Potential Match Fixing involving Finnish teams FC Futura and Ilves-Kissat - page 7.

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Quote from: holydarkness on June 08, 2024, 12:40:21 PM

I actually would have to agree with Haunebu. The pendulum did swing toward newfish1, but the jury is still out [umm, pun intended] and everything is still not set in stone yet.

We all seem to be saying the same thing in different ways. I didn't say anything was set in stone yet, just that one party has more support and sympathy than the other.

Quote from: holydarkness on June 08, 2024, 12:40:21 PM

This case has one too many loose ends that need to be tied, and both parties reluctance to be transparent clearly didn't help.

I am not holding out much hope, but if Fairlay does return to this thread and arbitrators are decided on and get to work, we can then say one or the other are not being transparent.

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Quote from: Upgrade00 on June 08, 2024, 10:43:20 AM

Quote from: Haunebu on June 08, 2024, 10:37:16 AM

Incorrect! The pendulum is definitely swinging his way, but that doesn't mean he is completely in the clear which is why some members like me still find his activities shady based on the evidence Fairlay provided.

I wouldn't ask for the specifics about what exactly is shady cause everyone can form their opinion about a topic, but we can all agree that shady =/= Let's seize all funds on the account. You have to actually have some hard evidence to take such action.

Quote from: Haunebu on June 08, 2024, 10:37:16 AM

True. They are dragging this case unnecessarily and messing up their reputation within this forum. They should have selected efialtis and holydarkness as arbitrators and proceeded sometime back.

I think one or both of those users were not too keen on it or at least not comfortable with having just one arbitrator as fairlay were suggesting.

I actually would have to agree with Haunebu. The pendulum did swing toward newfish1, but the jury is still out [umm, pun intended] and everything is still not set in stone yet. I can easily see several scenario that can greatly put extra momentum to that pendulum, be it toward newfish1 or fairlay; one or two statements that can greatly put an impact.

This case has one too many loose ends that need to be tied, and both parties reluctance to be transparent clearly didn't help.

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Quote from: Haunebu on June 08, 2024, 10:37:16 AM

Incorrect! The pendulum is definitely swinging his way, but that doesn't mean he is completely in the clear which is why some members like me still find his activities shady based on the evidence Fairlay provided.

I wouldn't ask for the specifics about what exactly is shady cause everyone can form their opinion about a topic, but we can all agree that shady =/= Let's seize all funds on the account. You have to actually have some hard evidence to take such action.

Quote from: Haunebu on June 08, 2024, 10:37:16 AM

True. They are dragging this case unnecessarily and messing up their reputation within this forum. They should have selected efialtis and holydarkness as arbitrators and proceeded sometime back.

I think one or both of those users were not too keen on it or at least not comfortable with having just one arbitrator as fairlay were suggesting.

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Quote from: Upgrade00 on June 08, 2024, 09:37:49 AM

The user already has the forum support without dropping any evidence. It isn't even up to the accused to prove innocence, it is up to the accuser (Fairlay) to show enough evidence to convince the community that this user indeed broke their rules and should have his funds locked.

Incorrect! The pendulum is definitely swinging his way, but that doesn't mean he is completely in the clear which is why some members like me still find his activities shady based on the evidence Fairlay provided.

Quote from: Upgrade00 on June 08, 2024, 09:37:49 AM

I sincerely Fairlay will settle with any mediators for this case. They have backtracked too many times in the thread and don't look to be willing to make any sort of payments to the user wo has even suggested a compromise in the situation.

True. They are dragging this case unnecessarily and messing up their reputation within this forum. They should have selected efialtis and holydarkness as arbitrators and proceeded sometime back.

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Quote from: Beparanf on June 08, 2024, 08:22:29 AM

At least you have the forum support against fairlay so that they will not gonna promote here if you made a very solid evidence on your case.

The user already has the forum support without dropping any evidence. It isn't even up to the accused to prove innocence, it is up to the accuser (Fairlay) to show enough evidence to convince the community that this user indeed broke their rules and should have his funds locked.

I sincerely Fairlay will settle with any mediators for this case. They have backtracked too many times in the thread and don't look to be willing to make any sort of payments to the user wo has even suggested a compromise in the situation.

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Quote from: Beparanf on June 08, 2024, 08:22:29 AM

But in the end, Fairlay is the one who will gonna pay you so whoever they hire they are still the one who will decide whether they will honor your profit or not regardless of the mediator result unless your balance is on escrow.

At least you have the forum support against fairlay so that they will not gonna promote here if you made a very solid evidence on your case. I know that you are trying to get your money back by providing facts that you are right but the problem is what if Fairlay doesn’t plan to pay you regardless of how solid your evidence is?

There’s same scenario here about coinplay.com which they confiscate user balance due to accusations of cheating which is not proven. Coinplay just abandoned the forum so that they can escape from the payment.

Source: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/coinplay-confiscating-291mbtc-of-fair-nba-winnings-5446504

If they don't want to pay him anyway then it also makes no sense to play his cards now as well. It's much better for him to wait until a mediator is decided and fairlay agrees to actually respect the decision made no matter what.

Don't know why you want to convince this guy from anything different.

Fairlay won't come back here anyway, even if they pay, acting the way they are doing here is definitely bad for their reputation and people will remember this case. I always wanted to try fairlay but not I won't waste a second on that site.

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Quote from: newfish1 on June 08, 2024, 07:00:11 AM

Quote from: Beparanf on June 08, 2024, 06:46:33 AM

Quote from: newfish1 on June 08, 2024, 06:32:18 AM

I simply do not believe them at this point. We will run out of potential mediators, if I was to share my evidence too early Grin

When the mediation process will officially start, all cards will be on deck. Until then let there be doubt.

I don’t get the point on this logic. Why do you need to make the evidence in sneak peek while you should win all the case in every mediator they will get. How come they will run out of mediator if you will provide evidence to establish solid conclusions about this case.

Are you planning to prolong this case? This kind of a little bit dodgy attitude might backfire to you soon. If you can win here then you will just need to copy paste all the info on other mediator that they will hire to look on your case unless you are not confident with your betting history record.

Easy example

They wanted Gosu representative to be the mediator, they approached him.

But in the meantime I was explaining my side in this thread, Gosu representative efialtis voiced his opinions on the Fairlay's wrongdoings.

Fairlay backtracked and no longer wanted efialtis as the mediator.

There is no point for me to share everything against Fairlay until the mediation process is set up and ready to go. I am afraid they will say holydarkness is not good enough for them, even though they have already agreed.

But in the end, Fairlay is the one who will gonna pay you so whoever they hire they are still the one who will decide whether they will honor your profit or not regardless of the mediator result unless your balance is on escrow.

At least you have the forum support against fairlay so that they will not gonna promote here if you made a very solid evidence on your case. I know that you are trying to get your money back by providing facts that you are right but the problem is what if Fairlay doesn’t plan to pay you regardless of how solid your evidence is?

There’s same scenario here about coinplay.com which they confiscate user balance due to accusations of cheating which is not proven. Coinplay just abandoned the forum so that they can escape from the payment.

Source: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/coinplay-confiscating-291mbtc-of-fair-nba-winnings-5446504

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Quote from: Beparanf on June 08, 2024, 06:46:33 AM

Quote from: newfish1 on June 08, 2024, 06:32:18 AM

I simply do not believe them at this point. We will run out of potential mediators, if I was to share my evidence too early Grin

When the mediation process will officially start, all cards will be on deck. Until then let there be doubt.

I don’t get the point on this logic. Why do you need to make the evidence in sneak peek while you should win all the case in every mediator they will get. How come they will run out of mediator if you will provide evidence to establish solid conclusions about this case.

Are you planning to prolong this case? This kind of a little bit dodgy attitude might backfire to you soon. If you can win here then you will just need to copy paste all the info on other mediator that they will hire to look on your case unless you are not confident with your betting history record.

Easy example

They wanted Gosu representative to be the mediator, they approached him.

But in the meantime I was explaining my side in this thread, Gosu representative efialtis voiced his opinions on the Fairlay's wrongdoings.

Fairlay backtracked and no longer wanted efialtis as the mediator.

There is no point for me to share everything against Fairlay until the mediation process is set up and ready to go. I am afraid they will say holydarkness is not good enough for them, even though they have already agreed.

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Quote from: newfish1 on June 08, 2024, 06:32:18 AM

I simply do not believe them at this point. We will run out of potential mediators, if I was to share my evidence too early Grin

When the mediation process will officially start, all cards will be on deck. Until then let there be doubt.

I don’t get the point on this logic. Why do you need to make the evidence in sneak peek while you should win all the case in every mediator they will get. How come they will run out of mediator if you will provide evidence to establish solid conclusions about this case.

Are you planning to prolong this case? This kind of a little bit dodgy attitude might backfire to you soon. If you can win here then you will just need to copy paste all the info on other mediator that they will hire to look on your case unless you are not confident with your betting history record.

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Quote from: holydarkness on June 07, 2024, 02:08:04 PM

I am interested to know about your betting strategy, that you've keep tight in your pocket all this time, and that you claimed to be a proof of your innocence. Perhaps we can go with that? See if it put thing back in motion? Given this thread seemingly stuck on a point and didn't move in any direction.

Its in my pocket for a reason.

Seeing how Fairlay has turned many people against them (even the people they approached themselves to be mediators), I dont want it to happen to anybody else until we finalize the future mediation process.

I simply do not believe them at this point. We will run out of potential mediators, if I was to share my evidence too early Grin

When the mediation process will officially start, all cards will be on deck. Until then let there be doubt.

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When they saw my post, they PMed me, asking me to reach out to them via a "secure connection".

1. They really seem to have some kind of "security" paranoia
2. I told them they could contact me via the official BTCGOSU email
3. Not heard anything from them yet

Let me be clear, as usual, I am not here to bash anyone, I am not here to bash brands, etc. When you act unreasonable and unprofessional though, then I say so and take action. Running a gambling affiliate business, I think that`s the least I can and have to do - sure, most operators would love all affiliates to be pure advertisers with no questions asked, but that`s not me and not the BTCGOSU`s reason for existence or else, it would be just another random affiliate platform - I am trying hard to do better than that.

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Quote from: newfish1 on June 07, 2024, 01:12:06 PM

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

To simply put your issue in summary. They didn’t plan to pay even with this mediator shenanigans since they already have a verdict on your case regardless of the result.

By simply judging their action about permanently ban you due to the match fixed which they assumed. This casino doesn’t have plan to negotiate this but rather they are just finding a way to finally get a support. They failed to gain it using forum mediator so they will just keep looking for other mediators to delay this issue until everyone forgotten already.

@Efialtis feedback is the only good move here and will serve as receipt about this casino action.

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Quote from: newfish1 on June 07, 2024, 01:12:06 PM

Quote from: holydarkness on June 07, 2024, 11:52:29 AM

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Seeing where this thing was going (before Gosu blacklisted them) and never having an intention to somehow harm Fairlay's reputation (because frankly speaking I really do like them a lot and I still think this whole thing is one big misunderstanding, because Fairlay guys are not really from betting industry, but rather IT specialists and Crypto guys), I made another attempt to prove to Fairlay that I am just a real big stakes gambler.

I offered them to bet a total of ridiculous amount of 10 BTC on Euro2024 games (the biggest market there is in the industry now) before I could withdraw.

My offer was refused and instead I was promised a "thorough investigation" by Fairlay (what kind of authority do they have to investigate anything across so many borders?), that will take God how much time. I will be notified when it is completed.

All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

Dude, don't bother with them.
If they do this to you once, what would stop them to do it again and confiscate even higher amounts.
This is a lesson learned I would say.
Why don't you use betfair? Just because of crypto or any other reasons? I mean the markets are better at bf and obviously it's much safe as we have learned.
Or just use outright pinnacle, since they are somehow connected to them anyway, why bother using fl instead of the real deal? Pinnacle also accepts crypto payments by the way, if this is a big factor to you.

I think any site would be happy to take your business if you are willing to bet high numbers.

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Quote from: newfish1 on June 07, 2024, 01:12:06 PM

Quote from: holydarkness on June 07, 2024, 11:52:29 AM

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Actually, that is me agreeing that one person, me, holding the final say is not a good thing.

Quote from: newfish1 on June 07, 2024, 01:12:06 PM

[...]
All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

I don't think so.

Though they previously mentioned that they're looking for an experienced mediator and is in touch with Betting Integrity Unit, and seemingly voted me and efialtis out, not long after I made my post regarding it, they reached to me again through PM.

The content of the PM is, naturally, can't be disclosed, but I think it's safe to tell the gist of it, that they're still interested to have me overseeing it, and that they're [at least the impression that I get] weighting my competence through several questions.

I am interested to know about your betting strategy, that you've keep tight in your pocket all this time, and that you claimed to be a proof of your innocence. Perhaps we can go with that? See if it put thing back in motion? Given this thread seemingly stuck on a point and didn't move in any direction.

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Quote from: holydarkness on June 07, 2024, 11:52:29 AM

Anyway, agree.

Thank you for agreeing to this not easy task.

Seeing where this thing was going (before Gosu blacklisted them) and never having an intention to somehow harm Fairlay's reputation (because frankly speaking I really do like them a lot and I still think this whole thing is one big misunderstanding, because Fairlay guys are not really from betting industry, but rather IT specialists and Crypto guys), I made another attempt to prove to Fairlay that I am just a real big stakes gambler.

I offered them to bet a total of ridiculous amount of 10 BTC on Euro2024 games (the biggest market there is in the industry now) before I could withdraw.

My offer was refused and instead I was promised a "thorough investigation" by Fairlay (what kind of authority do they have to investigate anything across so many borders?), that will take God how much time. I will be notified when it is completed.

All of these, after they agreed on you, holydarkness, as the mediator.

I don't understand, are they backing out of their own decision to leave this matter to a mediator in the first place ?

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Quote from: un_rank on June 05, 2024, 03:42:08 PM

[...]

Quote from: FairlaySupport on June 05, 2024, 12:56:05 PM

Just one arbitrator should be enough. So far, we would go for holydarkness, who was recommended to us first and signaled his willingness to participate.

No, you will need at least 2, 3 will be perfect cause then you have a tie breaker, but 1 is no arbitration at all.

- Jay -

Hmm... somehow missed my name being mentioned and discussed here in between that crazy multi-threads discussion with uhh... one of the deadly sin. The fact that two people engaged in pyramid quote with my name [unfortunately] being in the earlier quote, that dragged along all the way down, certainly didn't help as my tg notification bot goes crazy.

Anyway, agree.

As I previously mentioned, when I "mediate", I simply ask questions until it became apparent who did what and who is who. I am not Solomon, I believe my wisdom is insufficient enough to make a final say that people has to follow. So if we leave that to me and only me, well... I think I don't have to paint it to us of what'll happen [hint: it involves the word "decade" and/or "eternity"].

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- Jay -

Quote from: efialtis on June 05, 2024, 05:17:23 PM

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

They have had 5 pages of replies telling them they are in the wrong but have not bulged even a bit, they rather came back with a flimsy evidence from Instagram which should not get a second look and then deleted that when they did not get the "shocked" response they were expecting.

I will give them the room to reply before tagging them, but I do not fault you for doing it now, maybe that is the push they need to act professional.

- Jay -

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Quote from: efialtis on June 05, 2024, 05:17:23 PM

We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

Blacklisted on both GOSU sites - sharing the story on industry portals shortly, too.

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Quote from: efialtis on June 05, 2024, 05:17:23 PM

We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

Awesome, it's great to see you are taking action against such a strange behaviour.
People should be warned about this, not only here in our forum.
They way they handle this situation is just ridiculous and I have never seen anything like this before. It really is sad to see cause they looked like a well running site and I even considered joining them at some point in the past. But now it looks like I made a good decision not doing so.

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We will blacklist Fairlay first thing in the morning. We will then also go public about this on major industry portals.

Operations like this are the reason why the majority of the iGaming industry still considers crypto gambling/betting to be shady as hell, which in many cases is a valid claim.

The unprofessionalism shown here is unheard of - you act like a bunch of amateurs, not like some serious betting business. And your attitude...

Tagged them as well, not only can these people not be trusted. It`s quite ironic that they are the ones claiming abuse when it`s them abusing.

Topic: Potential Match Fixing involving Finnish teams FC Futura and Ilves-Kissat - page 7. (Read 2952 times)