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Topic: [POR]⚡ELECTRONEUM⚡Official Moderated Thread - page 147. (Read 240346 times)

newbie
Activity: 178
Merit: 0
Waw! Electroneum Kudos for this recent update now i can see my old LG g3 mining up to 10 etn a day with a high Hash rate if 30.76h/s, before i couldn't mine 1etn for whole day with same device, whatever it was you did to make this transformation is really impressive,  the mobile mining now is alot better than previously, only just the price of etn is not able to move up like other tokens from time to time, but more time to grow.


How is hash rate even calculated if you're not using CPU power? I would like to know how this mobile "mining" thing actually works.

They just benchmark your phone and according your hardware specifications you get a certain reward in a given time - "hash rate". No mining involved in the real meaning. Well, I don't really see the point of getting rewarded for nothing, but this is their strategy. At least you are not killing your battery/phone by doing this so called "mining".



Isn't that prone to someone cheating by making the app believe the smartphone has different specs? I guess that wouldn't be too difficult.

I think that is why the hash rate now flat 30 h/s with low spec android phone like my phone.
sr. member
Activity: 574
Merit: 261
I know not everybody on this forum visits the Electroneum FB page (https://www.facebook.com/electroneum/), but apparently there are some fake ETN giveaways going on in social media. Just wanted to give you a heads up.
This is what they posted: "Please remain vigilant- we are aware of multiple ETN accounts posting fake ETH/ETN giveaways under our social media posts to cause confusion- note, the @ name will be slightly different, in addition they will have fake comments. Do not send your details!" (they also posted some pictures: https://www.facebook.com/electroneum/posts/1983242025271099)


It's not only Electroneum and it's not only on Facebook, almost every Twitter altcoin account is flodded with givaway scams, remember 'if it's too good to be true...'
full member
Activity: 322
Merit: 101
So basically now they started to block accounts because of mobile mining! Why?
John I missing your moans ;-)

What is going on ?

Maybe Richard latest update put some confidence back into him Cheesy
member
Activity: 413
Merit: 17
So basically now they started to block accounts because of mobile mining! Why?
John I missing your moans ;-)

What is going on ?
full member
Activity: 459
Merit: 102
So basically now they started to block accounts because of mobile mining! Why?
newbie
Activity: 75
Merit: 0
If everybody gets 10 ETNs / day with phone fake mining why should I bother with real mining ?

I get 10 ETNs/day mining on cpu using 500 Hs/s.

Why anyone with small CPU power should bother with real mining?

I thought everything is about many small miners keeping the network alive.
Why do we need real miners? Because real miners are going to transfers the ETN to each wallets.
If there is no miners, the fake mining can't work. You can double your ETN by doing real mining and also fake mining.
But i totally agree that it is not very fair for people doing real mining as the reward is very small compare to the electricity they are spending.

Also you don't even need a mobile phone ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIl3sF6sTgw
full member
Activity: 798
Merit: 103
If everybody gets 10 ETNs / day with phone fake mining why should I bother with real mining ?

I get 10 ETNs/day mining on cpu using 500 Hs/s.

Why anyone with small CPU power should bother with real mining?

I thought everything is about many small miners keeping the network alive.
Why do we need real miners? Because real miners are going to transfers the ETN to each wallets.
If there is no miners, the fake mining can't work. You can double your ETN by doing real mining and also fake mining.
But i totally agree that it is not very fair for people doing real mining as the reward is very small compare to the electricity they are spending.
sr. member
Activity: 630
Merit: 253
Didn't know this, thank you very much for explanation. I really wonder how it will performed on android powered laptops  Cheesy

Well, after the latest update most of smartphones I have checked or saw on screeshots, have all same hashrate - 30H/s which give about 10 ETN coins per day. I don't really know chromebook specs, but I'm wondering too if those would get more hashpower than high end smartphones. Although they may be not compatible with Electroneum app, cause for example I can't install it on my Samsung Galaxy S2 Tablet.

Am also finding it strange why some good spec device are not compatible with the app? I think this is a flaws in the part of the mobile mining experience, it can only support one of my device, why make it compatible to some device and not compatible to other's? I thought follow up updates could have fix this discriminating error or some how the dev are aware and are working to fix it, but i guess am wrong!
Between balance has not reflected in my wallet till now, i don't know, but seem the network is really congested as it is.
newbie
Activity: 75
Merit: 0
If everybody gets 10 ETNs / day with phone fake mining why should I bother with real mining ?

I get 10 ETNs/day mining on cpu using 500 Hs/s.

Why anyone with small CPU power should bother with real mining?

I thought everything is about many small miners keeping the network alive.

And another thing: if a fake 30 hs/s phone mining gives you 10 etn / day, just try real mining with a 30 hs/s CPU.
As I sad, I get 10 ETN/day with 500 Hs/s and not 30 hs/s and that is of real mining.

I hope ETN team understand real miners frustrations right? Or else we'll just all do fake mining and let ASIC run the network ...
member
Activity: 124
Merit: 10
Didn't know this, thank you very much for explanation. I really wonder how it will performed on android powered laptops  Cheesy

Well, after the latest update most of smartphones I have checked or saw on screeshots, have all same hashrate - 30H/s which give about 10 ETN coins per day. I don't really know chromebook specs, but I'm wondering too if those would get more hashpower than high end smartphones. Although they may be not compatible with Electroneum app, cause for example I can't install it on my Samsung Galaxy S2 Tablet.
It almost sounds like its more profitable to mine with my phone than my cpu
It is, by far, if you have a 4 core cpu or less.
hero member
Activity: 906
Merit: 507
Didn't know this, thank you very much for explanation. I really wonder how it will performed on android powered laptops  Cheesy

Well, after the latest update most of smartphones I have checked or saw on screeshots, have all same hashrate - 30H/s which give about 10 ETN coins per day. I don't really know chromebook specs, but I'm wondering too if those would get more hashpower than high end smartphones. Although they may be not compatible with Electroneum app, cause for example I can't install it on my Samsung Galaxy S2 Tablet.
It almost sounds like its more profitable to mine with my phone than my cpu
newbie
Activity: 6
Merit: 1
Tried posting this on reddit, but it seems that new accounts can't do that.

Status of tx flooding attack + partial solution

I've been looking at the tx flooding attack of ETN for some time and today I've decided to do something to help the coin. I'll give some suggestions below, but I would like to start with some facts. All the facts come from the current state of affairs and from looking at the electroneum source code.

* blockexplorer.electroneum.com is mostly misrepresenting the size of the transaction pool. Right now it says "no of txs: 2252" and electroneum daemon on on of my servers (restarted few hours ago, otherwise numbers would be higher) shows:
7407 tx(es), 62708270 bytes total (min 473, max 18335, avg 8466)
fees 646.32 (avg 0.08 per tx, 0.00 per byte)
0 not relayed, 0 failing, 7259 older than 10 minutes (oldest 4 hours ago), estimated 3136 block (3136 minutes) backlog
   Age      Txes       Bytes
00:00:00     370     2700389
00:30:21     601     4867303
01:00:43     977     7682079
01:31:05     899     6599388
02:01:27     940     8608865
02:31:49     804     7092333
03:02:11     788     7017459
03:32:33     686     6090759
04:02:55     894     7972295
04:44:53     448     4077400

* The current formula for block reward (what miner gets for mining a block) is: there is this thing called "block size", which is important for miner reward and is somewhat proportional to the numer of transactions in the block. Median of the last 100 block sizes is calculated (imagine sorting the sizes and taking average of 50th and 51th value). Also there is some value called "base_reward", that is based on amount of already mined coins and is very slowly decreasing with each block. The maximum a miner can get from mining a block is base_reward+some transaction feed. However the miner can algo get (significantly) less than base_reward. As long as miner keeps the mined block strictly under or equal of median block size, the miner collects base_reward+fees of the transactions he manages to squeeze in the block. The miner is allowed to create a block with size between basically zero (0.2 kb in reality for "empty" block) and twice the median size. However if the produced block size is over median size, he gets less than base_reward. The exact formula for what miner gets for miner reward when it produces block that is larger than median is base_reward*(median_size*2-block_size)*block_size/median_size/median_size+fees. It is optimal to produce a block equal to median size. If you go over median, for 5% over your reward will be 99.75% of base_reward, for 10% over median you get 99%, for 12.5% over median the payout is 98.44%, for 15% over is 97.75%, for 20% over 96%, for 25% over - 93.75%, for 30% over - 91%, for 40% over - 84%, for 50% over - 75%, for 60% over - 64%. The picture is clear, you get exponentially lower payment for going over median. If you manage to go exactly twice - your reward will be zero. In case somebody is not convinced I've mined a block with as close to the twice the median as I could - look at block number 237226 in the block explorer and as you can see I've got 363.59 in miner rewards (normally around 6400 for block nowadays).

* Current algorithm for creating a block is the following: keep adding the most profitable transactions to the block until the block is over median size. That mean that in presence of transactions in the pool, the block size will be over the median size on average by half of a transaction size. With the current fee structure this means that almost always a miner with unmodified daemon gets less reward than base_reward and lower than maximum possible reward. So there is a incentive for generating empty blocks. A miner can get slightly more by including some transactions without going over the median block size.

* With the cryptonote protocol your if your wallet does not really "own" the amount you have in the balance. Your wallet has "unspent_outputs" (displayed by unspent_outputs command in cli wallet) that is equivalent sum of decimal digits in incoming transactions. That is if you receive 754.43 ETN you wallet receive one "output" of 700, one 50, one 4, one 0.4 and one 0.03. If you receive two transactions of 56.54 and 34.44 you wallet will have the following outputs: 50, 30, 6, 4, 0.5, 0.5, 0.04, 0.04.

* When are sending a transaction, you are listing the "outputs" you are willing to spend. The more outputs you list, the bigger is the transaction. That is if you are sending 1000 ETN from your wallet and you've been receiving transactions of say 30-50 ETN from your minnig pool - your transactions will be a big one. Sometimes it will be too big and the wallet will suggest that what you want to send will be split in multiple transaction. One tricky point - what I'm calling "unspent outputs" once in a transaction become "inputs" of the transaction.

* It generally costs the same to send an unspent output of 10 ETN and 100000 ETN.

* Transactions have two properties that are relevant to inclusion in a block: size in kilobytes and fee per kilobyte. You can't really control the size - it is proportional to the number of unspent outputs/inputs you are sending. However you can set the price you are willing to pay per kilobyte (0.01, 0.04 and 1.66 ETN/kb are levels in the default wallet, if I'm not mistaken). It is also worth mentioning that for purposes of fee calculations sizes are rounded up to a full kilobyte size. That is the fee for sending a 0.3kb and 0.9kb transaction is the same, but 0.3kb transaction will use less space in the block, so a miner will generally prefer it.

All of the above are mathematical/algorithmic facts. Now I'll cite some facts from the current state of blockchain. I prefer to call those "observations", so they are in a different section.

* There are significant number of "empty" blocks in the blockchain, that is ones without any transactions. It is my belief that even when those blocks were "blocktemplates" that miners mined on, there were many transactions to be included in the block. Examples: blocks 237477 and 237479.

* Normally if all participants in the network would mine with unmodified, normal daemon, in a presence of many transactions in the pool, the median size block will and therefore number of transactions in a block will slowly grow - every block will have size sligtly over the median of last 100 blocks, so the median will slowly grow. In the presence of numerous "empty" blocks that is not happening.

* Up until today the attacker would employ techniques to create the largest possible transactions. Today the attacker(s) realized that it is far more beneficial to create transactions around 0.5kb in size. Those will still pay 0.01 ETN to be included in block, but are twice more profitable than 1kb transactions for the miners. Therefore unmodified miners would prefer those "attack" transactions over any other larger ones (except if the sender sets higher fee).

OK, what can be done? Well, we can modify our daemons not to prioritize small transactions. Generally an attacker can't really flood the network with large transactions, since it will lock too much funds (think of 5000 transactions of 10000 ETN). I've modified the daemon code in such a way and I've been mining for hours with some of my gear and mostly with nicehash. Here are few of the last blocks I've mined: 237537, 237530, 237527, 237520, 237516, 237507.

As you can see, mostly large transactions in the block and not spammy ones. Also as of now, empty block get rewards of 6401.92, my block are rewarded like 6340-6360 - like 1% lower, but those blocks are trying to actually increase the median size without sacrificing more than 1.2% of the income.

My modification prefers larger transactions (however it threats all transactions over 5000 ETN as equal in size) and give lower priority to transactions with very high ring sizes (which translate in size in kilobytes). However I can't do it by myself. If at least some pools would use my modifications, I believe we can achieve a goal of "transactions over 100 ETN are fast", which would be a start.

I'm not arguing that this is a long-term solution, so I'm not submitting a pull request to the official electroneum github repo. Instead, I'm providing a link to a patch:
https://my.pcloud.com/publink/show?code=XZ4kgQ7ZyARUX262JupgngVRLDuG1RiAqEV7

You can apply it to your source by going to the "electroneum" directory and executing "patch -p1 < ../electro-txfee.patch", where "../electro-txfee.patch" is the path to the downloaded file. As everybody can see, the changes are minimal and concern only one function in one file. The current logic allows the blocks size to go up to 12.5% over the median for 98.44% of the maximum payout. In practice it will almost always achieve over 99% of the maximum payout.

There are many options for long term solutions, but if I would be in the shoes of electroneum team right now, I would modify my daemon to mine blocks as close as twice the median as possible and I would mine with all the hashing power there is for sale (at a reasonable price) as possible. Most of the long term solutions are already implemented in the code, given that it's borrowed from Monero. Electroneum just have to bump the version. However, for the time being and for the prices being, a working solution would have to increase transaction prices significantly.

Best,
Very concerned citizen
member
Activity: 212
Merit: 12
It seems that there is too much transactions on the blockchain. Not enough real miners... Could some people do real mining to help for the transfers of ETN?

As far as I understand blockchains, the speed doesn't depend on the number of machines currently mining. Only the security of the blockchain and resistance against the 51% attacks increases.

Also, there are no official news from the Electroneum team regarding the ongoing attack. What is the reason for this silence?
jr. member
Activity: 122
Merit: 1
Does antiasic fork planed in near future? And where I can find manual or "howto" about mobile mining?
ASIC solution currently in the works

Good news hopefully something unique that deviates from V7 would be great
legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1002
Waw! Electroneum Kudos for this recent update now i can see my old LG g3 mining up to 10 etn a day with a high Hash rate if 30.76h/s, before i couldn't mine 1etn for whole day with same device, whatever it was you did to make this transformation is really impressive,  the mobile mining now is alot better than previously, only just the price of etn is not able to move up like other tokens from time to time, but more time to grow.


How is hash rate even calculated if you're not using CPU power? I would like to know how this mobile "mining" thing actually works.

They just benchmark your phone and according your hardware specifications you get a certain reward in a given time - "hash rate". No mining involved in the real meaning. Well, I don't really see the point of getting rewarded for nothing, but this is their strategy. At least you are not killing your battery/phone by doing this so called "mining".



Isn't that prone to someone cheating by making the app believe the smartphone has different specs? I guess that wouldn't be too difficult.
newbie
Activity: 178
Merit: 0
Any news when the electroneum transaction back to normal? I have some pending transaction
full member
Activity: 420
Merit: 110
I know not everybody on this forum visits the Electroneum FB page (https://www.facebook.com/electroneum/), but apparently there are some fake ETN giveaways going on in social media. Just wanted to give you a heads up.
This is what they posted: "Please remain vigilant- we are aware of multiple ETN accounts posting fake ETH/ETN giveaways under our social media posts to cause confusion- note, the @ name will be slightly different, in addition they will have fake comments. Do not send your details!" (they also posted some pictures: https://www.facebook.com/electroneum/posts/1983242025271099)

hero member
Activity: 1232
Merit: 528
Community Manager: ETN
Does antiasic fork planed in near future? And where I can find manual or "howto" about mobile mining?



ASIC solution currently in the works




Mobile mining how to:

Download app
Create account
Press "Start Mining" button

Seriously not kidding, it is really that simple




Its great and will bring alot of the general population into crypto because its so easy and free. Someone would need to be confused not to do it.

Some dont think its even worth worring about because you can only mine 2 to 10+ cents a day, but thats based off todays value.

If you hold all the ETN and contine mining for a few years, the value of your mined ETN will be in the THOUSANDS!!

sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 252
Buy/Sell crypto at BestChange
Does antiasic fork planed in near future? And where I can find manual or "howto" about mobile mining?
legendary
Activity: 1862
Merit: 1505
I've recently bought some ETN from Kucoin and withdrawn them to my mobile wallet, but seems like even after more than 12 hours, there're no confirmations and it's not getting processed:

https://blockexplorer.electroneum.com/tx/949ed435a55df58e2586f1657e5fecc9da62ebb43e9d9bbdef82319c896ce0f8

Is this usual thing with Electroneum? Roll Eyes

I'll quote the announcement of a pool I'm using,
"Electroneum network is is being flooded with <1 ETN transactions.
  As ETN network's pending transaction count exceeded 5000 and new transactions are not confirmed, pool disabled payouts temporarily. "


The "transactions are not confirmed" though is an outdated statement, I've received payments just fine the last hours. I'm not checking my wallet every hour but on a daily basis and personally I didn't notice anything weird, but it seems someone tried a DDOS kind of attack or for whatever reason a lot of transactions caused delays.

The issue seems critical. I didn't receive anything and at last, the transaction has been wiped out of blockexplorer. I'll now have to write a whole support ticket to Kucoin to re-send the Electroneum and pay more fee this time.

From what I see in the news, seems like Electroneum has been facing it for a while. I'm starting to wonder, if they can't handle this DDoS attack, how in the world will they be able to actually make instantaneous transactions a reality.
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