Topic: The problem with atheism. - page 2. (Read 38470 times)

The problem isn't with atheism. The problem is with atheists. Why? Because they talk like they believe in atheism. But they don't, because all of them know that God might exists somewhere they haven't looked yet.

Self-proclaimed atheists are liars, although many of them are not maliciously so. And for the same reason, those who proclaim others to atheists are liars, as well.

There is really no problem with Atheism, their main belief is that there is no God and at the moment, there hasnt been anything to disprove that God does or doesn't exist. It all really depends on the person who believes and nothing at all.

It would be an endless debate if we'll talk about religion and our own belief. Well, for the atheist , if that's what they believe then we can't do nothing about it. We can't force them to believe that God really exists. As long as we, believers, know that God is in our lives and we're following His path, then we have nothing to worry about.

For me personally i believe in God. I know that there is a God, i personally experienced so much with prayer and jst believe that he will guide me right. But i also know that Atheism is also a religion. The religion of not mind god in any way. The bible is teaching us that everyone has a choice he can make in his live. We can always make a choice for God and also for beeing an atheist. This is the Reason why the earth is still in existence because of all this sin and eveil stuff on this planet, god would have made an end with us already. It is love, the same love our parents have for us that is still patient.

It depends on how do you define atheism.
Atheism could be defined as strict denial of existence of any deity. Then it is just irrational as any religion.

Dawkins definition of Atheism is "Atheist is a person who thinks there is no compelling evidence for any existing narrative for any deity." In Dawkins definitions atheism = agnosticism.

For me I am a rationalist. I don't have a goal to believe in god. I don't have a goal to disbelieve in god. My goal is to believe in god in the universe where god exists and not to believe in god in the universe where he doesn't exist.

Remember that even atheism is a belief, a belief that no god exists. But as far as existence of God cannot be proven, it can't also be proven that God does not exist so you have faith on the fact that no God exists.

As an inner atheist myself (as opposed to those who needs to constantly do outing about their atheism) I must say you couldn't put it down better

but I don't understand what is the problem? people have their own point of view - they don't believe in God - how does this prevent others from living? it seems to me that it doesn't interfere...why raise this topic at all? people have the right to their personal opinion, decisions and life

Atheism is characterised by a whole lot of contradictions. It is largely not in sync with the real world. Atheists say they don't believe in morality and moral laws and generally feel that it doesn't exist but yet my experience with some of them shows that they are appalled by what they see in the world and try to define some things they see in the world as cruel.

It is very easy to say that there is no God but very difficult to live consistently within the resulting moral framework.

If we say there is no God because there is no evidential proof that he exists, what proof do we have that God doesn't exist? None perhaps but atheists still have faith that god doesn't. #problematic

It's hard to overcome almost 2,000 years of brainwashing.

Personally, I say happy holidays.

The funniest thing is that atheists celebrate Christmas.. 
As for me I just don't believe in God and don't try to prove everyone that he doesn't exist. I think he exists for those who truly believe in Him and this faith inspires them. I don't see anything bad about it.

Фyндaмeнтaльнaя пpoблeмa aтeизмa в тoм, чтo yтвepждeниe aтeиcтa «Бoгa нe cyщecтвyeт» - бeccмыcлeннo.

Этa пpoблeмa фyндaмeнтaльнaя, пocкoлькy peчь идeт o кpeдo дoктpины; этo пpoблeмa, пocкoлькy oнo (кpeдo) лишeнo cмыcлa. Бeccмыcлeннo и oбcyждaть, вepнo ли oнo, пocкoлькy yтвepждeниe, лишeннoe cмыcлa, нe имeeт cтaтyca вepнocти, oнo нe мoжeт быть ни иcтинным, ни лoжным.

Для тoгo, чтoбы этa фpaзa имeлa cмыcл, нaдo, чтoбы ocмыcлeнными были пoнятиe Бoгa, и eгo cyщecтвoвaниe. Знaмeнитый дoвoд «чaйник Pacceлa» cpaвнивaeт вoпpoc (нe) cyщecтвoвaния Бoгa c пpeдпoлoжeниeм o cyщecтвoвaнии чaйникa нa oкoлocoлнeчнoй opбитe. B этoм cлyчae пoдлeжaщee, т.e. cyбъeкт впoлнe oпpeдeлeнo, y этoгo пoнятия ecть peфepeнт, и лeгкo зaдaть кpитepий eгo cyщeтвoвaния нa opбитe ecтecтвeнным oбpaзoм; т.o. yтвepждeниe o нecyщecтвoвaнии чaйникa ocмыcлeннo. Дaлee мы пpexoдим к нeтpивиaльнoй, нo вce лишь эмпиpичecкoй пpoблeмe: кaкoвa вepoятнocть тaкoгo чaйникa и мoжнo ли eгo нaйти.

Этa пpoблeмa aтeиcтa, мeждy тeм – вapиaция нa тeмy “empty name problem”. B yтвepждeнии «вce pycaлки – бeлыe» cлoжнocть нe в эмпpичecкoм изyчeнии тoгo, a вce ли дeйcтвитeльнo, a в тoм, чтo пoнятиe «pycaлкa» нe имeeт peфepeнтa, т.e. нeт ничeгo эмпиpичecки eмy cooтвeтcтвyющeгo. Фpaзa «pycaлкa нe cyщecтвyeт» тeм нe мeнee ocмыcлeннa, пocкoлькy кoнцeпция pycaлки дocтaтoчнa чeткa, и кaк тoлькo нaм пoвcтpeчaeтcя пepвaя pycaлкa, мы ee oпoзнaeм. B этoм cлyчae мы oбxoдимcя пepeoпpeдeлeниeм cyщecтвoвaния – pycaлкa нe cyщecтвyeт кaк мaтepиaльный oбъeкт, нo впoлнe ceбe cyщecтвyeт, кaк aбcтpaкция, aнaлoгичнo тoмy, кaк cyщecтвyeт дecять.

Well!!! Thats an interesting post!! However, I would like to draw your attention to the most important law that all humans should know apart from Evolution. As far as we are concerned in microscopic human environment whatever we do is not always meaningless. Useless, Well may be, but meaningless, I doubt it!. We are all but a sum of the choices that we make. Our life is not really that different from those sims like games where every individual reaches a certain place based on what choices they make. Everyone in this planet is presented multiple choices, the free will in us decides which one we want even though we may think its forced! Hence, if you believe in athiesm, that is your choice and it would definitely lead you to a path that would lead you to a certain path. Now if you chose to believe in God, it is your choice and it will definitely lead you to a different path. But in the end, it may be like you both end up in the same place! Life is interesting just like the game of life Have fun till it lasts!

I think that there is no problem with atheism at all. The only problem I see is with us people who have no respect for what are fellow mankind believes in. We should always have that boundary where our beliefs might be the greatest of all, but we should also remember that others might feel the same way for what they believe in. It would make the world a very peaceful place once we learn this.

I pity those atheist. The real lroblem they are facing today is existing without a reason. For me, I exist to honor my God. That is my being and that is the reason why I live. Atheist just lives for the sake of living. I hope that there will come a time where they will just believe in God.

I must take extreme exception to the emphasized portion. That seems to me, and I have an unfortunate amount of exposure to Christianity, to be the EXACT truth of religion. "nothing matters in this life".

As an atheist/agnostic (I'll get back to that), I feel that what I do in THIS life is the ONLY thing that has any consequence. If like-minded and smarter people than I are able to extend life, then maybe there will be another lifetime. But I have no belief due to extreme lack of evidence in any sort of after life. From my perspective, the day of my death is my ending. Therefore what I do in this life is of PARAMOUNT importance, cuz it's the only shot I get.

Religious people like to mix up atheism as an actual philosophy, rather than something else. And there are atheists who do the same.

Thus, two categories have been arbitrarily assigned, and capriciously labeled.

The first, the so-called "strong" atheist, does indeed hold the view that there is no god. They hold this as close and dearly as the Theist holds to their beliefs.

The second, the so-called "weak" atheist, does not. I fall into the latter category, and I call it an arbitrary and capricious label because the "strong" position is logically weak, whereas the "weak" category is utterly defensible.

I do not believe there is a god or gods. Note that this is the exact opposite of believing there is no god. It is rather a statement that I do not have sufficient proof for the extraordinary claim that some being(s) who "live" outside of time and space in violation of all that we have learned caused it all to happen.

Is such a thing possible? Yes, I suppose it is. Is it plausible? Decidedly not.

To make this explicit in the minds of "believers", I will present to you a very simple argument that to my knowledge destroys all theistic religions. Not all deistic religions, mind you, but theistic.

Theism, regardless of stripe, holds the following as axiomatic.

1. There is or are a deity or deities
2. This being or group of beings is omnipotent
3. This being or group of beings want(s) to be worshiped by humans.

Following these axioms, there could NEVER BE more than one religion, arguments of free will notwithstanding. If all three are true, than we would KNOW that there are gods.

Now if point three is false, and the god(s) simply don't care, then they could exist within a logical framework. Of course, this, too, puts the binders on all theistic religions.

As for some of you claiming that atheists have no spiritual beliefs, this is simply untrue. A great many of us believe in such things, or at least ponder whether they can or do exist. Personally, the idea of spirits makes sense to me. Energy came first, why would it not also evolve first? That doesn't make such beings, if they exist, gods. Just a different sort of conscious life.

In my own life, I explore the esoteric and arcane to a great extent. I did not come lightly to my lack of belief in any gods. I started from the standpoint of rather extreme Christianity. When it failed to match up with reality, the cognitive dissonance was more than I could bear, so I went exploring. The exploration is not over, I yet live. But if there is a god, it's not that monster, nor the monster of the Muslims, nor any of the other monstrous deities who's followers wage war on one another over bullshit.

The thing that religious people never seem to understand about atheists is that we are NOT defined by atheism except by YOU. "Atheist", as a label, describes what I am NOT, not what I am. The word simply means "without gods". While it can imply a great many things, it doesn't define anything.

For instance, I am a philosopher, a religious man in a different way, a bitcoiner, a singer, a cook, a father, a son, I am a great many things, none of which are determined by what gods I don't believe in. I also would point out to you believers that absolutely every one of you is an atheist in regards to all the other gods aside from your chosen favorite. Again, it merely defines what you are NOT.

As I indicated above, I believe the "strong" and "weak" labels are arbitrary and capricious, and completely wrong. There is not one thing that is weak about my beliefs. One of them is that extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof, and that is simply lacking. If the supposed creator(s) of the universe made themselves known and could prove their claims, I would cease to be atheist, because it would no longer be a matter of "faith", which Mark Twain defined as the belief in what you know ain't so. But the dusty writings of Bronze Age people, while interesting, is not and will not be the definition of who I am. Or you, for that matter, because the computer you're using to view this would be viewed as an infernal device by those same people.

Religions, like life itself, evolve. But their core doctrines often hinder that evolution. For the most part, through this process, Christianity has become far less violent, though no less vile, over the course of centuries. Islam, with 700 years less to develop, came to it's more violent middle stage at the same time that weapons got a lot worse. Would be interesting to see who has the higher body count between the two.

I think the only problem with atheism is the fact that they no longer fear anyone. They do not believe in the higher power such as God. Therefore, the highest authority that they fear must be the law. It's sad that when it comes to deeper spiritual aspect, it doesn't apply to them anymore.

I like the statement found in one of the first posts of this thread " There cannot be an atheist without a theist".
There is really no point in discussing such a matter because the simple fact to discus it is legitimating is as a meaningful issue, while it is not.

Completely , perfectly agreed. Atheists are always promoting science and technology because These fields are telling the exact facts about life, universe etc. On the other hand, All of the religions are telling lies and manipulating people with its illogical doctrins. For that reason, atheism does not have any problem with it.

Atheists do not impose atheism. And they mainly promote science and technology.