie without permission, they would lose the contract and never be able to show good quality movies again.
sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 250
October 20, 2011, 02:39:18 PM
Hawker, FirstAscent please answer the question posted.

Given: When copying a DVD in china sold to another chinese person. What is the significance of this force?

So are you're referring to a magical mystical (MM) kind of force? So what are the units of this force? Oh, and if it isn't this new MM force and it's still about "degrees" of force in Newtons (kg*m/s^2), what is the approximate measure and quantity of force as applied in my example? I do understand a proportionality of punishment (force applied), so I would be willing to accept that proportion I'd be found guilty of.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 20, 2011, 02:26:07 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be
 downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online

And if there is no IP law, the movie maker won't see a cent of that $12.  

Unless he releases copies of the movie ONLY to specific theaters under contract, or sells it for millions to Hulu or Netflix.

You know, like how movie makers do already, and which has been mentioned many many many times.

Yes the movies are on the net before they reach the theaters...as was also mentioned many times.  The only reason the theater owners pay is IP law.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 20, 2011, 02:22:00 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be
 downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online

And if there is no IP law, the movie maker won't see a cent of that $12.  

Unless he releases copies of the movie ONLY to specific theaters under contract, or sells it for millions to Hulu or Netflix.

You know, like how movie makers do already, and which has been mentioned many many many times.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
October 20, 2011, 02:05:40 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online

And if there is no IP law, the movie maker won't see a cent of that $12. 

Unless they own all the theaters somehow and do searches of everyone entering the theater and exert tight control over the editing team during production and the theater workers.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 20, 2011, 02:03:44 PM
...snip...
What is society?  Is it the entire population that  resides within a particular set of imaginarly lines on a map?

Wikipedia it.  I already linked it once for you.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
October 20, 2011, 02:01:53 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online

And if there is no IP law, the movie maker won't see a cent of that $12. 
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1010
October 20, 2011, 01:48:23 PM


To what are you referring?

Oh, sorry.  I was looking at the post above yours, which might be the post behind yours for yourself because I have the forum set to read in reverse.
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 252
October 20, 2011, 01:40:45 PM


If you've got arguments that address the issues highlighted in this post, please use them. Otherwise,

Wait, what?  That was a serious post?

The post to which I linked is serious. The post you quoted was in response to FirstAscent. He and Hawker constantly stick their fingers in their ears and yell "ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!!" but then ignore the answers given and create some new fantasy scenario.

Do you have issues with the multiple meanings of English words?

To what are you referring?
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 20, 2011, 01:28:55 PM
Why would most people pay for a game when it's available for free legally? I think you're sadly mistaken if you think most people who do pay right now the retail price for a game would actually pay anything if it was legally available for free.

Because we want to support the developers of the game. I do this all the fucking time, and so do many others.

Ditto! I admit to downloading games I'm not even sure if I'll like, and buying those I know I want, even if they can be downloaded. Same thing for movies. It if a movie I know I'll want to see, I'l happily spend the $12 to go see it, even if the DVD screener is already available online
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