Topic: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] - page 296. (Read 73604 times)

If you continue to test those simpler "proven" solutions with people inside, there may be no more people willing to play dummy.

Javelin's are expensive, agreed. They are 126k USD, but they kill tanks worth 1M USD plus 4 to 5 young Russian soldiers - still good cost-effective. I kind of agree that other AT are better and cheaper.

Nope, NLAW is perfectly effective against Explosive Reactive Armour. See here how the top-attack works. An here how the Russ are using what they call "emotional support armour" or "cope cages" absolutely useless BTW against Javs or NLAWs.

Again, all this is good for short distance. UKR is now getting proper siege artillery, the modern ones that are accurate, fast firing and come with a range of ammo for various situations. We have already seen footage and my guess is we are going to see much more.

I'm not saying that there are no losses at all, I'm saying that if they immediately relied not on hand-held anti-tank weapons, but on self-propelled artillery, Russia would have more problems. The vaunted American M777 howitzers also turned out to be zilch, they were delivered without a digital fire control unit.

The collective-farm welded structure in the first photo is a Ukrainian craft, if you draw the letter V on a wrecked Ukrainian tank, it does not become Russian. Do not tell me propaganda tales about how bad everything is in Russia - show real Ukrainian successes. 

LOL sure, nothing to worry about, and surely Russians didn't try to put makeshift "anti-Javelin" contraptions on their tanks, and the turrets just randomly fly off for no reason at all, because Javelins, NLAWs, and other anti-tank weapons didn't work:



"dynamic armor" turned out to be vaporware too BTW:

Javelin is heavy, expensive and not very effective, there are problems with target acquisition. NLAW is very unreliable and frankly weak against a tank with modern dynamic armor. In general, the initial bet on hand-held anti-tank systems did not work, the main tank losses were from artillery.

During the assault on Mariupol, Russia did not even have a two-fold numerical superiority. This is perhaps Russia's biggest problem in this operation, with overwhelming technical superiority, there is simply not enough infantry. However, the current pale appearance of Ukraine and NATO standards is all the more dramatic.

Armata is not needed there. Maybe they will bring one or two for tests at the next stage of the operation. At the current stage, risking a fifth generation tank is simply stupid, simpler and well-tested solutions work.

At least one exists or three counting on this video. So that must be 6 dachas and 3 tanks.

Your general point is right, there is no proof of any of the in theory sophisticated Russian ground vehicles to actually do anything of what is claimed.

Translation from Russian: it's vaporware. Instead of Armata, generals have new dachas. You can't really send a dacha to Ukraine.


Javelins need distance. In urban battles NLAW works better. Still needs at least 20 meters. Good thing is that Ukrainians have a wide range of anti-tank weapons.

Funny how bring up Mariupol again, a city that for two months Russians were not able to take with a 10-fold advantage in numbers.

Not advisable = We only have 10 and 1 has a glitch with the aim (shoots inwards). Jokes apart, they are too expensive, it is much cheaper for the Russian Ministry of Sociopathy to send a few dudes from the eastern regions in a T-72. Their strategy on the ground is not about subtlety or technological superiority.

Most tanks are killed by artillery or other armoured vehicles. Javelin missiles have definitely killed armoured vehicles in Ukraine. However, the best thing is that the tanks and other know that they cannot just walk on their own without support or feel confident in attacking an infantry position, not to mention urban warfare. It provides the guy on foot with something that can deal with a tank effectively.

 I particularly find Stugna-P an even better weapon. There is footage of it killing tanks and choppers, soldiers do not have to be there so backfire is not really an issue. Quite a threat, great for ambush.

Armata has not yet appeared in Ukraine, apparently, in the opinion of the General Staff, this is not advisable. The most modern Russian attack tank that participates in this operation is the T90M Proryv. The main tank of Russia - T72BZ, it is also quite good. The Terminator is built on the T72 chassis, it is good in urban battles and in general for supporting tanks (which is especially important given the small number of soldiers participating in the operation from Russia).

Javelins, by the way, say hyped shit, moreover, according to the reviews of Ukrainian soldiers. In Mariupol, the Javelins did not seem to be able to burn a single Russian tank. There are a lot of conditions for successful operation, which are difficult to put together in a real battle.

Will they be testing the Armata, or is still not capable of anything other than to appear in parades?

I bet there is a Javelin somewhere itching to participate in that test.

A good face? You mean like  this

Oh, by all means, go test - the problem of Putin's army has never been having weapons, it is a problem of corruption and poor leadership so any vehicle sent is just another death trap for the young Russ that should be at home fuck*ng their wives and making more little Russ and, instead will die for Putin. Particularly a 30MM with anti-tank is something that most armies have since years ago. Fronts stalled, even some advances by Ukraine in the North and all you have to show is that the last bit of Mariupol conceded after months of siege - and there is no guarantee that it will be kept in the future.

You still think Putin's Russia has something to win from this war. Somehow, Putin will take the coast and perhaps a bit of Donbas and then everyone will call it a day, go home (those who did not die on both sides I mean) and that is it. What could go wrong? Something like Ukraine continuing to fight with plenty of western help is not possible. Or is it?

US strategy is letting Russia bleed itself and it is working. All they are wishing for is another year of war and then another and then more members for NATO... and Putin is just giving it to them. The recession will be worldwide, but you guys are heading for honours.


In case you do not get the last bit - That means big inflation.

Of course they will, but I'm not sure that it will be too humane. In Russia, at the request of the Prosecutor General's Office, they now want to add the Azov regiment to the list of terrorist organizations, and its fighters have prospects from 15 years to life imprisonment. And if they are judged in the Donbass, then there is no moratorium on the death penalty. The Marines of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, who did not appear in war crimes, the situation is better.

The figure according to the statements of Ukrainian propaganda?

And the fact that three waves of mobilization in Ukraine have already turned into mincemeat forgot to tell you?

Do you think they'll get a fair trial?

Keep talking...

28,300 Russians dead so far, not counting the ones vaporized or blown up to pieces.

You are trying in vain to put on a good face on a bad game. No, they shouldn't have given up, it's a shame. The "cyborgs" from Azov were to die and become heroes - that would have been a military defeat, but a political victory for Kyiv. And now it's just an inglorious defeat of Kyiv, and a shameful defeat of the Nazi ideals of Azov, which, in fact, turned out to be not worthy of dying for them. There will be no exchange, military investigators are already working and Nazi criminals will be convicted. The surrender continues, last night another 200 Nazis of Azov came out of the bunker in addition to 265 from the first batch.

Meanwhile, Russia has decided to test the new Terminator tank support fighting vehicle in combat conditions.

Yup that's mainly the problem, that is why Biden backed up from his statement that Putin should be removed from power and why I pointed in my previous post that we are no longer in 1914.


That's all right, I saw it today in CNN. Now, will your leader admit these are soldiers and exchange them or the desire for revenge and barbarism is too much to resist? I can figure out that he cares little for Russ prisoners, as little as he cared for these ones.


Lol... still pretending that we use "his sources" as credible is kind of fun. But yes, they surrendered, it had to happen.

Translation: after torture and questioning, plus a few years in artic.

I agree with you. War is stupid.

Even if Russia started the war, it did so with Putin signing off on #51 in the UN charter, which states that he is doing it as a police action... the same thing that the US has been doing for decades around the world.

Putin's actions might be stupid, but there is a large chunk of cleverness involved as well. As it stands, Russia might be the only strength that stands between one-worlders forcing all of the nations into a one-world government. No more independent US. Lots of freedoms gone at the same time.

Finland and Sweden want to join the NATO because Russia is fighting for autonomy in foreign countries!
It's shit about what the US did, it's about how Russia was reacting to it. I don't deny that the US and some other "interested" involved parties played a role in escalation, but this war is unneccessary, rushed and inhuman. Russia indirectly gave the US more opportunities to interfere.

WHERE IS THE RUSSIAN WIN IN THIS WAR?

Russia can only lose, imo.
Unbelievable stupid play by Putin. He may have lost his mind.

EDIT:
Alternative option: Maybe Putin always was just a moron, and it went OK for Russia in his past regency times by luck, until recently?

At the core, Russia is fighting for her autonomy. Sweeden and Finland want to join NATO. The Ukraine is almost there, and other nations on Russia's border have already joined.

Russia has been warning the US to back off, just as the US would warn Russia to back off if Russia set up its military in Mexico and Canada.

WW3, around the corner, because the US is pushing Russia into it.

FTFY  
You know, two governments bringing opposite presentations of these happenings via mass media (more or less)...
We can't both be sure, but there are things we just don't know (yet?).
But, at the core, Russia is invading Ukraine, killing civilians in civil places, drawing others in to send them against their own citizens, doing the opposite of the government's proposed plans ("nobody is going to invade UA, it's just maneuvers", remember?), and this just stinks like hell, nazis or not.
Nazis are international, but they don't "rule" no population. Well, definitely not sure about Russia, as of now, though.

All the Nazi members in Bitcointalk. They don't want to talk this stuff:


The Sweet Sound of Surrendering Nazified Ukrainian Thugs in Mariupol