Topic: Is taxation theft? - page 48. (Read 76002 times)

There should be some sort of tax, either direct or indirect. Else, who will pay for the law enforcement, education, and defense? But the point is that, the overall tax should be in the 15% to 20% range and not more than that.

Why does the cost of maintenance dissuade you from thinking that you own a thing? The government will continue to defend your property and assets from unlawful seizure and foreign aggression as long as it exists. You are a member of a club, your respective nation. Unfortunately, clubs have dues. Your property or asset continues to exist within your nations respective borders; at some point is this service of security simply.supposed to become free?

Tax always reminds me that I don't really own a thing in these world. I can't even call my profession a property or my own because of that tax. Tax it's not just theft, it's a unfairness of mankind.

1. Without clear example where are you from your argument is invalid. Imagine the situation - you want to talk about specific situation but don't provide context.
2. Crooked politicians can't steal every single penny from your taxes, you have public roads, transport, parks or public schools or hospitals in your country?
3. If your country is in bad economic state in general, then taxes won't make it suddenly amazing, managing complicated economy is not that simple.

This position is wrong. When you don't pay taxes to the pockets of your corrupt politicians is not empty. Firstly they will still find how to steal, and secondly, if there is no money in the coffers, they will take the credit and steal the money. Such actions only make their country poorer. Debts will give your children they will live in poverty. Try to unite and change the country's leadership.

In our country, on the contrary, it is better not to pay taxes, because all this money goes into the pocket of the governors of the state and the economy does not improve at all.

In my country, which I stayed all commodities we had in here have taxes all we can buy goods stuff in any of the supermarket, fast food chain, restaurant, all aspects of business, also the house residence too had their own tax too.  Meaning everything has a tax

Taxation is not a theft, it is a one way of contributing to the economy of one country. As long as the government know how to manage the tax of people then the tax is really a big help in making the country progressive. So we should bear in our mind that taxation is not a theft but it is a way in making the country more progressive.

Believe me in third countries there are people who are much richer than people in most developed countries. Problems with the redistribution of funds exist in all countries. The poorer the country the greater the difference between rich and poor.

this is all greed and consumerism, fed by fear (great marketing tool) and short term fiscal thinking, also unsustainable in long term...
in short - we're fucked:)

Which is sadly the case in a hell lot of countries...
Developped countries are in the end only slightly affected by corruption and tax problem.
When you look at third world countries THERE you see how shitty a government can become.

Balance of power is always the most important.

no, unless it's stolen and not being used to improve the common world.

I disagree! But the book is complex it would be difficult to be sure what was the point Orwell wanted to make.
Pigs took over from farmer but if you remember well the first pigs wanted indeed to keep their promises. It's only because the other animals were too stupid to see the pig named Napoleon as what he really was (a dictator) and agreed to give him all powers.

If they had stopped him from taking absolute powers, then the farm would have worked nicely.
As you can see I did read the Animal farm but I don't have the same reading that you ^^
I'm sorry but just read the definition of the word that I gave to you...

Solidarity is the share of responsability in a community. There is NO NEED FOR GOODWILL.
Of course it's better, but solidarity isn't "being nice to ones fellow citizens". It's sharing the responsability accross a group. In socialism, taxation is the way to share the responsability. Responsability of what will you ask? Responsability for the future generations to be able to continue making the country grow.

Granting basic education and healthcare to all citizens is considered as a responsability in some developped countries. It is not the case in USA and UK but that's merely a question of what does the people consider as a responsability, there isn't a good or a bad answer to that. Only a question of perspectives.

But YES taxation IS solidarity by DEFINITION because taxation is the way we share the responsability accross a nation. That you like it or not has no impact on what it is.
I advise re-read too ^^
Pigs control is not a result of direct democracy, the full control that Napoleon takes on the farm was by force, it's only when he kills the other pigs and takes everything by force that the shit hits the fan.

I've watched the video you have linked and honestly it provides a misleading thought and understanding regarding tax. Every person has a choice whether to live or not, give or not, kill or not (you will understand why kill or not is included in here even though the talk is about taxation if you watch that bs or nonsense video). The point here is that taxes that the government collect is a duty that the citizens need to do for their country! The video is very misleading if you are not truly observant and listen very well! They are trying to say to disband the government as well as laws and let the corporation or company take over or decide since they have the power and they are the one who gave the job but remember the greed especially those who are at the top. You are like saying that let's disband this democratic government and have a dictatorship corporation lead!

The taxation is not a theft but you can commit theft with taxation! The taxation is a duty of every citizen to contribute to the country in exchange of protection, facilities, and services and also help those poor people by allocating some of the accumulated taxes. The government, especially the democratic government, is the face of the entire group of people who choose their leaders and maintain the order and help the people. Its like a group project where in every member needs to contribute, they can't just get in without contributing anything like playing a no-care-at-all figure so as a punishment you are expelled from the group. If you don't want to contribute you can just leave the project and don't ever try to benefit from the benefits the project brings. What is a duty of every citizen to pay taxes? Does that tax so high then it is not fair but if your problem is the tax itself then you better get out of the system and don't you ever use the roads that has been built, the security against foreign intruders, the public employment that they offer, etc.

They are things that should be mandated and there are things that you have a choice from. Whether you kill or not to kill should not be a choice but rather should be mandated and not allowed to kill anyone. As you see, this where the law, the regulation takes in action that is made possible with the government's authority to impose judgement. Ofcourse for it to function as a systematic body taking form as one in the face of a group of people, it is the duty of every citizen to pay taxes. As one body, a unity of several millions of people, it needs a unity in decisions because we can't just take every choice especially that this choice are contradicting each other (that nonsense video really irks me that I wish I didn't watch that bs but as they know all the information in the argument present before judging or critiquing).

The taxation is needed in order to allocate it especially those who are unfortunate which all will benefit. Again, taxation is not a theft but theft with taxation can be so we better be smart and wise enough to choose a righteous leader.

P.S. The video is completely bs.
P.P.S. To the OP, a friendly advice so its your choice, don't ever watch or subscribe those videos again (utterly nonsense). They are just twisting your head from the true essence of the subject; a valid argument in other words.

Did you indeed read the Animal farm? Because I am not sure, you understood the message. Pigs took over from farmer under the promise of social justice. They then became the new farmer accusing their slaves of being accomplices to the former master. It is the story of socialism.


Its not *free*, if there is payment involved. At the very best you could call it a hand out. In this way big governments buy loyalty of lower classes and keep them in order. Calling it solidarity is ridiculous, completely twisting meaning of the word. It is means of control, targeting people, who have no moral compass of their own.


I would love to see your definition of slavery then. Also see above.
 

I advise re-read. Pigs control was direct result of democracy. They won others under false promise of equality replacing natural order.

When someone else pays it for you it's free for you. But you can say it's not free from a macro point of view.
No I don't I'm afraid. Solidarity: union or fellowship arising from common responsibilities and interests, as between members of a group or between classes, peoples, etc.

It doesn't have to be of goodwill, it's just the share of responsability. Even forced it's still solidarity, even if of goodwill would be better.
See above.
Ahahah!
Where you're right it's that the pigs are still in power...
But as you saw in Animal Farm the problem isn't the system in itself but the fact that the pigs took the power on the system.
If you can make the same system with everyone in control (direct democracy) then there is nothing wrong with it.

Your opponent, while simple minded - is getting one thing right. It is not *free*. The only thing free is your body and mind, that you were born with.

It is not solidarity anymore, when people do it out of fear of state, dont you agree? Solidarity is motivated by love, sometimes by pity or bad consience, never by coercion and violence.

Perhaps secular governments have no other way to justify it then? Solidarity by the working class. So *everything* is *free* for *everybody*. I feel like reading Orwellls Animal farm all over again...

It is for those who can't afford. It's free for those who need it and can't pay it, because other paid for it. Solidarity.

This is the problem. Nothing is free. The government part of the money stealing, and the other part sends not on purpose. Medicine should be paid, but the price should be adequate and covered.

You mean you take money and use it to pay for the thousands of things that are free for citizens in the country?

I don't know where you're from but in most countries the tax are used to finance the healthcare and education. That's the 2 big spendings posts.

Apart if you're from USA then it will pay for the big tanks responsible for global terrorism.