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Topic: The problem with atheism. - page 9. (Read 38470 times)

Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
November 01, 2013, 08:17:02 PM
I will do my best to repay with much time before the concert.  I should be able to because I should be on tour by then.

You have unlimited time for that (well, until you die).  I doubt squall will want to wait 50 years for his payment. 

So how much are you sending him every month?

legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1002
You cannot kill love
November 01, 2013, 08:14:30 PM
I will do my best to repay with much time before the concert.  I should be able to because I should be on tour by then.
Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
November 01, 2013, 08:09:37 PM
If only it worked that way, the government's wetdream.

My conscious is burdened by my failure to payback squall.  Which is why I will correct my mistakes.  There is no such thing as ownership on the universal scale.

Have you started a payment program yet, or are you going to continue to ignore your debt and promise to repay one day when one million people come to see you play guitar?   As an intelligent person with a non-damaged brain, I can tell you that will never happen.
legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1002
You cannot kill love
November 01, 2013, 07:59:10 PM
If only it worked that way, the government's wetdream.

My conscious is burdened by my failure to payback squall.  Which is why I will correct my mistakes.  There is no such thing as ownership on the universal scale.
Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
November 01, 2013, 07:45:44 PM
I'll say it again, I do not go blind.  And I will not starve.  As a matter of fact, I don't believe I will die either, I will ascend to the fifth dimension.  I am god and I am infinitely powerful.

My body would rot, who cares, it's the experience of the spirit that matters.  As I said, we are multidimensional, when you die, you change channels, to unity, and truth.  A place you are fully capable of experiencing on earth, yet your fear blocks you from doing so.

You forget that you gave you soul/spirit to squall when you stole money from him.  All you have left is your body, which will start to rot the minute you die.
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1020
November 01, 2013, 07:17:56 PM
Rassah:

Do you believe there are non-empirical truths or undecideable truths (e.g. "This sentence is false") that are real? 

If so, why do you not include at least minimal consideration of these truths in your model of understanding of the Universe?

If not, then why don't you believe these truths exist when they have been acknowledged by prestigious mathematicians, scientists, and philosophers (and especially when some are self-evidently real)?
legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1002
You cannot kill love
November 01, 2013, 07:03:26 PM
Quote
You can not convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it is based on a deep-seated need to believe.

— Carl Sagan
Bullox, I didn't believe in anything until I saw evidence before my eyes.

Of course you didn't understand the quote.   Undecided
Enlighten me, either he was categorizing all believers as people that do not have evidence to support their beliefs, or he was stating a truth in to validate a non truth, the sense you need beliefs to exist, for how do you experience anything if you don't believe in it's presence?

The statement is full of none truths, can not, is not.
legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1002
You cannot kill love
November 01, 2013, 06:44:12 PM
If you truly believe it's flat, perhaps it will be so.  If you believe you are a finite being on a finite planet, then you're destined to live a finite life and death over and over.  If you want to live as an infinite being, you simply must believe you are so.  You are infinite no matter what, you can keep living in the realms of time on another planet in your comfortable finite illusion, or you can understand how you are infinitely powerful and believe that you are so.

Over and over? Hah! OK, sure. You keep believing that you are infinite, and when you die, you'll just rot away into nothingness. I'll actually plan for my existence, earn and save money, and actually physically, for real, extend my life until I can genetically and mechanically make myself be immortal. We'll see which one of us ends up  being "infinite"  Cheesy


Quote
That's what happens to you.  I stare in the sun to align my frequency with the universe and to gain spiritual energy.  I do not go blind.  See how beliefs play a big role in one's reality?

This is why I don't really support things like medicare. Idiots like you who eventually go blind shouldn't be supported by tax dollars, and should be allowed to starve, fester, and die away. You will be very important some day in the future. Though just as a big warning to others.

Quote
So the universe was created?  By?

Why does there need to be a "by?" Who created the dust in your room? It's just a result of physics, and we already proved that universe creation is spontaneous and doesn't need a creator. But hey, feel free to ignore proofs and believing your magic stories.


Quote
Bullox, I didn't believe in anything until I saw evidence before my eyes.

Dude, you stare at the sun and take mind-fucking drugs. If I were you. I wouldn't trust my eyes at all any more.
Okay sir, have fun been being nothing forever.  That is your choice.  I will do my best to bring heaven to earth before you die so you do not experience such.

I'll say it again, I do not go blind.  And I will not starve.  As a matter of fact, I don't believe I will die either, I will ascend to the fifth dimension.  I am god and I am infinitely powerful.

My body would rot, who cares, it's the experience of the spirit that matters.  As I said, we are multidimensional, when you die, you change channels, to unity, and truth.  A place you are fully capable of experiencing on earth, yet your fear blocks you from doing so.

Nothing is spontaneous, everything is connected no matter how big or small of a level.  Do you have freewill to chose your own thoughts or are you simply a meat body programmed that way?

Psychedelics do not fuck your brain, they open your antenna to new frequencies.  You can channel positive entities/thoughts, or you can channel negatives.  The problem lies within the user, if there is a problem, not the chemical.  I believe in unconditional love, is there a problem with that?
Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
November 01, 2013, 06:24:31 PM
Quote
You can not convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it is based on a deep-seated need to believe.

— Carl Sagan
Bullox, I didn't believe in anything until I saw evidence before my eyes.

Of course you didn't understand the quote.   Undecided
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
November 01, 2013, 06:22:58 PM
If you truly believe it's flat, perhaps it will be so.  If you believe you are a finite being on a finite planet, then you're destined to live a finite life and death over and over.  If you want to live as an infinite being, you simply must believe you are so.  You are infinite no matter what, you can keep living in the realms of time on another planet in your comfortable finite illusion, or you can understand how you are infinitely powerful and believe that you are so.

Over and over? Hah! OK, sure. You keep believing that you are infinite, and when you die, you'll just rot away into nothingness. I'll actually plan for my existence, earn and save money, and actually physically, for real, extend my life until I can genetically and mechanically make myself be immortal. We'll see which one of us ends up  being "infinite"  Cheesy


Quote
That's what happens to you.  I stare in the sun to align my frequency with the universe and to gain spiritual energy.  I do not go blind.  See how beliefs play a big role in one's reality?

This is why I don't really support things like medicare. Idiots like you who eventually go blind shouldn't be supported by tax dollars, and should be allowed to starve, fester, and die away. You will be very important some day in the future. Though just as a big warning to others.

Quote
So the universe was created?  By?

Why does there need to be a "by?" Who created the dust in your room? It's just a result of physics, and we already proved that universe creation is spontaneous and doesn't need a creator. But hey, feel free to ignore proofs and believing your magic stories.


Quote
Bullox, I didn't believe in anything until I saw evidence before my eyes.

Dude, you stare at the sun and take mind-fucking drugs. If I were you. I wouldn't trust my eyes at all any more.
legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1002
You cannot kill love
November 01, 2013, 05:55:00 PM
The universe is infinite, there is infinite energy to be taken from the universe.

You can claim the earth is flat, but that doesn't make it fact. The universe is not infinite, and neither is energy. I'm not stating this, this is actual fact supported by actual evidence.

Quote
Stare into the sun.  What happens?

Uh, you prove to your eye doctor that you are an idiot?

Quote
I don't know what it was but it was explaining how consciousness reacts instantaneously, faster than light.

If consciousness reacts faster than light, then it would react, or more, or do whatever it does, slower that anything else in the world. Time slows as you approach the speed of light. Coonsciousness "reacting" at the speed of light would make it react backwards.
If you truly believe it's flat, perhaps it will be so.  If you believe you are a finite being on a finite planet, then you're destined to live a finite life and death over and over.  If you want to live as an infinite being, you simply must believe you are so.  You are infinite no matter what, you can keep living in the realms of time on another planet in your comfortable finite illusion, or you can understand how you are infinitely powerful and believe that you are so.

That's what happens to you.  I stare in the sun to align my frequency with the universe and to gain spiritual energy.  I do not go blind.  See how beliefs play a big role in one's reality?

Time is an illusion, we only live in the present.  Light is not the highest form of energy, it is consciousness.

If you and someone else are at different points on a number line, and you calculate that 0 is 6 numbers away,n while someone else calculates that 0 is 15 numbers away, the 0 is still at the same exact spot. So our calculations of the age of the universe may be earth-centric, but it still tells us when the universe popped into existence. So I'm not sure why you have a problem with the age.
So the universe was created?  By?

Quote
You can not convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it is based on a deep-seated need to believe.

— Carl Sagan
Bullox, I didn't believe in anything until I saw evidence before my eyes.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
November 01, 2013, 05:45:30 PM
I don't have a problem with the big bang insofar as it explains the expanding Universe, but I have a problem with the purported age of the Universe.

Take your measuring devices near the event horizon of a black hole, look out, and then tell me what the age of the Universe is.  The age of the Universe has been determined upon math, based upon empirical data collected from a relational area of space with unique spatial properties that determine the evidence.  Simply put, you see what you see because of where you are.  Go somewhere else, you might see something different.  If I travel at the speed of light while you remain stationary, we 'age' differently.  Does the age of the Universe therefore change because we aged differently, or does it remain the same?  The answer is "yes."  You need to re-evaluate your idea of time and age.

Are you actually claiming that you are smart enough to realize that this should be taken into account, and astrophysicists were too dumb to take effects of relativity, gravity, speed, and time dialation into account when calculating the age of the universe?
(Yes, you can calculate time near the event horizoon, since you can calculate the mass of the black hole you are orbiting, and adjust for time dialatioon from the nearby gravity well using well established relativity functions).

Surely there's an XKCD strip outlining the absurd content-stripping that occurs between stage 1 when the scientists do their experiments, and stage 5 when the junk press gets hold of the news?

They probably never did claim that the universe 'is' 13.x billion years old.
The scientists almost certainly tacked some qualifiers into their abstracts, like: from our frame of reference on Earth, the most distant parts of the universe that we've managed to observe, appear to be 13.x billion light years away. Or maybe they tried to explain that the 'age' might be a constant, and that in a billion years time it will still appear only 13 billion years old?

I think they just observed that the universe is expanding, calculated the speed at which everything is moving away from everything else, and figured out how long it would have had to move to get to where it is at if it started expanding from a starting point. Like the "Train A left the station traveling at 100km an hour" problem, except taking into account the effects on gravity on the acceleration and time.
Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
November 01, 2013, 05:15:36 AM
Quote
You can not convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it is based on a deep-seated need to believe.

— Carl Sagan
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1020
October 31, 2013, 10:20:14 PM
If you and someone else are at different points on a number line, and you calculate that 0 is 6 numbers away,n while someone else calculates that 0 is 15 numbers away, the 0 is still at the same exact spot. So our calculations of the age of the universe may be earth-centric, but it still tells us when the universe popped into existence. So I'm not sure why you have a problem with the age.

Because the way things age is absolutely mind-fucking!  And then to go ahead and tack a number to it that is presented as concrete does a complete injustice to the utility that can be gained by looking at the forest instead of the trees, or at basically any valid consideration outside a prima facie worldview.
sr. member
Activity: 322
Merit: 250
October 31, 2013, 10:15:15 PM
The main problem of atheism is infinity of reality which humanity  not yet discovery, and probably never might.

It is about techno-fascism. I'm still do not understand, Is they discovery Higgs boson on the collider. What will be the next? Casion, paragon, marathon, lipuqion.... + 10 zeros after comma. Might it ever end? It looks like absolute infinity.

The same picture with the space. There are billions of galaxies. Probably, quadrillions of universes like this one. Septillion of worlds of the next dimension, etc...  

Humanity will not ever reach any of that borders. There will not ever appear any mathematically precise evidence of nonexistence of God, because God is absolute power of whole.

But New York Times Says:
Quote
God is dead.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 31, 2013, 09:52:16 PM
If you and someone else are at different points on a number line, and you calculate that 0 is 6 numbers away,n while someone else calculates that 0 is 15 numbers away, the 0 is still at the same exact spot. So our calculations of the age of the universe may be earth-centric, but it still tells us when the universe popped into existence. So I'm not sure why you have a problem with the age.
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1020
October 31, 2013, 01:04:41 PM
No, I know they take this into account, but that doesn't really mean anything if they continue to ignore the problem this creates.

So are you claiming you understand the problem this creates, and they didn't, and didn't account for it?

Quote
So, you've reached a determination of the static age of the Universe when various objects contained within that Universe age differently.  

Let's assume I'm moving at some velocity V ad that this causes my experience of 1 second to be (relatively) twice the length of a second that is experienced by you.  Now assume I move at this velocity for a billion years. I have thus relatively aged only 500 million years compared to your 1 billion.  Are you saying that after this, the Universe is still some 13.8 billion years old relative to both of us?

No. You would calculate the age of the universe relative to your timeline, and I would calculate it relative to my timeline. We calculated the age of the universe relative to earth's timeline, based on all the movements, accelerations, and decelerations of things we see out there. The age of the universe would be slightly different if we were calculating it from Mars, not the least of which due to the "year" on Mars being different than the year on Earth.

So...where do you disagree with me then?  I agree with these statements.  The whole purpose of my suggestion to take measurements from the event horizon of a black hole is because one would age at a significantly different rate there.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 31, 2013, 12:32:21 PM
No, I know they take this into account, but that doesn't really mean anything if they continue to ignore the problem this creates.

So are you claiming you understand the problem this creates, and they didn't, and didn't account for it?

Quote
So, you've reached a determination of the static age of the Universe when various objects contained within that Universe age differently.  

Let's assume I'm moving at some velocity V ad that this causes my experience of 1 second to be (relatively) twice the length of a second that is experienced by you.  Now assume I move at this velocity for a billion years. I have thus relatively aged only 500 million years compared to your 1 billion.  Are you saying that after this, the Universe is still some 13.8 billion years old relative to both of us?

No. You would calculate the age of the universe relative to your timeline, and I would calculate it relative to my timeline. We calculated the age of the universe relative to earth's timeline, based on all the movements, accelerations, and decelerations of things we see out there. The age of the universe would be slightly different if we were calculating it from Mars, not the least of which due to the "year" on Mars being different than the year on Earth.
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1020
October 31, 2013, 12:19:57 PM
I don't have a problem with the big bang insofar as it explains the expanding Universe, but I have a problem with the purported age of the Universe.

Take your measuring devices near the event horizon of a black hole, look out, and then tell me what the age of the Universe is.  The age of the Universe has been determined upon math, based upon empirical data collected from a relational area of space with unique spatial properties that determine the evidence.  Simply put, you see what you see because of where you are.  Go somewhere else, you might see something different.  If I travel at the speed of light while you remain stationary, we 'age' differently.  Does the age of the Universe therefore change because we aged differently, or does it remain the same?  The answer is "yes."  You need to re-evaluate your idea of time and age.

Are you actually claiming that you are smart enough to realize that this should be taken into account, and astrophysicists were too dumb to take effects of relativity, gravity, speed, and time dialation into account when calculating the age of the universe?
(Yes, you can calculate time near the event horizoon, since you can calculate the mass of the black hole you are orbiting, and adjust for time dialatioon from the nearby gravity well using well established relativity functions).

No, I know they take this into account, but that doesn't really mean anything if they continue to ignore the problem this creates.

So, you've reached a determination of the static age of the Universe when various objects contained within that Universe age differently.  

Let's assume I'm moving at some velocity V ad that this causes my experience of 1 second to be (relatively) twice the length of a second that is experienced by you.  Now assume I move at this velocity for a billion years. I have thus relatively aged only 500 million years compared to your 1 billion.  Are you saying that after this, the Universe is still some 13.8 billion years old relative to both of us?
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 31, 2013, 11:02:17 AM
The universe is infinite, there is infinite energy to be taken from the universe.

You can claim the earth is flat, but that doesn't make it fact. The universe is not infinite, and neither is energy. I'm not stating this, this is actual fact supported by actual evidence.

Quote
Stare into the sun.  What happens?

Uh, you prove to your eye doctor that you are an idiot?

Quote
I don't know what it was but it was explaining how consciousness reacts instantaneously, faster than light.

If consciousness reacts faster than light, then it would react, or more, or do whatever it does, slower that anything else in the world. Time slows as you approach the speed of light. Coonsciousness "reacting" at the speed of light would make it react backwards.
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