Topic: Usagi: falsifying NAVs, manipulating share prices and misleading investors. - page 7. (Read 92684 times)

Well they can't - as usagi has their assets.  They're in the unfortunate position where they daren't criticise in case usagi runs off with whatever's left of their investment.  That doesn't. of course, explain why any shareholders who believe usagi did a great job aren't posting.  Obviously they'll be flattering in emails to usagi - they saw the way usagi threatened to not return EskimoBo's shares after he'd criticised usagi.

When someone who seems unstable has your money you CAN'T go criticising them.

Have to say the timing of usagi deciding to revive this thread is unfortunate - I'd have preferred it to stay dormant until usagi had paid out to investors: so there was no longer any (unstated) threat preventing investors from speaking up.

Update:  simple question for usagi.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/usagi-is-he-or-isnt-he-a-scammer-133823

I am quoting this, so I can read this later on in the detail.

How does agreeing the accusation was unjustified in ONE case suddenly mean ALL such claims are unjustified?  If it was that easy then anyone could prove they were innocent by having someone make an unjust accusation against them, disproving that then saying it proved their innocence on everything.  This sort of non-logic is one of the main reasons why this saga never ends - you jump from a conclusion on a specific to a conlusion on a generality in total defiance of logic and common-sense and expect people to swallow it.

You misled investors when you told them BMF was indemnified against capital loss by CPA.  You'd said yourself just recently that the contract (with acceleration) had no material value and that even IF there was no acceleration it wouldn't indemnify BMF (amusingly I don't agree with this - but will accept your word on it for the purpose this specific allegation).  How is telling them something which isn't true (according to you) anything other than misleading?  And where did BCB agree that charge had no merit?

I agree that SOME of the accusations against you are unjustified and that others wouldn't deserve a scammer tag even if proven (as even if true they only amount to simple error and/or incompetence).  The problem anyone investigating has is working out which claims have no merit and which need further examination.  Which isn't helped when you usually focus on the unjustified ones then claim that somehow proves you're innocent on the others - and then we're back to square one except now you continue to insist your innocence has been proven on things that were never even discussed.

Usagi

WHY is it so hard for you to answer a simple question unless you are hiding something and are attempting to continue to perpetuate your duplicity.

In what country are you located?

Stochastic

Good points.

Hi and thanks for extending that to me. While it is not my decision to say whether or not BCB's decision is binding, I have agreed to respond to all of the evidence he has posted. One of the primary complaints is that there is too much spam in the threads against me. As a result BCB has created a locked thread containing all accusations and all evidence against me. I strongly suggest you use this to your advantage so that this can be resolved once and for all.

One thing I would very much like you to state is what you think I need to do to resolve your complaint. I would agree to a fair fine or penalty such as any or all of:

a) (for example) paying 100 btc to BMF shareholders as per the BMF/CPA insurance contract
b) cancelling or donating any number (but not all) of my personal shares
c) cancelling my management shares

The key here is that you would need to show damages. I am just referencing the BMF/CPA contract as an example because it states a number (100 bitcoins). Anyway I hope you can see that all I really want to do is resolve this one way or another. Unless you are interested in waging an endless war against me, I think you should consider my offer to close the complaints that way. It would be:

• fast
• simple
• easy
• no sperging required
• no spammy threads

If BCB agrees it's a valid way of closing his scam accusation, then yes, I will agree to it.

Try to stay focused and stop insulting me. Of the three charges in this thread:

1. falsifying NAVs,
2. manipulating share prices (and)
3. misleading investors

You have admitted that #3, misleading investors, was an unjustified charge in at least one case. I will shortly be re-examining your locked thread to determine if there is any additional evidence that I have misled investors. If not I'll flip a coin and move on to one of the other two.

The goal here is to get this thread resolved by a moderator. Theymos has said that he will not close this thread unless there is evidence I have not scammed. Both you and I and others now agree #3 is a false claim. Therefore in order to get this thread closed in my favor I only have to clear up the first two charges. This seems to be the fastest and easiest way to resolve your complaints. Once this thread is closed we can let it die and reduce the number of threads against me. Then we can move on and continue to deal with the evidence people have sent you.

Thank you for agreeing to be a central clearing house for all complaints against me.

I assume most people, like me, find the scammer forum pretty ridiculous.  Only low level scammers get a tag and then there are countless accusations against some other people, usually to do with securities, that claim misapropriation of funds.  Instead the inevestor should have looked hard at their investment decisions.  Business failure due to incompetence or bad decisions do not, in my opinion, due to constitute a scammer tag.  Many people will have a failure, but that does not make them a scammer.  In the real world, people are protected by limited liability agreements.  If there is no agreement in place specifying what kind of liability then that was a bad investment decision and just goes to show the though the manager of the investment put into when they created their investment.  If they knew what they were doing they would have covered all their risks before opening the business.

I bet there would be a lot less pointless posts in the scammer forum if there was a requirement for the accuser to pay a moderator 10 bitcoins for a scamming accusation.  That accuser can be given back their 10 bitcoins if the mediator determines a scammer tag is warrented or bot the accuser and the accused come to a mutually agreed resolution.  If there is not enough evidence a scam took place then the accuser loses their 10 bitcoin deposit.

There is a reason why people in real life get to face their accusers, judged by a jury of their peers, and the prosecution has to pay heavy filing and court fees to initiate a suit.  This is because anyone can make false or exaggerated claims without proof.

Very odd, indeed.

Does anyone else find it highly unusual that none of usagi's shareholders have bothered to weigh in here?

Usgai

Why is it that you can sperg pages and pages of useless nonsense but you can not answer a simple question? 

Is that in the same time zone as JST?

Usagi doesn't live in Japan - he just likes to claim to be a Japanese female.  He's in Republic of China (Taiwan).

Usagi

Could you please confirm that you live in Japan. 

Are you threatening me? LOL.

Or what usagi? May be I'll file a criminal complaint against you in Ontario?

Here is a hint:

Sale of illegal securities.
Fraud
Failure to pay canadian tax income

I think your proposals are a good starting point.  While they might not be acceptable to your shareholders, I think it's reasonable that if they're not acceptable people make a counter-proposal of their own.  I believe it's up to your shareholders to assess each proposal on its merits so I'm not going to comment on any of the proposals themselves other than to say that I think that discussing proposals and counter-proposals is something I view as the only productive way forward in this mess.

If you accept that BCB's decision is binding I'll stop making posts.

Vampire part of your going through BCB is that the community seems to have agreed he will be the arbiter. It's probably in your best interest now to stop making wild accusations, and give the evidence you have to BCB.

I will not have time or energy to respond to 5 different people anymore. Go through him... just a thought.

Return of the investment of course. But he refused to do so far. Usagi doesn't understand that even if he didn't do anything criminal (he's an idiot that doesn't know to calculate) he's still liable for damages. I am implying that he's criminally liable.