Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 285. (Read 78223 times)

Are you aware of what it means to be accepted into the EU? It immediately triggers a number of large aid packages for any region that is below the average wealth, income or employment. I am no fool, this comes with strings attached, but it would be in Ukraine's hands to make good use of these resources and become a marvellous place in the next decade with growth and thriving cultural life.

I recommend you to read this web page (it is shorter and TBH less expensive than the book you mention)

https://ec.europa.eu/info/research-and-innovation/funding/funding-opportunities/funding-programmes-and-open-calls_en


Do you wonder why Ukraine would rather show the middle finger to Adolf Putin now?

But, particularly, since Adolf Putin is making such an effort on getting RF assets (and his own) frozen, there may be extra support on the ground of "war reparations"... why not? It is not like if Europe is going to ask the RF any favours in the future IMHO.

Yup, west will "help" them as much as it "helped" Kurds, Libyans, Syrians, etc...there's no chance that
they ever see any of those money
I suggest you to read this book:
https://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Economic-Hit-John-Perkins/dp/0452287081

Horizon Europe
Health Programme
Cohesion Fund
Environment and climate action (LIFE)
European Regional Development Fund (ERDF)
Structural Reform Support Programme (SRSP)
European Structural and Investment Funds (ESIF)
Research Fund for Coal and Steel (RFCS)

Since there is no credible evidence for this even though they have already a ton of opportunities, it's pretty clearly a 'plan' that originates in your own fever-dream mind mostly.  With help from psychological operations targeting your caliber of person of course.

Actually I kind of doubt that even you really believe very much of the BS you've been spouting, but whether or not it's not of much consequence.

Russia is responsible for inciting genocide and perpetrating atrocities that show an “intent to destroy” the Ukrainian people, a new legal analysis signed by more than 30 independent experts concluded.

The report, published Friday by the Washington-based New Lines Institute for Strategy and Policy and the Montreal-based Raoul Wallenberg Centre for Human Rights, also concludes that there is “serious risk of genocide in Ukraine,” and that states have a legal obligation to prevent genocide from occurring.

It cited denials from high-level Russian officials and state media commentators of the existence of a distinct Ukrainian identity, and dehumanizing claims that Ukrainians are Nazis and “are therefore deserving of punishment.” The report also points to Russian authorities’ rewarding soldiers suspected of mass killings in Ukraine, among other evidence.

“The purveyors of incitement propaganda are all highly influential political, religious and State-run media figures, including President Putin,” the report says. “There is mounting evidence that Russian soldiers have internalized and are responding to the State propaganda campaign by echoing its content while committing atrocities.”

Genocide, often seen as the ultimate crime, has a precise legal definition: “acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group.”

The joint report Friday included input from about three dozen experts on genocide and international law, including several former ambassadors and others who were involved in the creation and proceedings of international criminal tribunals.

Their analysis pointed to a genocidal pattern of Russian forces’ targeting of Ukrainian civilians, including evidence of mass executions and torture of civilians in areas that were occupied by Russian forces, such as the Kyiv suburb of Bucha, as well as deliberate attacks on shelters, evacuation routes and humanitarian corridors; sieges of Ukrainian cities; and indiscriminate bombing of residential areas. The report also cited sexual violence and reports of the forcible deportation of Ukrainians to Russia.

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Ukraine is a large strategic piece of land that creates a military buffer zone between the south-west and west.  That is why Russia wants to exterminate 40+ million people and destroy and then rebuild the area. Erase Ukrainian culture and replace it with Russian culture.
That is the plan.
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Methodically?  Jesus, you need to stop watching whatever you are watching. Donetsk does not know there is/was a war in Ukraine.

Have you seen pictures of Donetsk and Mariupol?

Which one looks like it was bombed?

re: This is not to mention the regular shelling of residential areas of Donetsk by the Armed Forces of Ukraine
Ukrainian army shelled Russian positions in response to attacks on their positions.

It is time for you to go home.

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Sooner or later. It will be 100 times worse for them than Afghanistan and in the end, they will go home empty-handed.

As for this current war, other than just a land grab I see no other justification. Historical revisionism at its best. All the talk about NATO expansion, 'denazification', 'demilitarization', and 'genocide of the Russian peoples' are just empty propaganda points.

This war started with the aggression, occupation, and annexation of Crimea in Feb 2014. Followed up by the Russian invasion of Donbas in March 2014.

Putin sells this war as a defensive war against the 'Russian peoples' but it is a war of conquest, plain and simple. There were no Russian people in Ukraine before 2014.

Just because someone speaks Russian as their first language, it does not make him Russian. Many Canadians speak North American English
but are not Americans, or speak French, yet are not French, they are Canadians.  The same goes for Russian-speaking Ukrainians. They are Ukrainians. Many became Russians, no doubt. But to bomb and level the country? How nuts does someone has to be?

Nazism or more precisely imperialism 101. I think Russia poke the wrong wolverine. They will have their ass handed to them.
Sooner or later. It will be 100 times worse for them than Afghanistan and in the end, they will go home empty-handed.

BTW, I'm a bit confused by wheat shortage...Ukraine is producing
24 out of 750 million tonnes of world production...that is around 3%...
how can such tiny number have such big influence on price

Yup, west will "help" them as much as it "helped" Kurds, Libyans, Syrians, etc...there's no chance that
they ever see any of those money
I suggest you to read this book:
https://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Economic-Hit-John-Perkins/dp/0452287081

I think that there is plenty of Ukraine and that, even with just the assets that can be taken from Adolf Putin, his family and the plutocrats it could become a great country to live and work in. The billions in London and NY flats, the gold reserves that are outside Russia, the immense asset base that all the plutocrats have all around Europe... You can move your yatch, but you cannot move your villas in Spain, you flats in London, your gold in the US.... You cannot move your planes unless you want the confiscated, you cannot sell your shares,... More than enough for a fair war compensations.

It will be an epically "Karma" situation that the wealth stolen by the Plutocrats and Adolf Putin from the RF people end up as schools, hospitals, road and bridges all shiny and new right across the border and protected by a NATO treaty.

Now it doesn't matter, forget about the Minsk agreements, they have lost their relevance. There are two types of people, some in a difficult situation ask "What to do?", while others ask "Who is to blame?". I urge you not to engage in fruitless searches on whom to blame for what happened, this is an infantile position in life. It is wiser and more productive to actively look for a way out of the current situation, and not the reasons for getting into it. It will take about the same amount of force, but the result will be significantly different. Now Ukraine is facing an incredibly difficult challenge associated with the complete loss of its statehood - that's what you should focus on! Otherwise, there will be no Ukraine soon, as it did not exist before 1917.

I am saying that I consider the treaty signed under threats and it was never fully followed by ANYONE.

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Thank you for acknowledging that Ukraine didn't implement those two points. Words have meanings, you should look up differences between "impossible" and "undesirable"!

1) "did Ukraine abide by the Minsk agreements from 2014 until 2022?" -> "Of course, they did."
2) "This point was not fulfilled by Russia. It was impossible to accomplish anything else with Russia."

That is objectively called lying! You're not going to raise any support by lying! You can't expect anyone with half a brain to fall for such cheap trick! You can finger point all day long, explain how they weren't fair, or provide reasons why Ukraine didn't implementing Minsk agreements by blaming DPR/LPR not implementing other points first, that's all fine, but what you cannot do is fool people by saying that Ukraine implemented Minsk agreements. That's just a lie, you ruin any credibility you've had by claiming such nonsense, and trying to make idiots out of the readers!
..

Following reports of Ukrainian positions being shelled from the Russian side of the border, between 22 and 25 August 2014, Russian artillery, personnel, and what Russia called a "humanitarian convoy" crossed the border. Russian crossings reportedly occurred both in areas that were controlled by pro-Russian forces and those that were not, such as the south-eastern part of Donetsk Oblast, near Novoazovsk.[42][43] The Head of the Security Service of Ukraine, Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, called the events of 22 August a "direct invasion by Russia of Ukraine"

The Minsk II deal set out military and political steps that remain unimplemented. A major blockage has been Russia’s insistence that it is not a party to the conflict and therefore is not bound by its terms. In general, Moscow and Kyiv interpret the pact very differently, leading to what has been dubbed by some observers as the “Minsk conundrum”.

The agreement contains a timeline for implementation but no binding mechanism, though certain elements—for example, promises to respect the territorial integrity of Ukraine, efforts by France and Germany to help restore financial links with the separatist territories, and promises to continue trilateral dialogue between the EU, Ukraine, and Russia as well as the Normandy-format discussions—are quite important from a technical perspective.

Ukraine gets the ball back...

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-june-5

RUSSIAN OFFENSIVE CAMPAIGN ASSESSMENT, JUNE 5

Ukrainian forces continued to conduct limited and localized but successful counterattacks against Russian positions throughout Ukraine on June 5, including retaking large areas of Severodonetsk—the city in Luhansk Oblast the Kremlin has concentrated the majority of its forces on capturing. A Russian Telegram channel claimed that Ukrainian troops launched a counterattack north of Kharkiv City, indicating that Ukrainian forces continue to pressure Russian defensive lines near the Russian border.[1] Ukrainian forces are likely seeking to leverage the continued Russian focus on Severodonetsk to conduct counterattacks on other axes of advance. Even as Russian forces continue to pour equipment and troops into the Severodonetsk-Lysychansk area, Ukrainian forces have conducted a successful counterattack in Severodonetsk in the last 48 hours and pushed Russian troops back to the eastern outskirts of the city and out of southern settlements.[2] Ukrainian counteroffensive pressure will likely continue to draw the attention of Russian forces to Luhansk Oblast and therefore leave vulnerabilities in Russian defensive efforts in Kharkiv Oblast and along the Southern Axis. The ability of Ukrainian forces to successfully counterattack in Severodonetsk, the Kremlin’s current priority area of operations, further indicates the declining combat power of Russian forces in Ukraine.

It's a nice quote, but what's the logic here? Back in 2014 Ukraine was loosing land even without official Russian involvement. Germany and France clearly didn't want to get involved (as today), Ukraine didn't have 8yrs of training and weapons from US, are you saying Ukraine should've fully surrender/got captured back in 2014? Pretty sure that was their plan and Germany/France managed to get Russia to compromise on some land, and now Germany/France are the bad guys for doing that?

And even for today i still can't trace such logic. Are you betting on Russia not fully mobilizing and just surrendering even before mobilization? Or is the bet on Ukraine somehow winning when Russia mobilizes? Or are you pushing for NATO involvement after Russian mobilization aka WW3?

And yes US/EU stole exponentially more of Russian property without any court rulings, think they even sanctioned Ukrainian born billionaire, so much for the idea of genocide

Nobody should. It is giving away territory and concessions just to appease Adolf Putin. Big mistake.


Seize assets (AKA plunder and steal), it seems to me that Ukraine will be rebuilt with the sales of some yatchs, plenty of London ("Londongrad" / "Moscow upon thames") houses and flats in prime districts, gold reserves in custody. There is no way Adolf Putin can try to be "symmetrical" in the sanctions because it is simply beyond his power to do so. In the end, Russia still holds some Soviet era military gadgets, but economically is just another (poorly led) country sending their young to die for no purpose.

"Never bet against America" - Warren Buffet