Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 137. (Read 73667 times)

To destroy the hypersonic Dagger, the Patriot launcher doesn't even have to do anything, just stand still. But there is a nuance here, this trick only works once, to destroy the next Dagger they need a new Patriot launcher. The method is expensive, but very effective.

This is a clear example of the lies of Ukraine. Russia usually launches missiles and drones at night, but when some important person arrives in Kyiv, it is mandatory to set off an air raid alert to demonstrate to the distinguished guest all the horrors of war. Little lying asshole, tell me how you shot down six Calibers and six Daggers again.

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If thats how they destroy your hypersonic missiles, I guess you have nothing to worry about...imaginary kills of imaginary rockets

Curiously, the scale of this lie is much larger. The reports of the Ukrainian side were replicated by the Reuters agency, and even after a refutation by a member of the African delegation, Zelensky continued to assert about Russian missile strikes, accusing Putin of inadequacy and loss of control over the Russian army. It would be funny if it weren't so sad. They come up with a ridiculous story and begin to believe in it themselves with all their might.

lets see what African delegation says about your lies and propaganda

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/51048

Well when you are over optimistic it is normal to write these things,by the way how do you welcome African delegation who tomorrow will be in Russia with Kalibr 47 missiles who luckily got all shot down by Patriot air defense systems?
You have a strange way of welcoming guests there in Russia and for me this is enough to never set foot there even when the regime of Putin will be changed and there will be again the normal Russia running business as usual.

As for Biden don't worry he has over 75% support for supporting Ukraine for as long as it takes as Ukraine is fighting for democracy against autocratic regime that Putin has put Russia in these last couple of years.

I don't know where you're getting these numbers from. First you claimed that between 100 or 200 F-16s would not change anything for Ukraine, now you say they had more of their own jets before the war...

Ukraine had around 100 fighter jets total before the war (of various types) which included less than 70 MiG-29, so getting even 100 F-16s would be a greater firepower than they ever had in store.

Especially the ones that had a Russian bomb dropped on their city by mistake, or those who are in fear of getting drafted, or those whose family members were drafted and sent to Ukraine...
Don't forget about the families of those who died. Maybe they don't care because they got a Lada, or the government officials paid their respects by baking them a cake.
I'm guessing you can sleep well because you don't live in or near Belgorod, or in Kursk where those warehouses blew up.

I don't understand the reasons for this massive admiration of Ukrainians for Western weapons, it looks like a cargo cult. The F16 fighters are an approximate analogue of the MiG-29 fighters, of which Ukraine had noticeably more than the wildest expectations for the supply of F16, and most of them have already been spent.

LOL what? The special operation in Ukraine does not interfere with the ordinary Russian at all. People here live as usual and do not wake up every night from air raid alerts. I think the majority of the townsfolk, with the possible exception of residents of the Crimea, Belgorod and Kursk regions, just do not follow the events in Ukraine too much. Almost a year and a half is too long to focus on one topic. But on the other hand, the overwhelming majority understand that the defeat of Russia will turn into a catastrophe and only await victory.

Tnx. Biden is no stranger to humiliating military defeats. Let me remind you that his presidency began with a crushing fiasco in Afghanistan, and he came to power precisely on promises to withdraw troops from there and end the conflict. Although the Doha peace agreement with the Taliban was signed by Trump, who also wanted to play this card in his election campaign. Thus, both candidates in their election campaign sought to use the powerful trump card of a peaceful settlement of the protracted Afghan conflict, which they inherited from the Obama administration. I think the topic of a peaceful settlement of the Ukrainian conflict will also become a similar trump card in the 2024 election campaign for both Trump and Biden, and it doesn’t matter who plans to participate in this political show. Society loves victory and dislikes defeat, but even more society does not like protracted military conflicts with murky goals at the expense of taxpayers.

I think even after the crushing victory of Russia, the media in the USA will convincingly explain to ordinary Americans why this is a victory, not a defeat - some Russians (from Russia) killed other Russians (from Ukraine) and this is a good waste of American money. And damn it's hard to argue with that, given that most ordinary Americans can't seem to find Ukraine on the world map.

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I think even after the crushing victory of Russia, the media in the USA will convincingly explain to ordinary Americans why this is a victory, not a defeat - some Russians (from Russia) killed other Russians (from Ukraine) and this is a good waste of American money. And damn it's hard to argue with that, given that most ordinary Americans can't seem to find Ukraine on the world map.

Well when you are over optimistic it is normal to write these things,by the way how do you welcome African delegation who tomorrow will be in Russia with Kalibr 47 missiles who luckily got all shot down by Patriot air defense systems?
You have a strange way of welcoming guests there in Russia and for me this is enough to never set foot there even when the regime of Putin will be changed and there will be again the normal Russia running business as usual.

Strangely, we didn't hear the sirens or explosions. #AfricanPeaceMission program is proceeding as planned.

And we didn't hear any explosions. Instead, we saw people going on about their day leisurely. Everything seems normal from what we have experienced thus far.

Tnx. Biden is no stranger to humiliating military defeats. Let me remind you that his presidency began with a crushing fiasco in Afghanistan, and he came to power precisely on promises to withdraw troops from there and end the conflict. Although the Doha peace agreement with the Taliban was signed by Trump, who also wanted to play this card in his election campaign. Thus, both candidates in their election campaign sought to use the powerful trump card of a peaceful settlement of the protracted Afghan conflict, which they inherited from the Obama administration. I think the topic of a peaceful settlement of the Ukrainian conflict will also become a similar trump card in the 2024 election campaign for both Trump and Biden, and it doesn’t matter who plans to participate in this political show. Society loves victory and dislikes defeat, but even more society does not like protracted military conflicts with murky goals at the expense of taxpayers.

I think even after the crushing victory of Russia, the media in the USA will convincingly explain to ordinary Americans why this is a victory, not a defeat - some Russians (from Russia) killed other Russians (from Ukraine) and this is a good waste of American money. And damn it's hard to argue with that, given that most ordinary Americans can't seem to find Ukraine on the world map.

Nice tale. It is much more unprofitable to finish the conflict without a victory. US not liking war loosers when paying big tax for having the biggest and possibly the best military at least in terms of capability.

But there is a clear risk of the Republicans wanting to false-end this conflict a then having to pay again the price of a cold war during the next decade. It would be pretty much in the line of the international gaffes of Trump (like fucking the pacific trade agreement, fucking the Iran non-proliferation deal, leaving top-secrets in the hallway...). But de Santis or others are unlikely to know much better either.

However, if they make the White House, they would have access to the information and perhaps see things differently, who knows. IMO Trump is pretty much a Russian agent.

I think that there are good chances for the conflict to end in 2023, perhaps in the fall or towards the end of the year, maybe at the beginning of 2024. Because in January next year the active phase of the US election campaign will begin, and it is extremely unprofitable for Biden to reach the finish line of the election campaign racing with the unfinished conflict in Ukraine. And by and large, it doesn’t matter to him whether Ukraine wins or not, even the loss of Ukraine is better than the continuation of the conflict before the elections. Why am I talking about the United States - because without the active support of the United States, the ability of Ukraine to continue to conduct active hostilities will be calculated in a couple of months, if not a couple of days.

Of course, Ukraine will not accept its defeat and will continue to resist in a guerrilla-terrorist format, but this is no longer a task for the regular army, but for special services and law enforcement agencies.

I think that there are good chances for the conflict to end in 2023, perhaps in the fall or towards the end of the year, maybe at the beginning of 2024. Because in January next year the active phase of the US election campaign will begin, and it is extremely unprofitable for Biden to reach the finish line of the election campaign racing with the unfinished conflict in Ukraine. And by and large, it doesn’t matter to him whether Ukraine wins or not, even the loss of Ukraine is better than the continuation of the conflict before the elections. Why am I talking about the United States - because without the active support of the United States, the ability of Ukraine to continue to conduct active hostilities will be calculated in a couple of months, if not a couple of days.

Of course, Ukraine will not accept its defeat and will continue to resist in a guerrilla-terrorist format, but this is no longer a task for the regular army, but for special services and law enforcement agencies.

Thank you for your reply and it is helpful to know the viewpoint from both sides of the issue.I hope some agreement can be reached soon because with both parties not willing to compromise on their own terms for an agreement it looks unlikely there will be peace in the very near future.It is worrying for global citizenry who have no say whatsoever in the decisions their politicans make when those politicans seem to be detached form reality and only follow rhetoric in many instances.War is bad for everyone and the casualties are are mainly those who have no say in the matter.It is not a terrible grief to see those who enjoy combat and warfare to fall on the battlefield but a very sad affair to see conscripted citizens from both sides be forced into a bloodbath not to mention all the civilians and infrastructure,wildlife,environment and habitat caught up in this abomination.

Personally, I do not see any big and fundamental difference between the supply of military equipment and intelligence by NATO countries and the direct deployment of troops. Trying to distance yourself from participating in the conflict is laughable if your reconnaissance drone is coordinating your maritime drones and they are attacking a Russian warship in the Black Sea. The only difference between a NATO-Russia proxy conflict and a direct NATO-Russia conflict is that instead of NATO soldiers, Ukrainian soldiers are dying.

It is surprising to me why at least 10% of all NATO military assistance to Ukraine does not go in the form of direct targeted cash assistance to finance the Foreign Legion operating on the side of Ukraine. With better funding, which Ukraine obviously cannot afford, instead of the current 10-15 thousand bayonets, there could be 100-150 thousand of them and this would be a much more serious force.

Yep. The potential for non-nuclear escalation in the supply of arms is almost exhausted, even the supply of a hundred or two F16 fighters, which Ukraine so dreams of, will not noticeably change the current balance of power and it is not in favor of Ukraine. Then either peace talks on Russia's terms, or the entry of a NATO peacekeeping contingent with its subsequent defeat, or an exchange of nuclear strikes between the US, UK and Russia, I think everyone will get it. But let's not get too ahead of ourselves, Ukraine still has a chance to prove itself in the counteroffensive.

Looks like the 'greatest counter-offensive' has become the 'most humiliating counter-offensive'.  In most places what's left of the Ukrainians didn't get through the forward lines and not even close to the actual defensive belts.  And they lost another huge crop of soldiers and a bunch of the Western weapons to boot.  Thankfully the DU contamination of the farmlands will be more contained to a relatively narrow strip.

The Russians set a lot of traps some of which got tripped as I've come to expect, and the effects were impressive.  Have the Russians done the same amongst the more fortified defensive belts farther back?  I would expect so.  I would expect that Russia would fall back to the first defensive belt for no other reason than to not let the work on their various traps go to waste.  At least if they are confident that they can mostly pick off the NATO systems which are spreading DU contamination early.

Seems like it is effective technique to send high ranking generals, including Grasimov himself, to the operational areas.  Working with the higher level staff is a good way for the more junior officers to get noticed so I'm guessing that everyone is really trying as hard as they can.  Plus it has a good effect on morale of the whole military.  The down-side is that one can get killed as happened to a high ranking general recently.

I am highly confident that if I were a conscripted Ukrainian I would immediately recognize that the cause of my grief was a flood of NATO gear and I would be at least passively trying to get rid of the 30% or so which got through the corruption and on to the front lines.  I sometimes get the feeling like that may be what we are seeing at the present time.

Also we are seeing more mass surrenders which is also a good sign and long overdue.  We saw it early on, then not so much for a year or so.  I don't have a real strong hypothesis about why, but a few include:  1) Even when the Nazi's had free reign before the SMO, there were serving soldiers who were dis-satisfied.  They left the ranks, and 2) the ZioNazi SS commissars and so-called 'nationalists' upped their game and became even more brutal.  Although I've not heard of it, I would expect that they are exacting retribution against the family members of POW's back home since that a common tactic of these classes of scumbags.

More and more Ukraine's options shrink until pure terrorism is the only option left to them.  We'll just have to see how far NATO can push them in this direction.  Alas, it could be quite a ways farther since they have broad support in such methods from the entire 'Collective West' not the least of which being the financial and media power-houses.