Nicely done... and needed...
Thanks. If it becomes useful enough it might as well be a sticky. Would save us repeating ourselves about warnings.
Topic: [Guide] Dogie's Comprehensive Manufacturer Trustworthiness Guide [1st Feb 2016] - page 66. (Read 131506 times)
February 09, 2014, 09:38:33 AM
Thanks. If it becomes useful enough it might as well be a sticky. Would save us repeating ourselves about warnings.
February 09, 2014, 08:30:40 AM
Nicely done... and needed...
July 26, 2014, 10:37:13 PM
Disclaimers
I provided technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts had any influence over company ratings.
I am currently engaged in legal action against SpondooliesTech for unpaid debts.
I provided technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts had any influence over company ratings.
Hello all,
Bitmain has employed me to help liaise with the community and later provide technical support. They have done this in order to help provide:
1) timely technical support
2) provide better feedback (if I don't know, I can find out from the people within Bitmain who will)
3) provide product and sales input from you guys directly into the company. If something is going wrong, YOU can fix it
4) provide native English press releases - less ManderEnglish, more sense.
This is a paid position, however it will in no way affect my independence or freedom in being critical towards Bitmain outside of this thread. My contract specifically stipulates:
This means I won't sit here and reply to every post saying Bitmain is a scam, don't buy from Bitmain etc etc, in this thread. It does NOT prohibit me from saying that in my own threads, if that is what I believe. It also has absolutely no impact on their rating in the Manufacturer trustworthiness thread [in which Bitmain just went down 10 points].
Bitmain has employed me to help liaise with the community and later provide technical support. They have done this in order to help provide:
1) timely technical support
2) provide better feedback (if I don't know, I can find out from the people within Bitmain who will)
3) provide product and sales input from you guys directly into the company. If something is going wrong, YOU can fix it
4) provide native English press releases - less ManderEnglish, more sense.
This is a paid position, however it will in no way affect my independence or freedom in being critical towards Bitmain outside of this thread. My contract specifically stipulates:
Quote
Dogie will speak on behalf of BITMAIN and will not criticize BITMAIN in these threads. Dogie still reserves the right to criticize BITMAIN in his other threads. Both parties acknowledge that this relationship has no impact whatsoever on BITMAIN’s rating or standing in “Dogie’s ‘Manufacturer Trustworthiness” thread.
This means I won't sit here and reply to every post saying Bitmain is a scam, don't buy from Bitmain etc etc, in this thread. It does NOT prohibit me from saying that in my own threads, if that is what I believe. It also has absolutely no impact on their rating in the Manufacturer trustworthiness thread [in which Bitmain just went down 10 points].
Hello all,
Canaan Creative has employed me to help liaise with the community and later provide technical support. They have done this in order to help provide:
1) timely technical support
2) provide better feedback (if I don't know, I can find out from the people within CC who will)
3) provide product and sales input from you guys directly into the company. If something is going wrong, YOU can fix it
4) provide native English press releases.
This is a paid position, however it will in no way affect my independence or freedom in being critical towards Canaan Creative outside of this thread. My contract specifically stipulates:
This means I won't sit here and reply to every post saying CC is a scam, don't buy from CC etc etc, in this thread. It does NOT prohibit me from saying that in my own threads, if that is what I believe. It also has absolutely no impact on their rating in the Manufacturer trustworthiness thread.
Canaan Creative has employed me to help liaise with the community and later provide technical support. They have done this in order to help provide:
1) timely technical support
2) provide better feedback (if I don't know, I can find out from the people within CC who will)
3) provide product and sales input from you guys directly into the company. If something is going wrong, YOU can fix it
4) provide native English press releases.
This is a paid position, however it will in no way affect my independence or freedom in being critical towards Canaan Creative outside of this thread. My contract specifically stipulates:
Quote
Dogie will speak on behalf of Canaan Creative and will not criticize CC in these threads. Dogie still reserves the right to criticize CC in his other threads. Both parties acknowledge that this relationship has no impact whatsoever on CC’s rating or standing in “Dogie’s ‘Manufacturer Trustworthiness” thread.
This means I won't sit here and reply to every post saying CC is a scam, don't buy from CC etc etc, in this thread. It does NOT prohibit me from saying that in my own threads, if that is what I believe. It also has absolutely no impact on their rating in the Manufacturer trustworthiness thread.
I am currently engaged in legal action against SpondooliesTech for unpaid debts.
We filed at the Kiryat Gat Miagistrates Court on the 11th Jan, served ... by registered mail on 18th Jan. They've yet to file a response. The case is open to the public which means anyone can request documents from it, and although there isn't a public case docket I can post the documents on here and give a rough translation from Hebrew.
July 26, 2014, 10:37:05 PM
July 26, 2014, 10:36:55 PM
- Retired permanently inactive companies who have either gone out of business or have no prospects of selling miners again.
- With the removal of the smaller companies, the company sizes scoring criteria have been rescaled.
- Retired Bitcrane, Yiazo, ASICMiner, BTCGArden, XBTech, RockMiner, BFL, BitMine, CoinTerra, HashFast, AMT and Black Arrow. These companies are unlikely to be updated.
- Bitfury 'Preorders' down from 'No' to 'Batch' (20 to 16).
- KNC Miner 'Preorders' up from 'Yes' to 'Mix' (1 to 8 ).
- KNC Miner 'OnTime' up from 'No' to 'Mix' (1 to 5).
- KNC Miner 'Hardware Issues' up from 'Major' to 'Minor' (1 to 4).
- SpondooliesTech 'Preorders' down from 'Mix' to 'Yes' (8 to 1).
- SpondooliesTech 'Hardware Issues' down from 'No' to 'Minor' (10 to 6).
- Spondoolies-Tech 'Communication' down from 'Great' to 'Okay' (10 to 4).
- SpondooliesTech 'Size' down from 'Huge' to 'Large' (10 to 7).
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against SpondooliesTech.
- Added 'Farm' ethics infringement against SpondooliesTech.
- Added 'Other' ethics infringement against SpondooliesTech.
- HashCoins 'Preorders' down from 'Mix' to 'Yes' (8 to 1).
- HashCoins 'Size' down from 'Medium' to 'Small' (4 to 1).
- Added 'Other' ethics infringement against HashCoins.
- Technobit 'Size' down from 'Medium' to 'Small' (4 to 1).
- Technobit 'Preorders' down from 'Batch' to 'Mix' (16 to 8 ).
- Added 'Bankrupt' ethics infringement against ASICMiner.
- Added 'Bankrupt' ethics infringement against BitMine.
- Added 'Bankrupt' ethics infringement against RockMiner.
- Added 'Bankrupt' ethics infringement against AMT.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against XBTech.
Changelog 02/26/2015
- Retired permanently inactive companies who have either gone out of business or have no prospects of selling miners again.
- Clarified that combined ethics ratings can not fall below 1.
- Retired 'Premine' ethics criterion due to being subjective and reports often based on inconclusive evidence.
- Added Legal ethics criterion with a penalty of -5.
- Added color to changelog.
- VMC retired due to prolonged bankruptcy.
- Lightning ASIC retired due to withdrawal from market to sell ATMs.
- OneStringMiner retired due to single product/run company.
- Awaiting submissions of evidence of legal action against XBTech.
- Awaiting submissions of evidence of legal action against Technobit.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against Black Arrow.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against AMT.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against HashFast (already at minimum score).
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against CoinTerra.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against KNC Miner.
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against BFL (already at minimum score).
- Added 'Legal' ethics infringement against BitMine.
- Removed 'Other' ethics infringement against BTCGarden
- Added 'Farm' ethics infringement against BTCGarden.
- Technobit 'On Time' down from 'Yes' to 'No' (10 to 1).
- Technobit 'Hardware Issues' clarified that issues with actual hardware are minor, with the major of problem being lack of timely support which is penalised in other categories.
- Technobit 'Refund Issues' down from 'No' to 'Yes' (10 to 1).
- Technobit 'Communication' down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- Added 'Farm' ethics infringement against Technobit.
- Added 'Other' ethics infringement against Technobit.
- Bitcrane size up from 'Small' to 'Medium' (1 to 4).
- RockMiner 'Hardware Issues' down to 'Minor' from 'No' (10 to 6) due to lack of technical support.
- RockMiner 'Size' down from 'Large' to 'Medium' (7 to 4).
- Bitmain Preorders up from 'Mix' to 'Batch' (8 to 16).
- BFL being considered for Communication up from 'Bad' to 'Okay' (1 to 4).
- No change in BFL 'Preorders' due to no new generation launched. Remains at transition score.
- No change in SpondooliesTech 'Preorders' due to no new generation launched. Remains at transition score.
- ASICMiner 'On Time' will next be considered on new generation launch.
Changelog 12/17/2014
- Ethics criterion 'BFL' changed from 'BFL' to Gov to represent behaviour so serious that government / regulatory intervention is required. This does NOT mean that the previous 'BFL' rating - a mark of extreme market behaviours - wasn't proper and correct.
- Communication ratings have been normalised lower than previously.
- Canaan Creative Communication up from 'Okay' to 'Good' (4 to 7).
- SpondooliesTech Preorders up from 'Yes' to 'Mix' (1 to 8]. *Although SpondooliesTech is currently selling out of hand, they have not yet demonstrated that their business model can support this into the next generation. On the announcement of next gen preorders, this rating will return to 'Yes'. On the announcement of next gen in hand / batch sales, this rating will increase to 'Batch' or 'No'.
- Bitmain Hardware Issues up from 'Minor' to 'No' (6 to 10).
- ASICMiner Communication down from 'Okay' to 'Bad' (4 to 1).
- ASICMiner OnTime down from 'Yes' to 'Mix' (10 to 5).
- ASICMiner Hardware Issues? Down from 'No' to 'Minor' (10 to 6). *Prisma suffered 'major' problems, but the company is offering more than fair buyback terms so customers are not out of pocket.
- OneStringMiner Communication down from 'Great' to 'Good' (10 to 7). *Was an error, already had the score of 'Good' but had the text of 'Great'.
- RockMiner Size down from 'Large' to 'Medium' (7 to 4).
- RockMiner Communication down from 'Good' to 'Bad' (7 to 1).
- XBTec Communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- Yiazo Communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- BTCGarden Communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- HashCoins added.
- BFL Ethics changed from 'BFL' to 'Gov' (1 to 1).
- BFL Delivered Yet? Changed from 'Few' to 'Yes' (5 to 10). *Due to the large numbers that Monarchs are / could be if it wasn't for temporary receivership delivered in.
- BFL Preorders up from 'Yes' to 'Mix' (1 to 8]. *Although BFL is currently selling out of hand, they have not yet demonstrated that their business model can support this into the next generation. On the announcement of next gen preorders, this rating will return to 'Yes'. On the announcement of next gen in hand / batch sales, this rating will increase to 'Batch' or 'No'.
- BFL Communication. *Clarification that the low rating is due to the regression to their own heavily moderated forums and to a lack of official participation in these forums - amongst other things. Additionally, the professionalism of interactions of staff on these forums is below the expected standard.
- KNCMiner Hardware Issues. *Clarification, that the low rating is due to the potentially dangerous use of high power draw far exceeding the PCI-E specification.
- KNCMiner Refund Issues up from 'Yes' to 'Some' (1 to 5).
- BlackArrow Communication down from 'Okay' to 'Bad' (4 to 1).
Changelog 10/20/2014
Company changes:
- ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.
- ASICMiner communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- Bitmain Hardware Issues down from 'No' to 'Minor' (10 to 6).
- Bitmain Commuication up from 'Good' to 'Great' (7 to 10).
- XBTech On Time not changed, but receives a warning for original Pacific 1250 delays.
- RockMiner Hardware Issues up from 'Minor' to 'No' (6 to 10).
- SpondooliesTech Size up from 'Large' to 'Huge' (7 to 10).
- BTCGarden Hardware issues clarified that its due to the % of DOA boards.
- BTCGarden Communcation up from 'Okay' to 'Good' (4 to 7).
- Bitmine Communaction down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- KNC Miner Hardware Issues down from 'Minor' to 'Major' (6 to 1) - suffered minor to moderate problems on both product launches.
- KNC Miner Ethics, F up from FF (-4 to -2) - removed FF criteria from rating system due to being potentially speculative.
- CoinTerra refund issues from 'No' to 'Some' (10 to 5).
- Blackarrow Hardware Issues down to Major due to X3 total recall.
- AMT Communication down from 'Okay' to 'Bad' (4 to 1).
- BFL Hardware Issues up from 'Minor' to 'No' (6 to 10).
- BitCrane added (76).
- Bitcrane size being considered for Medium if newer offerings sell better.
- Bitcrane communication being considered for Good, again on the basis that newer offerings sell better and there is more engagement.
- Canaan Creative Communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
- Bitmine Refund Issues down from 'Some' to 'Yes' (5 to 1).
Changelog 09/12/2014
Company changes:
- Canaan Creative added (92).
- XBTech Added (80).
- Lightning ASIC 'Own Chips' changed from 'No' to 'Promised' (1 to 5). Overall score from 54 to 58.
- BFL 'Own Chips' changed from 'Promised' to 'Yes' (5 to 10).
- BFL 'Delivered Yet?' changed from 'No' to 'Few' (1 to 5). Overall score from 24 to 33.
BlackArrow 'Hardware Issues?' changed from 'Major' to 'Minor' (1 to 6). Overall score from 35 to 40.- Bitmine 'Hardware Issues?' changed from 'No' to 'Some' (10 to 6). Overall score from 63 to 59.
- Technobit 'Hardware Issues?' changed from 'No' to 'Some' (10 to 6). Overall score from 78 to 74.
- SpondooliesTech 'Preorders?' changed from 'Mix' to 'Yes' (8 to 1). Overall score from 85 to 78.
- Bitmain 'Preorders?' changed from 'Batch' to 'Mix' (16 to 8 ). Overall score from 93 to 83.
July 26, 2014, 10:36:46 PM
Retired Companies
These are companies that either no longer exist, do not trade or do not offer products for sale. It is highly advisable not to trade with any company listed below as it is likely to
be an imitation scam.
Individual Criteria
Own Chips?
Companies manufacturing their own chips prospect significant time, resources and funds up front. They have likely raised significant capital from investors who will have performed
due diligence on information that is not available to the public. All of these factors reduce the chances of customers being left without of their orders.
10/10 = Yes - designing and investing in own chips
8/10 = Mixed - utilises a mix of own and other companies' chips
5/10 = Promised - designing and investing in own chips but not yet delivered
1/10 = No - integrates other companies chips
Delivered Yet?
This criterion represents a company's successful delivery of a new generation, product or offering.
10/10 = Yes
5/10 = Few units only
1/10 = No
Preorders?
Preorders are extremely bad for the industry and put all the financial risk on the buyer. This criterion does not act as a snapshot, but a longer term (both past and future) "does
this company engage in preorders". A company who's business model relies on preorders to fund development and new generations is still considered to utilise preorders even if
they intermediately sell some products from stock. Transitional scores may be used when companies have promised the exclusion of preorders but have yet to prove their business
model can operate without them.
20/20 = No - does not use preorders
16/20 = Batch - 'Presells' a batch being manufactured for delivery in the immediate future
8/20 = Mixed - sells some in hand hardware and some preorders, or utilises split payments
1/20 = Yes - only sells using preorders
On Time?
This criterion highlights if the majority of a company's products have been or have nearly been delivered in a timely fashion. Allowances may be made if companies sufficiently
compensate customers for delays.
10/10 = Yes
5/10 = Mix
1/10 = No
Hardware Issues?
This criterion seeks to highlight if a company's products often suffer from defects which reduce a customers income or the value of their products. Allowances may be made if
companies sufficiently compensate customers for delays.
10/10 = No
6/10 = Minor - some issues with performance, reliability or software
4/10 = N/A - for companies that have not yet delivered hardware.
1/10 = Major - significant issues that severely impact the performance or reliability of the miners
Refund Issues?
This criterion represents how well a company responds to requests to cancel orders and refund payments. This rating is used sensitively and as such only a small number of
confirmed customers is needed to result in lower scores. "No refunds" policies are not considered a defence in regards to this criterion.
10/10 = No - refunds issued as requested
5/10 = Some - some orders being ignored or refunds delayed but processing
1/10 = Yes - refunds significantly delayed or not being processed at all. Includes stall tactics.
Communication?
10/10 = Great - senior management actively engages with customers
7/10 = Good - customer service staff contactable as required
4/10 = Okay - some issues or lack of communication with customers
1/10 = Bad - significant issues with communication
Ethics?
All companies start with 10 points, and lose points for various infractions. The key is as follows:
F = Operates own mining farm = -2
FF = Operates own large mining farm = -4
P = Evidence of premining on preordered equipment = -2
GOV = Has been a subject of government or regulatory intervention / investigation = -9
B = Bankrupt = -9
L = Legal action taken against company = -5
O = Other generic unethical behaviour = -5
Company Size?
This criterion seeks to represent a company's size and market-share in the industry. Larger companies are less likely to disappear overnight where as smaller, newer companies
maybe be more likely to do so. Smaller companies may also be harder to legally persue to receive refunds.
10/10 = Huge
7/10 = Large
4/10 = Medium
1/10 = Small
These are companies that either no longer exist, do not trade or do not offer products for sale. It is highly advisable not to trade with any company listed below as it is likely to
be an imitation scam.
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| BitCrane | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread T-110, T-110S, T-720 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 79  | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes No | 1/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay Medium | 4/10 10/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 79 | Sold in hand hardware based off HashFast's chips. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Yiazo | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread YBF |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 76 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes No | 1/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay Small | 4/10 10/10 1/10 |
| Last Score: 76 | Small OEM utilising Bitfury's generation 2 chips and reference design for one run. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ASICMiner | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Chips, Block Erupter USBs, V1/V2 Blades, V3 Cubes, Tubes, Primsa |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 73  | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Batch | 10/10 10/10 16/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Mix No No | 5/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad F B Huge | 1/10 1/10 10/10 |
| Last Score: 80 | Was a publicly floated company that sold in hand hardware while maintaining their own farms. The founder and CEO, 'Friedcat', alledgedly ran away with most of the company's money. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| BTCGarden | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread AMV1, AMV1-X2 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 73 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes No | 1/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes Minor No | 10/10 6/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F Medium | 4/10 8/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 73 | Integrator of ASICMiner's chips. Some problems with DOA rates and communication. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| XBTech | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Pacific 1250, Pacific V2 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 72 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes No | 1/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F L Medium | 4/10 3/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 77 | Medium integrator of ASICMiner's chips, only sold in hand hardware. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| RockMiner | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread R-BOX, New R-BOX, R3-BOX, R4-BOX |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 63 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes No | 1/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes Minor No | 10/10 6/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad F B Medium | 1/10 1/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 70 | Large integrator of ASICMiner's chips. Significant quantity sold. Transitioned to being a supporting arm of ASICMiner, before also falling victim to 'Friedcat'. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| BFL | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Jalapeno, Single, Monarch |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 49 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Mix | 10/10 10/10 8/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No No Yes | 1/10 10/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad GOV L Large | 1/10 1/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 49 | Product releases have been subject to significant delays, and the company was investigated by the FTC. Insolvent. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| BitMine | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Chips, Rig, Desk |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 48 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Mix | 10/10 10/10 8/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Minor Yes | 1/10 6/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F L B Large | 4/10 1/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 50 | First generation was very delayed, sold in hand hardware for a bit. Ended up in a bitter bankruptcy and legal case. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| CoinTerra | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Terraminer IV |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 37 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Yes | 10/10 10/10 1/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Major Some | 1/10 1/10 5/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad F O L Large | 1/10 1/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 37 | Promised performance aggressively and it didn't pay off. Had problems with units under performing, being delayed and other problems. Suffered cashflow problems and stopped honouring refunds for a while, leading to a class action lawsuit. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| HashFast | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Sierra, Babyjet |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 35 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Yes | 10/10 10/10 1/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Minor Yes | 1/10 6/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad B L Medium | 1/10 1/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 35 | Sold preorders, things went sour and they're in receivership. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| AMT | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread AMT520, AMT1.2Th |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 28 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes Mix | 1/10 10/10 8/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Major Yes | 1/10 1/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad O L B Medium | 1/10 1/10 4/10 |
| Last Score: 32 | First generation significantly delayed, although may be due to a third party. Products were recalled and only some refunds processed. Bitter legal case to track down the owner. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Black Arrow | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Minion chips, Prospero X1, Prospero X3 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 28 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Few Yes | 10/10 5/10 1/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Major Yes | 1/10 1/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Bad O L Large | 1/10 1/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 28 | Historically reputable, however latest generations that were sold on preorders were extremely delayed. Refunds were not being honoured. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
Individual Criteria
Own Chips?
Companies manufacturing their own chips prospect significant time, resources and funds up front. They have likely raised significant capital from investors who will have performed
due diligence on information that is not available to the public. All of these factors reduce the chances of customers being left without of their orders.
10/10 = Yes - designing and investing in own chips
8/10 = Mixed - utilises a mix of own and other companies' chips
5/10 = Promised - designing and investing in own chips but not yet delivered
1/10 = No - integrates other companies chips
Delivered Yet?
This criterion represents a company's successful delivery of a new generation, product or offering.
10/10 = Yes
5/10 = Few units only
1/10 = No
Preorders?
Preorders are extremely bad for the industry and put all the financial risk on the buyer. This criterion does not act as a snapshot, but a longer term (both past and future) "does
this company engage in preorders". A company who's business model relies on preorders to fund development and new generations is still considered to utilise preorders even if
they intermediately sell some products from stock. Transitional scores may be used when companies have promised the exclusion of preorders but have yet to prove their business
model can operate without them.
20/20 = No - does not use preorders
16/20 = Batch - 'Presells' a batch being manufactured for delivery in the immediate future
8/20 = Mixed - sells some in hand hardware and some preorders, or utilises split payments
1/20 = Yes - only sells using preorders
On Time?
This criterion highlights if the majority of a company's products have been or have nearly been delivered in a timely fashion. Allowances may be made if companies sufficiently
compensate customers for delays.
10/10 = Yes
5/10 = Mix
1/10 = No
Hardware Issues?
This criterion seeks to highlight if a company's products often suffer from defects which reduce a customers income or the value of their products. Allowances may be made if
companies sufficiently compensate customers for delays.
10/10 = No
6/10 = Minor - some issues with performance, reliability or software
4/10 = N/A - for companies that have not yet delivered hardware.
1/10 = Major - significant issues that severely impact the performance or reliability of the miners
Refund Issues?
This criterion represents how well a company responds to requests to cancel orders and refund payments. This rating is used sensitively and as such only a small number of
confirmed customers is needed to result in lower scores. "No refunds" policies are not considered a defence in regards to this criterion.
10/10 = No - refunds issued as requested
5/10 = Some - some orders being ignored or refunds delayed but processing
1/10 = Yes - refunds significantly delayed or not being processed at all. Includes stall tactics.
Communication?
10/10 = Great - senior management actively engages with customers
7/10 = Good - customer service staff contactable as required
4/10 = Okay - some issues or lack of communication with customers
1/10 = Bad - significant issues with communication
Ethics?
All companies start with 10 points, and lose points for various infractions. The key is as follows:
F = Operates own mining farm = -2
FF = Operates own large mining farm = -4
P = Evidence of premining on preordered equipment = -2
GOV = Has been a subject of government or regulatory intervention / investigation = -9
B = Bankrupt = -9
L = Legal action taken against company = -5
O = Other generic unethical behaviour = -5
Company Size?
This criterion seeks to represent a company's size and market-share in the industry. Larger companies are less likely to disappear overnight where as smaller, newer companies
maybe be more likely to do so. Smaller companies may also be harder to legally persue to receive refunds.
10/10 = Huge
7/10 = Large
4/10 = Medium
1/10 = Small
February 09, 2014, 08:23:24 AM
Dogie's Miner Setup Guides:
Intro
I get a lot of questions regarding the legitimacy of current companies in the marketplace. Its not always viable for customers to search through 1000 pages of drama and so I've assembled the below summary of current market suppliers. Remember, this information is my personal interpretation of past performance and it is NOT an absolute indicator of what will happen to your order. Supplement this guide with your own research, protect your money.
Rating System
Position in the list signifies trustworthiness, the higher the better. A perfect score is 100 and the worst possible score is 10. Criteria includes the use of preorders, prompt delivery, the investment of custom chips, hardware and refund issues, communication ability, ethical behaviour and company size.
90+ = AAA tier firm
80+ = A tier firm
70+ = B tier firm, company can improve practises
50+ = C tier firm, issues to be resolved
30+ = D tier firm, significant issues or problems
30- = E tier firm
Ratings
Intro
I get a lot of questions regarding the legitimacy of current companies in the marketplace. Its not always viable for customers to search through 1000 pages of drama and so I've assembled the below summary of current market suppliers. Remember, this information is my personal interpretation of past performance and it is NOT an absolute indicator of what will happen to your order. Supplement this guide with your own research, protect your money.
Rating System
Position in the list signifies trustworthiness, the higher the better. A perfect score is 100 and the worst possible score is 10. Criteria includes the use of preorders, prompt delivery, the investment of custom chips, hardware and refund issues, communication ability, ethical behaviour and company size.
90+ = AAA tier firm
80+ = A tier firm
70+ = B tier firm, company can improve practises
50+ = C tier firm, issues to be resolved
30+ = D tier firm, significant issues or problems
30- = E tier firm
Ratings
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Bitmain | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Antminer S1, S2, S3, S4, U1, U2, U3, C1, L1 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 94 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Batch | 10/10 10/10 16/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Great F Huge | 10/10 8/10 10/10 |
| Last Score: 94 | Primarily sells in hand hardware, issues are fairly resolved when they occur. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Canaan Creative | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Chips, Avalon1, Avalon2, Avalon3, Avalon4 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 92 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes No | 10/10 10/10 20/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Good F Large | 7/10 8/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 92 | Only sells in hand hardware and has done for two years. Not to be confused with BitSyncom or Yifu. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Bitfury | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Chips, 3500BF, H-boards |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 88 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Batch | 10/10 10/10 16/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes No No | 10/10 10/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F Huge | 4/10 8/10 10/10 |
| Last Score: 92 | First ASIC company to deliver in quantity and without problems. More focused on their own farms however have pledged to sell to OEMs. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| KNC Miner | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Saturn, Jupiter, Neptune, Titan |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 62  | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Mix | 10/10 10/10 8/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Mix Minor Some | 5/10 6/10 5/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Good F O L Huge | 7/10 1/10 10/10 |
| Last Score: 46 | Huge company that sold several rounds of their first generation miners, and used the proceeds to build a private super farm. Then sold further preorders and potentially mislead about shipping dates. Problems with latest generation. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| SpondooliesTech | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Chips, SP10, SP20, SP30, SP31, SP35 |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 59 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | Yes Yes Yes | 10/10 10/10 1/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Yes Minor No | 10/10 6/10 10/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F O L Large | 4/10 1/10 7/10 |
| Last Score: 88 | Sold preorders quite far into the future, specification problems with both 2X and 3X miners. Agreed to merge with the unusual company "BTCS Inc". |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| HashCoins | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread Apollo, Zeus, Uranus, Ares |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 40 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes Yes | 1/10 10/10 1/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | Mix No Some | 5/10 10/10 5/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F O Small | 4/10 3/10 1/10 |
| Last Score: 55 | Integrator of HashFast and other chips. Offered preorders for two products which did not materialise. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
| Technobit | Product lines: Company Site | Bitcointalk Thread S-Hash, HEX4M, HEX8A1, HEX8A2, HEX16A2, HEX16B, HEX16E, 4HEX16E |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | |||||||||
| Rating: 35 | Uses own chips? Delivered miners? Uses preorders? | No Yes Mix | 1/10 10/10 8/20 | On time? Quality Issues? Refund Issues? | No Minor Yes | 1/10 6/10 1/10 | Communication Ethics Size | Okay F O Small | 4/10 3/10 1/10 |
| Last Score: 46 | Designs and sells boards integrating 3rd party chips on the market. A number of problems with batches, orders and refunds. |
| ___________________________________________________________________________ | _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________________________ _ |
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