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Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 14. (Read 901373 times)

hero member
Activity: 1624
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April 23, 2019, 06:21:26 PM
^^^ Why do you think that I don't accept random events. Haven't I been telling you that the events that brought C&E activity into effect were different than C&E? The fact that QT might assign a probability point to something, also suggests that something can be improbable enough so as to be impossible.

As far as C&E being philosophy, it is only such because a bunch of people won't accept the fact that C&E is QT essentially absolute. Why? Because if everything were QT equally possible, we'd be able to do anything. You'd be out flapping your ears and flying around the city. As it is, it's only the flapping of the mouth that keeps you thinking that there are no limits, contrary to QT, btw.

Cool

''accept the fact'' and it is a fact because you say so? Are you a god or something? If you say something is a fact, it's a fact?
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
April 23, 2019, 03:32:51 PM
^^^ Why do you think that I don't accept random events. Haven't I been telling you that the events that brought C&E activity into effect were different than C&E? The fact that QT might assign a probability point to something, also suggests that something can be improbable enough so as to be impossible.

As far as C&E being philosophy, it is only such because a bunch of people won't accept the fact that C&E is QT essentially absolute. Why? Because if everything were QT equally possible, we'd be able to do anything. You'd be out flapping your ears and flying around the city. As it is, it's only the flapping of the mouth that keeps you thinking that there are no limits, contrary to QT, btw.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 23, 2019, 12:42:14 PM
^^^ That's what Quantum Theory tells us. Yet we have a difficult time doing some of the bizarre things that we should be able to do if QT is right. So, I guess there are some facts and some non-facts after all.

Among the facts is the fact that all atheists hate religion. The difference is that some of them don't know it, just like they don't know that God exists.

Cool

Quantum theory also tells us about truly random events that you don't seem to accept either because it doesn't fit your narrative of ''cause and effect'' which is NOT a scientific law but rather a philosophical thought so I guess you pick what you want to believe and what not based simply on your ideology and not the truth.
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
April 22, 2019, 04:47:38 PM
^^^ That's what Quantum Theory tells us. Yet we have a difficult time doing some of the bizarre things that we should be able to do if QT is right. So, I guess there are some facts and some non-facts after all.

Among the facts is the fact that all atheists hate religion. The difference is that some of them don't know it, just like they don't know that God exists.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 22, 2019, 03:17:17 PM
^^^ Absolutely, science isn't the only religion, or the only part of the religion of which it is a part. The scientific method is one of the greatest parts of science for making it a religion. Why? Because science theories are part of the scientific method, and we know that science theories are not fact, just like you have been saying about the other religions.

Cool

Nothing is a fact, ever, therefore your argument is worthless and meaningless, you will never be able to prove anything to an 100% degree since you don't even know if you are truly alive or simply an illusion, a virtual entity, a program, perhaps the universe is matrix. Anyhow, the word fact is simply stupid. Again, you can read the definition of religion and science, it doesn't really matter what you say, the definitions are clear Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3990
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April 22, 2019, 11:37:50 AM
^^^ Absolutely, science isn't the only religion, or the only part of the religion of which it is a part. The scientific method is one of the greatest parts of science for making it a religion. Why? Because science theories are part of the scientific method, and we know that science theories are not fact, just like you have been saying about the other religions.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 22, 2019, 10:59:22 AM
^^^ Religion is the only reason why science is done at all. If people absolutely knew what the absolute future was going to be, they wouldn't need science, except to fulfill what they already knew. Since people don't know the future, science is only proving to be their religion for themselves.

Cool

''1The belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.

‘ideas about the relationship between science and religion’
More example sentencesSynonyms
1.1count noun A particular system of faith and worship.
‘the world's great religions’
More example sentencesSynonyms
1.2count noun A pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.
‘consumerism is the new religion’''

No, science is not religion, science uses the scientific method to get to the truth, religion simply states things without any sort of evidence and fools believe it.
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
April 22, 2019, 09:04:48 AM
^^^ Religion is the only reason why science is done at all. If people absolutely knew what the absolute future was going to be, they wouldn't need science, except to fulfill what they already knew. Since people don't know the future, science is only proving to be their religion for themselves.

Cool
ZPW
newbie
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April 22, 2019, 08:56:52 AM

science has always been good for people, religion is mostly death
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
April 22, 2019, 08:40:49 AM

...

Simply put: Who is your God?

Noone. Next question.


Your problem is that you don't have enough of a scientific mind to see that you are trying to make yourself into your own god by claiming something that you don't have any knowledge about. Look at the following little story. It's about evolution and creation.

----------

In a galaxy far, far away, life evolved several billion years ago. It started long before life started on Earth, and it was of a kind that was different than any found on Earth.

This life advanced rapidly, because it was near the core of the galaxy, in an area where mutations came about much more favorably for evolution.

Several forms of life advanced to intelligence, but one form outdid all the others. The development of his form of life quickly outpaced even the greatness of human life on Earth today. It wasn't long before one creature of this life form developed the ability to control all aspects of the space/time continuum mentally.

Realizing how wonderful it was to have this kind of control, and realizing how long it might take other evolved forms of life to achieve this great advancement (many wouldn't get this far, but would die out before they could make it), he/it decided to do something about the slow process called evolution.

Using his mind, he dissolved space/time, including evolution, completely, and started it over with something called creation (about 7,500 years ago). In this creation thing, he placed intelligent forms of life that could advance, rapidly, to positions of mental space/time control just like his own.

But for whatever reason, these creatures partially turned against the idea. They felt the coming grandeur, but advanced to the feeling of the grandeur, faster than advancing to their actual development. And, in so doing, started to destroy themselves.

----------

So you see? Here is one way that the anomalies of evolution and God can be blended to make all things look like they do, and to keep both evolution and creation intact, sort of. And you can't say that this could never happen... if you want to remain logical and honest, that is.

The point of it is that you are going to need a whole lot of evidence to show that God doesn't exist. In the face of machine nature, God has to exist. And I don't mean you, in your exalting yourself as a god, because you think you can out-think nature and the real God.

Cool
sr. member
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April 21, 2019, 08:56:38 PM
Atheists unfortunately don't understand that there are higher Powers his higher power involved that controls the world and we are mere tiny little things that are subject to it but they think they control everything
legendary
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April 21, 2019, 08:22:16 PM
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
April 21, 2019, 07:18:19 PM
...
Unfortunately for you, your argument is dull...
It's time to stop.

Your disagreement with my argument is well documented in our prior exchanges so I agree it’s time to stop.
I will close with this article I read today.

Have a blessed Easter Sunday.

Easter And Why Government Is Not Our God
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-21/easter-and-why-government-not-our-god
Quote from: Leesa Donner
The American people have a love-hate relationship with their government. This is as it should be, primarily because government is not our God. Easter Sunday seems an opportune time to remember this and renew our commitment to a republic under God rather than one that displaces or subjugates the creator.



James Madison Had It Right
In 1785 James Madison wrote, “The essence of Government is power; and power, lodged as it must be in human hands, will ever be liable to abuse.” Born in King George County, Virginia in 1751, Madison’s words seem prescient when applied to our day and time. Often referred to as the “Father of the Constitution,” Madison rightly expressed caution and concern for the power that government can assert over its people. It could be said that this quote of his captures the principle difference between the political left and right in America today. Ronald Reagan echoed Madison’s fear when he asserted that “government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.”

The Bible speaks of power this way. In Matthew 22:29 Jesus said, “Your mistake is that you don’t know the Scriptures, and you don’t know the power of God.” Real power rests with the creator and not His creation (Job 38-42), and certainly not in the governments of any era which, after all, are appointed by God (Daniel 2:21). Thus true power cannot be attained by governments; it rests with One who will not abuse it (Psalm 86:5).



Ayn Rand’s Pithy Pointers
The mother of objectivism, Ayn Rand, penned yet another perceptive concept that demonstrates why government is not our God. And it cannot be said that Rand adhered to any sort of established religion. Yet the author of The Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged was able to put her finger on a dilemma that has reared its head in 21st century America:

“We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history, the stage of rule by brute force.”

An era of government tyranny does seem to be fast approaching if it has not already arrived, as many would argue that, indeed, it has. When people labor under such laws as to which straws they are permitted to use and a tax code that is 60,000 pages – an estimated seven times the length of the Bible – one can safely say that the hand of tyranny is upon us, pushing its way into every aspect of our lives.

Thus, individual liberty and freedom suffer under myriad regulations that are tantamount to oppression. Step out your door, get in your car, and head on down to the McDonald’s drive-thru; you will likely be violating one law or another. Yes, government can be suffocating, which again shows us that it cannot and should not be our God.

In contrast, Paul wrote in his epistle to the Galatians: “So Christ has truly set us free. Now make sure that you stay free, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law.” Of course, Paul was talking about the religious laws of the day, and some non-Christian enthusiasts may counter this with the verse where Jesus says,  “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s,” (Mark 12:17, KJV), but they would be reminded to read the second part of this verse, which adds “and give to God what belongs to God” (NLT). Even a tyrannical government does not own its people,  though some have tried to sell this assertion to their people.

Milton Friedman Puts Bounty In Perspective
Economist and Nobel prize winner Milton Friedman said: “If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there’d be a shortage of sand.” Here we recognize how tyrannical governments are effective in taking rather than giving to their people. While this comment is a bit satirical, as is often said, the truth is in the joke. The leftist politicians of our day are always “running out of” and “requesting more.” There is never enough money to do all the things we don’t want and always a desire to take from those who toil for what they own.

In contrast, Jesus said in John 10:10, “The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life and have it abundantly.” Professing Christians will attest to the fact that life under the power of God is one where their “cup runneth over” (Psalm 23:5, KJV) – not necessarily with earthly things, but The Things that Matter Most.

Is Easter calling you to throw off the yoke of an all-powerful, tyrannical government whose raison d’être is to rule, take, and enslave?

During the last supper, Jesus said the following to His disciples: “In this world the kings and great men lord it over their people, yet they are called ‘friends of the people.’ 26 But among you it will be different. Those who are the greatest among you should take the lowest rank, and the leader should be like a servant. 27 Who is more important, the one who sits at the table or the one who serves? The one who sits at the table, of course. But not here! For I am among you as one who serves.” (Luke 22:25)

And so today – Easter Sunday, 2019 –  may be a time to ask yourself a central question: Who would you rather reign over your life – the liberating, loving, and truly powerful presence of Jesus Christ, who showed humility and sacrificial love in His life, death, and resurrection. Or do you prefer to worship at the altar of a tyrannical government?

Simply put: Who is your God?

hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 21, 2019, 05:26:25 PM
Well, belief in imaginary beings is a mental illness too, you know?

Yes indeed, fortunately for me I don't believe in imaginary beings.  Wink

An Argument for God

I'm sure they think they have their own arguments too and they also don't think they are crazy, transgenders I mean. Unfortunately for you, your argument is dull, has no science behind it and Gödel’s Incompleteness Theorem applied incorrectly as already shown before, in fact there is a book about all the people that use ''Gödel’s Incompleteness Theorem'' for their own stupid arguments.

''A common misunderstanding is to interpret Gödel's first theorem as showing that there are truths that cannot be proved. This is, however, incorrect, for the incompleteness theorem does not deal with provability in any absolute sense, but only concerns derivability in some particular formal system or another.''

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/goedel-incompleteness/

It's time to stop.
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
April 21, 2019, 03:57:10 PM
Well, belief in imaginary beings is a mental illness too, you know?

Yes indeed, fortunately for me I don't believe in imaginary beings.  Wink

An Argument for God
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 21, 2019, 03:54:26 PM

Gays are ill?

I think you are ill, but I repeat myself.

You don't know how I feel? I feel we should live in a society were all members of society are protected (under the law) and are free from discrimination (that includes you btw).  If they are not, it is our duty as good people to change the law so they are protected.

Even if trans are mentally ill (which I don't think they are) you should not refuse them your service, just like (I hope) you would not refuse your service to people who are Atheists or suffer from Autism or Down Syndrome.  

That is how I feel on this issue.

Regarding any religious mythologies, you know my position.  I view them as an ancient, cultural tradition, a political relic that has no place in a progressive society driven by science, medicine, engineering, and technology.

To be fair, gender dysphoria might be a disease, there is science that says so, however if we are talking only on discrimination, then no, obviously no one should discriminate other people even if it's a mental illness, actually because it might be a mental illness, they shouldn't be discriminated ever at all costs, you are not supposed to mock mentally ill people.

All human beings are ill. The only difference lies in the severity of the illness. One man might suffer from occasionally feeling down another might be so depressed he cannot hold down a job. When the illness is severe we categorize it box it off and call it a disease but reality is a spectrum. So yes gays are ill so are all the heterosexuals. The severity of the overall illness will depend on the the individual. We don't always agree on what constitutes normal healthy variation and what behaviors are destructive. When a disagreement like that arises its is the result of ignorance a failure of one party or often both to accurately assess the the reality of the situation.

Discrimination is always an evil for every individual deserves to be evaluated on their own merits not based on arbitrary groupings. However, occasionally discrimination is an unavoidable evil due to imperfect human knowledge and society. Take pedophiles for example. Even after they have completed their jail terms and paid their debts to society we don't let them live near elementary schools. We know that the rate of repeat offenders among individuals with that particular illness is high and have no way of knowing with certainly who will fall back into crime so we discriminate against them all to protect innocent children. Is that ideal no the ideal would be certain knowledge that the offender was cured or not but we don't have that.

When you deny reality and demand others not challenge that denial there are always going to be consequences. That is what you are really aiming for here with your "equality law" for gender dysphoric individuals. In addition to being a potential tool to attack religious freedom it would also discriminate against biological women. It would destroy women sport a process that is already well underway in liberal parts of the country. You should watch the video of the 16 year old teenage athlete in the following story. Denial of reality is insanity. If you claim to ground your worldview in science af_newbie you should acknowledge that.

https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2019/04/21/female-athlete-speaks-out-against-transgender-equality-act/

The answer to how to deal with human illness is found in the New Testament as so many words of wisdom are. We should treat each human life as inherently and innately valuable regardless of any disease it may suffer from. Each human being is a precious and child of God and deserving of the dignity and respect that status accords. We should also treat each of our fellow brothers and sisters as we would want to be treated if we stood in their shoes.

Matthew 22:36-40
“Teacher, what is the most important commandment in the Law?”
Jesus answered:
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. This is the first and most important commandment. The second most important commandment is like this one. And it is, “Love others as much as you love yourself.” All the Law of Moses and the Books of the Prophets are based on these two commandments."

If we follow that approach any errors we make will be those of ignorance not intent. I may for example try to help the drug addict by getting him into treatment before he is ready and push him away when what he really needs is to be left alone and hit rock bottom first before he is ready to quit but that is an error of ignorance my not knowing the best way to help him. As we grow in knowledge as individuals and as a species errors of ignorance will decline if our intent remains pure.

You should certainly not refuse to help an individual suffering from gender dysphoria if you can just as you should help an atheists or someone suffering from autism or down syndrome. In fact it is our duty to try and help those individuals. That is what I am doing right now. I am trying to help you. Writing this post is certainly not a profitable use of my time. As unpleasant as it may be helping someone sometimes requires us to highlight the error in their false beliefs.  

Well, belief in imaginary beings is a mental illness too, you know?
legendary
Activity: 1946
Merit: 1055
April 21, 2019, 03:43:19 PM

Gays are ill?

I think you are ill, but I repeat myself.

You don't know how I feel? I feel we should live in a society were all members of society are protected (under the law) and are free from discrimination (that includes you btw).  If they are not, it is our duty as good people to change the law so they are protected.

Even if trans are mentally ill (which I don't think they are) you should not refuse them your service, just like (I hope) you would not refuse your service to people who are Atheists or suffer from Autism or Down Syndrome.  

That is how I feel on this issue.

Regarding any religious mythologies, you know my position.  I view them as an ancient, cultural tradition, a political relic that has no place in a progressive society driven by science, medicine, engineering, and technology.

To be fair, gender dysphoria might be a disease, there is science that says so, however if we are talking only on discrimination, then no, obviously no one should discriminate other people even if it's a mental illness, actually because it might be a mental illness, they shouldn't be discriminated ever at all costs, you are not supposed to mock mentally ill people.

All human beings are ill. The only difference lies in the severity of the illness. One man might suffer from occasionally feeling down another might be so depressed he cannot hold down a job. When the illness is severe we categorize it box it off and call it a disease but reality is a spectrum. So yes gays are ill so are all the heterosexuals. The severity of the overall illness will depend on the the individual. We don't always agree on what constitutes normal healthy variation and what behaviors are destructive. When a disagreement like that arises its is the result of ignorance a failure of one party or often both to accurately assess the the reality of the situation.

Discrimination is always an evil for every individual deserves to be evaluated on their own merits not based on arbitrary groupings. However, occasionally discrimination is an unavoidable evil due to imperfect human knowledge and society. Take pedophiles for example. Even after they have completed their jail terms and paid their debts to society we don't let them live near elementary schools. We know that the rate of repeat offenders among individuals with that particular illness is high and have no way of knowing with certainly who will fall back into crime so we discriminate against them all to protect innocent children. Is that ideal no the ideal would be certain knowledge that the offender was cured or not but we don't have that.

When you deny reality and demand others not challenge that denial there are always going to be consequences. That is what you are really aiming for here with your "equality law" for gender dysphoric individuals. In addition to being a potential tool to attack religious freedom it would also discriminate against biological women. It would destroy women sport a process that is already well underway in liberal parts of the country. You should watch the video of the 16 year old teenage athlete in the following story. Denial of reality is insanity. If you claim to ground your worldview in science af_newbie you should acknowledge that.

https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2019/04/21/female-athlete-speaks-out-against-transgender-equality-act/

The answer to how to deal with human illness is found in the New Testament as so many words of wisdom are. We should treat each human life as inherently and innately valuable regardless of any disease it may suffer from. Each human being is a precious and child of God and deserving of the dignity and respect that status accords. We should also treat each of our fellow brothers and sisters as we would want to be treated if we stood in their shoes.

Matthew 22:36-40
“Teacher, what is the most important commandment in the Law?”
Jesus answered:
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. This is the first and most important commandment. The second most important commandment is like this one. And it is, “Love others as much as you love yourself.” All the Law of Moses and the Books of the Prophets are based on these two commandments."

If we follow that approach any errors we make will be those of ignorance not intent. I may for example try to help the drug addict by getting him into treatment before he is ready and push him away when what he really needs is to be left alone and hit rock bottom first before he is ready to quit but that is an error of ignorance my not knowing the best way to help him. As we grow in knowledge as individuals and as a species errors of ignorance will decline if our intent remains pure.

You should certainly not refuse to help an individual suffering from gender dysphoria if you can just as you should help an atheists or someone suffering from autism or down syndrome. In fact it is our duty to try and help those individuals. That is what I am doing right now. I am trying to help you. Writing this post is certainly not a profitable use of my time. As unpleasant as it may be helping someone sometimes requires us to highlight the error in their false beliefs.  
legendary
Activity: 3990
Merit: 1385
April 21, 2019, 03:14:52 PM
^^^ Believing in science is another illness. It's mostly engineering that brings about our advances.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
April 21, 2019, 11:40:34 AM

Laws change my friend.  So be ready to obey the new laws or face the piper.

You are against the bill that would prohibit discrimination based on gender identity and sexual orientation.

And you asking me what is wrong with your opposition?  I bet you would be for segregation laws back in the day, for the same reason.

You are a bigot.  A horrible human being.

You can redeem yourself by supporting a law that will criminalize discrimination. Be a better man than your 'God'.

Ha ha tell me how you really feel af_newbie.

I guess laws only matter to you if you agree with them. So much for all your talk about respecting the collective determination of which actions are causing harm. Looks like you have some other metric you are choosing not to share with us.

Interesting that you now turn to name calling and offering redemption if I repent. You really fit right in with today's radicalism don't you. If we were on a less freedom loving forum like twitter or facebook you or someone like you would probably go complaining to the moderators at this point attempting to get me kicked off the platform for the horrific "hate crime" of disagreeing with your goals to transform society and the law into your Utopian ideal.

The honest truth is that you are the one participating in the horror by encouraging your fellow human beings to their self-destruction. Gender dysphoria is a disease. It is a very serious behavioral condition with definite health consequences. One in seven biological men who identify as transgender women have HIV. That number rises to 44% among blacks. About half of biological women with gender dysphoria will attempt suicide.

https://www.breitbart.com/health/2019/04/20/cdc-one-seven-transgender-women-have-hiv/

These poor individuals are very very ill. They need help learning to live with and dealing with a biological reality they wish did not exist. Affirmations that their condition is wonderful and normal does them a tremendous disservice.

That said I would consider supporting your bill if you added in language that also prohibited discrimination based on religious beliefs, allowed for faith based consciousness objections, and included protections for private employers to run their business in accordance with their faith based principles. I doubt you would be on board with that though. The goal of most extremist when seeking this kind of legislation is to obtain weapons to use against their political and ideological opposition not to defang government or increase freedom.  


Gays are ill?

I think you are ill, but I repeat myself.

You don't know how I feel? I feel we should live in a society were all members of society are protected (under the law) and are free from discrimination (that includes you btw).  If they are not, it is our duty as good people to change the law so they are protected.

Even if trans are mentally ill (which I don't think they are) you should not refuse them your service, just like (I hope) you would not refuse your service to people who are Atheists or suffer from Autism or Down Syndrome.  

That is how I feel on this issue.

Regarding any religious mythologies, you know my position.  I view them as an ancient, cultural tradition, a political relic that has no place in a progressive society driven by science, medicine, engineering, and technology.

To be fair, gender dysphoria might be a disease, there is science that says so, however if we are talking only on discrimination, then no, obviously no one should discriminate other people even if it's a mental illness, actually because it might be a mental illness, they shouldn't be discriminated ever at all costs, you are not supposed to mock mentally ill people.
member
Activity: 69
Merit: 10
April 21, 2019, 10:31:11 AM
There are few things that atheists also believe in that the universe is run by a natural force and the people are doing the sins and good deeds by their own will. And that is itself in believing in God. Because you are admitting that there is something that is running the world and the whole universe system. If we talk about islam then there is only one explanation first you have experience islam and then you will know whether it is bad or good for your believe.

People just don't want to follow islam because it told you to be in control in you actions and you deeds that you do normally in your daily life thats it.
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