Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 341. (Read 901520 times)

We can agree on this, though:

You have no evidence that my beliefs are demonic and have not taken responsibility upon yourself to rationally evaluate ANY of the writings, so your "belief" is made in total ignorance.

So, we can agree that you are not using reason, and that you know nothing about my beliefs.

I hope that by my use of reason, I can convince others that these three beliefs are actually big lies that have yet to be proven:
1) "Jesus" is the savior of humanity and you only need to accept him to "enter heaven".
2) Darwin's theory, since it is based on three fallacious “gaps” in reasoning that were pointed out in 1873 and remain unchanged to this day, as explained here: http://www.lloydpye.com/essay_interventiontheory.htm
3) Integrity of the Bible.

Answering you is not the point. Coming up with an answer for you on these issues, I feel, is pointless because you won't change your mind. And you won't change mine on this issue. So we can just agree to disagree.

Which book did you read through completely?

These teachings come from God. Do you have proof otherwise?
I told this thread that the Biblical story about sacrificing Isaac is not of God, for God would not terrorize a child to teach a man a lesson. Do you care to rebut this and do you have a similar example from my teachings?

It is "fundamentalist" Christians who make God an "alien" by believing in a separate "savior" who will take all of the responsibility for obeying God (even though God resides within you), and do so without any basis in reason OR the Bible. If this were not so, then my 6 questions would be easy to answer.

I asked 6 questions to clear up my confusion because I could not find Biblical or rational support of a "savior":
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12452294

What is fascinating to me is that anomalous phenomena are connected.

Principles of quantum physics support NDE concepts, [including] the properties of (a) light, (b) a multi-dimensional reality, (c) zero point field, (d) quantum interconnectivity, (e) quantum consciousness, (f ) quantum synchronicity, (g) space and time interconnectivity, (h) time travel, (i ) teleportation, (j ) non-locality, (k) singularities and the concept of (l ) subjectivity.

See these two points:
http://www.near-death.com/science/evidence.html#a22
http://www.near-death.com/science/evidence.html#a37

How would you explain the evidence supporting rebirth?
http://www.near-death.com/science/evidence.html

Very astute observation.
I might add that these three beliefs are big ones that have yet to be proven:
1) "Jesus" is the savior of humanity and you only need to accept him to "enter heaven".
2) Darwin's theory, since it is based on three fallacious “gaps” in reasoning that were pointed out in 1873 and remain unchanged to this day, as explained here: http://www.lloydpye.com/essay_interventiontheory.htm
3) Integrity of the Bible.

totally agree with you well said

Don't act like I didn't read through all that when we originally discussed things. I did my research. As you can see no one else seems to even call you on the fact that your info comes from an "alien".

You have no evidence that my beliefs are demonic and have not taken responsibility upon yourself to rationally evaluate ANY of the writings, so your "belief" is made in total ignorance.

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."--Aristotle

I am keeping this short so that you can focus on the most obvious point of disagreement.

MMH,
Read about the Laws of God/Creation in full, so that you don't have to claim ignorance or misunderstanding.

Im against no religion here.

However I am a most scientific person.   I need proof of things.

Anyways, I don't believe in a load of the rituals some religions have.  I see some religions as money makers only.  A job for some and they need donators.

I don't see how there can be for instance Christianity but yet there be different variations of it where each church believe in something similar but different.  There should be one.

Way to many things are unknown.  I think there is more to quantum physics then we know.  Which is true.
But with that being said I believe people tend to put it on religion because they do not understand it.   They see something happen and they call it a miracle.  When what it was was not understood and anomaly I should say.  So being as it was not understood.   God had to have done it.  The world is way to messed up for religion to have anything to do with it.  Unless god as a wicked sense of humor.

Just makes you think what is out there.  I am more opened minded to things unknown then what is known but not actually proven.  Things like that tend to be lie.

Not being weird here.  But I could say I am a God.  I am sure there are aleast a few people out there I could make believe it.  which as has happened in many cults in the past.  If this is true which it is.  I just made my own religion and there ya go.  Who says its not the same for all other religions.  There is no proof of any of them being totally legit and yes this includes Christianity.

Science demands verifiable evidence which can be reproduced again and again under experimental situations. Dr. Jim Whinnery, of the National Warfare Institute, thought he was simply studying the effects of G forces on fighter pilots. He had no idea he would revolutionize the field of consciousness studies by providing experimental proof that NDEs are real. The pilots were placed in huge centrifuges and spun at tremendous speeds. After they lost consciousness, after they went into seizures, after they lost all muscle tone, when the blood stopped flowing in their brains, only then would they suddenly have a return to conscious awareness. They had "dreamlets" as Dr. Whinnery calls them. These dreamlets are similar to near-death experiences and they often involved a sense of separation from the physical body. A typical dreamlet involved a pilot leaving his physical body and traveling to a sandy beach, where he looked directly up at the sun. The pilots would remark that death is very pleasant

i did answer your question..
I said it could be the brains way of making you comfortable before you die ..
just like when you have a bad accident you don.t feel nothing until 10 to 15 mins after then the pain comes..
like these pilots said death felt comfortable..a pain blocker could it be..
remember i am an NDE ..i will say the feeling was like going home.. WHY YOU ASK..i don.t know why i was just going home..A NEED TO GO HOME..
we are humans the brain acts the same way as other brains
like how we move our arms the brain tells the arm to move so it moves just like most brains..
so its no surprise to say that when we are dying the brain does the same process to make us feel comfortable before we die..just you might see your mum and i will see my mum if i am dying..
we all dream..you must of had a dream were its felt so real..or you have had a dream and its been so good you try go back asleep to go back into your dream..
well the same could go for death..A PAIN BLOCKER
But because i have had an NDE does not mean there is a god ..plus say there was an after life why would there still be a god..
would this not be just what happens to humans after they die..

After reading I feel most of the atheist dont hate religion itself but what put the off religion is the religious customs,rituals and laws that are associated with religion

Deliverance, evil spirits (demons), prayer working, getting out of "sleep paralysis" just by saying Jesus's name, etc. Nothing that would convince anyone else that God exists.


You're the one who believes in the teachings of an "alien" right? I don't agree with that philosophy. I believe it was demonic, to get people to not be saved.

Everyone has full responsibility for what they choose to do or not, but they can either be a slave to their sin and continue to do it, even if they wanted to stop, or stop with the help of Jesus, because He frees us. Matthew only says those doing the will of the Father will get in, he doesn't say all who do the will of the Father will get in. I'm not going to debate that though, I know there's a line that talks about people later being judged by works, but those aren't the elect who get to live with Jesus for 1,000 years and they have to go through the wrath of God part, so it's really not preferable to go through all that and do good works and hope it works out, versus just believing that Jesus came to save us. But that's not a good reason to believe in God, so whatever. I'm not going to get into a long discussion with you. I don't believe you'll actually change your mind on this issue, so we have to agree to disagree as I did the last time I talked with you here.

God's people DIE for lack of knowledge, but the truth can set us free. So, let us reason about the truth! I have doubts about this "savior" doctrine; I hope you can clarify.

MMH, won't you Please tell us:

1) where Emmanuel actually suggested he was my savior? *
2) how such a belief is not magical thinking?
3) how you can still have full responsibility for your life if someone else has taken that burden?
4) why didn't Emmanuel explicitly say that one must believe in him and accept him as one’s “personal savior” to get to “heaven” while he was alive over and over again?
5) Why must Man have interpreters and go-betweens, authorities other than self and "saviors" to take his burden and "save even his soul"? Is it because you think Man is separate from God and that God does not reside within you?
6) Since Matthew 7:17-21 refutes the notion that mere faith suffices for entrance into the kingdom of heaven, and even calling Jesus "Lord" is not enough; how can this possibly be reconciled with the doctrine of Paul which you promote?

* Since the ending of Mark was probably added a long time after the gospel was written and is not considered by scholars to be authentic, and this would include Mark 16:16, could you please take note of this fact in your answer to my question of "where did Emmanuel actually suggest he was my savior?"

I will post this link again for your education:
http://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/15353/did-jesus-actually-ever-say-if-you-dont-believe-in-me-you-go-to-hell

About that evidence... I am still waiting for your reply to the 52 points of evidence that support life-after-death; it is an important starting point in our discussion. To be rational means that one can intelligently evaluate new ideas when presented. SO, are you a clever thinker? What is your evaluation of this evidence?

http://www.near-death.com/science/evidence.html

We need to start our own religion, and pass around the glue and pray for whatever god we want!

That's what thousands of people do every year.  

what like a climax thats not god what did you experience then..

I didn't say I "saw" anything. I've had experiences and knowledge. But as I said people who don't believe in God will not believe in anyone's personal experiences. They want "proof". You said it yourself. Proof to one person is not proof to another. And no matter what, science can't prove anything either because everything they know could be a program like in the matrix. The best way to have personal proof, is to accept Jesus as your Lord and savior, and ask Him to fill you with the Holy Spirit. But it's not the best reason. The best reason to get "saved" is because you're sick and tired of being a slave to sin and want to be free. Jesus sets us free from the bondage if we want to be free.

what have you experienced to make you believe in god ..Do tell..what did you see..

YOU CAN STILL GET THICK ATHEIST  
IF YOUR A CLEVER THINKER..you want proof..To see it with your own eyes..
evidence.. I AM A FREETHINKER IRRELIGIOUS PERSON..

I've had experiences and knowledge showing me proof. But those with hardened hearts who disbelieve are not going to experience Him like that, they're being kept behind a veil that doesn't let the light in. There are so many things the bible has predicted, and so many anti-Christian (in particular) hatred movements that make me wonder why people can't see it's the Truth. There's no reason to be so anti-Christian if it was just another religion. Just IMHO.

this is the way i think about god..
if you were my friend and you said to me i have just won 1 million pounds..i would say oh yer right what ever..and i would not believe you..but if you showed me it then i would have to believe you..

well people have been saying all my life there is a god but not 1 person on this planet has showed me him yet ..nor has he showed him self to me.. Have you seen him MMH...