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Topic: Scientific proof that God exists? - page 36. (Read 845650 times)

hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 11, 2018, 01:47:55 PM

'' Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being'' No I'm not you are just ignoring everything to keep your belief going. I said numerous times that multiple supremely intelligent beings could have created the universe, can you disprove that, no you can't, therefore why do you keep claiming it was god when it could have been numerous supremely intelligent beings? I pointed out to super intelligent aliens several times. Again you have no ARGUMENT against any of my examples, you can't keep claiming it was god, period. You lost, deal with it.

There is only ONE God. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

We have no evidence of anything in the universe making itself without something from outside of itself making it. But there is evidence and proof all over the place in countless numbers of things where they are made by something outside themselves.

This brings us to the question >>> Does anything ever make itself, from scratch, without something outside of it making it?

Another way to say this is >>> Is there ever any spontaneous generation of anything?

We have no evidence of such. Everything we know about has at least one maker. Even the idea of radioactive decay having to do with some form of spontaneity, is just an idea, but might be a theory. What it isn't is a known fact. But if it somehow could be a fact, it would be one against countless trillions of trillions of makers making things.

In other words, things have makers outside of themselves...

once something is made the maker might go inside of it...

the maker generally doesn't entirely become part of the thing that he made even if he is inside of it.

One God, not originally from within the universe He made, but partially within it now, yet also outside of it, and different than it.

Again, One God because outside-the-universe is all we know about what is outside of the universe. Outside includes not even understanding what this "outside" is or means, because we are universe oriented. One outside. That's it. One God.

Cool

''There is only ONE supreme intelligent alien. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

There are a few supreme intelligent aliens, why? Because the universe is so complex that multiple creators are required to build it

The universe was created by ''Insert any name'' supreme being

And so on and so on. Again, why does it have to be your god and not a super intelligent alien? Why not multiple aliens, why not any other being that we can think of? Why god?  


Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of multiple causes, meaning that you can't be certain it was god and not gods.

So, you think you can think along the lines of something outside of the universe clearly enough to know what it is, right?

Even if, in their relationships among themselves, there were more beings outside the universe than the number of electrons that could fill the whole volume of the universe, for us there is still only One. That One is outside-the-universe.

Or have you been out there to check it all out? Have you facts that show that there could not be one intelligent Being outside the universe, that is so vastly intelligent, that building a universe like ours is child's play to Him/It?

Your stuff is speculation. Outside the universe is not speculation. Outside is one outside. Show how it is not, and that your showing is other than speculation or ideas.

Cool

That's the point you dumbass, you claim to know what it is and you call it god, I'm trying to make you realize that we can't know what it is, I'm glad you finally realized it without really realizing it.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 11, 2018, 11:42:27 AM

'' Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being'' No I'm not you are just ignoring everything to keep your belief going. I said numerous times that multiple supremely intelligent beings could have created the universe, can you disprove that, no you can't, therefore why do you keep claiming it was god when it could have been numerous supremely intelligent beings? I pointed out to super intelligent aliens several times. Again you have no ARGUMENT against any of my examples, you can't keep claiming it was god, period. You lost, deal with it.

There is only ONE God. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

We have no evidence of anything in the universe making itself without something from outside of itself making it. But there is evidence and proof all over the place in countless numbers of things where they are made by something outside themselves.

This brings us to the question >>> Does anything ever make itself, from scratch, without something outside of it making it?

Another way to say this is >>> Is there ever any spontaneous generation of anything?

We have no evidence of such. Everything we know about has at least one maker. Even the idea of radioactive decay having to do with some form of spontaneity, is just an idea, but might be a theory. What it isn't is a known fact. But if it somehow could be a fact, it would be one against countless trillions of trillions of makers making things.

In other words, things have makers outside of themselves...

once something is made the maker might go inside of it...

the maker generally doesn't entirely become part of the thing that he made even if he is inside of it.

One God, not originally from within the universe He made, but partially within it now, yet also outside of it, and different than it.

Again, One God because outside-the-universe is all we know about what is outside of the universe. Outside includes not even understanding what this "outside" is or means, because we are universe oriented. One outside. That's it. One God.

Cool

''There is only ONE supreme intelligent alien. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

There are a few supreme intelligent aliens, why? Because the universe is so complex that multiple creators are required to build it

The universe was created by ''Insert any name'' supreme being

And so on and so on. Again, why does it have to be your god and not a super intelligent alien? Why not multiple aliens, why not any other being that we can think of? Why god?  


Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of multiple causes, meaning that you can't be certain it was god and not gods.

So, you think you can think along the lines of something outside of the universe clearly enough to know what it is, right?

Even if, in their relationships among themselves, there were more beings outside the universe than the number of electrons that could fill the whole volume of the universe, for us there is still only One. That One is outside-the-universe.

Or have you been out there to check it all out? Have you facts that show that there could not be one intelligent Being outside the universe, that is so vastly intelligent, that building a universe like ours is child's play to Him/It?

Your stuff is speculation. Outside the universe is not speculation. Outside is one outside. Show how it is not, and that your showing is other than speculation or ideas.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 11, 2018, 10:51:07 AM

'' Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being'' No I'm not you are just ignoring everything to keep your belief going. I said numerous times that multiple supremely intelligent beings could have created the universe, can you disprove that, no you can't, therefore why do you keep claiming it was god when it could have been numerous supremely intelligent beings? I pointed out to super intelligent aliens several times. Again you have no ARGUMENT against any of my examples, you can't keep claiming it was god, period. You lost, deal with it.

There is only ONE God. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

We have no evidence of anything in the universe making itself without something from outside of itself making it. But there is evidence and proof all over the place in countless numbers of things where they are made by something outside themselves.

This brings us to the question >>> Does anything ever make itself, from scratch, without something outside of it making it?

Another way to say this is >>> Is there ever any spontaneous generation of anything?

We have no evidence of such. Everything we know about has at least one maker. Even the idea of radioactive decay having to do with some form of spontaneity, is just an idea, but might be a theory. What it isn't is a known fact. But if it somehow could be a fact, it would be one against countless trillions of trillions of makers making things.

In other words, things have makers outside of themselves...

once something is made the maker might go inside of it...

the maker generally doesn't entirely become part of the thing that he made even if he is inside of it.

One God, not originally from within the universe He made, but partially within it now, yet also outside of it, and different than it.

Again, One God because outside-the-universe is all we know about what is outside of the universe. Outside includes not even understanding what this "outside" is or means, because we are universe oriented. One outside. That's it. One God.

Cool

''There is only ONE supreme intelligent alien. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

There are a few supreme intelligent aliens, why? Because the universe is so complex that multiple creators are required to build it

The universe was created by ''Insert any name'' supreme being

And so on and so on. Again, why does it have to be your god and not a super intelligent alien? Why not multiple aliens, why not any other being that we can think of? Why god?  


Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of multiple causes, meaning that you can't be certain it was god and not gods.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 11, 2018, 09:56:07 AM

'' Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being'' No I'm not you are just ignoring everything to keep your belief going. I said numerous times that multiple supremely intelligent beings could have created the universe, can you disprove that, no you can't, therefore why do you keep claiming it was god when it could have been numerous supremely intelligent beings? I pointed out to super intelligent aliens several times. Again you have no ARGUMENT against any of my examples, you can't keep claiming it was god, period. You lost, deal with it.

There is only ONE God. Why? Because there is only one "outside of the universe."

We have no evidence of anything in the universe making itself without something from outside of itself making it. But there is evidence and proof all over the place in countless numbers of things where they are made by something outside themselves.

This brings us to the question >>> Does anything ever make itself, from scratch, without something outside of it making it?

Another way to say this is >>> Is there ever any spontaneous generation of anything?

We have no evidence of such. Everything we know about has at least one maker. Even the idea of radioactive decay having to do with some form of spontaneity, is just an idea, but might be a theory. What it isn't is a known fact. But if it somehow could be a fact, it would be one against countless trillions of trillions of makers making things.

In other words, things have makers outside of themselves...

once something is made the maker might go inside of it...

the maker generally doesn't entirely become part of the thing that he made even if he is inside of it.

One God, not originally from within the universe He made, but partially within it now, yet also outside of it, and different than it.

Again, One God because outside-the-universe is all we know about what is outside of the universe. Outside includes not even understanding what this "outside" is or means, because we are universe oriented. One outside. That's it. One God.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 11, 2018, 08:50:10 AM

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

''So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.''
Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.



Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

Complexity only makes equal or less complexity, Therefore whatever created the universe had to be more complex, not God, just more complex, why Your God and not many gods?


Are you even serious? Who or what other than God could make the universe? What do you mean "where does it show it was God?" God is the only Thing that it shows.

Cool

... Forget about god, imagine you didn't know anything about the bible or any religion. Then you are presented with your arguments, C&E, complexity, etc. What conclusion would you arrive at? If you agreed with all the 3 arguments, what would you say created the universe? Your argument simply says it has to be ''something'' more complex, it doesn't give that something any other characteristic, it doesn't say whether it's a person, a sentient being, something without consciousness, multiple beings, etc etc.

Intelligence is complexity that is backed by the subconscious. Yet, the best or highest intelligence of mankind can only create limited things, and can barely see anything beyond a tiny bit of the complexity of nature. The more we study nature and the universe, and the more we see the great complexity that is way beyond any complexity we do, the more we see the intelligent design in everything. Whatever the Designer is, He/It is way beyond us... a Super Intelligence.

More and more scientists who are coming to understand about the design and the complexity of the universe, are coming to understand that there is a Great Designer.

Often-times a person can feel an answer without being able to put all the pieces of whatever leads him to the answer in place. In the past, when people didn't have the exact sciences like we do today, they still understood that the Great Intelligence existed, by what they saw in nature. Their result was God, or in many cases, gods.


For some strange reason you are so completely against the idea of a Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being, that you won't accept It when It almost stares you right in the face.

Consider. You have identity. You say "I" or "me." Nobody understands the things about you the way you do. That's why nobody but you can say "I" or "me" about the things of yourself. So, why would you think that the "I" or "me" of what you are is not surpassed by some Great "I" or "Me?" The science of the way C&E and complexity operate backs this up. But you simply want to deny this science. Why?

Cool

'' Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being'' No I'm not you are just ignoring everything to keep your belief going. I said numerous times that multiple supremely intelligent beings could have created the universe, can you disprove that, no you can't, therefore why do you keep claiming it was god when it could have been numerous supremely intelligent beings? I pointed out to super intelligent aliens several times. Again you have no ARGUMENT against any of my examples, you can't keep claiming it was god, period. You lost, deal with it.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 10, 2018, 05:41:14 PM

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

''So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.''
Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.



Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

Complexity only makes equal or less complexity, Therefore whatever created the universe had to be more complex, not God, just more complex, why Your God and not many gods?


Are you even serious? Who or what other than God could make the universe? What do you mean "where does it show it was God?" God is the only Thing that it shows.

Cool

... Forget about god, imagine you didn't know anything about the bible or any religion. Then you are presented with your arguments, C&E, complexity, etc. What conclusion would you arrive at? If you agreed with all the 3 arguments, what would you say created the universe? Your argument simply says it has to be ''something'' more complex, it doesn't give that something any other characteristic, it doesn't say whether it's a person, a sentient being, something without consciousness, multiple beings, etc etc.

Intelligence is complexity that is backed by the subconscious. Yet, the best or highest intelligence of mankind can only create limited things, and can barely see anything beyond a tiny bit of the complexity of nature. The more we study nature and the universe, and the more we see the great complexity that is way beyond any complexity we do, the more we see the intelligent design in everything. Whatever the Designer is, He/It is way beyond us... a Super Intelligence.

More and more scientists who are coming to understand about the design and the complexity of the universe, are coming to understand that there is a Great Designer.

Often-times a person can feel an answer without being able to put all the pieces of whatever leads him to the answer in place. In the past, when people didn't have the exact sciences like we do today, they still understood that the Great Intelligence existed, by what they saw in nature. Their result was God, or in many cases, gods.


For some strange reason you are so completely against the idea of a Supremely Intelligent Supreme Being, that you won't accept It when It almost stares you right in the face.

Consider. You have identity. You say "I" or "me." Nobody understands the things about you the way you do. That's why nobody but you can say "I" or "me" about the things of yourself. So, why would you think that the "I" or "me" of what you are is not surpassed by some Great "I" or "Me?" The science of the way C&E and complexity operate backs this up. But you simply want to deny this science. Why?

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 10, 2018, 04:16:18 PM

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

''So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.''
Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.



Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

Complexity only makes equal or less complexity, Therefore whatever created the universe had to be more complex, not God, just more complex, why Your God and not many gods?


Are you even serious? Who or what other than God could make the universe? What do you mean "where does it show it was God?" God is the only Thing that it shows.

Cool

... Forget about god, imagine you didn't know anything about the bible or any religion. Then you are presented with your arguments, C&E, complexity, etc. What conclusion would you arrive at? If you agreed with all the 3 arguments, what would you say created the universe? Your argument simply says it has to be ''something'' more complex, it doesn't give that something any other characteristic, it doesn't say whether it's a person, a sentient being, something without consciousness, multiple beings, etc etc.
jr. member
Activity: 117
Merit: 2
October 10, 2018, 01:01:05 PM
Controversial topic. But anyways, GOD is the Law. People name differently according to their beliefs and I am naming God the Law according to my beliefs. And yeah this can be proved scientifically. Metaphysics talks abut this in detail, its very interesting if you get the time to understand.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 10, 2018, 11:13:17 AM

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

''So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.''
Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.



Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

Complexity only makes equal or less complexity, Therefore whatever created the universe had to be more complex, not God, just more complex, why Your God and not many gods?


Are you even serious? Who or what other than God could make the universe? What do you mean "where does it show it was God?" God is the only Thing that it shows.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 10, 2018, 08:07:47 AM

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool

Nope, we already discussed this several times and always ends up with you not being able to explain how it points to your god. As previously discussed: Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of different entities

Even if we agree with all the arguments there, it still doesn't show it was your god and not other god or multiple gods or multiple aliens or a simulation or anything that you can imagine. Your argument only shows 1 feature of what created the universe, it says it has to be more complex so anything that's more complex could be the creator/creators.

Again, you can't really get away with this badecker, your argument is dead, admit it.

If we discussed this, we barely discussed it. Rather, I almost always discussed about God, but you almost always discussed about god. Do you see the difference? In addition, you constantly talk about my god, whereas this thread has always been about God.

The point is that we are talking in different directions. We are talking right past each other. And you are talking, basically, off-topic. Why are you talking off-topic? Because the OP, and the topic title, both talk about God rather than god, just as most of what I talk about is God, and seldom god, and barely ever my god (if I even have one), and seldom ever even my God.

Why do talk as you do? Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists, even though you might wish that He doesn't exist.

Cool

The thread talks about the god from the bible, which is also the god you believe in. ''in the Bible'' It's mentioned in the first post and the article clearly says it's the God from the bible so we are talking about the same thing.

If you were confused because I typed god instead of God, you must be really confused about a lot of things.

''Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists'' Again, your ''proof'' goes like this:

Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

''So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.''
Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.



Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.

Complexity only makes equal or less complexity, Therefore whatever created the universe had to be more complex, not God, just more complex, why Your God and not many gods?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 09, 2018, 10:31:59 AM

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool

Nope, we already discussed this several times and always ends up with you not being able to explain how it points to your god. As previously discussed: Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of different entities

Even if we agree with all the arguments there, it still doesn't show it was your god and not other god or multiple gods or multiple aliens or a simulation or anything that you can imagine. Your argument only shows 1 feature of what created the universe, it says it has to be more complex so anything that's more complex could be the creator/creators.

Again, you can't really get away with this badecker, your argument is dead, admit it.

If we discussed this, we barely discussed it. Rather, I almost always discussed about God, but you almost always discussed about god. Do you see the difference? In addition, you constantly talk about my god, whereas this thread has always been about God.

The point is that we are talking in different directions. We are talking right past each other. And you are talking, basically, off-topic. Why are you talking off-topic? Because the OP, and the topic title, both talk about God rather than god, just as most of what I talk about is God, and seldom god, and barely ever my god (if I even have one), and seldom ever even my God.

Why do talk as you do? Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists, even though you might wish that He doesn't exist.

Cool

The thread talks about the god from the bible, which is also the god you believe in. ''in the Bible'' It's mentioned in the first post and the article clearly says it's the God from the bible so we are talking about the same thing.

If you were confused because I typed god instead of God, you must be really confused about a lot of things.

''Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists'' Again, your ''proof'' goes like this:

Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.

God from the Bible that the OP talks about is the God of the universe. Why? That is what the Bible says.

The Bible talks about God from a different standpoint than science. This thread talks about a scientific standpoint. This means that Bible stuff doesn't count if it doesn't fit scientific stuff. So, the Bible in the OP simply tells us that we are talking about God, not god (There are many gods referred to in the Bible, now and again.).

So, which god of the Bible are you talking about? The God of the universe is supported scientifically as I have shown in the links, above.

Cool

EDIT: Probably the most complex thing in the universe is the brain of mankind, and/or its inter-connectivity, and/or the communications that go on between the parts of the brain through the inter-connectivity. There is sentience connected to the brain of mankind. Complexity only makes equal or less complexity. Therefore, God is greater sentience.
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 09, 2018, 10:15:24 AM

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool

Nope, we already discussed this several times and always ends up with you not being able to explain how it points to your god. As previously discussed: Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of different entities

Even if we agree with all the arguments there, it still doesn't show it was your god and not other god or multiple gods or multiple aliens or a simulation or anything that you can imagine. Your argument only shows 1 feature of what created the universe, it says it has to be more complex so anything that's more complex could be the creator/creators.

Again, you can't really get away with this badecker, your argument is dead, admit it.

If we discussed this, we barely discussed it. Rather, I almost always discussed about God, but you almost always discussed about god. Do you see the difference? In addition, you constantly talk about my god, whereas this thread has always been about God.

The point is that we are talking in different directions. We are talking right past each other. And you are talking, basically, off-topic. Why are you talking off-topic? Because the OP, and the topic title, both talk about God rather than god, just as most of what I talk about is God, and seldom god, and barely ever my god (if I even have one), and seldom ever even my God.

Why do talk as you do? Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists, even though you might wish that He doesn't exist.

Cool

The thread talks about the god from the bible, which is also the god you believe in. ''in the Bible'' It's mentioned in the first post and the article clearly says it's the God from the bible so we are talking about the same thing.

If you were confused because I typed god instead of God, you must be really confused about a lot of things.

''Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists'' Again, your ''proof'' goes like this:

Entropy: A beginning

Cause and Effect: Universe must have a cause

Complexity(not defined but it doesn't matter): Whatever created the universe must be more complex than it

And that's where your argument ends, where does it show it was god? It simply shows the universe had a beginning and a cause and it has to be more complex. Again, this does not show it was God, it only points out to a complex being or beings or something that is not a sentient being, since it only has to be more complex.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 09, 2018, 09:45:48 AM

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool

Nope, we already discussed this several times and always ends up with you not being able to explain how it points to your god. As previously discussed: Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of different entities

Even if we agree with all the arguments there, it still doesn't show it was your god and not other god or multiple gods or multiple aliens or a simulation or anything that you can imagine. Your argument only shows 1 feature of what created the universe, it says it has to be more complex so anything that's more complex could be the creator/creators.

Again, you can't really get away with this badecker, your argument is dead, admit it.

If we discussed this, we barely discussed it. Rather, I almost always discussed about God, but you almost always discussed about god. Do you see the difference? In addition, you constantly talk about my god, whereas this thread has always been about God.

The point is that we are talking in different directions. We are talking right past each other. And you are talking, basically, off-topic. Why are you talking off-topic? Because the OP, and the topic title, both talk about God rather than god, just as most of what I talk about is God, and seldom god, and barely ever my god (if I even have one), and seldom ever even my God.

Why do talk as you do? Because you don't have any answers against the scientific proof that God exists, even though you might wish that He doesn't exist.

Cool
jr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 1
October 09, 2018, 05:36:43 AM
Why prove something?  What is the point of this.  After all, it would be better for no one if they prove that it exists or, on the contrary, that it does not exist!
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 09, 2018, 05:04:26 AM
There,s nothing we can do to prove Beliefs, because GOD is belief.

How do you know that empty space exists? You can't grab hold of it. You can't find ways to analyze it directly. Science doesn't really know what it is. So, can you prove that empty space exists? Or is empty space just a belief?

The way we know that empty space exists is to analyze relationships between some of the things that lie within empty space. So, we know that empty space is a fact. We don't have to simply believe.

Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.

Do these 3 describe God? Barely. We can't tell from these 3 if He is the God af any particular religion, or if there is no religion that describes Him. But they DO let us know that He exists, simply because they could not exist without Him.

Cool

''Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.'' How so?

Why is a god (your god) necessary to make those 3 things exist? You are simply assuming it for some unknown reason when your whole argument doesn't say anything about god. Where in your argument do you show that those 3 things can't exist without god?

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool

Nope, we already discussed this several times and always ends up with you not being able to explain how it points to your god. As previously discussed: Nothing in your argument rules out the possibility of different entities

Even if we agree with all the arguments there, it still doesn't show it was your god and not other god or multiple gods or multiple aliens or a simulation or anything that you can imagine. Your argument only shows 1 feature of what created the universe, it says it has to be more complex so anything that's more complex could be the creator/creators.

Again, you can't really get away with this badecker, your argument is dead, admit it.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 08, 2018, 06:13:43 PM
There,s nothing we can do to prove Beliefs, because GOD is belief.

How do you know that empty space exists? You can't grab hold of it. You can't find ways to analyze it directly. Science doesn't really know what it is. So, can you prove that empty space exists? Or is empty space just a belief?

The way we know that empty space exists is to analyze relationships between some of the things that lie within empty space. So, we know that empty space is a fact. We don't have to simply believe.

Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.

Do these 3 describe God? Barely. We can't tell from these 3 if He is the God af any particular religion, or if there is no religion that describes Him. But they DO let us know that He exists, simply because they could not exist without Him.

Cool

''Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.'' How so?

Why is a god (your god) necessary to make those 3 things exist? You are simply assuming it for some unknown reason when your whole argument doesn't say anything about god. Where in your argument do you show that those 3 things can't exist without god?

I have explained this over and over for you. If you are really curious, go on back over the thread and read what I have said. Start here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10718395
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16803380.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 08, 2018, 06:09:46 PM
There,s nothing we can do to prove Beliefs, because GOD is belief.

How do you know that empty space exists? You can't grab hold of it. You can't find ways to analyze it directly. Science doesn't really know what it is. So, can you prove that empty space exists? Or is empty space just a belief?

The way we know that empty space exists is to analyze relationships between some of the things that lie within empty space. So, we know that empty space is a fact. We don't have to simply believe.

Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.

Do these 3 describe God? Barely. We can't tell from these 3 if He is the God af any particular religion, or if there is no religion that describes Him. But they DO let us know that He exists, simply because they could not exist without Him.

Cool

''Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.'' How so?

Why is a god (your god) necessary to make those 3 things exist? You are simply assuming it for some unknown reason when your whole argument doesn't say anything about god. Where in your argument do you show that those 3 things can't exist without god?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 08, 2018, 05:44:16 PM

Again, you keep talking about complexity without defining it. ''The word "God" fits, and especially because we don't understand what God is.'' The word Zeus also fits, all the other god names also fit, aliens also fit, super intelligent being from outside the universe also fits, and so and so on, there is no evidence that points towards god.

To help you out, check the dictionary and encyclopedias for the definition of complexity.

Perhaps you have studied about Zeus enough to know that Zeus fits. But I guarantee you, not all other gods fit, nor do aliens.

If you want to call the God of the universe "super intelligent being from outside the universe," you have just described some aspects of God.

All you are saying is that all evidence points toward God. Why? Because "god" is not "God." So, you are right... god doesn't fit, but God does.

Cool

''the state of having many parts and being difficult to understand or find an answer to'' You said ''If there were not enough complexity in existence for us to reason and have personal identity''
So if there wasn't enough what, enough parts that are difficult to understand?

If there were not enough (parts and being difficult to understand or find an answer to) in existence for us to reason and have personal identity. That's what you said, how does that make any sense?

Made perfect sense to God.     Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
October 08, 2018, 05:42:49 PM

Again, you keep talking about complexity without defining it. ''The word "God" fits, and especially because we don't understand what God is.'' The word Zeus also fits, all the other god names also fit, aliens also fit, super intelligent being from outside the universe also fits, and so and so on, there is no evidence that points towards god.

To help you out, check the dictionary and encyclopedias for the definition of complexity.

Perhaps you have studied about Zeus enough to know that Zeus fits. But I guarantee you, not all other gods fit, nor do aliens.

If you want to call the God of the universe "super intelligent being from outside the universe," you have just described some aspects of God.

All you are saying is that all evidence points toward God. Why? Because "god" is not "God." So, you are right... god doesn't fit, but God does.

Cool

''the state of having many parts and being difficult to understand or find an answer to'' You said ''If there were not enough complexity in existence for us to reason and have personal identity''
So if there wasn't enough what, enough parts that are difficult to understand?

If there were not enough (parts and being difficult to understand or find an answer to) in existence for us to reason and have personal identity. That's what you said, how does that make any sense?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
October 08, 2018, 05:24:16 PM
There,s nothing we can do to prove Beliefs, because GOD is belief.

How do you know that empty space exists? You can't grab hold of it. You can't find ways to analyze it directly. Science doesn't really know what it is. So, can you prove that empty space exists? Or is empty space just a belief?

The way we know that empty space exists is to analyze relationships between some of the things that lie within empty space. So, we know that empty space is a fact. We don't have to simply believe.

Cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, when combined as they are in our universe, prove that God exists. Why? Because these 3 things can't exist together as they do in our universe without God making them to exist this way.

Do these 3 describe God? Barely. We can't tell from these 3 if He is the God af any particular religion, or if there is no religion that describes Him. But they DO let us know that He exists, simply because they could not exist without Him.

Cool
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