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Topic: Nefario - page 56. (Read 198714 times)

newbie
Activity: 42
Merit: 0
October 09, 2012, 07:24:13 PM
Quote
It's not the "behind the scenes" activity that was illegal here.  The whole site was illegal (and obviously so) from the moment it was founded.  And you failed to report it for over a year.  Far from immediately.  

As soon as I was aware of the activity it was reported.  As is any other illegal activity I see here.  

So, you reported Nef to the "proper authorities" but don't think he deserves a scammer tag?  I guess that makes everything perfectly clear, then.
sr. member
Activity: 966
Merit: 311
October 09, 2012, 07:22:12 PM
we're talking about like ~8900 BTC, like $105,000, this is a crime taking place.

If bitcoin securities are illegal because bitcoin is now officially money,

then Nefario has stolen >$100k,

and that is a crime,

and he will go to jail,

I made an appointment with my lawyer today, we'll see what he says.

You have over 100,000$ on GLBSE?
legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
www.bitcointrading.com
October 09, 2012, 07:18:23 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

Have you contacted law enforcement yet to tell them your side of the story?

Not everyone is a whinny baby like you. Grow up.

we're talking about like ~8900 BTC, like $105,000, this is a crime taking place.

If bitcoin securities are illegal because bitcoin is now officially money,

then Nefario has stolen >$100k,

and that is a crime,

and he will go to jail,

I made an appointment with my lawyer today, we'll see what he says.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
October 09, 2012, 07:18:14 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

I see.  I'm afraid I can already guess for myself exactly what that plan is.

What about the possibility of other current copies of the asset ownership database?  Can you comment on whether any may exist, and the possibilities of obtaining such?

ColdHardMetal, can you weigh in here with anything more concrete regarding the user funds?

Its a shared key to decrypt the database.

So what will it take to accomplish that exactly?  Details are everything.
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Look upon me, BitcoinTalk, for I...am...Rarity!
October 09, 2012, 07:16:16 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

Have you contacted law enforcement yet to tell them your side of the story?

Not everyone is a whinny baby like you. Grow up.

It seems like if someone is actually concerned about a rogue officer stealing customer funds (and not concerned with hiding his own role in running an illegal operation) his first step should be to get law enforcement to help.  What is he afraid of?  Why is it your priority to attack people trying to help recover customer funds rather than the people who have scammed?
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
October 09, 2012, 07:13:23 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

It's sounding to me that GLBSE as a pseudocorporate entity of Officers who respect the entity and obey its bylaws is no longer.  That the four (?) of you have discarded any allegiance to the entity and to one another and gone your separate ways.  Is that assessment correct?
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 07:09:16 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

Have you contacted law enforcement yet to tell them your side of the story?

Not everyone is a whinny baby like you. Grow up.
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Look upon me, BitcoinTalk, for I...am...Rarity!
October 09, 2012, 07:04:24 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

Have you contacted law enforcement yet to tell them your side of the story?
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 07:03:19 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

How about releasing all the meeting minutes instead of just bits and pieces.  If it is OK to post parts of the minutes then it is OK to post it all.

Seconded.  Having more solid data available and transparency in general as the process moves forward would go a long way towards fixing this situation in the least painful way possible for all involved.


So is your lack of response on the matter a refusal to release the minutes?
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
October 09, 2012, 07:02:05 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.

I see.  I'm afraid I can already guess for myself exactly what that plan is.

What about the possibility of other current copies of the asset ownership database?  Can you comment on whether any may exist, and the possibilities of obtaining such?

ColdHardMetal, can you weigh in here with anything more concrete regarding the user funds?
administrator
Activity: 5222
Merit: 13032
October 09, 2012, 06:57:27 PM
Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?

I don't know Nefario's plan.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Wat
October 09, 2012, 06:46:30 PM


Nobody is morally required to honor an agreement to break the law.

Quote
Not all laws are moral to support.
I still agree with that exactly as much as the first ten times you tried to plant the strawman there.  

I suppose I'm the only one seeing the contradiction here.

Because you're an illiterate moron, there is no other explanation at this point.   I am talking about moral necessity to honor a private agreement to break the law.  You are talking about the the morality of honoring an unjust law.  The question is not about the morality of the law, but of the morality of the agreement.  

Quote
It's not the "behind the scenes" activity that was illegal here.  The whole site was illegal (and obviously so) from the moment it was founded.  And you failed to report it for over a year.  Far from immediately.  

As soon as I was aware of the activity it was reported.  As is any other illegal activity I see here.  

Quote
Have you also reported all of the gambling threads and sites?  They're all breaking the law every time they accept money from or pay out to anyone on American soil.  

When I can verify laws are broken, I certainly have reported gambling activity.



I hope you reported MPEX and all the other stock exchanges because sure as shit they are no different to glbse.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
October 09, 2012, 06:40:18 PM
It sounds to me like GLBSE has decided to hand the user funds (both what Theymos and Nefario hold) over to ColdHardMetal, who is to (reluctantly) manage their distribution to the claimants.  Is this correct, GLBSE ppl?

I don't think Nefario agreed to send BTC to CHM.

Well, uhh, you know we're dying for more information here, I assume.  Have you any more to offer on what the plan(s) may be?
administrator
Activity: 5222
Merit: 13032
October 09, 2012, 06:31:24 PM
It sounds to me like GLBSE has decided to hand the user funds (both what Theymos and Nefario hold) over to ColdHardMetal, who is to (reluctantly) manage their distribution to the claimants.  Is this correct, GLBSE ppl?

I don't think Nefario agreed to send BTC to CHM.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
October 09, 2012, 06:27:37 PM
At this point, Nefario should make a public statement on the status or start paying out deposit funds REGARDLESS if CHM or Theymos sent him what looks to be 9% of the total funds on deposit. 

He could try and play that game with Goat but this is too far.  If this doesn't happen very soon then we should conclude that either he is keeping them or they have been seized. 

I know people are upset and don't like this answer but in the end, we need to root out all the scammy activities in Bitcoin and this forum if we want to move forward and create an environment where real business interests can prosper.

Nefario also has no reason to not be sending "claim codes" to the asset issuers.  This does not require any bitcoin funds (operational or user) to achieve.  If they are not received in the next few days I am going to assume he has deleting the information.

Indeed.  He seemed to have no problem doing this in a hurry when it came to the whole Goat/TYGRR incident.  Why he isn't doing that now is anyone's guess.

My personal guess is that he is withholding the data as "leverage".

If the GLBSE disaster plan were in place, other parties besides Nef should be able to obtain the database.  I'm going to again guess that the plan is actually not in place (maybe it broke down at some point and was never fixed), and that the only good copy of the database in is Nef's hands.

The motion was:

Code:
[05/10/2012 18:32:35]  I propose a motion to have theymos return the user BTC which has in his posstion for the purpose of allowing me to repay users

So I sent CHM only the amount of BTC designated as user funds. I still hold the operating funds.

How about releasing all the meeting minutes instead of just bits and pieces.  If it is OK to post parts of the minutes then it is OK to post it all.

Seconded.  Having more solid data available and transparency in general as the process moves forward would go a long way towards fixing this situation in the least painful way possible for all involved.

It sounds to me like GLBSE has decided to hand the user funds (both what Theymos and Nefario hold) over to ColdHardMetal, who is to (reluctantly) manage their distribution to the claimants.  Is this correct, GLBSE ppl?
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Look upon me, BitcoinTalk, for I...am...Rarity!
October 09, 2012, 06:14:23 PM


Nobody is morally required to honor an agreement to break the law.

Quote
Not all laws are moral to support.
I still agree with that exactly as much as the first ten times you tried to plant the strawman there.  

I suppose I'm the only one seeing the contradiction here.

Because you're an illiterate moron, there is no other explanation at this point.   I am talking about moral necessity to honor a private agreement to break the law.  You are talking about the the morality of honoring an unjust law.  The question is not about the morality of the law, but of the morality of the agreement.  

Quote
It's not the "behind the scenes" activity that was illegal here.  The whole site was illegal (and obviously so) from the moment it was founded.  And you failed to report it for over a year.  Far from immediately.  

As soon as I was aware of the activity it was reported.  As is any other illegal activity I see here.  

Quote
Have you also reported all of the gambling threads and sites?  They're all breaking the law every time they accept money from or pay out to anyone on American soil.  

When I can verify laws are broken, I certainly have reported gambling activity.

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
October 09, 2012, 05:45:01 PM
At this point, Nefario should make a public statement on the status or start paying out deposit funds REGARDLESS if CHM or Theymos sent him what looks to be 9% of the total funds on deposit. 

He could try and play that game with Goat but this is too far.  If this doesn't happen very soon then we should conclude that either he is keeping them or they have been seized. 

I know people are upset and don't like this answer but in the end, we need to root out all the scammy activities in Bitcoin and this forum if we want to move forward and create an environment where real business interests can prosper.

Nefario also has no reason to not be sending "claim codes" to the asset issuers.  This does not require any bitcoin funds (operational or user) to achieve.  If they are not received in the next few days I am going to assume he has deleting the information.

With the utter silence since the Goat delisting, it is anyone's best guest.  I tried to point out how odd the manner of the Goat delisting was and how at that point you should really think about what it means.  Using language like he was the only "liability" on his exchange was quite telling in my opinion.  That is why I directly tried to have him address these comments.

Yes, there's plenty of evidence all over the forums from which to make an educated guess.  I wouldn't even blink twice over somebody telling me that one of Goat's victims went to the feds and implicated GLBSE in the process.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 05:40:31 PM
At this point, Nefario should make a public statement on the status or start paying out deposit funds REGARDLESS if CHM or Theymos sent him what looks to be 9% of the total funds on deposit.  

He could try and play that game with Goat but this is too far.  If this doesn't happen very soon then we should conclude that either he is keeping them or they have been seized.  

I know people are upset and don't like this answer but in the end, we need to root out all the scammy activities in Bitcoin and this forum if we want to move forward and create an environment where real business interests can prosper.

Nefario also has no reason to not be sending "claim codes" to the asset issuers.  This does not require any bitcoin funds (operational or user) to achieve.  If they are not received in the next few days I am going to assume he has deleting the information.

I'd say I'd guess he doesn't want to give the claim codes or database because he has fake ipo's and was running multiple small ponzi schemes through glbse.

EDIT: I had to change "I'd say" to "I'd guess" because k3t3r would go on a 10 post rant about how I am a liar with no proof and then when I tell him "I'd say" means I am guessing per the definition of the phrase he'd think I was admitting to jumping to my own conclusions without evidence... so just for the record in case k3t3r gets freaked out, I have no evidence of this, these are just my opinions and thoughts.

I uploaded all the history I saved about trades and payments through GLBSE onto dropbox in case people never were able to see the last few moments of GLBSE alive.
legendary
Activity: 1330
Merit: 1026
Mining since 2010 & Hosting since 2012
October 09, 2012, 05:31:27 PM
At this point, Nefario should make a public statement on the status or start paying out deposit funds REGARDLESS if CHM or Theymos sent him what looks to be 9% of the total funds on deposit. 

He could try and play that game with Goat but this is too far.  If this doesn't happen very soon then we should conclude that either he is keeping them or they have been seized. 

I know people are upset and don't like this answer but in the end, we need to root out all the scammy activities in Bitcoin and this forum if we want to move forward and create an environment where real business interests can prosper.

Nefario also has no reason to not be sending "claim codes" to the asset issuers.  This does not require any bitcoin funds (operational or user) to achieve.  If they are not received in the next few days I am going to assume he has deleting the information.

With the utter silence since the Goat delisting, it is anyone's best guest.  I tried to point out how odd the manner of the Goat delisting was and how at that point you should really think about what it means.  Using language like he was the only "liability" on his exchange was quite telling in my opinion.  That is why I directly tried to have him address these comments.
full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
October 09, 2012, 05:16:11 PM

And I call fucking bullshit, Theymos said the funds are "anonymous user funds"  they are not operating expenses and shareholder funds.

My understanding is based upon the most recent email from the secretary.

Quote
The address is: 18bEUAuzWg97swzHXzK4prGGYSBAMCUgz

theymos: If you feel that is a secure address, then send away.

Nefario: Note that this means all of BG's operating funds are in my
hands once they arrive at that address.


So as a review... he said 18bEUAuzWg97swzHXzK4prGGYSBAMCUgz is the paperwallet address, he also said that funds sent to that address would not be given to Nefario, then in the above referenced post he quotes a conversation between Theymos and Nefario that Nefario says the funds are in his hands when they arrive at that address.

Does that work for you?
no, that is not a conversation between nefario an theymos, that is an email sent to both from coldhardmetal with notes to theymos telling him to "send away" and a note to nefario telling him "...means ...funds are in my hands"


Ahhh, this helps in understanding much better.  I was wrong on that.

I can admit when I'm wrong, can you k3t3r?
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