Topic: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... - page 28. (Read 141409 times)

Both Redbulls were not capable of passing on track of any car including Ferrari,Mercedes and McLaren,if this is their true power after claiming a huge massive upgrade for this race in Verstappen car it means that most likely they are not going to be winning this Championship at least the constructor title is not at all guaranteed for them.I wonder what decision they will take about Perez tomorrow,most likely he is going to be sacked as he did not show anything,starting 2nd and finishing 8th does not mean anything good for him and not good for the team also.To bad we are having a long break right now in the middle of where things are becoming beautiful.

There are only 10 minutes to go for the race to start. It is going to be interesting to watch Verstappen climb the positions today.    He looks really fast this time if you watched the qualifying session. A time gap like 0.6 seconds is really big but he is unlucky to have that grid penalty. I'm still expecting him to finish on podium of course.

But can he win the race? I don't think so. Perez needs to keep McLarens behind to give Verstappen a more realistic chance to win here. But I wouldn't trust Perez even a bit. 

I mean Perez was great yesterday. He was so close to taking pole also but I think he used the track conditions to his advantage. No rain is expected today so I feel like he will drop down by many places.

2024 F1 Belgian Grand Prix - Qualifying Results
Pos   Driver   Nat.   Team   Q1   Q2   Q3
1   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m54.938s   1m53.837s   1m53.159s
2   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m55.349s   1m54.193s   1m53.754s
3   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m55.139s   1m54.470s   1m53.765s
4   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1m55.692s   1m54.037s   1m53.835s
5   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m55.582s   1m54.358s   1m53.981s
6   Oscar Piastri   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m54.835s   1m54.136s   1m54.027s
7   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1m55.353s   1m54.095s   1m54.184s
8   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m55.169s   1m54.112s   1m54.477s
9   Fernando Alonso   ESP   Aston Martin Aramco F1 Team   1m55.489s   1m54.258s   1m54.765s
10   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m55.417s   1m54.460s   1m54.810s

Pole position for Leclerc cause Max got 10 positions penalty.

It will be a fun race to see, if we have raid I guess Max will win.

Source: https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1052777/1/2024-f1-belgian-grand-prix-qualifying-results

Tomorrow at least there is no sight of rain and although cooler weather we are free from rain which will make a beautiful race.I was watching in F1 official Instagram page a scrolling post with many small ones reviving to us what happened in 2008 where Hamilton and Raikkonen fought it hard for the win and although Hamilton won back then he was penalized with 25 seconds for touching with Raikkonen,so Massa got the win,glorious times which I hope we can see a repeat tomorrow judging from the starting grid.It sure promises a lot of action and the track permits it.

My source says it is full rainy today at the location. So we had better get ready for some interesting action.    It isn't expected to rain heavily though, only around 1 mm.



Source: YR served by the Norwegian Meteorological Institute and NRK

However even this amount of rain can make a big impact. If it rains, stops and starts again then having the right strategy can carry even an unexpected driver to pole position. 

Only half an hour to go and the odds are like 2.49 - Verstappen, 2.85 - Norris. But one should keep in mind that even if Verstappen finishes the session as the 1st he is starting the race 10 positions back because of a power unit change.

That doesn't sound right...  If Newey still has a live contract until early 2025 then he should be doing his job and help the team win the most races they can.  And I don't think he would do Horner dirty like that, leaving him at the middle of the season.  Lol. 

Unless...  I missed something?

Anyway, track was wet at FP3 and most of the drivers just had under 10 laps in.  So no additional info to pick up on.  Quali in an hour or so. 

2024 F1 Belgian Grand Prix - Free Practice Results (2)
Pos   Driver   Nat.   Team   Time
1   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m42.260s
2   Oscar Piastri   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m42.475s
3   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m42.477s
4   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m42.837s
5   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m43.098s
6   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1m43.290s
7   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.401s
8   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   MoneyGram Haas F1 Team   1m43.485s
9   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m43.504s
10   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1m43.519s
11   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco F1 Team   1m43.532s
12   Fernando Alonso   ESP   Aston Martin Aramco F1 Team   1m43.538s
13   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Stake F1 Team Kick Sauber   1m43.675s
14   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   Visa Cash App RB F1 Team   1m43.823s
15   Pierre Gasly   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.829s
16   Nico Hulkenberg   GER   MoneyGram Haas F1 Team   1m43.846s
17   Alex Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m43.892s
18   Logan Sargeant   USA   Williams Racing   1m44.226s
19   Zhou Guanyu   CHN   Stake F1 Team Kick Sauber   1m44.302s
20   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Visa Cash App RB F1 Team   1m44.348s

Source:https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1052680/1/2024-f1-belgian-grand-prix-friday-practice-results

Mclaren is still ahead, rain could be a possibility.

I'm expecting a big difference in cars, long tracks kinda do

First practice session has ended with Verstappen's lead. Norris wasn't competitive yet. But now after the second session things changed quite much.    Norris finished as the leader and Piastri followed right behind. Verstappen followed them in the 3rd position. McLaren isn't joking at all as of now. They are targeting the championship which is very realistic considering how bad Perez is.

By the way Esteban Ocon has signed a multi-year deal with Haas. I wonder what Gasly's future is going to be as well. Does Alpine think of keeping him?

He already left his position.
He is still in redbull but he is not contributing anymore in the development of the car.

He is still payed by them but he is doing things for redbull outside the F1.

^  Wait what?  I may have missed something...  Adrian Newey already left Red Bull and will not stay til the end of the season?

*Checks internet*

Ah no.  Lol.  He's set to leave early 2025.  I think Newey could still figure out something to get their edge back.  But it's gonna be another close fight between Red Bull and McLaren for sure.  It's the season that we have been waiting for and deserve.

Since Adrian Newey left they have no more engineering superiority.
Next race is Spa he can recover easly to top 4, after that it will be harder.

The race for the world title is still on.

If I can remember correctly we will have a spring race next race too and I'm assuming the penalty will be on the race start and not on sprint race start.

So I heard that Max Verstappen will have a 10 place grid penalty because Red Bull replaced his car's power unit.  What does this mean?  I guess watch quali and see how he finishes.  If he gets pole position then we could be pretty sure thst there's a good chance he'll be on the podium even if he starts at 11th on the grid.

If he's still behind the McLarens then we'll see a lot more shenanigans that we saw in Hungary.  He's frustrated now.

McLaren has been said to have the fastest performance car at the moment, but they are very bad at managing their drivers which makes clashes inevitable. They need to manage their two drivers as quickly as possible, because otherwise McLaren can make Lando and Piastri the same as Hamilton and Nico as before, and they will miss the opportunity to make one of their drivers become world champions.

I congratulate McLaren on an outstanding performance. They've come back from the bottom to the top. As for the team order, if they had a plan to keep Piastri in front, I think they could have easily dealt with it with an early pit. It was a clumsily managed sequence. Congratulations to Piastri, but he is still behind Norris in terms of pace. I hope Red Bull, like Ferrari, have been misled by the updates. They were saying they completed the program three weeks early, but they were not in a good mood. I hope they didn't understand the updates or it wasn't something track specific and they messed up.

The season is going exactly as I thought it would. It's evolving into a scenario where they lose the constructors' championship. I thought Ferrari would be champions in the constructors' championship, but McLaren have been very strong in the constructors' championship this year. I think the relationship between Verstappen and Red Bull may have broken down, Verstappen knows that next year he will fight for the top with McLaren and the championship will not be easy with Red Bull. Mercedes, on the other hand, is on the upswing in terms of performance and bringing Allison back into the project has been very effective. Next year, when he designs the car himself, it looks like we will see Mercedes and McLaren at the top. Maybe Ferrari will join them if they get Newey. Therefore, the ideal scenario for Verstappen seems to be Mercedes.

Most likely McLaren with a Piastri upgrading his performances from race to race and Norris being there fighting and getting the pole,at least 2 this season shows that clearly Redbull is not the fastest car and they can consider lost their constructor title already.Perez is having difficulties getting many points for the team while at McLaren both drivers bring good points to the team,a nervous,very nervous Verstappen shows that Redbull has not everything under control any more.I need this last race that will be held this weekend in Belgium before the long break and if McLaren dominates in such a long track also it means that Redbull long dominance is long gone.

2024 FORMULA 1 DRIVERS' WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP   
Pos   Driver   Nat.   Team   Wins   Points
1   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   7   265
2   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1   189
3   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1   162
4   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1   154
5   Oscar Piastri   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1   149
6   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1   125
7   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   0   124
8   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team   1   116
9   Fernando Alonso   ESP   Aston Martin Aramco F1 Team   0   45
10   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco F1 Team   0   24

This si the F1 Championship leaderboard after the hungarian Grand Prix.

2024 FORMULA 1 CONSTRUCTORS' WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP
Pos   Team   Wins   Points
1   Oracle Red Bull Racing   7   389
2   McLaren F1 Team   2   338
3   Scuderia Ferrari   2   322

And this is the constructors' championship

With This Mclearen and this Perez, I can see Norris fighting with Max until the end and Mclearen easly win the second Mondial

Source: https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1052538/1/f1-world-championship-points-after-2024-hungarian-grand-prix

That is the thing, I agree that the strategy put Piastri down, and that is why Norris was up, and they asked Norris to give up the position BECAUSE their own strategical decision, I get that and it was fair to ask Norris to give up. However, we need to remember that Norris "could" go for drivers title, which is insane when you think about it because it is not really expected of Mclaren to be this good normally, suddenly they became so great, like just a few years ago a 4th place was something amazing for them.

I think it's clear that Norris should have been given the first place, even though it wasn't fair, and even though Piastri would have only lost because of team strategy, we should have still seen Norris win because those points mean something to Norris more than it means to Piastri.

It is obvious that they are going for constructors, because Perez sucks, and could even be fired during the season itself, whereas Piastri and Norris combined could beat Max, hence why they care about team title a lot more. But they should still not put this type of mistake for Norris, imagine if he loses at the end of the season with like just five points difference? That would make this decision even worse.

It was nothing about who the team thinks should win or setting one driver to get first place over the other.  Piastri was prolly the faster guy at the race.  They need to got that 1 - 2 and that's all that mattered in Hungary for the team.


Oh nice...  Would've loved to see Binotto as technical guy and design cars tho.  But good to see him back.  As for Newey, wow that's tempting.  Looks like Aston Martin is really serious.  But I don't think money will be a decision maker for Newey tho?  Dunno.

I have also seen it. That's absolutely a huge offer.    Ferrari didn't even want to meet Newey's demands despite his expecting much less money. Plus, Newey was going to bring 20 engineers together with himself (They say it has been denied though).

Newey is a great engineer. Why wouldn't Ferrari like to give their best to agree with him?    From now on, they have missed that train though as they have to pay much more money to equal Aston Martin offer.

Binotto to Audi? Interesting. Binotto shouldn't actually be a boss for any team. Instead, he should do what he is doing best. I would like to see him showing his engineering skills.

Some rumors about managers today
Adrian Newey has been offered €100m to join Aston Martin, the rumor for Ferrari was 50m €, so basically the double

Ferrari ex team principal Mattia Binotto will come back in F1.

Audi has confirmed Binotto as manager Today with others people like Sauber CEO Andreas Seidl and Oliver Hoffmann from Sauber.