[CHESS] FIDE Candidates Chess Tournament 2022 - page 6.

qwertyup23

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Quote from: KTChampions on April 15, 2023, 10:58:39 AM

Quote from: qwertyup23 on April 14, 2023, 06:30:14 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on April 13, 2023, 11:46:03 AM

Match for the title of world champion - 2023. Fourth game:

Ding Liren 1:0 Ian Nepomniachtchi

An unexpected victory for Liren which equalizes the position of both players. We can say that everything was decided by Nepomniachtchi's single mistake, but that doesn't matter anymore. Nepomniachtchi is very lucky that tomorrow is a day off and there will be no game - he is famous for his emotional instability and I would not be surprised if, after one lost game, he lost the second. Now he has time to recover.

You can see that on the exchange sacrifice with the rook, you can see Ding's hand shaking when he took that knight. You can clearly see the pressure among these players since a single mistake can cost you the whole game. I was not expecting Ian to lose on the fourth game but he definitely miscalculated when he placed his knight back.

Both players have a point respectively and they will become more careful with the games from now on. At the end of the day, I am rooting for Ding to win this title!

Today Nepomniachtchi won again Grin

I am surprised by such performance in games - usually at the level of grandmasters, draws are almost 80-90 percent, but here out of 5 games 3 turned out to be productive.
By the way, why are you rooting for Ding? If judged strictly formally, he is a cheater and got into the Candidates Tournament in a fraudulent way. I think it would be very unpleasant if he became a world champion.

Ohh I think calling him a cheater is very unfair- he qualified for the candidates due to Karjakin's ban from participating in this year's candidate so under the rules, he is the "substitute" for his place. Still, Ding was around top 3 when the candidates happened and calling him a "cheater" is very uncalled for.

Well, the game ended with Nepo winning this match. I really like what Giri mentioned during the commentating of the game in which he explained that playing with the black pieces is more difficult than white. You have to prepare for all kinds of preparations while white may play any kind of preparation to his liking.

Furthermore, I do think that this year's WC match contained more wins compared to past WC matches that happened.

KTChampions

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on April 14, 2023, 06:30:14 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on April 13, 2023, 11:46:03 AM

Match for the title of world champion - 2023. Fourth game:

Ding Liren 1:0 Ian Nepomniachtchi

An unexpected victory for Liren which equalizes the position of both players. We can say that everything was decided by Nepomniachtchi's single mistake, but that doesn't matter anymore. Nepomniachtchi is very lucky that tomorrow is a day off and there will be no game - he is famous for his emotional instability and I would not be surprised if, after one lost game, he lost the second. Now he has time to recover.

You can see that on the exchange sacrifice with the rook, you can see Ding's hand shaking when he took that knight. You can clearly see the pressure among these players since a single mistake can cost you the whole game. I was not expecting Ian to lose on the fourth game but he definitely miscalculated when he placed his knight back.

Both players have a point respectively and they will become more careful with the games from now on. At the end of the day, I am rooting for Ding to win this title!

Today Nepomniachtchi won again Grin

I am surprised by such performance in games - usually at the level of grandmasters, draws are almost 80-90 percent, but here out of 5 games 3 turned out to be productive.
By the way, why are you rooting for Ding? If judged strictly formally, he is a cheater and got into the Candidates Tournament in a fraudulent way. I think it would be very unpleasant if he became a world champion.

qwertyup23

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Quote from: KTChampions on April 13, 2023, 11:46:03 AM

Match for the title of world champion - 2023. Fourth game:

Ding Liren 1:0 Ian Nepomniachtchi

An unexpected victory for Liren which equalizes the position of both players. We can say that everything was decided by Nepomniachtchi's single mistake, but that doesn't matter anymore. Nepomniachtchi is very lucky that tomorrow is a day off and there will be no game - he is famous for his emotional instability and I would not be surprised if, after one lost game, he lost the second. Now he has time to recover.

You can see that on the exchange sacrifice with the rook, you can see Ding's hand shaking when he took that knight. You can clearly see the pressure among these players since a single mistake can cost you the whole game. I was not expecting Ian to lose on the fourth game but he definitely miscalculated when he placed his knight back.

Both players have a point respectively and they will become more careful with the games from now on. At the end of the day, I am rooting for Ding to win this title!

KTChampions

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Match for the title of world champion - 2023. Fourth game:

Ding Liren 1:0 Ian Nepomniachtchi

An unexpected victory for Liren which equalizes the position of both players. We can say that everything was decided by Nepomniachtchi's single mistake, but that doesn't matter anymore. Nepomniachtchi is very lucky that tomorrow is a day off and there will be no game - he is famous for his emotional instability and I would not be surprised if, after one lost game, he lost the second. Now he has time to recover.

KTChampions

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Quote from: wildan88 on April 11, 2023, 11:23:50 AM

The world championship is officially underway, but it's hard to take it very seriously. It's like organizing a World Cup without France and without Brazil. Because this year at the world chess championship Magnus Carlsen is missing, who himself did not feel like participating. The cause is not entirely known to me, but it seems that he no longer has any motivation to play another match because he would find the opposition too low. Somewhere understandable, but how are you going to tackle that problem? You could also see it as an achievement in itself and also as a challenge to continue to maintain this level that he is now called. And these players are ranked 2nd and 3rd in the world, right? Those aren't cookie cutters.

Bullshit. If a player does not have the physical or psychological strength to fight for the title, then this only means that he is weaker than the contenders. You can fantasize as much as you like on the topic "how he would win another match for the chess crown", but he turned out to be so weak that he could not even start it. Whether you like it or not, there are two strongest chess players in the match right now.

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Quote from: wildan88 on April 11, 2023, 11:23:50 AM

The world championship is officially underway, but it's hard to take it very seriously. It's like organizing a World Cup without France and without Brazil. Because this year at the world chess championship Magnus Carlsen is missing, who himself did not feel like participating. The cause is not entirely known to me, but it seems that he no longer has any motivation to play another match because he would find the opposition too low. Somewhere understandable, but how are you going to tackle that problem? You could also see it as an achievement in itself and also as a challenge to continue to maintain this level that he is now called. And these players are ranked 2nd and 3rd in the world, right? Those aren't cookie cutters.

The ambition seems to be gone at Carlsen. But that incident with Hans Niemann could also have something to do with it. I'm not saying it is, but it could be. Since that incident, Carlsen has emphatically indicated that he no longer finds playing a World Cup match interesting. He would only be interested in a World Cup match if his opponent would be Firouzja. Understandable, because that is perhaps the greatest talent, but can you demand that kind of thing as a world champion? In advance it is actually an exaggerated luxury that as a champion you only have to play the final, we don't see that tournament formula coming back in any other sport.

wildan88

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The world championship is officially underway, but it's hard to take it very seriously. It's like organizing a World Cup without France and without Brazil. Because this year at the world chess championship Magnus Carlsen is missing, who himself did not feel like participating. The cause is not entirely known to me, but it seems that he no longer has any motivation to play another match because he would find the opposition too low. Somewhere understandable, but how are you going to tackle that problem? You could also see it as an achievement in itself and also as a challenge to continue to maintain this level that he is now called. And these players are ranked 2nd and 3rd in the world, right? Those aren't cookie cutters.

KTChampions

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on April 10, 2023, 06:49:47 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on April 10, 2023, 01:38:12 PM

Already the second game of the match for the chess crown turned out to be productive and Nepomniachtchi won with black against Ding Liren.
What do you guys think - the outcome of the match is already a foregone conclusion? There have been very few cases in history when the balance of power has been reversed at this stage. Even taking into account that Nepomniachtchi can be unstable, I would rather believe that Ding Liren will completely fall apart (instability in difficult conditions is also his property) than that he can make a comeback.

With the very unfortunate loss of Ding, I think games from now on would be more interesting as we can expect lots of deviations from the main openers. After the first game, Ding mentioned that he is somehow feeling overwhelmed by the whole situation and there had been a wave of emotions on his part. I do think that these contribute to his overall mentally on this match which led to his loss on game 2.

Though this may be the case, I expect the games further to be more interesting since Ding has to play for the win. He cannot rely on main lines and short-draws as he needs to create imbalances on the position and play solid chess from now on as his back is against the wall right now.

Judging by his result in the grandmaster tournament in Wijk aan Zee, where Dinh Liren completely failed and took 3rd place from the bottom of the tournament table, he has little chance in "open" chess. Now a few draws would just be very beneficial for him, because maybe he would gain confidence and the will to endure and wait for Nepomniachtchi's mistakes. If now he goes into sharp positions and loses at least one more game, then the match can be considered completed. It would be an early risk.

qwertyup23

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Quote from: KTChampions on April 10, 2023, 01:38:12 PM

Already the second game of the match for the chess crown turned out to be productive and Nepomniachtchi won with black against Ding Liren.
What do you guys think - the outcome of the match is already a foregone conclusion? There have been very few cases in history when the balance of power has been reversed at this stage. Even taking into account that Nepomniachtchi can be unstable, I would rather believe that Ding Liren will completely fall apart (instability in difficult conditions is also his property) than that he can make a comeback.

With the very unfortunate loss of Ding, I think games from now on would be more interesting as we can expect lots of deviations from the main openers. After the first game, Ding mentioned that he is somehow feeling overwhelmed by the whole situation and there had been a wave of emotions on his part. I do think that these contribute to his overall mentally on this match which led to his loss on game 2.

Though this may be the case, I expect the games further to be more interesting since Ding has to play for the win. He cannot rely on main lines and short-draws as he needs to create imbalances on the position and play solid chess from now on as his back is against the wall right now.

KTChampions

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Already the second game of the match for the chess crown turned out to be productive and Nepomniachtchi won with black against Ding Liren.
What do you guys think - the outcome of the match is already a foregone conclusion? There have been very few cases in history when the balance of power has been reversed at this stage. Even taking into account that Nepomniachtchi can be unstable, I would rather believe that Ding Liren will completely fall apart (instability in difficult conditions is also his property) than that he can make a comeback.

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There's no need to be upset

Quote from: South Park on February 28, 2023, 03:10:21 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on February 25, 2023, 04:13:41 PM

Quote from: qwertyup23 on February 19, 2023, 04:45:08 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on February 19, 2023, 02:49:56 PM

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

Ohh this is interesting but I do understand on why it is the other way around- athletes should put themselves at high regard due to the nature, skill, and fame they put out on the world. They must uphold themselves as truthful to everyone especially considering the scrutiny they face. If they are considered or alleged to be cheated, it is up to them to prove their innocence.

As with the contention against Niemann, it is still being reviewed and investigated. Given the history of Niemann repeatedly cheating on tournaments, I would not be surprised if he cheated on his recent games also.

It's not about morals or ideals or anything. It's more of a math. If the criminal principle is applied in sports (not guilty until caught), then the sport will be instantly destroyed, since even one successful cheater out of 100 destroys the entire existing ecosystem of honest athletes. If you can "legally" run from doping commissioners, refuse to take tests, etc. then competing without doping will simply lose its meaning.

And this is even more true in chess, when it comes to doping it only increases the performance of the athlete and the more skill the sport requires the less effect the doping has on the sport, but in chess you could give a computer with a chess engine to a 5 year old kid and as long as you explained to them they only needed to copy the moves given by the computer and they followed those instructions they will beat even the world champion without any problem, so a very strong stance against cheating in this way needs to be implemented on chess.

that's true
even doping in sports it's really hard to pull out, requires training of specifics skills, time, and comes with much more risks

cheating in chess is much easier to accomplish and with smaller risks

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Quote from: KTChampions on February 25, 2023, 04:13:41 PM

Quote from: qwertyup23 on February 19, 2023, 04:45:08 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on February 19, 2023, 02:49:56 PM

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

Ohh this is interesting but I do understand on why it is the other way around- athletes should put themselves at high regard due to the nature, skill, and fame they put out on the world. They must uphold themselves as truthful to everyone especially considering the scrutiny they face. If they are considered or alleged to be cheated, it is up to them to prove their innocence.

As with the contention against Niemann, it is still being reviewed and investigated. Given the history of Niemann repeatedly cheating on tournaments, I would not be surprised if he cheated on his recent games also.

It's not about morals or ideals or anything. It's more of a math. If the criminal principle is applied in sports (not guilty until caught), then the sport will be instantly destroyed, since even one successful cheater out of 100 destroys the entire existing ecosystem of honest athletes. If you can "legally" run from doping commissioners, refuse to take tests, etc. then competing without doping will simply lose its meaning.

And this is even more true in chess, when it comes to doping it only increases the performance of the athlete and the more skill the sport requires the less effect the doping has on the sport, but in chess you could give a computer with a chess engine to a 5 year old kid and as long as you explained to them they only needed to copy the moves given by the computer and they followed those instructions they will beat even the world champion without any problem, so a very strong stance against cheating in this way needs to be implemented on chess.

KTChampions

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on February 19, 2023, 04:45:08 PM

Quote from: KTChampions on February 19, 2023, 02:49:56 PM

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

Ohh this is interesting but I do understand on why it is the other way around- athletes should put themselves at high regard due to the nature, skill, and fame they put out on the world. They must uphold themselves as truthful to everyone especially considering the scrutiny they face. If they are considered or alleged to be cheated, it is up to them to prove their innocence.

As with the contention against Niemann, it is still being reviewed and investigated. Given the history of Niemann repeatedly cheating on tournaments, I would not be surprised if he cheated on his recent games also.

It's not about morals or ideals or anything. It's more of a math. If the criminal principle is applied in sports (not guilty until caught), then the sport will be instantly destroyed, since even one successful cheater out of 100 destroys the entire existing ecosystem of honest athletes. If you can "legally" run from doping commissioners, refuse to take tests, etc. then competing without doping will simply lose its meaning.

Zackgeno96

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It's an interesting discussion about Hans Niemann cheating. But to what extent can we say with 100% certainty that he cheated. What would a judge say about this? The problem still remains that he has not been caught in the act, then it will be very difficult. In his performances after that he also played very well while he was checked by all arbitrators with a hand scanner. So in those games it actually seems impossible to me that he cheated, yet you don't know with the new technology. I'm not watching anything anymore. It is a pity that Carlsen has withdrawn from the World Cup.

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Quote from: KTChampions on February 19, 2023, 02:49:56 PM

Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on February 19, 2023, 02:22:33 PM

Perhaps what is most preoccupying the chess world right now is the performance of Niemann, who was accused of cheating a few months ago. No sanctions have yet been imposed. Would you say you are innocent until proven guilty? You can't find any hard evidence, or at least not that he was caught in the act. He is now also foiled at every tournament or a hand held metal detector is used to scan him. Shouldn't you invite him to tournaments because he has a bad name? Carlsen has already indicated that he does not want to play against Niemann and he may therefore not participate in a tournament in which Niemann also plays.

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

Ohh this is interesting but I do understand on why it is the other way around- athletes should put themselves at high regard due to the nature, skill, and fame they put out on the world. They must uphold themselves as truthful to everyone especially considering the scrutiny they face. If they are considered or alleged to be cheated, it is up to them to prove their innocence.

As with the contention against Niemann, it is still being reviewed and investigated. Given the history of Niemann repeatedly cheating on tournaments, I would not be surprised if he cheated on his recent games also.

South Park

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Quote from: KTChampions on February 19, 2023, 02:49:56 PM

Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on February 19, 2023, 02:22:33 PM

Perhaps what is most preoccupying the chess world right now is the performance of Niemann, who was accused of cheating a few months ago. No sanctions have yet been imposed. Would you say you are innocent until proven guilty? You can't find any hard evidence, or at least not that he was caught in the act. He is now also foiled at every tournament or a hand held metal detector is used to scan him. Shouldn't you invite him to tournaments because he has a bad name? Carlsen has already indicated that he does not want to play against Niemann and he may therefore not participate in a tournament in which Niemann also plays.

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

Innocent until proven guilty is the ideal but the reality is far different not only when it comes to sports but everywhere, and while it is not clear yet if he cheated when he played against Carlsen there is strong evidence Niemann could have cheated on more than 100 chess online games when money was on the line, so this is a stain that he is not going to be able to remove as this is no longer about the accusations Carlsen made, but about the strong evidence which shows his misdeeds.

KTChampions

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Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on February 19, 2023, 02:22:33 PM

Perhaps what is most preoccupying the chess world right now is the performance of Niemann, who was accused of cheating a few months ago. No sanctions have yet been imposed. Would you say you are innocent until proven guilty? You can't find any hard evidence, or at least not that he was caught in the act. He is now also foiled at every tournament or a hand held metal detector is used to scan him. Shouldn't you invite him to tournaments because he has a bad name? Carlsen has already indicated that he does not want to play against Niemann and he may therefore not participate in a tournament in which Niemann also plays.

It doesn't work that way in sports. It's the other way around: until you prove your innocence, you're guilty. That is why athletes who evade doping tests and the like are banned without question. As for Niemann, he is already a proven cheater, and the fact that FIDE still allows him to participate in their competitions (since he was not caught cheating specifically in FIDE competitions) only shows the impotence of this organization.

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Perhaps what is most preoccupying the chess world right now is the performance of Niemann, who was accused of cheating a few months ago. No sanctions have yet been imposed. Would you say you are innocent until proven guilty? You can't find any hard evidence, or at least not that he was caught in the act. He is now also foiled at every tournament or a hand held metal detector is used to scan him. Shouldn't you invite him to tournaments because he has a bad name? Carlsen has already indicated that he does not want to play against Niemann and he may therefore not participate in a tournament in which Niemann also plays.

KTChampions

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Quote from: Zackgeno96 on February 19, 2023, 02:04:25 PM

You can also bet on live matches in chess. Then I wonder who determines those odds during a match. You can't possibly let a program do that, because it's not football where you score a goal. Then you should base it on the quality of the moves played. I've looked, but the limits for such parties are really very low. And another thing is that players are sometimes approached for match fixing. Those are sports that are sensitive. You can easily play a bad game in chess without people noticing it.

Of course programs can do this. Firstly, they are better than people at determining what the position on the board is (who has the advantage). Secondly, they very accurately determine the quality of the players' moves - there is such an indicator as the loss of centipawns. If the player is in bad shape, then this indicator will be large, if in good shape, then less. If the player is a cheater like Niemann, then this indicator will be zero Grin

Zackgeno96

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You can also bet on live matches in chess. Then I wonder who determines those odds during a match. You can't possibly let a program do that, because it's not football where you score a goal. Then you should base it on the quality of the moves played. I've looked, but the limits for such parties are really very low. And another thing is that players are sometimes approached for match fixing. Those are sports that are sensitive. You can easily play a bad game in chess without people noticing it.

Topic: [CHESS] FIDE Candidates Chess Tournament 2022 - page 6. (Read 3216 times)