Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 481. (Read 123825 times)

Of course, I could have attempted to flesh this out a bit more, because we may well have various incoming cash that may or may not vary, and we have various monthly expenses and some can be deferred and so we can also project these out for 6 months and or even for a couple of years.. and of course, the upcoming 1-3 months are going to be more important than the further out months with an ability to be more loosey goosey with the numbers the further out the timeline, but if you were too loosey goosey with your numbers and you overly estimated (rather than being conservative 6-24 months out), you may well end up finding when some of those loose numbers have to be tightened up that you are running into cashflow problems because you had projected out in ways that ended up contributed to causing your own crunches late down the road.


Even though you might frame these goals in terms of an actual bitcoin number that you might be aiming for based on how many you already have, your whole approach may end up changing based on how many BTC that you are actually holding and whether you are near or far from your BTC accumulation goal.. and maybe even someone who currently has accumulated 1 BTC over the past 4 years .. may well have a plan to try to get up to 2-3 BTC within the next 5-10 years, whether or not that is realistic.. but at least such person is trying to account for where s/he is at and where s/he is wanting to attempt to get to.



Some other investments are more liquid than others, and there can be current value estimations that likely will need to consider how liquid they might be, and then like you suggested, other investments may or may not go up in value... and for someone new to bitcoin, they might consider how much they want to allocate into bitcoin based on their other investments, so if someone might have had been building an investment portfolio for more than 8 years (let's use your forum registration date, naira), then maybe that person might have gotten up to $100k size of all of his her investments.. and maybe those investments might be giving lower value to assets that are less liquid within the investment portfolio, so that person might aim to have anywhere between 1% and 25% into bitcoin. .. which shows that having $25k into bitcoin (right around 1 bitcoin) might be on the relatively aggressive end of the scale for such an investor, but sometimes even with a historical investment timeline of 8 years, sometimes it could take a while to reach high levels of investment or even any kind of need to diversify into other assets, so in your case if you mentioned that you own some property, and then maybe you have cash and bitcoin, so maybe your bitcoin investment might be a much higher than 25% allocation, and that might be o.k. too.. so if you might have some difficulties in terms of being able to in vest more than 10% of your income into bitcoin (or any other investments), if you are going at 10% of your income going into bitcoin, it still might take you 10 years to invest up to the equivalent of your yearly salary, and surely then you hope that whatever you had chosen to invest into is appreciating at a great enough rate in order to give you more than 1 years salary in your investment portfolio by the time you get to 10 years of building such investment portfolio.


Fair enough.

This will be very interesting, Cash Flow is the most important thing that is rightly mentioned to measure our consistency in accumulating Bitcoin based on a certain time span and you could say this point supports DCA to run well. Personally, I still can't be consistent because as a manager I have to be able to prioritize the needs of my beloved child above my own interests. Haha

The second point, definitely the target, or usually one of us prefers the more Bitcoin held the better. But there's no denying that there are people out there who have some kind of predetermined peak target for example Hodl 1 Bitcoin is enough. For me personally, it is still before I can determine the maximum target of ownership.

The third point, other investments may for now only focus on buying a few meters of strategic land based on long-term prospects, the funds will have potential if it is located on the side of the road.

The rest of the points let someone break it down for all of us to liven up the discussion.

Yeah I think you have a point because I could remember on 13 may 2022 when Elon musk tweeted about Tesla plans to no longer accept Bitcoin payment immediately the Bitcoin price fell from $54,819 to $45,700, with that it provides an opportunity for him to enter the market to buy larger amounts of Bitcoin and sells as the price goes up, with that method I believe he makes a thousand and millions of dollars even on January 2021 he also Tweeted about doge coin and immediately the price went 300% uptrend in four hours before it starts dropping back, and he must have accumulated enough dogecoin before he tweeted so as to enable him sell on higher price.

I guess that you are making a certain kind of point with the chart regarding ongoing wrong bitcoin price predictions, but wouldn't it also be a good idea to provide a link to the chart so that we can see from where you get it and maybe some other context for the various dots within the chart?


I will look at your two other threads, but seems quite incoherent to be suggesting (and even arguing) that bitcoin is in a bearish trend, especially if you attempt to look at actual context of where we are at... which seems to be a kind of in between stage.. that may or may not confirm whether we are out of the bearish trend that started from $69k (in November 2021) and down to the local low of $15,479 in November of 2022... so largely the move has been up.. . .and some current consolidating.. .. and sure maybe we might not end up getting out of the bear trend from $69 to $15,479 - but it still seems to be quite weird (and even misleading.. and too short-term focused.. sure traders love to get into these kinds of lame prognostications) to be labelling whatever has been happening in a kind of flip flopping way (which is to say.. now we are in bull, now we  are in bear, now we are back to bull and now we are back to bear.. blah blah blah nonsense) that makes little to no sense when considering the actual context.

It's been like for several years that this is no longer a speculation but really happening. That's why if there were some bad news for the past few days, there were for sure these big players that have bought already on the dip price.

I won't be surprised if he comes back and announces that he bought back and not just with a couple of millions but with another hundred millions to excite the market again.

That will drive the demand again even for just simple words of encouragement that he tells to the world for buying Bitcoin. But, we're not reliant on that as individual and long term investors.

Just look away, those who have been taking back their words and eating back their mockery will continue to do so. Bitcoin has shamed many people many times, this is not going to be new, it could only surprise when they continue their mockery and still get to be put to shame continually, that's folly. Even now, Bitcoin has not fallen to an alarming extent that any reasonable person would make a mockery of it, it's not like what happened in May 2021 that truly called for panic during the China banning and Elon Musk's betrayal. What happened recently is what could happen to any market where there are bear and bull seasons, it's nothing.

We are in the bearish trend and I knew this before it happened as crossing $29,400 convincingly could not mean well for the coin. Let's see how things unfold around $24,700-$25,000 this time. I strongly doubt if the market would breach the level convincingly, and if this is true, it won't be long before Bitcoin gets back on its feet and move around $30,000 even before the much-expected bull run that could see it hit $100,000 for the first time.

What if these guys do this to intentionally drop the price in order to buy low and sell high? We tend to look this guys only from one perspective but the truth is that, to them it is all about a game of profits. They don't attach emotions and are never loyal to anything. It might seem that they were proven wrong time and time again but they might actually be balancing their books in the whole thing.

If you pay close attention, you will noticed that Elon Musk seems to have deployed that method to cash out. Don't be surprise if he comes back again and accumulate Bitcoin citing one uncoherent reason for coming back... but then, he would have bought very low to sell high fee years from now. This guys are playing money game...

They said Bitcoin will "never recover".



Look at the red dots in that chart. After the recent "mini-crash", expect another few months of "it is dead"/doom and gloom towards Bitcoin from respected economists, the morons from legacy finance, and mere FUDsters. There are many of them, and ALL of them were always proven WRONG AGAIN AND AGAIN. Just HODL!

Yeah actually it may or may not be a barrier to them depending on their purpose which they may intend for it, looking at it on different pastpective some persons at that age could be looking for an avenue or a platform were they could invest their money in other to secure their children future because most persons at that age may also have ground children which they loved,  so referring them to Bitcoin will help them utilize the opportunity of investing ahead the future of his ground children with the belief that before they will come of age it would have yielded a good profit. This is also similar to a man I heard that bought some amount of Bitcoin for his children future, at least with this they would have something to start with when the time comes.

In otherwise it becomes a barrier Recomending Bitcoin to 70-80 years old because before they will start profiting it may take a long time of holding considering how volatile the market is and time may not really be on there side considering there age.

Wait, this is wrong. how do you equate DCA with trading?
In this case you should be able to distinguish trading and Investment because they have different meanings even though there is a buying factor but the purpose is different and trading has nothing to do with DCA.
I think we should be wiser in addressing a condition where you are currently on the wrong path when talking about investment and DCA but switching to trading.

To me it seems to come down to some individual specifics, but right from the start, we should be able to anticipate that age could have a BIG determining part, but not necessarily eliminate the person's determination regarding getting into bitcoin.

So if we look at the factors, they look like this:

When you invest into bitcoin, at minimum you should be attempting to consider:

1) cashflow,

2) how much bitcoin you have already accumulated,

3) other investments (including cash reserves),

4) view of bitcoin as compared with other investments,

5) timeline,

6) risk tolerance,

7) time, skills, goals (investment/lifestyle targets , which includes figuring out the extent that you are in BTC accumulation, maintenance or liquidation stage)

8 ) abilities to strategize, plan, research and learn along the way including tweaking strategies from time to time to consider:

           8 a)  trading, reallocating, use of leverage and/or financial instruments.

I am not going to say that some of these are not important, yet several of the top factors are more basic and some to the later factors such as 7 & 8 are a bit more mushy, and really 8 a) are more advanced strategies and sometimes still might need to be considered by someone getting in and/or out of bitcoin.

So age mostly affects timline, but surely we could see how age might affect each and every one of the factors, so we should not necessarily be too quick to judge why someone might need to modify their approach as compared with someone else, whether that is age or some other things that might be going on with that particular person at that particular time in their life.

You're right, but it's a shame you didn't read our previous conversation about Bitcoin both young and old. So this context has actually been resolved that the most important issue is in terms of the level of understanding, not the context of the age range. Actually it's all simple, just adjust it, bitcoin for anyone I agree.

Age is never a barrier to holding bitcoin or investing in it, bitcoin is not what the academic institutions can also analysis for justification over fiat for it acceptance but the relevance of bitcoin had made it all simple and applicable for everyone interested in learning or knowing what a decentralized digital currency is, there are many ways we could persay that bitcoin is what the world current economy situations wants without age limit just as fiat never have any age barrier for usage, bitcoin is for everyone, while everyone interested will learn the process and make an opportunity through its adoption.

After our conversation that very day, I sat down to reflect and flashback to my university days. I remember that some key computer related courses were taught be advanced men. Their wisdom and passion for impact was amazing and they taught algorithmic approach to modeling Engineering systems effortlessly.  I feel it will be a little incorrect to assume that appreciating and understanding Bitcoin and the underlying technology have anything to do with age. It is rather a matter of passion.

So I agree with you completely that the assumption of age limitation is not entirely correct. We can spread the knowledge of Bitcoin to the elderly who are even more attentive to learn than some young guys facing various forms of youthful distractions already.

FTFY

You did not really say anything wrong, yet many of us likely realize that we need to ongoingly attempt to account for the likelihood that an overwhelming majority of regular people (aka normies) do not have any coin or they are low coiners, and perhaps even active participants in this forum (including this thead) fit within a similar situation - except that probably if we are members of this forum and perhaps more actively involved in various forum threads, then we likely are a little further down the BTC accumulation path - as compared to the regular person.

It seems that part of the rationale behind this thread is attempting to emphasize various ways to make sure that each of us is erroring on the side of BTC accumulation - even at the same time as there likely are some decently varying ideas regarding which strategies are going to work best to ongoingly remain BTC accumulation/stacking focused.. so surely many of us who are active in this thread likely already agree on the fact we should have BTC accumulation/stacking goals even if we might not quite agree upon the various ways that we might better accomplish BTC accumulation in a way that we feel that we can maximize our own abilities to get the best (or better) bang for the buck... which there likely are not any real solutions to resolve that almost no matter what we do there is likely going to continue to be tensions in terms of each of us having questions about whether we might be doing a better job in accumulating BTC or might we be able to do better?


It seems to me that we need to be careful in terms of either being patronizing towards the eldery in terms of acting like we know something that they do not, even though it may well be the case that we do.. but surely everyone knows things that others do not know, so in that regard, there seems to always be quite a bit of value in terms of approaching elderly people and others in terms of their own agency and their own needs to make their own choices.

At the same time, if we are having any kind of conversation with anyone, whether elderly or not, there likely is a bit of a direction that is back and forth in terms of the conversation may well end up going in a variety of directions, and whenever we might be talking about finances, there may well be quite a bit of sensitivities in regards to the amount of information that we might have in regards to the various balances that anyone might be making and choosing (or not choosing) to disclose some of the details that we might have to make some estimations about how we might frame the subject..or the recommendation... that ultimately leaves them with the choices regarding how to get in, how much to put in and then maybe they might need more help in terms of setting up accounts, unless we are choosing to sell them bitcoin ourselves, which brings its own potential set of issues (not necessarily bad).


Sure there can be questions regarding how to treat direct in line family members but then also if we come to some kind of an agreement that we might even be holding their coins.. in the event that they might have some challenges when it comes to setting up their own accounts or their own ways of holding their corn.


Yeah of course, you can employ your own variation of DCA, but if you do not really understand what you are doing, it is likely best to attempt to employ a more strict variation of DCA first, and make sure that you understand the more strict variation of DCA before you start to get too fancy and then end up doing something that you call DCA but it really is not even close to what DCA should be.. but instead a kind of buying on dips or even a kind of gambling, but you call it DCA because you start out with DCA and then devolve into something else.


You seem to be describing that correctly.  So if you have a regular DCA set up, then you might have some dollars that you are holding in reserves, so when the BTC price dips, then you decide how much of that money in reserves that you are going to want to use to buy during the dip.. so if you are still ongoingly employing DCA and then also buying BTC on dips, then that would merely be a form of supplementing the DCA with buying on dips... and there is surely nothing wrong with those kinds of strategies, as long as you are able to figure out why they are different and then your education on the topic helps to inform you how many dollars that you would like to ongoingly dedicate (or reserve) for each of the practices.. and of course, you can change the amount of dollars that you dedicate to each category as your cashflow might change and also if you have situations in which your dollar reserves might build up to high amounts or become depleted more quickly than you had expected (or hoped).. so you can make adjustments to the amount of dollar value that you ongoingly try to maintain in each of the categories of your funding of your BTC accumulation strategies.


That's a good question regarding how involved any of us might get in terms of either giving advice and/or manageing the funds and/or having some discretion over the direction of the funds (like fiduciary duties).. so are we either gaining fiduciary duties or taking them upon ourselves when it comes to how involved that we might choose to get in the BTC accumulation and/or management of funds.


Take your trading bullshit to another thread, and sure your trading or whatever it is that you are describing might work.. who fucking cares? 

you are in the wrong thread to be framing trading as if you had been talking about DCA, when you are not talking about DCA.

You seem to be a disingenuine fuck to be presenting your ideas as if they were DCA.. and in the end you come back to clarify what you meand and then to explain that you had really been talking about trading.

..and some of us, including yours truly, attempted to give you some benefit of the doubt that you were actually talking about some kind of a DCA strategy..

I should have known better.


Fuck professionals.

Who gives any shits?

A lot of what we are trying to do is to figure out various ways that people can engage in fairly-straight forward strategies to accumulate BTC.... read the OP and the title of the thread.  It's about buying... and sure we interpret that to various kinds of accumulation.. and the more complicated that you end up making your accumulation, then the more difficult it becomes to employ whatever complicated formula that you are suggesting.


Again, who cares about the amount of money.  We have people who might have $1 per week or they might have $100 or they might have $1k or more who can employ basic BTC accumulation techniques, so who gives any shits about the supposed "BIG Balls" players who might happen to have more money .. blah blah blah.. fuck off with that shilling talk.  What do you want to sell, Agbamoni?  Are you trying to act like you have some kind of authority because you know people with a lot of money?


Fuck off with the trading bot talk too.  Either create your own thread, or go join a thread in which your trading bot talk is on topic.


I think that you are referring to my example of a $1,200 budget and placing them in 4 different price locations.

I think that I largely addressed this as a way that some kinds of buy order structures and plans are deficient and they may well cause panic because of their deficiencies, so merely dividing them into equal parts would not necessarily improve the deficiencies that I was trying to point out, but I agree with you that there are some benefits in terms of trying to stay somewhat consistent with amounts, once we might figure out other details, such as what are our increments, how much we have in our budget and how far down we want our buys to go in order to attempt to account for what we believe to be worse case scenarios (and perhaps even having enough of a budget to go beyond what we consider to be worse case scenarios).

And indeed this is a very good time to buy more than what we previously planned, do not hesitate to start because we can already see from the history of BTC movements over the past few months. Right now BTC is making a correction, and the price has now touched the support point in June yesterday and this is the third lowest support in 2023. This means that starting next month I am very confident that BTC will start its rise at least until it touches the resistance point in the last month at around $32k, but I hope that BTC will continue its rise. That's right, now is a very good opportunity to buy as much as possible and then hold it for at least the next few months if you are too afraid to face price fluctuations, now is a good step to apply technical analysis. I would strongly recommend that you start now, don't regret it when the opportunity is gone. Honestly, I have looked at the history of price movements since the beginning of 2023 and can conclude that now is the right time to stockpile more when the price is at the third lowest support this year, I see no doubt in this condition.

Well that's right, of course when someone has entered the elderly stage then most likely they will not take this too seriously, they will tend to see what benefits they get and maybe besides that whether they will immediately be able to enjoy the results or not, an elderly person has a mature mindset and if some facts about BTC cannot make them convinced then they will not jump into it and maybe not at all interested, while on the other hand they have to wait first with a fairly long time to be able to enjoy the benefits of BTC itself. That's right, on the other hand of course this will be a big hurdle for some people who will recommend it.
They are quite old and it makes sense that money is no longer the main thing for them because they just sit back and enjoy the rest of their lives, and the new technology about BTC might be the opportunity to make them feel interested in trying it. 

Well this can be fixed with the experience we have because of course we also realise that it would be very stupid to keep doing the same thing and on the other hand mistakes like this are quite common and I think almost everyone has done the same thing at least one or several times especially when they are new to investing and buying bitcoin.

Btw the division is quite good but I think we can still divide it equally such as with $300 in each purchase or DCA made or maybe make it $200 in one time it is also still possible.

Because if it is too big to make a purchase, we are worried that our consistency will decrease and this is precisely what makes DCA not work well.

DCA comes with various plans depending on how much someone knows about trading. I'm happy my plan has been good and it's been working for two years. It's easy, make the most of price changes by buying when it's low and selling when it's high. If you're unsure, the base order is the first investment amount you won't go over.


I'm glad you found this helpful and could understand and connect with it. I agree with you. If you read my earlier response again, I pointed out that this strategy is particularly effective for professionals. These experts often have a good amount of money to trade, sometimes on behalf of a company or a group of Bitcoin investors. To meet their target returns within a specific time, they need to use this strategy.

You know, Ryu, some people use trading bots for this purpose. It's a good approach too. With trading bots, you can input certain configurations and connect them to the exchange API you prefer. You set your initial investment amount and you're all set!

More simply, and from Bitcoin's technical viewpoint - As long as the transaction follows the consensus rules, it will be broadcasted and it will be included in the blocks for confirmation. No prejudice, no stereotypes, just Bitcoin transactions that you may approve or disapprove of.