Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 286. (Read 901342 times)

I thought you were going to reprove me for saying that you are good, when Jesus said that no one is good except God alone.

 

i come back to this when i read and viewed your documentation.

It doesn't prove the God of the bible, but it does prove Intelligent Design. To ignore Charles Darwin, himself, saying his whole theory "would absolutely break down" based on the information we have now, is just being blind.

You are soooo good. I suppose that I could find all these links, and many others. But I didn't do it. You did.

Finding proof of God is much easier than finding proof in the correct god.

If you're honestly curious you need to look into the Intelligent Designer arguments and the problem of irreducible complexity. There is no way our bodies would be built the way they are from evolution because they work too perfectly and some parts could not have grown up that way through evolution. In the video below, the Genes of Genesis, Walter starts talking about the problem of irreducible complexity at 46:10.

Walter Veith was professor/zoologist (and an atheist at the time) of the zoology department at the University of Cape Town and taught in the medical bio-science department. During this time the department was awarded a Royal Society London grant for zoological research.

He also takes on the Big Bang theory in the video series Evolution or Creation? The Earth in Time and Space.

He comes at it from the scientific standpoint, because it's what he knows. Of course, since becoming a Christian, he will mention some bible quotes from time to time, but his discussions are based on scientific study.

105 - The Genes of Genesis / Genesis Conflict - Walter Veith

https://youtu.be/KJ3IgGYf29k?t=23m50s

This is a pretty long video series, but if you are honestly wanting to find out more, then you might want to check this series out:

Dr. Walter Veith - Evolution or Creation? The Earth in Time and Space (Part 1/8)  - https://youtu.be/S9hQKD0vceQ?t=8m50s

Here's a quote from another page, "British philosopher, Dr. Antony Flew, was a leading spokesperson for atheism, actively involved in debate after debate. However, scientific discoveries within the last 30 years brought him to a conclusion he could not avoid. In a video interview in December 2004 he stated, "Super-intelligence is the only good explanation for the origin of life and the complexity of nature."1 Prominent in his conclusion were the discoveries of DNA. Here's why. DNA in our cells is very similar to an intricate computer program. In the photo on the left, you see that a computer program is made up of a series of ones and zeros (called binary code). The sequencing and ordering of these ones and zeros is what makes the computer program work properly.

In the same way, DNA is made up of four chemicals, abbreviated as letters A, T, G, and C. Much like the ones and zeros, these letters are arranged in the human cell like this: CGTGTGACTCGCTCCTGAT and so on. The order in which they are arranged instructs the cell's actions.

What is amazing is that within the tiny space in every cell in your body, this code is three billion letters long!!...Perry Marshall, an information specialist, comments on the implications of this. 'There has never existed a computer program that wasn't designed...[whether it is] a code, or a program, or a message given through a language, there is always an intelligent mind behind it.'"

http://www.everystudent.com/wires/Godreal.html

Another page discussing Irreducible Complexity - http://www.ideacenter.org/contentmgr/showdetails.php/id/840

"If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down."
--Charles Darwin, Origin of Species

Also, a proof based on conscience, etc: Proof of God is Inside You | Does God Exist? https://youtu.be/m8_G2877gIU

Scientific proof for the existence of God lies in combining these 3 things:
1. Newton's 3rd Law - action and reaction (cause and effect);
2. Our complex universe, especially the mind and brain of mankind;
3. Entropy.

There is no proof of god's existence. Here comes the brainwashing part again. They let religious people believe there is proof that there was a god. But there aint.

Some religious people believe in God. Others don't. I have been told that basically, Buddhists don't believe in God, but they certainly have religion.

Since science has proven that God exists, even if an atheist doesn't want to believe such science as proof, the science is at least strong evidence. To not accept such scientific evidence, but rather to make the bold statement that God does not exist, shows that the atheist is treating his atheism belief as a religion.

If you Google or DuckDuckGo search on the words "atheism religion," you will find a lot of evidence that shows that atheism is a religion, or that it is at least close to being a religion.

Makes no sence. Religious people believe in some kind of mysterious GOD, a GOD that doen't even exist. Religious people try to convince atheists to believe in their religion and their GOD.

So who is brainwashing who?

Atheists want to brainwash people into thinking that religious people want to brainwash atheists.

There is a lot of symbolism. Malachi is before the resurrection, before the lake of fire.

The thing called "eternity" is tied to this universe in its present form. It is not tied to the new universe in its present "eternity" form.

The lake of fire will be the dissolution of the current universe, and will probably even include the suffering and death of Jesus. After all, Jesus took the punishment for the sins of the whole world. While the destruction of and through the lake of fire will take forever in our understanding in this universe, in the understanding of the new universe it will not even be thought about.

Sodom and Gomorrah was said to burn forever and ever, and it's not burning.

Malachi 4:3 "You will tread down the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day which I am preparing," says the LORD of hosts.

How can they be ashes if they are burning forever?

Revelation 21: 1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. 4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

The lake of fire will be done away with, and there will be a new heaven, and new earth, and there will be no more pain. He is not going to torture people forever, they will be ashes under our feet.

The eternal bit is because they will be gone forever, not burning forever.

Hell - the Truth about Hell

At the beginning there was no death. Death came with sin. Restoration to eternal life through Jesus' work on the cross is the free gift of God to all who will accept it. However, even the ability to accept has been opened up by Jesus' work on the cross.

Evidence of torment forever from Revelation 20:10 and Revelation 20:15:
However, I think that if we looked for it we could find other places that say more directly that the torment of those who are unsaved will be lasting forever... such as Matthew 25:31-46.

Because religious people want to brainwash atheïsts.

That's funny, because it had nothing to do with what I was talking about. That would be the accurate thing to say if I was saying you must believe the bible because they just fulfilled the prophecy seen here. But I was purely saying they're fulfilling what's written, which is absolutely true. I wasn't saying you have to believe the bible based on that one prophecy coming true alone.


Only those with eyes will see the truth. If you look for truth you will find it, if you look for lies and contradictions and failed prophecies you will find those. I don't ignore anything, I have my eyes wide open. But those who read the bible looking for errors will certainly find them, and stop looking without questioning why those "Errors" may exist.

By the way, most contradictions in the bible are purely from people specifically translating it incorrectly on purpose to confuse people away form the truth.


I don't agree. We don't have eternal life from the beginning, people won't be burning in hell forever and ever. We are given eternal life through Jesus, or why else would it say Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Our eternal life is a gift, it is not for everyone, but only for those who choose to accept it. The wages of sin are death, not burning forever and ever.

For a biblical foreknowledge to be valid it must pass ALL these criteria:

1) It must be in the Bible.
2) It must be accurate.
3) It must be unambiguous.
4) It must be improbable.
5) It must have been unknown.

The prophecy you highlighted is false because it failed to satisfy #4.


Well it was written by humans, obviously.  

Prophecies coming true ehh? Mmmmm, suggest you read up on "postdiction".
Also "selective thinking" may explain why you are ignoring the mountain of predictive "prophecies" that completely and utterly failed. But hey, you just ignore that elephant in the room and focus on the unimportant tiny fly in the corner.

Well said. The Bible is full of prophesies that have been fulfilled. Those that are yet to be fulfilled, for example the fulfillment of the Kingdom (new heaven, new earth and a final end to evil), will all be fulfilled as well.

I am glad you replied to sorryforthat the way you did. Personally I believe that the Bible clearly speaks about a real Heaven and Hell existing outside of this earthly life. Our life here, since the fall into sin, is more like the Purgatory of the Roman Catholic Church.

The speaking in the Revelation about the New Heavens and the New Earth is a clearer explanation of Heaven. It is a new universe that has different physical laws than this one - a different physics and science.

The Lake of Fire in the Revelation is a smelting pot that melts the eternal soul down into its component parts so that God gets His energy back. Since the soul is eternal, the tearing down of the soul is eternal as well. God can wait for eternity to be over, because He is outside, even, of eternity, although He is eternal at the same time.

Great post. Yes, people who say they hate Christians are just fulfilling prophecy from the 2,000 year old book they dismiss as only being written by humans. If it was written by humans, why would the prophecies be coming true thousands of years later?

John 15:18-19 ESV:   

“If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you."

Matthew 10:22 ESV:

"And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved."

1 John 3:13 ESV:

"Do not be surprised, brothers, that the world hates you."