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Topic: rpietila Wall Observer - the Quality TA Thread ;) - page 10. (Read 907212 times)

legendary
Activity: 3892
Merit: 4331
4. You will keep making bigger and bigger blocks, then what?

Profit! As long as computing resources keep growing then bigger blocks do not pose a problem. If we ever reach a point where computing resources, including bandwidth, stop increasing, then it's a good time to stop increasing block sizes.

and how do you determine when to increase?
I am not even adamantly opposed to increase, but doing ONLY increases sounds really amateurish to me.
i wish there is some solution where all kind of methods are merged in (Segwit+block increase+LN+anything else) and you can choose the path of payment (with or without LN).
Besides, mining fees would collapse as well with every doubling (then probably recover).
legendary
Activity: 3878
Merit: 1193
4. You will keep making bigger and bigger blocks, then what?

Profit! As long as computing resources keep growing then bigger blocks do not pose a problem. If we ever reach a point where computing resources, including bandwidth, stop increasing, then it's a good time to stop increasing block sizes.
legendary
Activity: 3892
Merit: 4331
Lightning Network will probably never exist, first of all.

Secondly, yes it is possible to scale through a blocksize increase to VISA-level transactions. The only difference is you would need large servers. But, the technology exists, it is possible, and it would be FAR, FAR cheaper than what VISA or Mastercard are doing.

Stop holding back your own technology. Even if LN does suddenly magically exist 5 years from now, by then it will be TOO LATE. The peoples of this world need a scaling bitcoin, now. And the easiest way to do this is through a blocksize increase, which is in line with Satoshi's original vision. Stop submitting yourself to the brainwashing.

1. to geometrically increase block size and doing nothing else is a kindergarten/elementary school solution, in my opinion.
2. why do we need to do what is the easiest instead of what is more likely to succeed long term.
4. You will keep making bigger and bigger blocks, then what?
5. I don't even care if it is 1mb, 2mb or anything else, but there has to be a rationale behind the scaling, NOT forks all the time.
Hard forks don't work-just look at ethereum. Any contentious hard fork attempt in bitcoin will result in loss of 50-75% total value at the minimum. Maybe this is what you want to achieve?

personally, i don't even care about VISA level transactions for at least 10-20 years.
I care about limited issuance (21mil hard limit) and investability.

1) The two bubbles we've had in the past seven months are plenty bubbly for me.
2) Lightning network is inelegant.

then, what is? ...crickets
sr. member
Activity: 304
Merit: 380
1) The two bubbles we've had in the past seven months are plenty bubbly for me.
2) Lightning network is inelegant.
legendary
Activity: 3696
Merit: 5269
I feel Bitcoin is a crazy strong buy at <800. It is just not going away. What is the downside? Umm.. going to $500 (-38%) and retaining the unexpiring call? What's the upside immediately? $3000 (+275%) and even more in 12 months' time. Just my 2 cents.

+9000!!

With the PBoC wanting to put their boot on BTC every time they detect a 20%+ increase within month, I'm not sure that we'll ever again see the crazy spikes like we did in 2011 and 2013.  They are completely obsessed right now with playing whack-a-mole and squashing any potential bubbles brewing across all of China's securities and commodities markets.

However even with slow steady growth, bitcoin could still potentially double every 2-3 years, and mid to late adopters would still barely notice. Well, until they finally do notice.  Wink
legendary
Activity: 992
Merit: 1000
Lightning Network will probably never exist, first of all.

Secondly, yes it is possible to scale through a blocksize increase to VISA-level transactions. The only difference is you would need large servers. But, the technology exists, it is possible, and it would be FAR, FAR cheaper than what VISA or Mastercard are doing.

Stop holding back your own technology. Even if LN does suddenly magically exist 5 years from now, by then it will be TOO LATE. The peoples of this world need a scaling bitcoin, now. And the easiest way to do this is through a blocksize increase, which is in line with Satoshi's original vision. Stop submitting yourself to the brainwashing.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1252
Bitcoin is unlikely to stay above 1K+ without proper scaling solutions set in place.

Segwit is not a scaling solution.

Bitcoin is poised to benefit in massive ways from the global economic turmoil that is just around the corner.

But will it be sustainable without a blocksize increase or some other solution? No, I don't think so, and then the present scenario will repeat. A rapid rise followed by a rapid drop. People around the world are gonna be really pissed off if they have to pay a $20 fee everytime they need to move or use their bitcoin they just purchased to avoid the collapse of their local currency.

Segwit is part of the solution, so is a blocksize increase.

Increasing the blocksize is useless in the grand scheme of things, you still need segwit and lightning network to get anywhere notable, you can never compete with centralized system like VISA without a secondary protocol.

In any case bitcoin's number 1 strength is being a better gold for now, we'll see about the rest. Let's just hope stupid ass idiots blocking segwit learn already the fact that we need it activated soon.
legendary
Activity: 992
Merit: 1000
Bitcoin is unlikely to stay above 1K+ without proper scaling solutions set in place.

Segwit is not a scaling solution.

Bitcoin is poised to benefit in massive ways from the global economic turmoil that is just around the corner.

But will it be sustainable without a blocksize increase or some other solution? No, I don't think so, and then the present scenario will repeat. A rapid rise followed by a rapid drop. People around the world are gonna be really pissed off if they have to pay a $20 fee everytime they need to move or use their bitcoin they just purchased to avoid the collapse of their local currency.
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 1852
There is not TA that can predict the current crash. You think you have shit figured out, then BOOM you wake up with a price crashing in a damn straight line, this is ridiculous.

I'm concluding that the trick is to not chase the price on the way up and not try to catch falling knives on the way down. Just set your orders at your favorite support and resistance levels and one of your plans will be realized, which implies that you can't never go "all in".

+1.

Never hope. Always set your bid/ask such that you are happy either way.



OR try buying BTC on a dollar-cost-averaging basis.  This is what I try to do.  Buy less as the price goes up, buy more as the price goes down. 

A simple (hypothetical) example would be:

Month 1:  BTC price of $1000, buy BTC0.1, cost = $100
Month 2:  BTC price of $800, buy BTC0.125, cost = $100
Month 3:  BTC price of $1200, buy BTC0.0833, cost = $100

Total purchases over three months: BTC0.30833 with a total cost $300.

It's a pretty reasonable way to buy something as volatile as Bitcoin.
legendary
Activity: 2352
Merit: 1064
Bitcoin is antisemitic
There is not TA that can predict the current crash. You think you have shit figured out, then BOOM you wake up with a price crashing in a damn straight line, this is ridiculous.

I'm concluding that the trick is to not chase the price on the way up and not try to catch falling knives on the way down. Just set your orders at your favorite support and resistance levels and one of your plans will be realized, which implies that you can't never go "all in".
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1252
There is not TA that can predict the current crash. You think you have shit figured out, then BOOM you wake up with a price crashing in a damn straight line, this is ridiculous. A stupid ass chinese rumor crashes the price 100 dollars. You can't predict this and that's why I never day trade. You may make some gains here and there, then you are on the wrong side while a flash crash happens and you lose it all. I wish the marketcap was on the trillions so those price changes wouldn't be as noticeable. Im sick of stupid ass whales and then the people following them panic selling at every chinamen rumor out there.
legendary
Activity: 2282
Merit: 1050
Monero Core Team
...

It depends on how you define inflation. Bitcoin has no inflation if you examine the total supply of bitcoins to be 21 million. The same applies to gold - there is some fixed amount of gold on planet earth assuming no heavenly body will crash on Tellus. The amount will not increase (to make new gold discoveries will not affect the entire gold supply).

This is one of the most common misconceptions about gold. The economic (mined) gold that is traded and treated as a scare resource is about 0.00047% of the surface gold on earth. http://www.westcoastplacer.com/how-much-gold-is-left-on-earth/. There is a lot of gold on earth, it is just very expensive to get at it. There is also gold in the earth's core, gold from nuclear reactions and gold from mining asteroids. A much better model for economic gold is a small inflation rate from an "infinite" source.

To put things into perspective. After many thousands of years of mining gold there is a ~1% annual inflation rate, compare this to Bitcoin where the annual inflation rate falls to below 1% in under 20 years.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
Edit: One of the considerations with setting the tail emission in Monero was to have an inflation rate below that of gold.

I championed for a higher tail emission than the one selected. Gold is a special case as it already exists, and has the multimillennial status. Not that the existing gold is "fairly" acquired by its owners, nor the current mining is "fair" but it nevertheless is the case that gold has its role.

Gold's tail emission is about 1.0% at the moment, given the official figures for gold existing in the world. Most of the gold is mined in the 1900s so the figures can be off for 2 reasons: either most of the ancient gold stocks are unaccounted (this is possible mainly in the scenario that most of what we have been told about human origins is bullshit), OR most of the gold mined has been exported to another dimension by aliens. Despite my tendency to find truth in some of the most fantastic theories, I still subscribe to the official gold stocks figures myself, although wonder where all the gold is stored as it is not in Ft. Gox.

But having a completely non-inflationary currency is unworkable for the reason that the initial supply has to come from somewhere. "No inflation" exactly equals "100% premine", yet the first is taken as a virtue, the latter an abomination.

If it is possible to store real purchasing power (which it may or may not be in practice, since the liquid ways of holding it can be inflated and taxed or economy may contract due to the suppression; the uninflatable things such as land can be rendered illiquid, taxed 100% or more of their annual yield (causing a real net loss for holdings) or simply taken away by force), then any annual inflation has to be smaller than the economic growth in that currency.

Here is wisdom - in that currency basically allows nearly unlimited economic growth, as for an economy of $1 million to grow to the GDP of the world ($100,000 billion), even in the space of one hundred years, corresponds to a brisk 20.2% annual growth. Hence, any inflation below that is essentially a win-win situation for all the old and new holders of the currency, and raises the purchasing power of everyone.

I am afraid Bitcoin and Monero will both be relegated to be legacy currencies because their inflation rate does not scale enough with the realised growth in usership. I am aware that making a trustless software that is able to gauge actual userbase, change the emission rate on the go, and allocate coins to the new users with a non-wasteful mechanism is difficult to make.

The trusted setup for such is already employed in Kansanmarkka.

It depends on how you define inflation. Bitcoin has no inflation if you examine the total supply of bitcoins to be 21 million. The same applies to gold - there is some fixed amount of gold on planet earth assuming no heavenly body will crash on Tellus. The amount will not increase (to make new gold discoveries will not affect the entire gold supply).
legendary
Activity: 1281
Merit: 1000
☑ ♟ ☐ ♚

Vs.


18-02-2011

Good job Risto!
legendary
Activity: 2282
Merit: 1050
Monero Core Team

In order for crypto to become to become "asset class among metals, land, RE, bonds and fiat," it will need to be able to handle transaction volumes, on the main chain.

No it doesn't. The Monero meetup participant you talked to clearly had no clue what he was talking about. Larger blocks (or cheaper transactions) makes Bitcoin less valuable not more.

The largest problem I have with Monero is the tail emission. It's my second favorite crypto (after XBT of course)

I agree on this point on Monero. I would prefer fixed amount of coins and I tried to promote it (and suggested to smoothen the emission curve from quite early). I guess it would also have had a positive impact on the progress of development as the value of Monero would have gone up earlier.
But now I am fine with the emission and most likely Monero will gain some value against bitcoin from the current value but thanks to the tail emission most likely the most extreme valuations are not likely (that doesn't mean Monero will not reach trillions of dollars market cap - even more inflationary currencies have managed to do so).
You mean gold?

Edit: One of the considerations with setting the tail emission in Monero was to have an inflation rate below that of gold.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000

In order for crypto to become to become "asset class among metals, land, RE, bonds and fiat," it will need to be able to handle transaction volumes, on the main chain.

No it doesn't. The Monero meetup participant you talked to clearly had no clue what he was talking about. Larger blocks (or cheaper transactions) makes Bitcoin less valuable not more.

The largest problem I have with Monero is the tail emission. It's my second favorite crypto (after XBT of course)

I agree on this point on Monero. I would prefer fixed amount of coins and I tried to promote it (and suggested to smoothen the emission curve from quite early). I guess it would also have had a positive impact on the progress of development as the value of Monero would have gone up earlier.
But now I am fine with the emission and most likely Monero will gain some value against bitcoin from the current value but thanks to the tail emission most likely the most extreme valuations are not likely (that doesn't mean Monero will not reach trillions of dollars market cap - even more inflationary currencies have managed to do so).
legendary
Activity: 2324
Merit: 1125

In order for crypto to become to become "asset class among metals, land, RE, bonds and fiat," it will need to be able to handle transaction volumes, on the main chain.

No it doesn't. The Monero meetup participant you talked to clearly had no clue what he was talking about. Larger blocks (or cheaper transactions) makes Bitcoin less valuable not more.

The largest problem I have with Monero is the tail emission. It's my second favorite crypto (after XBT of course)
hero member
Activity: 496
Merit: 500
Spanish Bitcoin trader
I don't see the problem with tail emissions in Bitcoin. It will make a difference in dozens of years. Whatever happens in dozens of years is not priced into any asset in this planet. Risk is just too great to bother with it.
legendary
Activity: 2282
Merit: 1050
Monero Core Team
I guess im quite conservative with my 2.5 - 3k prediction Smiley

If crypto ever is to become an asset class among metals, land, RE, bonds and fiat, it will have to be x1000 higher than now.

So we are in front of 3 questions:

In order for crypto to become to become "asset class among metals, land, RE, bonds and fiat," it will need to be able to handle transaction volumes, on the main chain. at least comparable to the un-leveraged or  "monetary base" level of these assets. This will be possible if the current trends of falling real costs of CPU time, bandwidth, digital storage, digital memory etc. continue. I am talking of a continuation of the trends of the last 50 years.

- whether (after 8 years of consecutive ATHs and continuous progress, if it still was a fad...)
No
- how (BTC can keep its position, or something else...)
I doubt very much that Bitcoin will keep its position over the long term since the current Bitcoin protocol is hard coded to not scale the number of transactions per second (blocksize) and the only viable long term blocksize scaling solutions that I am aware of, and are sustainable would be very similar to those of Monero. The trouble with Monero like blocksize scaling solutions in Bitcoin is that they require a tail emission, which would be an unacceptable  change in the Bitcoin social covenant.
- when (how high do we go now, how high next time...)
It is possible that over the short term we may see an increase in the Bitcoin price above the last ATH; however over the long term I remain a bear with respect to Bitcoin because of the long term fundamentals of the blocksize issue. At the recent San Francisco Monero meetup one of the participants commented to me: "The product is transactions".  If one limits the number of transactions per second one in effect is limiting sales. This begs the question would one invest in a company for long term growth that has a hard limit on the gross sales?

I still hold a nominal amount of Bitcoin; however since September 2015; I have replaced the bulk of my Bitcoin holdings with a combination of Monero, Canadian Dollars and US Dollars. This portfolio of Monero, Canadian Dollars and US Dollars has out performed Bitcoin handsomely during this period of time with a significantly lower downside risk.

Edit: The rise of the order of 10^6 in the price of Bitcoin between December 2009 and December 2013 followed by at best a flat market since December 2013 can be explained as Bitcoin's growth until the 1 MB blocks were filled up followed by stagnation since the 1 MB blocks were full. Another way to put this is an increase in the value of a company until the hard gross sales cap was reached.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
^ That explains the Scrooge McDuck outfit Wink

But for once I totally agree with you TC. Actually when you are not speculating but talking about FIRE our financial lifestyles are quite similar it seems. Are you more leaning towards ERE or MMM?

I am not aware of what kind of clothes the young people are wearing these days so that will probably explain my outfit since I am no longer a single.
I am not aware of what MMM means but ERE I am interested indeed. I'd like to just spend my time on studying Talmud, Torah and Zohar instead of working despite I kinda like my work as well. I just consider the search for the ultimate wisdom more important to me.
Indeed I spend very little money, I try to eat as low budget as possible (and that is possible if you do not consume meat).
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