Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod] - page 1006.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on June 22, 2020, 11:31:44 AM

Quote from: UmerIdrees on June 22, 2020, 11:04:29 AM

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It has been quality of the Pakistani players that they always come up with the talent. They don't develop talent in the schools or domestic cricket but most of them are god gifted. You will not find players like Sohaib Akhtar , Shaid Afridi as those players had god gifted talent which made them super heroes of the cricketing world.

So what is the selection process, the selectors will scout local tournaments and pick players and put them in the domestic setup and then to international cricket, you need to have the talent to become an international player and you cannot teach anyone to become a world class player but you can only polish and coach them if you have the talent to be on that level. Now there is a big vacuum in talents and the selectors need to scout for new talents who could replace some of the legendary players they had.

I will give you a few examples. Waqar Younis was actually spotted by Imran Khan during the late 1980s during a club competition. Imran groomed him and made sure that he gets quality training. Similarly, it was Majid Khan who spotted Shoaib Akhar during a similar club competition. Those days are long gone. The senior players are no longer handpicking any of the promising players from the domestic scene.

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Quote from: UmerIdrees on June 22, 2020, 11:04:29 AM

~
It has been quality of the Pakistani players that they always come up with the talent. They don't develop talent in the schools or domestic cricket but most of them are god gifted. You will not find players like Sohaib Akhtar , Shaid Afridi as those players had god gifted talent which made them super heroes of the cricketing world.

So what is the selection process, the selectors will scout local tournaments and pick players and put them in the domestic setup and then to international cricket, you need to have the talent to become an international player and you cannot teach anyone to become a world class player but you can only polish and coach them if you have the talent to be on that level. Now there is a big vacuum in talents and the selectors need to scout for new talents who could replace some of the legendary players they had.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: UmerIdrees on June 22, 2020, 11:04:29 AM

It has been quality of the Pakistani players that they always come up with the talent. They don't develop talent in the schools or domestic cricket but most of them are god gifted. You will not find players like Sohaib Akhtar , Shaid Afridi as those players had god gifted talent which made them super heroes of the cricketing world.

Yes.. players such as Waqar Younis, Shoaib Akhtar and Shahid Afridi were hand picked by senior members of the Pakistani team during the 90s. But it is not happening now. Either the senior players are not helping the selectors to find new talent, or there is a shortage of talent in Pakistan right now. The latter scenario is very unlikely, as Pakistan is having such a large player pool.

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on June 21, 2020, 08:30:22 AM

Quote from: BitSat19 on June 20, 2020, 06:57:02 AM

Really this is need of time because if they no implement things like this then surely they will be in hot waters domestic cricket can give some some better alternative for these bowlers but they need to do some work on pitches and infrastructure as well hopefully in near future we will able to have some good changes from PCB about this all.

Domestic cricket in Pakistan is in very bad shape, and in the recent years the quality has actually gone down. Domestic competitions are no longer producing quality players, who can be drafted to the national team. That is one of the reasons why the average age of the players in the national teams remains one of the highest in the world. Unless the quality improves, I don't think that it will be right to ask the players to take part in the domestic matches.

It has been quality of the Pakistani players that they always come up with the talent. They don't develop talent in the schools or domestic cricket but most of them are god gifted. You will not find players like Sohaib Akhtar , Shaid Afridi as those players had god gifted talent which made them super heroes of the cricketing world.

JSRAW

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^^ Yeah, English and OZ bowlers takes test cricket way too seriously , after that comes Indian bowlers.

Quote from: Sithara007 on June 20, 2020, 12:47:08 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 19, 2020, 10:27:11 PM

~Edited~

I am not sure about the situation in Pakistan. However if the BCCI implements a similar policy, it can never be implemented. Because very few of the national players take part in the Indian domestic tournaments. One reason is that the Ranji Trophy doesn't have the same glamour as the Sheffield Shield of Australia or the County cricket of England.

yeah but they do have mutual understanding with the players if they are on break from the international cricket and in case someone deliberately avoiding the domestic cricket, then be ready for some kind of consequence. Recent example are Ambati Raydu and Shikhar Dhawan, one get kicked out from the team and other from the test squad after retiring and refusing to play in domestic cricket respectively.

Couple of players got away with the punishment though : Bumrah (After injury) and Dhoni. Bumrah went directly NZ after his comeback and in case of Dhoni, well he's big guy, he refused to play in vijay hazare trophy (Dhoni-Dhawan both- before 2019 Aus tour) However no central contract for him this year due to very same reason if i am not wrong.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 11:05:00 PM

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He's only 28 year old, played around 35ish test matches so i would say yeah he took retirement way to early. 1 bad season is not correct excuse, when everyone knows he took retirement only because of limited over cricket. Try Imagining Starc, Bumrah, Rabada taking retirement for T-20.

There is no debate about Amir taking the retirement on the Test level too early and the only excuse he has is the work load, i was fairly surprised when Tatenda Taibu retired from cricket at 29 citing personal reasons and it was surprising as Zimbabwe was already struggling with lack of talents.

On the flip side, James Anderson and Stuart Broad are the only two new ball bowlers who are not playing the shorter format but they play only Test format and they are the best bowlers in World Cricket as the pitches in England suites fast bowlers and majority of the matches played by Pakistan are in dust wickets which does not aide the fast bowlers which can be demoralizing for a bowler.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: BitSat19 on June 20, 2020, 06:57:02 AM

Really this is need of time because if they no implement things like this then surely they will be in hot waters domestic cricket can give some some better alternative for these bowlers but they need to do some work on pitches and infrastructure as well hopefully in near future we will able to have some good changes from PCB about this all.

Domestic cricket in Pakistan is in very bad shape, and in the recent years the quality has actually gone down. Domestic competitions are no longer producing quality players, who can be drafted to the national team. That is one of the reasons why the average age of the players in the national teams remains one of the highest in the world. Unless the quality improves, I don't think that it will be right to ask the players to take part in the domestic matches.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 19, 2020, 10:27:11 PM

^^ If leading players backing out from the Test format at the young age due to financial excuse, its clearly not acceptable IMO, injuries on the other hand seems valid reasons. Almost every board has some kind of policy to compensate test players or managing their workload but in the end mentality of players matter most. Good thing is after Amir's retirement PCB made it mandatory to participate in the domestic cricket, from now on if you want to play for the national team then participate in the domestic cricket, otherwise you are out.

I am not sure about the situation in Pakistan. However if the BCCI implements a similar policy, it can never be implemented. Because very few of the national players take part in the Indian domestic tournaments. One reason is that the Ranji Trophy doesn't have the same glamour as the Sheffield Shield of Australia or the County cricket of England.

BitSat19

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 19, 2020, 10:27:11 PM

^^ If leading players backing out from the Test format at the young age due to financial excuse, its clearly not acceptable IMO, injuries on the other hand seems valid reasons. Almost every board has some kind of policy to compensate test players or managing their workload but in the end mentality of players matter most. Good thing is after Amir's retirement PCB made it mandatory to participate in the domestic cricket, from now on if you want to play for the national team then participate in the domestic cricket, otherwise you are out.

Edit
After Mohammad Amir retirement, PCB makes it mandatory for stars to play domestic cricket

Quote

Karachi: Mohammad Amir's sudden decision to retire from Test cricket and concentrate on limited overs while shifting his base to UK has prompted the PCB to make participation in domestic cricket mandatory.

It is widely believed that Amir, whose wife Narjis is a British passport holder, will be shifting his base to UK and will only play T20s and ODIs for the national side.

A PCB official of the board said that besides restructuring of the domestic season, it would be made mandatory for players to appear in domestic matches to qualify for the Pakistan team.

"For example, Mohammad Amir who has now retired from Test cricket has to play in the domestic One-Day cup and National T20 competitions to be considered for national selection," the PCB source said.

Edit
You peak at 27: Wasim Akram tells Mohammad Amir post Test retirement

Quote

According to Akram, Amir shouldn't have hung his boots from Test cricket so early as that is when a fast bowlers peaks. "To me Mohammad Amir retiring from Test cricket is a bit surprising because you peak at 27-28 and Test cricket is where you are judged against the best, it's the ultimate format," Akram tweeted on Friday.

Really this is need of time because if they no implement things like this then surely they will be in hot waters domestic cricket can give some some better alternative for these bowlers but they need to do some work on pitches and infrastructure as well hopefully in near future we will able to have some good changes from PCB about this all.

JSRAW

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^^ If leading players backing out from the Test format at the young age due to financial excuse, its clearly not acceptable IMO, injuries on the other hand seems valid reasons. Almost every board has some kind of policy to compensate test players or managing their workload but in the end mentality of players matter most. Good thing is after Amir's retirement PCB made it mandatory to participate in the domestic cricket, from now on if you want to play for the national team then participate in the domestic cricket, otherwise you are out.

Edit
After Mohammad Amir retirement, PCB makes it mandatory for stars to play domestic cricket

Quote

Karachi: Mohammad Amir's sudden decision to retire from Test cricket and concentrate on limited overs while shifting his base to UK has prompted the PCB to make participation in domestic cricket mandatory.

It is widely believed that Amir, whose wife Narjis is a British passport holder, will be shifting his base to UK and will only play T20s and ODIs for the national side.

A PCB official of the board said that besides restructuring of the domestic season, it would be made mandatory for players to appear in domestic matches to qualify for the Pakistan team.

"For example, Mohammad Amir who has now retired from Test cricket has to play in the domestic One-Day cup and National T20 competitions to be considered for national selection," the PCB source said.

Edit
You peak at 27: Wasim Akram tells Mohammad Amir post Test retirement

Quote

According to Akram, Amir shouldn't have hung his boots from Test cricket so early as that is when a fast bowlers peaks. "To me Mohammad Amir retiring from Test cricket is a bit surprising because you peak at 27-28 and Test cricket is where you are judged against the best, it's the ultimate format," Akram tweeted on Friday.

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 18, 2020, 10:40:57 AM

^^ If money is the only driving force and records/respect/representing the country are not priority then why not announce a retirement from the international cricket completely? Become a mercenary cricketer and play in every T-20 league similar to Windies players?

Some of the players would do that as well. Cricket is just like any other profession. Players will prefer the formats which are less demanding and at the same time more rewarding. And unlike the other professions, the peak form for a player may last only a few years. So he needs to earn as much as possible during this time window.

Now coming to players retiring from international completely, to focus on franchise cricket. This may also be preferred by several players, especially as you mentioned the players from West Indies. But for the less known players, first they need to become famous and attract attention by playing international cricket, before they can venture in to the franchise leagues.

eaLiTy

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 19, 2020, 09:43:03 AM

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He was one of my favorite bowler in the modern era so kinda familiar with his response. TBH I found his reasoning pretty bullshit because i can't understand, why 27yo cricketer complained about work load after coming from the 5 years ban? he played only 2-3 season and got tired from the format which gave him recognition in the cricketing world at the first place.

Mohammad Amir and Mohammad Asif was one of the best pairs after Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis but they ruined their career with spot fixing and Amir underwent many traumatic things in his young career which would end many careers but he was able to come back and there will be heat if you are caught for match fixing and he may have his reasons for his excuse may be because of dressing room issues he might have retired and he was not in his best form like he used to bowl in the Test format after returning after the ban

JSRAW

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 18, 2020, 12:06:49 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 18, 2020, 10:40:57 AM

^^ If money is the only driving force and records/respect/representing the country are not priority then why not announce a retirement from the international cricket completely? Become a mercenary cricketer and play in every T-20 league similar to Windies players?

@JSRAW I don’t think that money was the motive behind Amir’s retirement, because he would never get to play in IPL or any big league because of his past mistakes (match fixing). Lastly I’m not sure if you’ll read this article or no where he clearly specified that he could not take the work load of playing in all formats, and hence he decided to quit Test cricket, and I feel that he’s correct to play less formats and keep himself fit for the long run.

Quote

"I can't roll back that lost time but I can manage my workload to extend my career as much as I can. With every passing day I'm getting older and I know fans want me to play. But if you look rationally I'm human and not an iron man. My passion is still there and I want to be there for fans, serving the country for a long time."

He was one of my favorite bowler in the modern era so kinda familiar with his response. TBH I found his reasoning pretty bullshit because i can't understand, why 27yo cricketer complained about work load after coming from the 5 years ban? he played only 2-3 season and got tired from the format which gave him recognition in the cricketing world at the first place.

BitSat19

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 18, 2020, 12:06:49 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 11:05:00 PM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on June 17, 2020, 05:20:53 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Amir was not performing like he used to after returning after the ban, his swing is gone and he was not that effective but he was bowling decently in the shorter format because he still has the pace and that might have forced him to retire rather than the cricket board dropping him in Test.

Any idea when Test cricket will return, since there are no matches how about the Test championships, will they delay the finals for that.

He's only 28 year old, played around 35ish test matches so i would say yeah he took retirement way to early. 1 bad season is not correct excuse, when everyone knows he took retirement only because of limited over cricket. Try Imagining Starc, Bumrah, Rabada taking retirement for T-20.

Next month : Windies vs England

And not much clarity on WTC final due to pandemic.

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on June 18, 2020, 08:09:24 AM

Players have the freedom to do that, and there is hardly anything the cricket boards can do. T20 format is the money churner now and obviously a lot many of the players are going to skip the demanding test format for the shorter formats. If the boards want to attract players to test format, then they need to increase the salary and benefits by many times. Nowadays no one want to play just to enter the record books.

Quote from: JSRAW on June 18, 2020, 10:40:57 AM

^^ If money is the only driving force and records/respect/representing the country are not priority then why not announce a retirement from the international cricket completely? Become a mercenary cricketer and play in every T-20 league similar to Windies players?

@JSRAW I don’t think that money was the motive behind Amir’s retirement, because he would never get to play in IPL or any big league because of his past mistakes (match fixing). Lastly I’m not sure if you’ll read this article or no where he clearly specified that he could not take the work load of playing in all formats, and hence he decided to quit Test cricket, and I feel that he’s correct to play less formats and keep himself fit for the long run.

Quote

"I can't roll back that lost time but I can manage my workload to extend my career as much as I can. With every passing day I'm getting older and I know fans want me to play. But if you look rationally I'm human and not an iron man. My passion is still there and I want to be there for fans, serving the country for a long time."

Sources:

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27260793/mohammad-amir-announces-retirement-test-cricket

https://www.indiatoday.in/sports/story/indian-premier-league-pakistan-cricket-board-cricket-bilateral-ties-239079-2015-02-06

This is just political statement as now most of players joining twenty/20 leagues and enjoying some good amount so they don't care about country and test we all know who is capable and what can do Aamir still can do some good but he just want leagues and short term cricket and good money like many soccer players doing just enjoying clubs and taking good money not doing any thing for country.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 11:05:00 PM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on June 17, 2020, 05:20:53 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Amir was not performing like he used to after returning after the ban, his swing is gone and he was not that effective but he was bowling decently in the shorter format because he still has the pace and that might have forced him to retire rather than the cricket board dropping him in Test.

Any idea when Test cricket will return, since there are no matches how about the Test championships, will they delay the finals for that.

He's only 28 year old, played around 35ish test matches so i would say yeah he took retirement way to early. 1 bad season is not correct excuse, when everyone knows he took retirement only because of limited over cricket. Try Imagining Starc, Bumrah, Rabada taking retirement for T-20.

Next month : Windies vs England

And not much clarity on WTC final due to pandemic.

Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on June 18, 2020, 08:09:24 AM

Players have the freedom to do that, and there is hardly anything the cricket boards can do. T20 format is the money churner now and obviously a lot many of the players are going to skip the demanding test format for the shorter formats. If the boards want to attract players to test format, then they need to increase the salary and benefits by many times. Nowadays no one want to play just to enter the record books.

Quote from: JSRAW on June 18, 2020, 10:40:57 AM

^^ If money is the only driving force and records/respect/representing the country are not priority then why not announce a retirement from the international cricket completely? Become a mercenary cricketer and play in every T-20 league similar to Windies players?

@JSRAW I don’t think that money was the motive behind Amir’s retirement, because he would never get to play in IPL or any big league because of his past mistakes (match fixing). Lastly I’m not sure if you’ll read this article or no where he clearly specified that he could not take the work load of playing in all formats, and hence he decided to quit Test cricket, and I feel that he’s correct to play less formats and keep himself fit for the long run.

Quote

"I can't roll back that lost time but I can manage my workload to extend my career as much as I can. With every passing day I'm getting older and I know fans want me to play. But if you look rationally I'm human and not an iron man. My passion is still there and I want to be there for fans, serving the country for a long time."

Sources:

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27260793/mohammad-amir-announces-retirement-test-cricket

https://www.indiatoday.in/sports/story/indian-premier-league-pakistan-cricket-board-cricket-bilateral-ties-239079-2015-02-06

JSRAW

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^^ If money is the only driving force and records/respect/representing the country are not priority then why not announce a retirement from the international cricket completely? Become a mercenary cricketer and play in every T-20 league similar to Windies players?

Vishnu.Reang

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Players have the freedom to do that, and there is hardly anything the cricket boards can do. T20 format is the money churner now and obviously a lot many of the players are going to skip the demanding test format for the shorter formats. If the boards want to attract players to test format, then they need to increase the salary and benefits by many times. Nowadays no one want to play just to enter the record books.

JSRAW

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on June 17, 2020, 05:20:53 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Amir was not performing like he used to after returning after the ban, his swing is gone and he was not that effective but he was bowling decently in the shorter format because he still has the pace and that might have forced him to retire rather than the cricket board dropping him in Test.

Any idea when Test cricket will return, since there are no matches how about the Test championships, will they delay the finals for that.

He's only 28 year old, played around 35ish test matches so i would say yeah he took retirement way to early. 1 bad season is not correct excuse, when everyone knows he took retirement only because of limited over cricket. Try Imagining Starc, Bumrah, Rabada taking retirement for T-20.

Next month : Windies vs England

And not much clarity on WTC final due to pandemic.

BitSat19

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on June 17, 2020, 05:20:53 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Amir was not performing like he used to after returning after the ban, his swing is gone and he was not that effective but he was bowling decently in the shorter format because he still has the pace and that might have forced him to retire rather than the cricket board dropping him in Test.

Any idea when Test cricket will return, since there are no matches how about the Test championships, will they delay the finals for that.

Currently no talk about Test Championship as right now we have hot topic is Twenty/20 world cup as still doubts about this event and for test matches now just 20 more days and we will able to have first test match between England vs West Indies. https://www.espncricinfo.com/scores/series/19497/west-indies-in-england-2020

7788bitcoin

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 17, 2020, 09:52:14 AM

^ Retiring at certain age from the test cricket is widely accepted and no one bats eyes on the players in that case, problem arise when quality bowlers like Amir take retirement at early age. This is not good sign for test cricket and sets a bad precedent IMO.

Amir was not performing like he used to after returning after the ban, his swing is gone and he was not that effective but he was bowling decently in the shorter format because he still has the pace and that might have forced him to retire rather than the cricket board dropping him in Test.

Any idea when Test cricket will return, since there are no matches how about the Test championships, will they delay the finals for that.

Topic: Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod] - page 1006. (Read 167870 times)