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Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 333. (Read 901368 times)

member
Activity: 84
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September 21, 2015, 10:18:49 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

The Lord created all of humanity. He loves us all beyond anything we can imagine. The best example is a parent loving his or her child, but it's so far beyond that. He made us in the womb. Psalm 139:13

He wants EVERYONE saved, because He loves us so much. That's why Jesus dying on the cross is such a big deal. He died so anyone can be saved from death. Plus Hitler was demonically oppressed. And though he did what he did (and shouldn't have), he was certainly egged on and led down the wrong path.
I understand the whole concept. Believe me I do. I just think it's not a very good one and why other religions have it better. If a person knows that killing is a sin and continues to do it UNDER the name of God. Then I'm not sure why he should be let into God's heaven.

If he continued to kill, he would not be Christian. Once you get born again, you'd ask to be filled with the Holy Spirit, and it would change your heart of stone, to a flesh heart, figuratively. You would then, be convicted (have a conscience) telling you it's wrong, and would either follow Jesus's teachings and start getting away from all sin, or fall away and not be Christian (saved) anymore. Those who fall away from the teachings can continue to call themselves Christian and sin, but Jesus will not save them.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

From what you've said though, he can kill as much as he wants. But if he wholeheartedly believes that the lord is the true savior, then he will be saved.
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
September 21, 2015, 10:15:41 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

The Lord created all of humanity. He loves us all beyond anything we can imagine. The best example is a parent loving his or her child, but it's so far beyond that. He made us in the womb. Psalm 139:13

He wants EVERYONE saved, because He loves us so much. That's why Jesus dying on the cross is such a big deal. He died so anyone can be saved from death. Plus Hitler was demonically oppressed. And though he did what he did (and shouldn't have), he was certainly egged on and led down the wrong path.
I understand the whole concept. Believe me I do. I just think it's not a very good one and why other religions have it better. If a person knows that killing is a sin and continues to do it UNDER the name of God. Then I'm not sure why he should be let into God's heaven.

If he continued to kill, he would not be Christian. Once you get born again, you'd ask to be filled with the Holy Spirit, and it would change your heart of stone, to a flesh heart, figuratively. You would then, be convicted (have a conscience) telling you it's wrong, and would either follow Jesus's teachings and start getting away from all sin, or fall away and not be Christian (saved) anymore. Those who fall away from the teachings can continue to call themselves Christian and sin, but Jesus will not save them.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 10:14:40 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

The Lord created all of humanity. He loves us all beyond anything we can imagine. The best example is a parent loving his or her child, but it's so far beyond that. He made us in the womb. Psalm 139:13

He wants EVERYONE saved, because He loves us so much. That's why Jesus dying on the cross is such a big deal. He died so anyone can be saved from death. Plus Hitler was demonically oppressed. And though he did what he did (and shouldn't have), he was certainly egged on and led down the wrong path.
I understand the whole concept. Believe me I do. I just think it's not a very good one and why other religions have it better. If a person knows that killing is a sin and continues to do it UNDER the name of God. Then I'm not sure why he should be let into God's heaven.

Part of that answer is that God requires perfection. Simply the fact of our impure genetics damns us all.

Smiley
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 10:10:41 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

The Lord created all of humanity. He loves us all beyond anything we can imagine. The best example is a parent loving his or her child, but it's so far beyond that. He made us in the womb. Psalm 139:13

He wants EVERYONE saved, because He loves us so much. That's why Jesus dying on the cross is such a big deal. He died so anyone can be saved from death. Plus Hitler was demonically oppressed. And though he did what he did (and shouldn't have), he was certainly egged on and led down the wrong path.
I understand the whole concept. Believe me I do. I just think it's not a very good one and why other religions have it better. If a person knows that killing is a sin and continues to do it UNDER the name of God. Then I'm not sure why he should be let into God's heaven.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 10:09:45 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

I don't have a clue about Hitler. I was using him as an "if" example.

Nobody can save himself. If somebody could, he would start by living for a few hundred years. Are we aware of anyone who is alive and at least 200-years-old? No! If there are any, they are not telling. Most of us die, it seems, before 100.

The point is, nobody can save himself. We need someone or something to do it for us, or we are lost.

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
September 21, 2015, 10:07:11 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.

The Lord created all of humanity. He loves us all beyond anything we can imagine. The best example is a parent loving his or her child, but it's so far beyond that. He made us in the womb. Psalm 139:13

He wants EVERYONE saved, because He loves us so much. That's why Jesus dying on the cross is such a big deal. He died so anyone can be saved from death. Plus Hitler was demonically oppressed. And though he did what he did (and shouldn't have), he was certainly egged on and led down the wrong path.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 10:03:01 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley

Which is obviously a flaw. People like that should not be saved just because he believes in the sacrifice of Jesus. If you believe that Hitler should belong in heaven, then I don't know why I'm even having this conversation with you.
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
September 21, 2015, 10:02:03 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

All sin is as detestable as another. There will be no speck of evil in Heaven, and that means we must be 100% clear of sin, and no one is. That means everyone on earth needs Jesus to wash away the sin. It's not a matter of being less dirty than others, it's about being 100% clean.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 10:00:22 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?

There is rumor, and strong evidence here and there, that Hitler made it to Argentina after WWII, and died there in his 90s.

If Hitler turned to Jesus in repentance for his crimes, and accepted that God would forgive him because of the sacrifice Jesus did on the cross, even Hitler would be saved.

Smiley
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 09:56:20 PM

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley

I find that to be a flaw. A murder, rapist, or mass killer could be a Christian. After killing thousands of people, he/she should still be granted access to heaven where everything is great?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 09:52:09 PM

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life. 

Smiley

I'm talking about the main message. Obviously the minor details are going to be different. In almost every religion, it would tell you do be good and in the end, you will reach salvation if you 'followed the rules' in this life.

Are you implying that eternal salvation or damnation is a minor detail?

Smiley

If you think that's what I was implying, you obviously need to reread my post. In almost every religion, there is salvation or damnation... you can't deny that. Christianity isn't the only special one that offers such promises.

Okay. We can get mixed up on words a little once in a while. Christianity is the only religion where salvation itself is given by God as a simple and pure gift, if the person accepts it. All other religions that offer salvation have the individual working for it a bit at least.

Smiley
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 09:30:17 PM

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life. 

Smiley

I'm talking about the main message. Obviously the minor details are going to be different. In almost every religion, it would tell you do be good and in the end, you will reach salvation if you 'followed the rules' in this life.

Are you implying that eternal salvation or damnation is a minor detail?

Smiley

If you think that's what I was implying, you obviously need to reread my post. In almost every religion, there is salvation or damnation... you can't deny that. Christianity isn't the only special one that offers such promises.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 09:25:00 PM

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life. 

Smiley

I'm talking about the main message. Obviously the minor details are going to be different. In almost every religion, it would tell you do be good and in the end, you will reach salvation if you 'followed the rules' in this life.

Are you implying that eternal salvation or damnation is a minor detail?

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
September 21, 2015, 09:24:14 PM

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life.  

Smiley

I'm talking about the main message. Obviously the minor details are going to be different. In almost every religion, it would tell you do be good and in the end, you will reach salvation if you 'followed the rules' in this life.

That's BADecker's point. Christianity teaches salvation by grace, not by works and it's not a minor difference, it's the main message.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 09:22:57 PM

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life. 

Smiley

I'm talking about the main message. Obviously the minor details are going to be different. In almost every religion, it would tell you do be good and in the end, you will reach salvation if you 'followed the rules' in this life.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 09:21:45 PM
The main problem with religion is everyone thinks their god is THE god.   Undecided

But how can you blame them? They're taught to believe in their God and told what to believe ever since they were a child. It's very hard to change someone's views when they've been told the same thing their whole life.

Not true. Some of you atheists were good, God-of-the-Bible believers at one time. Now you have your own religion that expresses that you are God. It shows by the decision you make to not accept the god of the Bible in the face of strong evidence that He exists.

Smiley

For however much strong evidence exists that there is a God, there is an equal amount of evidence to prove that God doesn't exist.

Perhaps. But there are 3 scientific laws that absolutely prove that God exists. They don't say that He is the God of the Bible, but if you know the Bible, you will see that the Bible God makes total sense with regard to the fact that God exists the way that the 3 scientific laws prove Him to exist.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 09:18:13 PM
The main problem with religion is everyone thinks their god is THE god.   Undecided

But how can you blame them? They're taught to believe in their God and told what to believe ever since they were a child. It's very hard to change someone's views when they've been told the same thing their whole life.

Sure, it may be true for some, but it is not true for all people;
some people come to believe in ONE God through their own efforts at self-education.
I am an example of one who formerly did not believe, but sought the truth and did find it;
it is not all that unusual, my friend; not everyone who believes is brainwashed from birth. Wink
There are even famous atheists who change their way of thinking; one example is:

Antony Flew, a champion of atheist beliefs for more than 50 years. In a news article titled "Atheist Discovers 'The Science of God'": "One of Britain's most prominent atheists has decided that God might exist after all. Professor Antony Flew now believes there is scientific evidence supporting the theory of some sort of intelligence behind the creation the universe. Professor Flew, 81, a professor emeritus of philosophy at the University of Reading, said that this was the only explanation for the origin of life ... "I'm thinking of a God very different from the God of the Christian and far and away from the God of Islam, because both are depicted as omnipotent Oriental despots - cosmic Saddam Husseins," he said in his new video, "Has Science Discovered God?"

The problem with religion is that it attempts to separate the human from God;
God resides within you, everyone is capable of following the golden rule, it is ingrained into human consciousness.
All monotheists acknowledge only ONE God, so they are really all talking about the same intelligence as described by Anthony Flew above.

What made you believe in your God and not some other God? In the end, don't they all practically give the same message?

Actually, the Christian religion is virtually the ONLY religion that has God saving people through the sacrifice of His Son. Virtually all other religions have people saving themselves by what they do, even if that salvation is only for this life. 

Smiley
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
September 21, 2015, 09:16:28 PM
The main problem with religion is everyone thinks their god is THE god.   Undecided

But how can you blame them? They're taught to believe in their God and told what to believe ever since they were a child. It's very hard to change someone's views when they've been told the same thing their whole life.

Not true. Some of you atheists were good, God-of-the-Bible believers at one time. Now you have your own religion that expresses that you are God. It shows by the decision you make to not accept the god of the Bible in the face of strong evidence that He exists.

Smiley

For however much strong evidence exists that there is a God, there is an equal amount of evidence to prove that God doesn't exist.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
September 21, 2015, 09:15:19 PM
The main problem with religion is everyone thinks their god is THE god.   Undecided

But how can you blame them? They're taught to believe in their God and told what to believe ever since they were a child. It's very hard to change someone's views when they've been told the same thing their whole life.

Not true. Some of you atheists were good, God-of-the-Bible believers at one time. Now you have your own religion that expresses that you are God. It shows by the decision you make to not accept the god of the Bible in the face of strong evidence that He exists.

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
September 21, 2015, 09:15:07 PM
It's really not that they hate it. It's just what they believe in. It's the same effect as that of religious people. If someone tries to tell you that your views are wrong, youre going to feel some type of way

Let's not forget an atheist started this thread because he hated religion. It wasn't started from a religious person.

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WHY DO ATHEISTS (like me) HATE RELIGION ?
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