BFL consistenly and systematically fucked customers over last year, denying them refunds although they were required BY LAW to give them, as they didn´t ship their product near advertised time or on spec (efficiency!).
BFL delay tactics in regards to refunds were still a huge issue this year, and have only recently improved slightly, after they essentially got "free loans" (and only because they delayed refunds again).
BFL pricing is a huge ripoff and nowhere near competetive ( see AM / Bitmain / spondoolies / A1 pricing).
BFL consistently lead their customers to believe shipping was "immininent", "in two weeks" and other similar variations of these phrases, which somehow proved to be wrong again and again.
Bad business ethics includes all the mentioned problems, aswell as the systematic preying on newbies through false advertising.
So yeah, BFL actually deserves a much worse rating than what dogie gave you, so stop bitching about it inaba.
There is a reason why your company coined the phrase BFLed, and I for one cannot understand how you even bring up the courage to show your face to anyone related to bitcoin mining.
(Then again, you are just ranting here, which might protect you from a lot of anger)
Topic: [Guide] Dogie's Comprehensive Manufacturer Trustworthiness Guide [1st Feb 2016] - page 39. (Read 131506 times)
September 16, 2014, 07:44:01 AM
September 16, 2014, 07:42:30 AM
and now, ethically, the maintainers of the list should go through each claim that Inaba has just made, to either confirm or invalidate each claim, WITH EVIDENCE, and if BFL's entry needs to be updated based on the new info, then it should be done... OBJECTIVELY, without bias or personal grudges involved.
ethics works both ways...
if I am to rely on this list to be an accurate reference for who I will do business with, then it needs to be objective and without bias, and their homework needs to be done... and not just base it on a bunch of loudmouthed socially-inept geeks who lack the ability to give reasonable criticism.
=squeak=
ethics works both ways...
if I am to rely on this list to be an accurate reference for who I will do business with, then it needs to be objective and without bias, and their homework needs to be done... and not just base it on a bunch of loudmouthed socially-inept geeks who lack the ability to give reasonable criticism.
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 07:35:06 AM
and should BFL make more improvements, and improve their reputation, then how is that supposed to fit into the scale, if the scale itself, has them essentially hardcoded to permanently be the worst of the worst?
=squeak=
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 07:33:06 AM
Do tell. What "ethics" are you so bent out of shape on?
You bitch and you moan about "ethics" constantly, yet you ignore the fact that BFL has bent over backwards to try to satisfy customers. Yes, BFL has been late. Yes, some of the products have failed to meet initial expectations from the design phase. Beyond that, what ethics do you realistically have a problem with? That BFL did not give refunds after shipping started (even though they gave full, 100% refunds up until that time.)? You complain that they didn't give refunds after they spent the money to acquire the hardware to produce the product to deliver? That's your beef? You conveniently forget the months and months of full refunds that were offered prior to that.
What else? People bitch about not communicating, except BFL has been the most open and forthcoming hardware manufacturer out there with timelines and states of progress. That's really been the problem all along, BFL has been too open and communicative, which gives people false understand of the processes involved. Anyone who's actually gone through the process understands the problems encountered. Those that haven't are the ones that complain the loudest.
What else is there? Lets talk about design spec not meeting final product performance.
1st generation FGPA? Yep, it was off and it was late. Refunds were offered.
2nd generation FPGA? Over performed initial spec, delivered on time.
1st generation ASIC? Yep, it was off and it was late. 100% refunds, no questions asked, were offered until the product actually started shipping, then on a case by case basis.
2nd generation ASIC? Learned from mistakes with 1st generation. Stated from the start that there was no definitive shipping date and if you were uncomfortable with this, in big bold letters you were told DO NOT PRE-ORDER THIS PRODUCT. Here, let me quote the text you are presented with before ordering:
That has been there from DAY 1 on the Monarch. Real unethical of BFL. Telling people to NOT order the product if they don't want to take the risk of waiting for the product. Telling people there is not delivery date.
Refunds offered? Check
Telling people not to pre-order? Check
Telling people there is no set delivery date? Check
Telling people where we are at with development process? Check
Longest warranty in the industry? Check
No questions asked RMA, even for 2nd hand devices? Check
What else is there? What other "ethics" are so poor? Do tell. Try to be objective.
You bitch and you moan about "ethics" constantly, yet you ignore the fact that BFL has bent over backwards to try to satisfy customers. Yes, BFL has been late. Yes, some of the products have failed to meet initial expectations from the design phase. Beyond that, what ethics do you realistically have a problem with? That BFL did not give refunds after shipping started (even though they gave full, 100% refunds up until that time.)? You complain that they didn't give refunds after they spent the money to acquire the hardware to produce the product to deliver? That's your beef? You conveniently forget the months and months of full refunds that were offered prior to that.
What else? People bitch about not communicating, except BFL has been the most open and forthcoming hardware manufacturer out there with timelines and states of progress. That's really been the problem all along, BFL has been too open and communicative, which gives people false understand of the processes involved. Anyone who's actually gone through the process understands the problems encountered. Those that haven't are the ones that complain the loudest.
What else is there? Lets talk about design spec not meeting final product performance.
1st generation FGPA? Yep, it was off and it was late. Refunds were offered.
2nd generation FPGA? Over performed initial spec, delivered on time.
1st generation ASIC? Yep, it was off and it was late. 100% refunds, no questions asked, were offered until the product actually started shipping, then on a case by case basis.
2nd generation ASIC? Learned from mistakes with 1st generation. Stated from the start that there was no definitive shipping date and if you were uncomfortable with this, in big bold letters you were told DO NOT PRE-ORDER THIS PRODUCT. Here, let me quote the text you are presented with before ordering:
Quote
This is a Pre-Order product which is not yet shipping. If you're uncomfortable waiting until the development is complete and the product is shipped, do NOT pre-order this product. Perhaps undesirable, but this is a pre-order market. Customers flatly demand to get in line for the new technology before it's finished development. All manufacturers in this space have experienced some degree of delay with their first generation ASIC, so we're reluctant to give a specific delivery date.
That has been there from DAY 1 on the Monarch. Real unethical of BFL. Telling people to NOT order the product if they don't want to take the risk of waiting for the product. Telling people there is not delivery date.
Refunds offered? Check
Telling people not to pre-order? Check
Telling people there is no set delivery date? Check
Telling people where we are at with development process? Check
Longest warranty in the industry? Check
No questions asked RMA, even for 2nd hand devices? Check
What else is there? What other "ethics" are so poor? Do tell. Try to be objective.
September 16, 2014, 07:30:39 AM
But you continue to make my comments here, about BFL itself, when my comments are solely about the list.
I don't think there is anything wrong with a "bfl" rating. It's sort of like the opposite of a gold standard.
Other than outright scams, it doesn't get worse than BFL when it comes to ethics.
Could be. I never bought from BFL.
What I would like to know, for those of us that don't know as we've never had the "pleasure" of doing business with BFL, is if "BFL'ing" is part of the ratings scale, what exactly is the definition if "BFL'ing"
September 16, 2014, 07:14:25 AM
But you continue to make my comments here, about BFL itself, when my comments are solely about the list.
I don't think there is anything wrong with a "bfl" rating. It's sort of like the opposite of a gold standard.
Other than outright scams, it doesn't get worse than BFL when it comes to ethics.
September 16, 2014, 07:13:44 AM
Fuck BFL. (Nothing personnal) 
September 16, 2014, 07:08:32 AM
Delivered miners? Few ... I mean, it's not like BFL hasen't delivered over 50k miners or anything. I guess anyone who's delivered less than 50k miners has delivered "few." Oh wait... that doesn't jive with the rest of your chart.
I think dogie should change this category to "undelivered miners". Yes, you have delivered a ton of vaporware to senile old folks and people learning how to use the internet but ignoring the massive backlog of monarchs would be dishonest.
Quote
Uses preorders? Yes ... O Rly? BFL Hasn't taken preorders in months. Additionally we were and are selling off the shelf miners from the 65nm generation.
Are you trying to deny the fact that you take preorders? Is the sky not blue?
When you start shipping current gen hardware from stock I agree the rating should be changed but it should always be noted that BFL is never to be trusted with preorders.
Quote
Refund Issues? BFL has been issuing refunds to anyone and everyone who asks for them prior to delivery of their order for awhile now. Prior to that, any order that was over 6 months old was refundable in full.
Communication? We are more open about our process and timeline than just about anyone else in the industry.
Communication? We are more open about our process and timeline than just about anyone else in the industry.
Have to agree on these two. Refunding/communication is about the only thing BFL is doing right.
Quote
Ethics: You've created a special category with our name because you don't like us, plain and simple.
It's not because dogie specifically doesn't like you.
He's created it based on the verb "BFL" which means to completely fuck over. source: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=BFL
You didn't earn possibly the most negative trust ratings on the forum because of your great ethics.
September 16, 2014, 06:59:31 AM
Then put them in the "do not buy from" section if that's where you feel they should be...
but don't use them as part of the scale you use to rate the companies.
They're hardly the first company to over-promise and under-deliver.
They're hardly the first people who are their own worst enemy when it comes to PR.
They have had plenty of opportunity to learn from their mistakes early on, even tho it doesn't seem that they have learned as much as they could have.
All valid arguments, which I share.
But you continue to make my comments here, about BFL itself, when my comments are solely about the list.
I don't give a fuck about BFL or Inaba... (and Inaba, you guys seriously need to get someone who's only responsibility is running the business itself and the PR, so the rest of you guys can focus on the tech and production, IMHO, and stop fanning the flames... you're not helping yourselves in that respect.)
The maintainers of the list, should take the integrity of the list seriously, and be more objective, and less personal.
=squeak=
but don't use them as part of the scale you use to rate the companies.
They're hardly the first company to over-promise and under-deliver.
They're hardly the first people who are their own worst enemy when it comes to PR.
They have had plenty of opportunity to learn from their mistakes early on, even tho it doesn't seem that they have learned as much as they could have.
All valid arguments, which I share.
But you continue to make my comments here, about BFL itself, when my comments are solely about the list.
I don't give a fuck about BFL or Inaba... (and Inaba, you guys seriously need to get someone who's only responsibility is running the business itself and the PR, so the rest of you guys can focus on the tech and production, IMHO, and stop fanning the flames... you're not helping yourselves in that respect.)
The maintainers of the list, should take the integrity of the list seriously, and be more objective, and less personal.
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 06:48:41 AM
I need specific examples. They already have significant penalties on communication and refunds, I need evidence that they are specifically doing underhand things regarding refunds to lower their score further. They already have a penalty for running a commercial farm.
What kind of proof do you need? bitminerefund.com lists over $400k of confirmed unpaid refunds. 6 months after I submitted the refund request form they still haven't paid me a single cent of the $5000 they owe me. AFAIK no refunds have been paid in months. Yet they built a mining farm in Iceland. With money they owe their customers. I have personally sent around 10 emails in the last few weeks and got 2 replies, both telling me that I could convert the refund they owe me to mining contracts before August 15th. After 8/15 they completely stopped responding to any of my emails. I'm sure there are dozens of similar stories if you ask in the official Bitmine thread.
September 16, 2014, 06:42:30 AM
It isn't personal.
It is business.
Who would you buy from?
Bitmaintech or BFL?
Simple Bitmaintech everytime.
There is no debate.
This isn't personal it is simple consumer advocacy.
If you want to get screwed buy BFL.
If you want to get something in 3 days buy Bitmaintech.
Am I lying?
Your recent postings, betray your "it isn't personal" claim.It is business.
Who would you buy from?
Bitmaintech or BFL?
Simple Bitmaintech everytime.
There is no debate.
This isn't personal it is simple consumer advocacy.
If you want to get screwed buy BFL.
If you want to get something in 3 days buy Bitmaintech.
Am I lying?
=squeak=
Are you answering the question?
BFL vs Bitmaintech
Answer
Bitmain...
You don't have to be PERSONAL to make a simple smart choice.
Right?
Has nothing to do with the fact that BFL lies and fails miserably to deliver every time it builds something. That is fact not emotion or personal. It is the truth.
Seriously would you buy BFL?
No you wouldn't that is just smart.
Why you need to even put a number on BFL at this point seems to cause more problems.
Simply relegate them to the DO NOT BUY FROM section as there are many other reputable places to buy from. Problem solved. Less work. No need to bother with them given they can't produce anything viable. No one is buying a Monarch are they?
September 16, 2014, 06:39:24 AM
It isn't personal.
It is business.
Who would you buy from?
Bitmaintech or BFL?
Simple Bitmaintech everytime.
There is no debate.
This isn't personal it is simple consumer advocacy.
If you want to get screwed buy BFL.
If you want to get something in 3 days buy Bitmaintech.
Am I lying?
Your recent postings, betray your "it isn't personal" claim.It is business.
Who would you buy from?
Bitmaintech or BFL?
Simple Bitmaintech everytime.
There is no debate.
This isn't personal it is simple consumer advocacy.
If you want to get screwed buy BFL.
If you want to get something in 3 days buy Bitmaintech.
Am I lying?
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 06:36:58 AM
You've let it get personal, Bicknellski...
You've turned rabid, frothing at the mouth at anything BFL does, any objectivity you may have is out the window.
It isn't about whether I would recommend BFL or not. I was one of the pre-orders, who ended up feeling let down when I finally got my kit over a year later, and ended up taking a loss in the end.
Those are the breaks in mining. I'm not their friend, or advocate. This has nothing to do with how I personally feel about them. This is about the objectivity and integrity of the list, and its perceived anti-BFL bias in the rating system itself.
Change BFL to another company which I have had no business with, and I would still feel the same way... in fact, I would probably feel even stronger since I wouldn't have the personal animus with the other company that I have with BFL...
... but this isn't about my personal feelings about BFL, but about the integrity and objectivity of the list... and I don't trust it, as they made it personal, and not objective.
Understand?
=squeak=
You've turned rabid, frothing at the mouth at anything BFL does, any objectivity you may have is out the window.
It isn't about whether I would recommend BFL or not. I was one of the pre-orders, who ended up feeling let down when I finally got my kit over a year later, and ended up taking a loss in the end.
Those are the breaks in mining. I'm not their friend, or advocate. This has nothing to do with how I personally feel about them. This is about the objectivity and integrity of the list, and its perceived anti-BFL bias in the rating system itself.
Change BFL to another company which I have had no business with, and I would still feel the same way... in fact, I would probably feel even stronger since I wouldn't have the personal animus with the other company that I have with BFL...
... but this isn't about my personal feelings about BFL, but about the integrity and objectivity of the list... and I don't trust it, as they made it personal, and not objective.
Understand?
=squeak=
It isn't personal.
It is business.
Who would you buy from?
Bitmaintech or BFL?
Simple Bitmaintech everytime.
There is no debate.
This isn't personal it is simple consumer advocacy.
If you want to get screwed buy BFL.
If you want to get something in 3 days buy Bitmaintech.
Am I lying?
No.
Is it personal.
No.
Are BFL a bunch of lying sacks of shit?
Not really debatable if you have read what others have posted about them for the past 2 years. There is evidence right here in the forums go read it.
Seriously what is the point of even entertaining the notion of buying from BFL when you have 4 or 5 alternatives all shipping in reasonable time factors to specifications at half the price or lower?
Are you serious?
Come on let us be brutally honest.
There is no one right now that would put money on a Monarch over anything that Bitmaintech puts out right now.
September 16, 2014, 06:34:49 AM
You've let it get personal, Bicknellski...
You've turned rabid, frothing at the mouth at anything BFL does, any objectivity you may have is out the window.
It isn't about whether I would recommend BFL or not. I was one of the pre-orders, who ended up feeling let down when I finally got my kit over a year later, and ended up taking a loss in the end.
Those are the breaks in mining. I'm not their friend, or advocate. This has nothing to do with how I personally feel about them. This is about the objectivity and integrity of the list, and its perceived anti-BFL bias in the rating system itself.
Change BFL to another company which I have had no business with, and I would still feel the same way... in fact, I would probably feel even stronger since I wouldn't have the personal animus with the other company that I have with BFL...
... but this isn't about my personal feelings about BFL, but about the integrity and objectivity of the list... and I don't trust it, as they made it personal, and not objective.
Understand?
=squeak=
You've turned rabid, frothing at the mouth at anything BFL does, any objectivity you may have is out the window.
It isn't about whether I would recommend BFL or not. I was one of the pre-orders, who ended up feeling let down when I finally got my kit over a year later, and ended up taking a loss in the end.
Those are the breaks in mining. I'm not their friend, or advocate. This has nothing to do with how I personally feel about them. This is about the objectivity and integrity of the list, and its perceived anti-BFL bias in the rating system itself.
Change BFL to another company which I have had no business with, and I would still feel the same way... in fact, I would probably feel even stronger since I wouldn't have the personal animus with the other company that I have with BFL...
... but this isn't about my personal feelings about BFL, but about the integrity and objectivity of the list... and I don't trust it, as they made it personal, and not objective.
Understand?
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 06:33:02 AM
Anyone out there want to recommend BFL?
Anyone?
Thought not.
No one should be giving Inaba or BFL any slack. There is nothing in their pattern of business that is redeemable at this juncture. It is clear they are crap and buying anything from them means nothing more than waiting for a refund or 12 months for a product that is way overpriced.
How does that jive with a 33%. Please. Just make it simple. Do not buy from BFL ever. No one gets hurt. No one loses money again.
Anyone?
Thought not.
No one should be giving Inaba or BFL any slack. There is nothing in their pattern of business that is redeemable at this juncture. It is clear they are crap and buying anything from them means nothing more than waiting for a refund or 12 months for a product that is way overpriced.
How does that jive with a 33%. Please. Just make it simple. Do not buy from BFL ever. No one gets hurt. No one loses money again.
September 16, 2014, 06:32:06 AM
Grind that axe, man! Grind it!
September 16, 2014, 06:18:06 AM
Dude.
Bottomline.
Would you recommend ANYONE buy from BFL?
If you do then you are seriously not really helping anyone in this community.
Cut the crap let us just get to the point.
BFL has for the past 2 years or more lied and stolen from members of the community. There is no scale that Dogie can build that would be fair to BFL unless it was simply a DO NOT BUY WARNING on them. They do not even belong in the same class as the companies that actually ship to customers to the specifications and dates that they give. They are basically a scam nothing more or less than that along with about 40% or more of all fabricators. Spin the numbers how you like there are only a handful of choices and you need not debate that.
... Inaba should be ignored and given his lies and threats to people in this community he doesn't even deserve mention nor does BFL.
Sorry for posting here but Inaba and BFL should be dropped from any list that gives them any quarter that could be interpreted as positive.
Monarch? Late? Still not shipped? Please this is a joke. How many times does BFL get a chance to do this again?
They have proven time and time again to be one of the LEAST trustworthy companies in mining. There really is no debate on their next product release right? It would be late. It would be mined by others before it is shipped. It would be an enormous blindspot for anyone to purchase anything from them to help perpetuate that company.
... no one seems to fighting for those who lost a lot of money when they play games with rating systems like this. There is only one recommendation based on the evidence. DO NOT BUY FROM BFL EVER.
Bottomline.
Would you recommend ANYONE buy from BFL?
If you do then you are seriously not really helping anyone in this community.
Cut the crap let us just get to the point.
BFL has for the past 2 years or more lied and stolen from members of the community. There is no scale that Dogie can build that would be fair to BFL unless it was simply a DO NOT BUY WARNING on them. They do not even belong in the same class as the companies that actually ship to customers to the specifications and dates that they give. They are basically a scam nothing more or less than that along with about 40% or more of all fabricators. Spin the numbers how you like there are only a handful of choices and you need not debate that.
... Inaba should be ignored and given his lies and threats to people in this community he doesn't even deserve mention nor does BFL.
Sorry for posting here but Inaba and BFL should be dropped from any list that gives them any quarter that could be interpreted as positive.
Monarch? Late? Still not shipped? Please this is a joke. How many times does BFL get a chance to do this again?
They have proven time and time again to be one of the LEAST trustworthy companies in mining. There really is no debate on their next product release right? It would be late. It would be mined by others before it is shipped. It would be an enormous blindspot for anyone to purchase anything from them to help perpetuate that company.
... no one seems to fighting for those who lost a lot of money when they play games with rating systems like this. There is only one recommendation based on the evidence. DO NOT BUY FROM BFL EVER.
September 16, 2014, 06:13:39 AM
If anything it points to the limitations of the system in that it gives BFL a higher rating that it deserves given the millions they have stolen from people. Let us not forget that fact.
There is nothing in what BFL stands for as a company that would warrant a positive number on any scale or system. They are abject failures as a company.
I don't give a damn about the rating itself... if BFL earned a poor rating then give them a poor rating...There is nothing in what BFL stands for as a company that would warrant a positive number on any scale or system. They are abject failures as a company.
What I'm talking about is this:
Quote
Rating System
Position in the list signifies trustworthiness, the higher the better. A perfect score is 100 and the worst possible score is 10. Criteria includes the use of preorders, prompt delivery, the investment of custom chips, hardware and refund issues, communication ability, ethical behaviour and company size.
90+ = AAA tier firm
80+ = A tier firm
70+ = B tier firm, solid company but can improve practises
50+ = C tier firm, issues to be resolved
30+ = D tier firm, significant issues or problems
30- = BFL tier
No amount of improvement in their service, is going to matter to you guys, cuz you made it personal. You're no longer objective, and you're just going to keep on bashing BFL no matter what, solely because they're BFL and you got your crusade that takes precedence.Position in the list signifies trustworthiness, the higher the better. A perfect score is 100 and the worst possible score is 10. Criteria includes the use of preorders, prompt delivery, the investment of custom chips, hardware and refund issues, communication ability, ethical behaviour and company size.
90+ = AAA tier firm
80+ = A tier firm
70+ = B tier firm, solid company but can improve practises
50+ = C tier firm, issues to be resolved
30+ = D tier firm, significant issues or problems
30- = BFL tier
I have my own issues with BFL, but that doesn't stop me from being objective, and the maintainers of this list should have the personal integrity to be objective too, or they're no better than the level of ethics they accuse BFL of, themselves.
=squeak=
September 16, 2014, 06:07:32 AM
As much as I hesitate to agree with Inaba, he does have a point...
When I was first going through the list, and saw that you were using BFL as one of your rating points, any thought about objectivity about this list went out the window.
Keeping the list is an important thing for people to be able to compare how a company has performed, but only if it is objective.
It appears that the maintainer/administrator of the list has a personal axe to grind and is using the list to do it with, and sorry, but that gives your list as a whole, a lower ethics rating than you probably want it to have.
There is no question that BFL has earned itself a lot of bad karma with the community in the past, but the way the list digs specifically at BFL, it makes it appear that no matter what BFL does to make things right and improve their image, they will never be able to raise their reputation as far as the list is concerned.
Guys... your list suffers by doing this. Be objective.
=squeak=
When I was first going through the list, and saw that you were using BFL as one of your rating points, any thought about objectivity about this list went out the window.
Keeping the list is an important thing for people to be able to compare how a company has performed, but only if it is objective.
It appears that the maintainer/administrator of the list has a personal axe to grind and is using the list to do it with, and sorry, but that gives your list as a whole, a lower ethics rating than you probably want it to have.
There is no question that BFL has earned itself a lot of bad karma with the community in the past, but the way the list digs specifically at BFL, it makes it appear that no matter what BFL does to make things right and improve their image, they will never be able to raise their reputation as far as the list is concerned.
Guys... your list suffers by doing this. Be objective.
=squeak=
If anything it points to the limitations of the system in that it gives BFL a higher rating that it deserves given the millions they have stolen from people. Let us not forget that fact.
There is nothing in what BFL stands for as a company that would warrant a positive number on any scale or system. They are an abject failure as a company and to agree with Inaba with regards to giving BFL a "fair" shake? Pardon me but where was that fair shake for their customers the past 2 years? Seriously... when do customers get the benefit of proper and timely refunds, honest specifications and a company that rectifies their customers problems. If that is the scale we use then BFL gets a failing grade on all accounts. This is just funny that anyone would argue that BFL needs to be given the same scale to measure them on. At this point their failures should remove them from any scale and a big red warning label applied DO NOT BUY FROM BFL EVER is all that needs to be said. Right? I think everyone except Inaba will agree with that assessment.
September 16, 2014, 06:04:12 AM
As much as I hesitate to agree with Inaba, he does have a point...
When I was first going through the list, and saw that you were using BFL as one of your rating points, any thought about objectivity about this list went out the window.
Keeping the list is an important thing for people to be able to compare how a company has performed, but only if it is objective.
It appears that the maintainer/administrator of the list has a personal axe to grind and is using the list to do it with, and sorry, but that gives your list as a whole, a lower ethics rating than you probably want it to have.
There is no question that BFL has earned itself a lot of bad karma with the community in the past, but the way the list digs specifically at BFL, it makes it appear that no matter what BFL does to make things right and improve their image, they will never be able to raise their reputation as far as the list is concerned.
Guys... your list suffers by doing this. Be objective.
=squeak=
When I was first going through the list, and saw that you were using BFL as one of your rating points, any thought about objectivity about this list went out the window.
Keeping the list is an important thing for people to be able to compare how a company has performed, but only if it is objective.
It appears that the maintainer/administrator of the list has a personal axe to grind and is using the list to do it with, and sorry, but that gives your list as a whole, a lower ethics rating than you probably want it to have.
There is no question that BFL has earned itself a lot of bad karma with the community in the past, but the way the list digs specifically at BFL, it makes it appear that no matter what BFL does to make things right and improve their image, they will never be able to raise their reputation as far as the list is concerned.
Guys... your list suffers by doing this. Be objective.
=squeak=
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