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Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 140. (Read 77398 times)

legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
The US is sneaky. They fight a war with failed economics. They fight it through other countries... this time Ukraine. Russia fights for real, right out in the open. Her strength hasn't been seen until now.


Putin Wins – on All Counts



https://www.lewrockwell.com/2023/06/no_author/putin-wins-on-all-counts/
When the lightning of History strikes, better cut to the chase in our first draft.

Here we go.

After the extraordinary events in Russia during The Longest Day, President Putin wins on all counts.

Among other feats, he has made an absolute, inter-galactic ass of the whole collective West MSM – all over again.

He rallied virtually every Russian to end the Special Military Operation (SMO) – or "almost war" (according to some business circles) quicker.

He – and the FSB – amassed a formidable list of traitors and 5th and 6th columnists, which will be properly dealt with.

And he now enjoys unlimited freedom to deploy de facto Counter-Terrorist Operation (CTO) martial law powers.

As much as Putin helped perennial Lukashenko in August 2020, preventing regime change in Belarus, good ol' Luka prevented Russia from sliding into civil war in June 2023.

A complex wide-ranging counter-terror op is now in effect in Moscow and beyond, while assorted Western sub-zoology specimens are stunned, dazed and confused: wasn't that supposed to be Putin meeting his Czar Nicholas II moment?

A first glance at the chessboard tells us that all the pieces seem to be falling in their right places.

Prighozin gets a golden parachute in Belarus. Shoigu may be about to be sacked, perhaps even Gerasimov (yes, there are deeply dysfunctional layers inside the Ministry of Defense). The Wagner musicians will be incorporated as a regular Army Corps. They may keep doing business in Africa: demand is huge.
...



Cool
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
Wooops... Surovikin seems to have been arrested as being linked to the Wagner march to (near) Moscow.

It's funny how the same z-nut "voyenkors" that just a few days ago were claiming Surovikin will replace Gerasimov now call him a traitor. The pseudo-coup really did a number on putinists, they don't know which lies to believe. Just look at be.open flailing here trying to make it sound like Lukashenko can threaten NATO... by throwing sacks of potatoes over the border wall into Poland I assume.

Meanwhile Putin (allegedly) is hugging people in Dagestan of all places, a bizarre departure from mile-long tables and week-long quarantines. Desperate for PR apparently.

There is quite a bit of fog on Surovikin's location to be honest. My hope was that he took care of the war, as I trust his incompetence even more than the rest of the Psychos.

Anyway, I am here looking at the crystal ball seeing F-16 supporting a stronger attack in a months time, direction wise, could be from Kherson direction, however I dare not suppose that it cannot be in three fronts (Kherson, Zapo an donbas as it seems to be happening now). My personal choice would be Kherson as it is less expected and perhaps less defended.

Re deploying troops near Poland, oh... just give NATO a excuse ... pleeeeease
legendary
Activity: 3654
Merit: 8909
https://bpip.org
Wooops... Surovikin seems to have been arrested as being linked to the Wagner march to (near) Moscow.

It's funny how the same z-nut "voyenkors" that just a few days ago were claiming Surovikin will replace Gerasimov now call him a traitor. The pseudo-coup really did a number on putinists, they don't know which lies to believe. Just look at be.open flailing here trying to make it sound like Lukashenko can threaten NATO... by throwing sacks of potatoes over the border wall into Poland I assume.

Meanwhile Putin (allegedly) is hugging people in Dagestan of all places, a bizarre departure from mile-long tables and week-long quarantines. Desperate for PR apparently.
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
Wooops... Surovikin seems to have been arrested as being linked to the Wagner march to (near) Moscow. Quite interestingly someone has to pay for the shitstorm and this is the choosen one for the purpose. What a shame, he was quite incompetent and would have been the perfect (for Ukraine) general to take charge of the war of aggression in Ukraine.

Curious that when you are the weakest, you need to do this type of stuff.
legendary
Activity: 3318
Merit: 1247
Bitcoin Casino Est. 2013
You are just getting to the ridiculous point of trying for this show to be somehow a "Western" failure?

So... one of your "generals" go rogue, takes a city, stops short of reaching Moscow, Putin flies to lastly having to say at the same time that all his men are pardoned and free to do whatever they want, then you say he is a criminal, but also thank your puppet Luka for giving allowing him to go away without having to hunt and judge the guy...

Is that the Eastern version of "being in control"? Because I am liking more the "Western" one here.

Look, Putin fucked up, "the West" is all right with it, no problem if it was or not known, it is just another RF clownlike failure and "the West" is only concern is having someone that is not nuts having the "button to end the world". Hint: Putin minimally qualifies.
I think that the relocation of Wagner to Belarus in the status of "fugitive rebels" is a very strong move by Russia in the proxy war with the West. Polish President Duda, confirming this idea, recently spoke in the style that "the relocation of Wagner PMC to Belarus is "negative" for Poland." Just imagine how much noise Wagner's unforced redeployment to Belarus would have made shortly after the deployment of tactical nuclear weapons there. And so everything seems to be fine, keep thinking that Putin fucked up. Grin

He absolutely f*cked up.He is happy to have avoided a real civil war as it was extremely near it,nevertheless the Wagner rebellion showed how easy one can take some tanks and enter Russia like there is nothing going on.Just some helicopters who were shot down by Wagner of course could not keep up with them and in fact Wagner has taken Bakhmut while Russian army have failed to do so,so losing a big support of mercenary soldiers will only unfold as a really bad move to Russia in general as they have already lost 1 or two new villages in these last couple of days.

legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
You are just getting to the ridiculous point of trying for this show to be somehow a "Western" failure?

So... one of your "generals" go rogue, takes a city, stops short of reaching Moscow, Putin flies to lastly having to say at the same time that all his men are pardoned and free to do whatever they want, then you say he is a criminal, but also thank your puppet Luka for giving allowing him to go away without having to hunt and judge the guy...

Is that the Eastern version of "being in control"? Because I am liking more the "Western" one here.

Look, Putin fucked up, "the West" is all right with it, no problem if it was or not known, it is just another RF clownlike failure and "the West" is only concern is having someone that is not nuts having the "button to end the world". Hint: Putin minimally qualifies.
I think that the relocation of Wagner to Belarus in the status of "fugitive rebels" is a very strong move by Russia in the proxy war with the West. Polish President Duda, confirming this idea, recently spoke in the style that "the relocation of Wagner PMC to Belarus is "negative" for Poland." Just imagine how much noise Wagner's unforced redeployment to Belarus would have made shortly after the deployment of tactical nuclear weapons there. And so everything seems to be fine, keep thinking that Putin fucked up. Grin

Tactical nukes in Belarus are not of more concern than the ones in Karelia. Relocating Wagner could have been done anyway without any of this. Putin did crap it by:

- Not being able to settle peacefully, quietly and quickly an internal dispute.
- Making it clear that his control is thin as a feather and his leadership as light.
- Actually sending quite good troops to a non-critical area hen they are most needed in the front.

So... yes, he did fuck up.
copper member
Activity: 2254
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White Russian
You are just getting to the ridiculous point of trying for this show to be somehow a "Western" failure?

So... one of your "generals" go rogue, takes a city, stops short of reaching Moscow, Putin flies to lastly having to say at the same time that all his men are pardoned and free to do whatever they want, then you say he is a criminal, but also thank your puppet Luka for giving allowing him to go away without having to hunt and judge the guy...

Is that the Eastern version of "being in control"? Because I am liking more the "Western" one here.

Look, Putin fucked up, "the West" is all right with it, no problem if it was or not known, it is just another RF clownlike failure and "the West" is only concern is having someone that is not nuts having the "button to end the world". Hint: Putin minimally qualifies.
I think that the relocation of Wagner to Belarus in the status of "fugitive rebels" is a very strong move by Russia in the proxy war with the West. Polish President Duda, confirming this idea, recently spoke in the style that "the relocation of Wagner PMC to Belarus is "negative" for Poland." Just imagine how much noise Wagner's unforced redeployment to Belarus would have made shortly after the deployment of tactical nuclear weapons there. And so everything seems to be fine, keep thinking that Putin fucked up. Grin
legendary
Activity: 2814
Merit: 1192
Some little advice for some poorly fed troll, Kyiv was conquered in under 3 hours, the Russian army destroyed 3 times all of the NATO, Commonwealth, Black Hole , Cardassian Order , Earth Sphere Federation , Gungan, The Host of the West and Rasalhague Kungsarmé armies, Fulda Gap was overrun in 3 weeks, Portugal was conquered 3 months into the camping and now I hear those damn rashist led by Potemkin are just 200 miles from Moscow!
No clue how to read damn fucking map but this would mean Spokane went from lilac to commie red, so how much till we go full Red Dawn?


It was the Obsidian Order, from the Cardassian Union, but I appreciate the reference.

It was fun while it lasted. I laughed when Putin said that it was a coup and a treachery. I thought it was a special Wagner operation.
In the end Putin said mercenaries can do what they want, they can join the army or go to Belarus, or go home if they want, but he hopes they'll choose to serve the country.
He wants people who wanted his head, traitors, to go home, or join the army... Scared old Vlad...
member
Activity: 80
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Some little advice for some poorly fed troll, Kyiv was conquered in under 3 hours, the Russian army destroyed 3 times all of the NATO, Commonwealth, Black Hole , Cardassian Order , Earth Sphere Federation , Gungan, The Host of the West and Rasalhague Kungsarmé armies, Fulda Gap was overrun in 3 weeks, Portugal was conquered 3 months into the camping and now I hear those damn rashist led by Potemkin are just 200 miles from Moscow!
No clue how to read damn fucking map but this would mean Spokane went from lilac to commie red, so how much till we go full Red Dawn?
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
I watched Putin’s speech this morning and am surprised with the Wagner mutiny situation. I did not see that coming. I wonder if anyone did. It seems like this war has gone far better than expected for Ukraine. More recently though it appears that this situation may end peacefully for Russia with Wagner reportedly no longer moving towards Moscow, which may swing the war back in their favor.

It is only natural and that coincided with advance of Ukrainian troops in territories that were since 2014 under Donetsk People Republic command.The coup I find it very stupid from Prigozhin to not continue it as he found Moscow government totally unprepared for such offensive,it shows how weak is Russia and how easily tanks can enter their territory if they want and this is of course really bad for Putin regime,anyone now who want to try his luck against Kremlin can do so as the Kremlin not punishing Prigozhin put a really dangerous precedent.

Because taking Moscow with 25.000 mercenaries gets you killed and would not change in any case the government, since the rest of the army and many other critical support that are needed to keep power (e.g. GRU) are not with you.

While the army may be busy in Ukraine, they would still most likely be loyal to Putin. This was never about taking power, it was about getting the paycheck and avoiding the effective dissolution of Wagner into the kleptokrat's black-hole that is the general RF army.
legendary
Activity: 3318
Merit: 1247
Bitcoin Casino Est. 2013
I watched Putin’s speech this morning and am surprised with the Wagner mutiny situation. I did not see that coming. I wonder if anyone did. It seems like this war has gone far better than expected for Ukraine. More recently though it appears that this situation may end peacefully for Russia with Wagner reportedly no longer moving towards Moscow, which may swing the war back in their favor.

It is only natural and that coincided with advance of Ukrainian troops in territories that were since 2014 under Donetsk People Republic command.The coup I find it very stupid from Prigozhin to not continue it as he found Moscow government totally unprepared for such offensive,it shows how weak is Russia and how easily tanks can enter their territory if they want and this is of course really bad for Putin regime,anyone now who want to try his luck against Kremlin can do so as the Kremlin not punishing Prigozhin put a really dangerous precedent.
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture?  
I'm just expressing my opinion. There was no loss of control over the headquarters in Rostov, these are your empty fantasies, which are not confirmed by any significant changes in the front line during the "mutiny". I think that this was a psychological operation to identify a high-ranking mole in the Russian General Staff, which was successfully carried out by the Wagner group. This will not lead to a weakening of the Russian army, but rather the opposite. But let's not make hasty conclusions, but wait for official announcements about personnel changes. I think not only the identified mole will fall under the personnel purge, but also a number of "parquet" generals who are quite loyal to Putin, for their incompetence.

1. Destroyed about 20 military pilots, 1 plane 4 helicopters Smiley
2. Power fled from Moscow
3. There was no resistance. It is confirmed that one part of it went to the side of the PMC.
4. PMC in Rostov and Voronezh greeted as liberators.
5. Seizure of the headquarters of the Southern Military District is officially confirmed.
6. Yesterday, the president called them traitors, traitors, state criminals, and today - they are all acquitted, no cases, no investigations!


What "moles? This is a very pathetic and ridiculous attempt to make up a "serious story" Smiley
Do you know what was the funniest thing for me in this serious story, which in a few words can be called "a tank stuck at the circus gate"? This is a panic in the West with the emergency activation of the Cobra plan, because none of the Western intelligence agencies could foresee that this would happen. Of course, in hindsight, it seems the CIA said that it was aware, but did not tell anyone, but this is bullshit, because if the CIA knew, then of course it would have warned Ukraine and it would have taken advantage of the moment more successfully, and not looked as if spellbound at what was happening in a static the role of the spectator.

For the Western intelligence services, this is a disaster, because the Western mentality understands the phrase "control the situation" in a peculiar way. For them, this means not having a direct hand on the control panel, but simply being aware of what is happening. And this almost manic desire to "be aware of what is happening" last Saturday failed.

You are just getting to the ridiculous point of trying for this show to be somehow a "Western" failure?

So... one of your "generals" go rogue, takes a city, stops short of reaching Moscow, Putin flies to lastly having to say at the same time that all his men are pardoned and free to do whatever they want, then you say he is a criminal, but also thank your puppet Luka for giving allowing him to go away without having to hunt and judge the guy...

Is that the Eastern version of "being in control"? Because I am liking more the "Western" one here.

Look, Putin fucked up, "the West" is all right with it, no problem if it was or not known, it is just another RF clownlike failure and "the West" is only concern is having someone that is not nuts having the "button to end the world". Hint: Putin minimally qualifies.

legendary
Activity: 4760
Merit: 1283
This is like your "biolabs" posts. Can you provide any example of any hospital of a reasonable size that does not have a "biolab"?

Oh, that ultra-clever trick again:  Clip the words I actually used and make up different ones.  Bravo on your technique...and shame on anyone who falls for such things.

He just regurgitates what he 'reads' on BitChute videos thrown together by conspiracy clickbaitists, to him that is academic journalism. I doubt he even understands what he is saying half the time.

I doubt you understand almost any of it almost ever, but I did stipulated that the post I was simply providing a link to something that semi-serious analysts with a reasonable enough background in the material might find interesting.  The article itself contained a series of observations and conjectures.  Competent parties who are interested can match them against their own and/or follow up on some of the suggestions to further verify.  I myself made some observations about activities in the ZNPP _very_ early on in the SMO, but information on this topic has been being highly censored by all sides.  I 'read' the article via a stream only because it is (or was) printed only in Hungarian and I don't read that language.

I'll post more information about what 'non-lethal biological weapons research' entails at a later date and on a different thread.  Suffice it to say, many 'public health clinics' out in the middle of nowhere are 'biolabs'.  If they are funded (from half way around the world) by USAID and other 'non-profit' NGOs, and through DTRA grants, and that sort of thing, it is highly likely that they are a piece of the puzzle.  It's also worth note that in most cases, not a single employee who set foot in the door of such a clinic has the foggiest clue about what they are involved in or what their role is.

Edit:  This just popped up at the top of BitChute.  And no, I had nothing to do with it.  It's about the Bulgarian reporter's work which I mentioned a few posts back.

  BOMBSHELL DOCUMENTARY FROM 2018 EXPOSES THE U.S. BIOLABS IN UKRAINE
  https://www.bitchute.com/video/EqYl6Pr5nlHL/


legendary
Activity: 2436
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Do not die for Putin
The Ukrainian advances seem to be getting more serious, without yet being a breakthrough. It is likely that the "first line" of defence (wrong name, the first line is the front) will be reached in two weeks. The task is not easy, but everyday it seems more clear that the RF cannot defend all the front at the same time despite having still many troops deployed.  

On Wagner going here and there... it would be funny if it were not for Russia having nukes.

...

70t military grade enriched material accumulated by Ukraine & sponsors at Zaporozhye Nuclear plant

...


Without even going into the veracity of this and given your "expertise" in the mater, could you point out ANY active nuclear energy central anywhere that does not keep highly radioactive materials that could potentially have dual use?

This is like your "biolabs" posts. Can you provide any example of any hospital of a reasonable size that does not have a "biolab"?
legendary
Activity: 4760
Merit: 1283
Quite an interesting 'read' about the ZNPP details.  On-par (in terms of interest to higher functioning analysts) with the Bulgarian journalist who did the work on the 'American' bio-weapons labs in Georgia.

  70t military grade enriched material accumulated by Ukraine & sponsors at Zaporozhye Nuclear plant
  https://www.bitchute.com/video/vTm7gZ6EvE77/

I have zero reason to doubt that stuff like this was going on, and very little reason to believe that such things (nukes, biological warfare agents, etc) have not migrated out of nation-state containment and into the 'private sector'.

Putin almost certainly would have brought $250,000,000,000 (quarter trillion) worth of SMO booty, once belonging to Larry Fink, home immediately.  He seems to be signaling 'Wanna try a tactical nuclear WW-III?  OK.  We can do that too if you insist.'

copper member
Activity: 2254
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White Russian
Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture?  
I'm just expressing my opinion. There was no loss of control over the headquarters in Rostov, these are your empty fantasies, which are not confirmed by any significant changes in the front line during the "mutiny". I think that this was a psychological operation to identify a high-ranking mole in the Russian General Staff, which was successfully carried out by the Wagner group. This will not lead to a weakening of the Russian army, but rather the opposite. But let's not make hasty conclusions, but wait for official announcements about personnel changes. I think not only the identified mole will fall under the personnel purge, but also a number of "parquet" generals who are quite loyal to Putin, for their incompetence.

1. Destroyed about 20 military pilots, 1 plane 4 helicopters Smiley
2. Power fled from Moscow
3. There was no resistance. It is confirmed that one part of it went to the side of the PMC.
4. PMC in Rostov and Voronezh greeted as liberators.
5. Seizure of the headquarters of the Southern Military District is officially confirmed.
6. Yesterday, the president called them traitors, traitors, state criminals, and today - they are all acquitted, no cases, no investigations!


What "moles? This is a very pathetic and ridiculous attempt to make up a "serious story" Smiley
Do you know what was the funniest thing for me in this serious story, which in a few words can be called "a tank stuck at the circus gate"? This is a panic in the West with the emergency activation of the Cobra plan, because none of the Western intelligence agencies could foresee that this would happen. Of course, in hindsight, it seems the CIA said that it was aware, but did not tell anyone, but this is bullshit, because if the CIA knew, then of course it would have warned Ukraine and it would have taken advantage of the moment more successfully, and not looked as if spellbound at what was happening in a static the role of the spectator.

For the Western intelligence services, this is a disaster, because the Western mentality understands the phrase "control the situation" in a peculiar way. For them, this means not having a direct hand on the control panel, but simply being aware of what is happening. And this almost manic desire to "be aware of what is happening" last Saturday failed.
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1634
Do not die for Putin
Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture?  
I'm just expressing my opinion. There was no loss of control over the headquarters in Rostov, these are your empty fantasies, which are not confirmed by any significant changes in the front line during the "mutiny". I think that this was a psychological operation to identify a high-ranking mole in the Russian General Staff, which was successfully carried out by the Wagner group. This will not lead to a weakening of the Russian army, but rather the opposite. But let's not make hasty conclusions, but wait for official announcements about personnel changes. I think not only the identified mole will fall under the personnel purge, but also a number of "parquet" generals who are quite loyal to Putin, for their incompetence.

1. Destroyed about 20 military pilots, 1 plane 4 helicopters Smiley
2. Power fled from Moscow
3. There was no resistance. It is confirmed that one part of it went to the side of the PMC.
4. PMC in Rostov and Voronezh greeted as liberators.
5. Seizure of the headquarters of the Southern Military District is officially confirmed.
6. Yesterday, the president called them traitors, traitors, state criminals, and today - they are all acquitted, no cases, no investigations!


What "moles? This is a very pathetic and ridiculous attempt to make up a "serious story" Smiley

be.open is right, the mole has been identified. In fact the success has been so great that around 250.000 moles have been identified (pretty much every single RF soldier and officer).

Meanwhile Wagner got his pay, seems like there are good news for Ukraine. Surovikin will be commanding  Grin

On the terrain gains, sorry to dissapoint but there have been gains in the form of small advances. Most interestingly, there seems to be a small bridge head in the Antonov bridge east side. Ukraine could potentially drive another vector of attack from Kherson. Sounds like Belgium to me.
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1864
Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture?  
I'm just expressing my opinion. There was no loss of control over the headquarters in Rostov, these are your empty fantasies, which are not confirmed by any significant changes in the front line during the "mutiny". I think that this was a psychological operation to identify a high-ranking mole in the Russian General Staff, which was successfully carried out by the Wagner group. This will not lead to a weakening of the Russian army, but rather the opposite. But let's not make hasty conclusions, but wait for official announcements about personnel changes. I think not only the identified mole will fall under the personnel purge, but also a number of "parquet" generals who are quite loyal to Putin, for their incompetence.

1. Destroyed about 20 military pilots, 1 plane 4 helicopters Smiley
2. Power fled from Moscow
3. There was no resistance. It is confirmed that one part of it went to the side of the PMC.
4. PMC in Rostov and Voronezh greeted as liberators.
5. Seizure of the headquarters of the Southern Military District is officially confirmed.
6. Yesterday, the president called them traitors, traitors, state criminals, and today - they are all acquitted, no cases, no investigations!


What "moles? This is a very pathetic and ridiculous attempt to make up a "serious story" Smiley
copper member
Activity: 2254
Merit: 915
White Russian
Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture?  
I'm just expressing my opinion. There was no loss of control over the headquarters in Rostov, these are your empty fantasies, which are not confirmed by any significant changes in the front line during the "mutiny". I think that this was a psychological operation to identify a high-ranking mole in the Russian General Staff, which was successfully carried out by the Wagner group. This will not lead to a weakening of the Russian army, but rather the opposite. But let's not make hasty conclusions, but wait for official announcements about personnel changes. I think not only the identified mole will fall under the personnel purge, but also a number of "parquet" generals who are quite loyal to Putin, for their incompetence.
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Military experts from the Institute for the Study of War are vainly minding not their own business
Their business is literally analyzing armed conflicts around the world.  It's why they are called The Institute for the Study of War.

Prigozhin never even verbally criticized Putin, in Russia it is somehow not customary to bite the hand that feeds you. The mercenaries of the Wagner group either have a pro-Putin position, or are completely apolitical, more loyal to Putin than Wagner, only bodyguards from his personal guard. This is the only reason why Wagner could exist at all for so long, being outside the legal field (mercenarism in Russia is a criminal offense, Article 359 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).

ps By Wagner, I mean the main core of the Wagner group, not including the former prisoners who temporarily joined it, recruited on six-month contracts specifically for the assault on Bakhmut.

Are you really trying to make the argument that Putin had Prigozhin pretend to stage an attempted insurrection that resulted in Russia losing control of it's military headquarters closest to the front line, have images of Russian helicopters exploding and highways being dug up to slow down the tanks rolling towards Moscow, was all part of Putins plan?  Have you considered what he promised in his speech Saturday morning, compared to what actually happened, and the fact he hasn't been seen since?

You think this is the kind of scenario that Putin would manufacture? 

Quote
Revolt Raises Searing Question: Could Putin Lose Power?
Russians with ties to the Kremlin expressed relief on Sunday that Mr. Prigozhin’s uprising did not spark a civil war. But at the same time, they agreed that Mr. Putin had come off looking weak in a way that could be lasting.

Konstantin Remchukov, a Moscow newspaper editor with Kremlin connections, said in a telephone interview that what once had seemed unthinkable was now possible: that people close to Mr. Putin could seek to persuade him not to stand for re-election in Russia’s presidential vote next spring. With Saturday’s events, he said, Mr. Putin had conclusively lost his status as the guarantor of the elite’s wealth and security.

The idea that “Putin is in power and provides stability and guarantees security — it suffered a fiasco on the 24th,” Mr. Remchukov said. “If I was sure a month ago that Putin would run unconditionally because it was his right, now I see that the elites can no longer feel unconditionally secure.”

“Stability” was the Kremlin’s refrain amid the 2020 referendum that cleared the way for Mr. Putin to serve two additional terms, until 2036. And it is the security of the Russian state that Mr. Putin describes as his guiding motivation for invading Ukraine.

Even amid the 16-month-old war in Ukraine, the Kremlin has been focused on normalcy at home. Mr. Putin has resisted hard-line calls to declare martial law or to close the country’s borders. For the elite, the sting of Western sanctions has been compensated by the new business opportunities of Russia’s wartime economy and a domestic market suddenly free of competition from many Western businesses.

But Mr. Prigozhin’s challenge to the Kremlin’s authority this weekend upended that calculus. The leader of the Wagner paramilitary group, Mr. Prigozhin had his forces seize a Russian military headquarters in the south, then sent a column of troops north toward Moscow, vowing to enter the capital. The crisis was defused late Saturday, when Mr. Prigozhin agreed to pull back his forces in a deal that allowed him and his troops to avoid prosecution.

The immediate threat was averted. But in the process, Mr. Putin lost more than his reputation for providing stability: The fact that Mr. Prigozhin and his forces were not being punished punctured Mr. Putin’s reputation as a decisive leader who would not tolerate disloyalty.

That impression was compounded by reports from Russian military bloggers that Prigozhin forces had shot down Russian combat aircraft. Mr. Putin also called Mr. Prigozhin a traitor after he launched his insurrection — and after the mercenary chieftain questioned Mr. Putin’s very rationale for the war in Ukraine. Those transgressions seemed to melt away with the deal that ended the crisis.

Experts said this made Mr. Putin look less in control of the Russian state than previously known. And foreign adversaries were quick to seize on that theme.

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