Seasteading - page 12. | Bitcointalksearch.org

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: Xester on May 16, 2017, 03:35:54 AM

You have a brilliant idea however you can only realize your idea if you have billions of dollars to construct a community floating in the ocean. Aside from creating a community you must also consider the hazards such as big waves and huge storms that your community will be facing. Your structures must be tough to meet those conditions. Lastly, I can say that your ideas are good but I can foretell that you do not have the resources to make your plans a reality.

Thank you.

These things have been taken into account.

It is true that without people joining the project, or without some wealthy benefactor, the project will fail. But this is the same for any large project.

This is a positive project. It can be made to work. Join us, add your funds, and secure a place. This is only the beginning.

Cool

Xester

hero member

Activity: 994

Merit: 544

You have a brilliant idea however you can only realize your idea if you have billions of dollars to construct a community floating in the ocean. Aside from creating a community you must also consider the hazards such as big waves and huge storms that your community will be facing. Your structures must be tough to meet those conditions. Lastly, I can say that your ideas are good but I can foretell that you do not have the resources to make your plans a reality.

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: Karpeles on May 14, 2017, 07:26:33 PM

How would you be protected from pirates and such? Most countries can't protect their citizen on land and can't effectvally watch all waterflow.

Also a certain nation in Asia(North Korea) has reports of abducting people from boats in sea, they may attack you and the outside world would never know what happened.

And I don't think the nations and people fleeing to live outside their jurisdiction, I think even the "host" nation would be a threat

Pirates? We don't develop near nations where pirating is common.

If any project starts out with "we have to be able to defend ourselves against nations" then it's dead from the start. Imagine if everyone considering buying a boat thought "I can't buy this boat, Korea may attack me".

countryfree

legendary

Activity: 3066

Merit: 1047

Your country may be your worst enemy

Thailand is already well developed, you may consider its neighbor, Burma. I was talking to a Vietnamese friend not long ago, and she's investing in Myanmar. The country's opening up, and there is plenty of opportunities for foreigners with cash in hand.

Spendulus

legendary

Activity: 2926

Merit: 1386

Quote from: Elwar on March 07, 2017, 12:49:17 AM

Quote from: BADecker on March 06, 2017, 09:38:17 PM

Concrete hulled pontoon boats are the cheapest to make. No? Cool

Yes. Concrete is the cheapest and most resilient material against salt water. Most seasteaders choose that as their material. I am fairly certain that The Seasteading Institute plans on creating huge 50 meters platforms out of concrete.

Concrete hulled pontoon boats would be good if they are separate from each other. But concrete is fragile when it bangs against concrete over and over. It would be very difficult to attach them together for a large platform. Anything that would be flexible and strong enough to separate the units would likely degrade in salt water over time.

Steel has been used for ship building for decades. It can also bang against each other over and over without degradation. Also, polyurea adheres best to steel, which is what I would use for coating to protect from salt water.
I address the reason for steel in my design outline: https://discuss.seasteading.org/t/my-viva-vivas-seastead-design/921/2

The prices for steel, particularly stainless, are not realistic. Stainless is not available for $500 per ton.

For comparison, look at SCRAP prices here:

http://www.scrapmonster.com/scrap-prices/category/Stainless-Steel/151/1/1

Karpeles

legendary

Activity: 1162

Merit: 1000

How would you be protected from pirates and such? Most countries can't protect their citizen on land and can't effectvally watch all waterflow.

Also a certain nation in Asia(North Korea) has reports of abducting people from boats in sea, they may attack you and the outside world would never know what happened.

And I don't think the nations and people fleeing to live outside their jurisdiction, I think even the "host" nation would be a threat

merchantofzeny

sr. member

Activity: 1036

Merit: 279

Quote from: Elwar on May 14, 2017, 06:43:29 PM

I am currently in Tahiti for a seasteading conference. Should be interesting. Spent the last few weeks scoping out Thailand, Cambodia and Vietnam. Thailand seems like it has good potential.

Wow. Thailand seem a good place to build it, that part of SE Asia don't usually get strong typhoons. Might have to consider the conflict over the South China Sea though. You wouldn't want China to think you're a shill for someone and that the project would be used by other claimants to build settlements on the disputed waters.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Seasteading... one of the weakest "nations" on earth.

So weak that they might be ignored as not-a-threat by other nations in a time of war, or they might be taken out as an easy precaution.

Fun, though, until then.

Cool

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

I am currently in Tahiti for a seasteading conference. Should be interesting. Spent the last few weeks scoping out Thailand, Cambodia and Vietnam. Thailand seems like it has good potential.

21kevin21

member

Activity: 105

Merit: 10

Quote from: Elwar on March 07, 2017, 12:30:23 AM

Quote from: coolcoinz on March 06, 2017, 06:55:33 AM

Just two things I'd miss if I chose to live like that are space to walk around and freedom to buy stuff I need at any moment.
What if you get sick and need medicine that you don't have in stock? What if a panel controller breaks and you are left with no lights and no way to cook food? Where do you get spare parts and how long will it take?

Initially it would be no different than living on a sailboat moored out in the water. You order your parts on Amazon, have it shipped to an address at a harbor address or marina, you take a dingy to the marina and get your supplies.

With many people on the seasteads, there will likely be someone going back and forth almost daily. It would likely be commonplace for people to pick up someone else's mail.

If people already begin to live in this way, I am sure that they will take care of the infrastructure and providing them with a large land. After all, this is not a problem in the world of high technology and technological progress.

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: BADecker on March 07, 2017, 05:08:38 PM

Quote from: Elwar on March 07, 2017, 12:49:17 AM

Quote from: BADecker on March 06, 2017, 09:38:17 PM

Concrete hulled pontoon boats are the cheapest to make. No? Cool

Yes. Concrete is the cheapest and most resilient material against salt water. Most seasteaders choose that as their material. I am fairly certain that The Seasteading Institute plans on creating huge 50 meters platforms out of concrete.

Concrete hulled pontoon boats would be good if they are separate from each other. But concrete is fragile when it bangs against concrete over and over. It would be very difficult to attach them together for a large platform. Anything that would be flexible and strong enough to separate the units would likely degrade in salt water over time.

Steel has been used for ship building for decades. It can also bang against each other over and over without degradation. Also, polyurea adheres best to steel, which is what I would use for coating to protect from salt water.
I address the reason for steel in my design outline: https://discuss.seasteading.org/t/my-viva-vivas-seastead-design/921/2

I, also, would prefer steel over concrete. But the expense of steel would be prohibitive right now, at the beginning.

I say start small, and use concrete. Gradually convert to steel as people come on board and add their funds.

Of course, if funds aren't a problem, do the steel right from the start.

Set it up this way, with the idea of conversion in mind, so that it is built in a way that can be converted more easily.

Cool

The cost for the steel required for my initial prototype would be less than $10k. For me that is not cost prohibitive.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: Elwar on March 07, 2017, 12:49:17 AM

Quote from: BADecker on March 06, 2017, 09:38:17 PM

Concrete hulled pontoon boats are the cheapest to make. No? Cool

Yes. Concrete is the cheapest and most resilient material against salt water. Most seasteaders choose that as their material. I am fairly certain that The Seasteading Institute plans on creating huge 50 meters platforms out of concrete.

Concrete hulled pontoon boats would be good if they are separate from each other. But concrete is fragile when it bangs against concrete over and over. It would be very difficult to attach them together for a large platform. Anything that would be flexible and strong enough to separate the units would likely degrade in salt water over time.

Steel has been used for ship building for decades. It can also bang against each other over and over without degradation. Also, polyurea adheres best to steel, which is what I would use for coating to protect from salt water.
I address the reason for steel in my design outline: https://discuss.seasteading.org/t/my-viva-vivas-seastead-design/921/2

I, also, would prefer steel over concrete. But the expense of steel would be prohibitive right now, at the beginning.

I say start small, and use concrete. Gradually convert to steel as people come on board and add their funds.

Of course, if funds aren't a problem, do the steel right from the start.

Set it up this way, with the idea of conversion in mind, so that it is built in a way that can be converted more easily.

Cool

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: BADecker on March 06, 2017, 09:38:17 PM

Concrete hulled pontoon boats are the cheapest to make. No? Cool

Yes. Concrete is the cheapest and most resilient material against salt water. Most seasteaders choose that as their material. I am fairly certain that The Seasteading Institute plans on creating huge 50 meters platforms out of concrete.

Concrete hulled pontoon boats would be good if they are separate from each other. But concrete is fragile when it bangs against concrete over and over. It would be very difficult to attach them together for a large platform. Anything that would be flexible and strong enough to separate the units would likely degrade in salt water over time.

Steel has been used for ship building for decades. It can also bang against each other over and over without degradation. Also, polyurea adheres best to steel, which is what I would use for coating to protect from salt water.
I address the reason for steel in my design outline: https://discuss.seasteading.org/t/my-viva-vivas-seastead-design/921/2

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: coolcoinz on March 06, 2017, 06:55:33 AM

Just two things I'd miss if I chose to live like that are space to walk around and freedom to buy stuff I need at any moment.
What if you get sick and need medicine that you don't have in stock? What if a panel controller breaks and you are left with no lights and no way to cook food? Where do you get spare parts and how long will it take?

Initially it would be no different than living on a sailboat moored out in the water. You order your parts on Amazon, have it shipped to an address at a harbor address or marina, you take a dingy to the marina and get your supplies.

With many people on the seasteads, there will likely be someone going back and forth almost daily. It would likely be commonplace for people to pick up someone else's mail.

Elwar

legendary

Activity: 3598

Merit: 2386

Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: RJX on March 06, 2017, 04:45:31 AM

I like the idea. So how would one set about governing an island like this? I remember a simpsons episode where they instated a mandatory conga-line for people that broke the rules.

How do you see that? How would conflicts be resolved?

As a libertarian I have my own ideas of governance but considering the first seastead will be within the waters of a nation, there is not much point in deciding now with people who don't actually live on the seastead. I would leave such things to be determined by those who actually take the action of uprooting their lives and live on the seastead. They would know best how things should be run. The initial governance would be under the host nation's governance.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Concrete hulled pontoon boats are the cheapest to make. No? Cool

DrPepperJC

member

Activity: 118

Merit: 100

Quote from: Mometaskers on March 06, 2017, 01:42:25 PM

Quote from: Elwar on March 06, 2017, 01:57:54 AM

Quote from: Mometaskers on March 05, 2017, 04:04:23 PM

This is a very interesting idea. There are some things I'd be concerned about though. How easy would it be to fly of from the stead? Someone might need an emergency procedure done that doctors in the island can't perform requiring a trip back to the mainland. Also, how fast can these thing be moved? If you build them anywhere in the Pacific you'd have to move them a safe distance from projected paths of typhoons. Even far from all the winds and rain of those pesky things, they'd churn up the water, risking the safety of the islands.

Typhoons and hurricanes do not exist on the equator.

Well I hope it stay that way. I live in the Philippines and we have a love-hate relationship with typhoons so it was the first thing I started to worry about when I thought about living on water. So basically, after the units are made, it could be placed anywhere on that storm-less band? Are you thinking of multiple settlements on that area? I was wondering where would be the perfect spot that's far enough from any country but close enough to fly to a city for medical emergencies.

Quote from: coolcoinz on March 06, 2017, 06:55:33 AM

Just two things I'd miss if I chose to live like that are space to walk around and freedom to buy stuff I need at any moment.
What if you get sick and need medicine that you don't have in stock? What if a panel controller breaks and you are left with no lights and no way to cook food? Where do you get spare parts and how long will it take?

I suppose each unit would have their own solar panels. Maybe they can just hook up their electric stove to it should any central generator fail.

There are also remote islands on which people live and have long since adapted to such a life. They have other priorities and ways of survival. So I do not see any problems with that.

Mometaskers

hero member

Activity: 1764

Merit: 584

Quote from: Elwar on March 06, 2017, 01:57:54 AM

Quote from: Mometaskers on March 05, 2017, 04:04:23 PM

This is a very interesting idea. There are some things I'd be concerned about though. How easy would it be to fly of from the stead? Someone might need an emergency procedure done that doctors in the island can't perform requiring a trip back to the mainland. Also, how fast can these thing be moved? If you build them anywhere in the Pacific you'd have to move them a safe distance from projected paths of typhoons. Even far from all the winds and rain of those pesky things, they'd churn up the water, risking the safety of the islands.

Typhoons and hurricanes do not exist on the equator.

Well I hope it stay that way. I live in the Philippines and we have a love-hate relationship with typhoons so it was the first thing I started to worry about when I thought about living on water. So basically, after the units are made, it could be placed anywhere on that storm-less band? Are you thinking of multiple settlements on that area? I was wondering where would be the perfect spot that's far enough from any country but close enough to fly to a city for medical emergencies.

Quote from: coolcoinz on March 06, 2017, 06:55:33 AM

Just two things I'd miss if I chose to live like that are space to walk around and freedom to buy stuff I need at any moment.
What if you get sick and need medicine that you don't have in stock? What if a panel controller breaks and you are left with no lights and no way to cook food? Where do you get spare parts and how long will it take?

I suppose each unit would have their own solar panels. Maybe they can just hook up their electric stove to it should any central generator fail.

coolcoinz

legendary

Activity: 2814

Merit: 1192

Just two things I'd miss if I chose to live like that are space to walk around and freedom to buy stuff I need at any moment.
What if you get sick and need medicine that you don't have in stock? What if a panel controller breaks and you are left with no lights and no way to cook food? Where do you get spare parts and how long will it take?

RJX

legendary

Activity: 1078

Merit: 1003

I like the idea. So how would one set about governing an island like this? I remember a simpsons episode where they instated a mandatory conga-line for people that broke the rules.

How do you see that? How would conflicts be resolved?

Topic: Seasteading - page 12. (Read 26903 times)